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  <session.header>
    <date>2023-11-14</date>
    <parliament.no>2</parliament.no>
    <session.no>1</session.no>
    <period.no>0</period.no>
    <chamber>Senate</chamber>
    <page.no>0</page.no>
    <proof>1</proof>
  </session.header>
  <chamber.xscript>
    <business.start>
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        <p class="HPS-SODJobDate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
          <span class="HPS-SODJobDate">
            <span style="font-weight:bold;" />
            <a href="Chamber" type="">Tuesday, 14 November 2023</a>
          </span>
        </p>
        <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
          <span class="HPS-Normal">
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">The PRESIDENT (Senator </span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">the Hon. </span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">Sue Lines</span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">)</span> took the chair at 12:00, made an acknowledgement of country and read prayers.</span>
        </p>
      </body>
    </business.start>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>STATEMENTS</title>
        <page.no>1</page.no>
        <type>STATEMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Occupied Palestinian Territories: Casualties</title>
          <page.no>1</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:01</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I seek leave to table the names of 6,747 people who have been massacred by the State of Israel in the last five weeks. These are the only names available that we have at the moment.</para>
<para>Leave not granted.</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I seek leave to make a short statement.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Leave is granted for five minutes.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>What I am trying to do today is get this chamber to acknowledge the thousands of Palestinians that have been massacred brutally over the last 35 days by the State of Israel. These are the names that you don't want to talk about here. These are the names that you don't want to acknowledge, because, for many, these people are not considered humans. But these are humans. These are children—children a few months old, babies, one-year-olds, two-year-olds, three-year-olds, four-year-olds, five-year-olds, six-year-olds, seven-year-olds, eight-year-olds, nine-year-olds, 10-year-olds. The list just keeps growing. These are hopes and dreams. These are lives completely snatched away from their loved ones. I met with someone yesterday who has had 42 members of their family murdered in Gaza. Yet the Labor government does not have the heart to call for a ceasefire. The Labor government is seeing a child being killed every 10 minutes but won't call for a ceasefire. It is happy to talk weasel words, but weasel words are not going to stop war crimes. You can't even bring yourselves to condemn Israel for the almost 11,000 killings that they have done.</para>
<para>How much cowardice are we going to see from this government? Truly, have a heart; have a head. Get some guts and stop this massacre. There is a chorus from the world and of world leaders who have joined this call for a ceasefire and who can see the inhumanity and the suffering of people being killed every single day. Can you not see that suffering? Can you not see that humanity? Can you not see that depravity by Israel in continuing to carpet-bomb Gaza and continuing to annihilate Gaza? People are asking me: what is wrong with the Labor government? Why can't they see this? Frankly, I don't have an answer for that. I do not have an answer for that, because I cannot comprehend that a government of this country would let this go on and still shield Israel from these war crimes. I cannot comprehend that, and people out there cannot comprehend it either.</para>
<para>I think shaking our heads in here, like the minister at the table, Senator Wong, is doing, and not actually taking the action that you have the power to take is not going to move us any steps towards a ceasefire. And we don't need steps towards a ceasefire. As we take those steps, people are being murdered every single day. So just do it; just call this for what it is—which is collective punishment, which is war crimes, which is apartheid. Just call it for what it is.</para>
<para>There are people out there who are telling us that they don't want to be used as props anymore when the Labor Party come and take photos with us at our religious events—at Eid, at Ramadan, during iftar. They're tired of it; they're tired of being taken for granted. You need to represent the people who elected you to this place. You need to make sure that you listen to their voices, because people are telling me that this government is not. While that is going on, babies, young children, teenagers, women, older people and men are being murdered every single day. Hospitals are under siege. There are babies in incubators who are now dying. Wake up, Labor! Wake up and call for a ceasefire now!</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:06</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I seek leave to make a short statement.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Leave is granted for five minutes.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, that was quite an inflammatory contribution. It was a hurtful contribution to suggest that somehow the only person in this chamber who cares about lives lost—</para>
</continue>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I listened to you in silence, Senator Faruqi.</para>
</continue>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I listened to her in silence, Senator. It was hurtful to suggest the only person in this chamber who cares about the loss of life is Senator Faruqi. That is not the case. We all care about the loss of life. The motion you voted against talked about every innocent life.</para>
<para>This is possibly not the time for a policy discussion, but I noticed in that contribution there was not one mention of terrorism, of Hamas, of hostages. This is not a binary debate. This is a deeply difficult, tragic, complex debate which has a long history and the horrific events of 7 October, and your party declined to support the motion where the parliament condemned them. I would ask the Greens political party to reflect on how they are handling this debate. I would ask them to reflect on whether this is a time when you want to make political differences about political parties or whether this is a time when all of us, as political leaders, might actually need to ensure that we don't amplify the distress and grief that we all know is in our communities—in the Jewish community, too, after the single biggest loss of life since the Holocaust, on any day, as well as in our Palestinian, Arabic and Islamic communities. Maybe our job is not to amplify that distress. Maybe our job is not to foment division in the hope that there is some political advantage. Maybe our job as leaders is to try—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Shoebridge</name>
    <name.id>169119</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Is to call for a ceasefire.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Here we go again. Maybe your job, as a leader, is not to chant a slogan and not to amplify distress into anger and violence, which is what we have seen. Maybe your job—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Shoebridge</name>
    <name.id>169119</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Stop the killing and call for a ceasefire.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Order!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>as leaders, is to ensure that we do not allow this to divide our country. Our caucus represents the breadth of Australia, and I'm so deeply proud—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister Wong, please resume your seat. Senator Faruqi?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Faruqi</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>President, I have a point of order. Senator Wong is casting aspersions and basically insinuating—</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Faruqi—</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Faruqi</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Could you listen to my point of order, please?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I've heard your point of view. Resume your seat. There is no point of order, and I will remind all senators in this place that Senator Faruqi was listened to in respectful silence. I expect that for any other speaker who seeks the call, and that silence needs to come from across the chamber.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I would make the point that Senator Faruqi's statement in large part attacked the Labor Party, and now she talks about aspersions. Well, you know what my statement is? I believe leadership is not amplifying distress so that it leads to anger and violence. I believe leadership is trying to hold our country together to unify our community and stand against all forms of prejudice and hatred, because we, as Australians, value and treasure our peaceful community. We treasure unity. We treasure the values of inclusion and acceptance.</para>
<para>I would say to the Greens political party: you have heard what I have said about the suffering of civilians. You have heard what we have said from the beginning about the need for Israel to observe international law. You have also heard us say that any ceasefire cannot be one-sided, because we know what Hamas is. There are legitimate political differences, but to come in here, Senator Faruqi, and suggest that we do not care about people dying is really—you talk about aspersions. It is very distressing to my caucus and, I suspect, to many people around the country.</para>
<para class="italic">This is an international crisis. It is a humanitarian catastrophe. We are seeing loss of life which is harrowing—I think that was the word I used. Let us not have politicians here in Australia using this crisis as another issue to campaign on. All of us in this place should remember each other's humanity. We should all remember each other's humanity. We are all Australian. All of us in this place have a job to do, and that is advocating the protection of civilians, working for peace and keeping our country unified.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Remembrance Day, Middle East</title>
          <page.no>2</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:12</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BIRMINGHAM</name>
    <name.id>H6X</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>President, I seek leave to make a statement.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The</name>
    <name.id>10000</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Leave is granted for five minutes.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BIRMINGHAM</name>
    <name.id>H6X</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank the Senate. Like many of us, I attended Remembrance Day services on Saturday. At the service in Adelaide that I attended, leaders of our RSL spoke. One of the messages they gave was that they did not like to hear people talk about the futility of war. The tragedy of war—yes. The sacrifice of war—yes. But, for those who have paid the price of war, be they those who've paid the price serving our nation and others, or be they, of course, innocent lives lost, they did not think that phrase suggesting war is futile was appropriate. The reason, of course, is that wars are fought for a purpose and a reason. I would hope that we would all agree that it would be preferable if wars never had to be fought. But, tragically, that is not the real world in which we live. Horrific actions are undertaken by groups, individuals and nation-states in a range of ways that do result in conflict and war. One of the factors and functions of war is that innocent lives tragically are lost.</para>
<para>We are seeing a war in Gaza at present, and it is a war that was sparked by the actions of Hamas on October 7. These were horrific, brutal actions that, as Senator Wong rightly acknowledged in her worthy contribution just then, saw the largest loss of Jewish lives in a single day since the Holocaust. This chamber, this parliament, sought to come together on 9 October, just a couple of days after, in a statement that amongst it very clearly acknowledged the devastating loss of Israeli and Palestinian life and that innocent civilians on all sides are suffering as a result of the attacks by Hamas and the subsequent conflict. The response by Israel to seek to rid Gaza and the region that Israel operates within so far as possible of Hamas is a response that seeks to ensure peace is possible in the future. Those who utter a slogan of 'ceasefire now' are ignoring the reality that a ceasefire now, short of a release of hostages, a surrender by Hamas and a handing-over of terrorist capabilities, infrastructure, equipment and leaders, would only perpetuate the type of tragedy that we have seen.</para>
<para>This Senate should not be used as a place to seek to fight the war of the Middle East. It should not be used as a place in seeking to fight that war of the Middle East to divide Australians. Where there were arson attacks on Islamic schools in South Australia, I condemned that act of Islamophobia, as I know Senator Wong did. Where we see, though, as we did on the weekend, deliberate, provocative acts of pro-Palestinian rallies going into parts of Melbourne and parts of Sydney that are known to be home to the largest numbers of Jewish populations in Australia, that deserves condemnation as well. That is not only deliberate provocation but a deliberate intent to intimidate Australians.</para>
<para>When we hear Jewish Australians saying that they are afraid to display religious symbols, afraid to wear religious garments and afraid for their children to wear their school uniforms going to or from school, then we have a serious problem. That problem does demand leadership, and we will have a contest of debate in this place about how Australia responds, but it should not be a one-sided response. The actions of the Greens consistently from 9 October onwards have been to view this through a one-sided approach that has never seen them support a motion to condemn Hamas and only sees them coming here seeking to create further division.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>3</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Tabling</title>
          <page.no>3</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>3</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Meeting</title>
          <page.no>3</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:17</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I remind senators that the question may be put on any proposal at the request of any senator.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>4</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Counter-Terrorism and Other Legislation Amendment Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>4</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7068" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Counter-Terrorism and Other Legislation Amendment Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>4</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:22</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The question is that the second reading be agreed to.</para>
<para> </para>
</speech>
<division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [12:22] <br />(The President—Senator Lines) </p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>25</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R.</name>
                  <name>Bilyk, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>Hughes, H. A.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Pratt, L. C. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Urquhart, A. E.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>9</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Rice, J. E.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whish-Wilson, P. S.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>0</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names />
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to.<br />Bill read a second time.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division></subdebate.2><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Third Reading</title>
            <page.no>4</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:24</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>No amendments have been circulated. Does any senator require a committee stage? If not, I shall call the minister to move the third reading.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:24</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator CHISHOLM</name>
    <name.id>39801</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That this bill be now read a third time.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
<para>Bill read a third time.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Social Services and Other Legislation Amendment (Australia's Engagement in the Pacific) Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>4</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7071" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Social Services and Other Legislation Amendment (Australia's Engagement in the Pacific) Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>4</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:25</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McALLISTER</name>
    <name.id>121628</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As I noted last night, the opposition's position on the Social Services and Other Legislation Amendment (Australia's Engagement in the Pacific) Bill 2023 is disappointing, but it's really not that surprising and it shows that they are still prepared to play politics with Australia's national interests. The opposition actually knows the challenges that we face in a more contested region. Senator Birmingham knows. Senator Paterson knows. They know that Australia must work harder than ever to stay competitive and to be a partner of choice for the Pacific and that deeper regional economic and social integration is central to delivering our interests in a peaceful, stable and prosperous region.</para>
<para>Australia took a massive step forward last week when Prime Minister Albanese and Prime Minister Natano signed the Australia-Tuvalu Falepili Union. It represents the most important development for Australia in the Pacific since the independence of Papua New Guinea in 1975, and it commits Australia to provide assistance to Tuvalu in the face of security threats while also establishing a dedicated migration pathway for Tuvaluans to work, study and live in Australia. It gives effect to the concept of Pacific-led security. The Falepili union was a request from Tuvalu for Australia to assist in dealing with the urgent impacts of climate change, its security challenges and the need to safeguard the future of its people, its islands and its culture, and Australia was honoured to respond.</para>
<para>But, at the same time, the Leader of the Opposition and the shadow minister for defence openly criticised Australia's attendance at the Pacific Islands Forum leaders summit. Two days later, they changed course and supported the Australia-Tuvalu Falepili Union. So one day we had Mr Hyde and the next day we had Dr Jekyll. We welcome the opposition's support for the Falepili union, but it does raise the question: who will show up for today's vote? Will we get Mr Dutton's continued relentless attacks on the Pacific family, or will we get a party of government that supports our national interest in being a partner of choice for the Pacific family?</para>
<para>I turn now to the contribution from Senator David Pocock and thank him for indicating he will support this bill and for working through his concerns and suggestions constructively with the government. Senator Pocock has made some important points about the difficulties that migrants face and about the importance of supporting successful settlement outcomes for Pacific engagement visa migrants. He has supported the bill's existing measures but then suggested that Pacific engagement visa holders should be provided with earlier access to four other benefits: JobSeeker, youth allowance, parenting payment and the low-income health card.</para>
<para>The government agrees with Senator Pocock that we need to support positive settlement outcomes for Pacific migrants. That is why this bill and associated policy measures will provide a range of social benefits and supports to Pacific engagement visa holders, and this includes immediate access to family tax benefit part A, family tax benefit part B, the childcare subsidy, Medicare, the National Disability Insurance Scheme, public schooling, Commonwealth supported higher education places, the Higher Education Loan Program, VET student loans, youth allowance (student) and (apprentice), and Austudy. Pacific engagement visa holders will have access to four additional benefits Senator Pocock has raised—JobSeeker payment, youth allowance (jobseeker), parenting payment and the low-income healthcare card—after a four-year newly arrived residents waiting period. This waiting period for these benefits applies to most other categories of permanent migration to Australia, and the government believes it is providing a right mix of benefits and waiting periods to support migrants under the Pacific engagement visa program.</para>
<para>However, to make sure that the program is working as intended, we will monitor and evaluate the Pacific engagement visa as it is implemented and comes into effect.</para>
<para>Minister Conroy has indicated that as part of that monitoring and evaluation the government will assess whether we have got the mix of social benefits right. Senator Pocock has also made a very useful suggestion that as part of this monitoring and evaluation government should consult with parties with expertise in migrant settlement outcomes as it implements the Pacific engagement visa. I understand Minister Conroy has taken the suggestion on board and agreed to develop a consultation process. This consultation process will involve listening to people with expertise in the migrant settlement experience in a Pacific context, people like settlement service providers, social welfare agencies and, importantly, representatives of Pacific diaspora communities in Australia.</para>
<para>Can I thank also Senator McKim for indicating that the Greens will support this bill. I acknowledge that the Greens have a progressive stance on migration, which is reflected in their support for this bill. I don't think I need to provide comment on the Greens's second reading amendment beyond saying that it draws a pretty long bow, and the government will not support it.</para>
<para>Let me conclude this debate by explaining why the government is introducing the Pacific engagement visa and the PALM family accompaniment programs. Closer engagement between Australia and Pacific countries deepens our people-to-people connections, and it enriches our communities and our countries. As a member of the Pacific family, Australia is committed to working with all countries in the Pacific and Timor-Leste to achieve our shared aspirations and address our shared challenges. This bill is an important step towards delivering on our commitment to strengthen the Pacific family by supporting a flourishing Pacific diaspora in Australia and deepening connections with the countries of the Pacific and Timor-Leste, and these initiatives will strengthen our links with the Pacific family and deepen our ties to the region that is our home and that is critical to our future.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e68</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The question is that the Greens second reading amendment moved by Senator McKim be agreed to.</para>
<para> </para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [12:36]<br />(The Acting Deputy President—Senator Sterle)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>9</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Rice, J. E.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whish-Wilson, P. S.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>30</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R.</name>
                  <name>Bilyk, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Pratt, L. C.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Urquhart, A. E.</name>
                  <name>Van, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>0</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names />
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:42</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e68</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The question is that the bill be now read a second time.</para>
<para> </para>
</speech>
<division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [12:42] <br />(The Acting Deputy President—Senator Sterle)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>32</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Bilyk, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Pratt, L. C. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Rice, J. E.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Van, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Whish-Wilson, P. S.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>25</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R.</name>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Davey, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hughes, H. A.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>Rennick, G.</name>
                  <name>Reynolds, L. K.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>0</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names />
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to.<br />Bill read a second time.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division></subdebate.2><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Third Reading</title>
            <page.no>7</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e68</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As no amendments have been circulated, does any senator require a committee stage? If not, I shall call the minister to move the third reading.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McALLISTER</name>
    <name.id>121628</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That this bill be now read a third time.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
<para>Bill read a third time.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>7</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r6979" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>7</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DEAN SMITH</name>
    <name.id>241710</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to speak on the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. This is an omnibus bill presented in a series of schedules. Some of these the coalition will support. Others, particularly schedules 4 and 5, we strongly oppose. The coalition supports schedule 1, which amends the Corporations Act. It closes a loophole in the post-royal commission requirement for financial advisers to register with ASIC's Financial Advisers Register. These changes minimise the risk of inadvertent legal breaches and allow ASIC to streamline applications where a provider is authorised by more than one licensee to provide financial advice. The coalition also supports schedule 2. This gives the Australian Accounting Standards Board, the Auditing and Assurance Standards Board and the Financial Reporting Council the power to develop climate and sustainable standards. However, we will be watching closely the implementation of this particular schedule.</para>
<para>Schedule 3 implements five recommendations from the 2020 Tax Practitioners Board review, which the coalition supports. These are to update and modernise the objective clause of the TAS Act, which is contained in recommendation 2.1; create financial independence for the TPB from the ATO, which is contained in recommendation 3.1; require that tax practitioners do not employ or use a disqualified entity without the Tax Practitioners Board's approval or enter an arrangement with a disqualified entity, which is contained in recommendation 4.6; convert to an annual registration period, which is contained in recommendation 4.7; and, finally, enable the minister to supplement the existing code of professional conduct to ensure that emerging or existing practices by tax practitioners are properly addressed, which is contained in recommendation 5.1. Each of these are important changes.</para>
<para>Unfortunately, though, this is where the good policy and our support for the bill end. That is because the bill makes two significant changes to taxation law that are reminiscent of former Labor leader Bill Shorten's franking credit tax. Schedule 4 amends the Income Tax Assessment Act to limit the ability of listed companies to offer franking credits in off-market share buybacks. Schedule 5 amends the Income Tax Assessment Act to limit the ability of listed companies to offer franking credits on capital-raisings. These are a franking credits tax by stealth. These are some of the taxes the Treasurer said he was proud of and pleased with before he started saying that there would be no franking credits tax.</para>
<para>In fact, both the Prime Minister and the Treasurer ruled out changes to franking credits before the election. Let's revisit some of those comments, for the benefit of the chamber. On 1 January 2021 the <inline font-style="italic">West Australian </inline>newspaper reported that the now Prime Minister said, 'We will not be taking any changes to franking credits to the next election.' It's worth repeating. On 1 January 2021 the <inline font-style="italic">West Australian </inline>newspaper reported that the now Prime Minister said, 'We will not be taking any changes to franking credits to the next election.' Then on 30 March the now Prime Minister said, on ABC radio, 'We won't have any changes to the franking credits regime which is there.' Again, it is worth repeating. On 30 March, on ABC radio, the now Prime Minister said, 'We won't have any changes to the franking credits regime which is there.' Then, on 15 December 2021, the now Prime Minister told Tasmanians who were listening to <inline font-style="italic">T</inline><inline font-style="italic">asmania </inline><inline font-style="italic">T</inline><inline font-style="italic">alks</inline>, 'We've made it clear that on areas like franking credits and negative gearing we won't be taking those policies to the next election.' Again, it's worth repeating: on 15 December 2021, to Tasmanians, the now Prime Minister said, then as opposition leader, wanting to get into government, 'We've made it clear that on areas like franking credits and negative gearing we won't be taking those policies to the next election.' He said that on three separate occasions. They didn't take those policies to the election. They waited until after the election, and then they broke these important election promises.</para>
<para>And on 17 January 2022 the now Treasurer said, 'We won't be doing franking credits.' Yet here we are today, in the Senate chamber, dealing with the government's further broken promises, which we're going to be asked to support today but which the coalition will not be supporting and Labor senators, supported by some on the crossbench, are going to endorse. They are going to endorse the Treasurer's broken promise and the Prime Minister's broken promise by supporting this particular bill. Of course, we add to these particular broken promises a growing list—a shopping list, almost—of broken promises including a promise to have cheaper mortgages, a promise to reduce electricity bills by $275 and a promise that the cost of living in our country would come down and that there would be no changes to superannuation. It is a shopping list of broken promises, and in this Senate chamber today you'll see, with your own eyes, Australian Labor Party senators, perhaps supported by the crossbench, endorsing the government's broken promises.</para>
<para>It's outrageous that the government can break its commitment so quickly and so easily, showing that they have little regard for the Australian people, who trusted them. That is why I will move the second reading amendment circulated in the name of Senator Hume. The government's actions are shameful, and they must be called out. The coalition will move amendments to strike out these broken promises from the bill. By doing so, we can then in good faith support some of the sensible measures within it. So, to be clear, the coalition will move amendments to strike out the broken promises contained in this bill, leaving a bill that we can in good faith support. If the government doesn't accept the coalition's amendments, we will not be supporting the bill. And even if the government does intend to keep its promises, the coalition will at least continue to hold it to account.</para>
<para>In a cost-of-living crisis, which everyone now recognises that we have, one of Labor's principal priorities seems to continue to be to come after the money of ordinary Australians. And we're not talking about the richest Australians, either. Hitting franking credits will target retirees, mum-and-dad investors who have saved and invested to make themselves independent, to make themselves a little bit more financially secure. We are under no illusions about that. This will significantly inhibit the ability of those older Australians—retirees, mum-and-dad investors—to sustain themselves, let alone grow, as the Australian economy slows under Labor's economic mismanagement.</para>
<para>The coalition will, as I said before, move amendments to remove these two schedules, because we're here to support ordinary Australian taxpayers and we oppose the negative impact of Labor's taxes, and we commend those amendments to the chamber. I ask particularly those senators on the crossbench, who sit over here, to consider the words from the Prime Minister and the Treasurer that I've quoted, and their historical commitments not to make these changes to the law. I ask them to ask themselves, 'Can I allow this government to get away with such breathtaking trickery and political cynicism?' Imagine: a leader of the opposition, desperate to become Prime Minister, who on three occasions, two of them in my home state of Western Australia, said he would not change these laws; a Treasurer who said when he became the Treasurer he would not change these laws. Today in the Senate chamber the government is breaking those promises, in black and white. It has brought before the Senate a bill which breaks those promises. We will not allow it to break its promises. Breaking those promises will hurt ordinary Australians, retirees, and mum and dad investors.</para>
<para>Today, Mr Acting Deputy President, as we debate this bill, pay attention to that end of the chamber and see whether or not the crossbench will endorse the government's decision to break its own promises. We call on members of the crossbench to support the coalition's amendments in Committee of the Whole so that these disingenuous, toxic schedules can be removed from the bill and the sensible elements of the bill can progress through the parliament. I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Omit all words after "That", substitute:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">"(a) the Senate notes that:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(i) the now Prime Minister said in May 2022: "We've said we have no intention to make any super changes.",</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(ii) the now Treasurer said in April 2022: "We've made it very clear Kieran, that we don't have any proposals for tax increases...", and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(iii) since these statements the Prime Minister and the Treasurer have announced a doubling of taxes on superannuation; and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(b) further consideration of the bill be postponed until the Minister representing the Prime Minister tables a letter from the Prime Minister that includes the following elements:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(i) a commitment to dump his new doubling of super taxes,</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(ii) a commitment to never tax unrealised capital gains, and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(iii) an apology for breaking his promises to the Australian people".</para></quote>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>12:56</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BARBARA POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>BFQ</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to speak to the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill. This bill represents an opportunity to respond to the PwC tax scandal; to pick up and respond to the public's and the Senate's outrage about what PwC has done and make sure it never happens again.</para>
<para>In recent months, the government have made their anger at the actions of PwC clear and foreshadowed their ambition to clean up consulting. In August, the Labor government announced it would oversee 'the biggest crackdown on tax adviser misconduct in Australian history'. Some steps are underway to break down the secrecy that stands in the way of a really good investigation and to increase penalties for tax misdemeanours. However, we need much more, and this is a start. We need to see stronger action across a broader range of measures.</para>
<para>We've worked with the government to ensure that this bill, with our amendment, will take the first legislative step towards reining in the power of the big firms and shaping our tax advisory structures in Australia to serve our purposes better. It takes a first and significant step to remove the vested interests of big consulting firms from the very board, the Tax Practitioners Board, that regulates their tax business. Our amendment will prohibit members with financial interests in big tax firms from being on the TPB. Once this amendment passes, board appointments to the Tax Practitioners Board can no longer be current partners or previous partners who are receiving payments from a partnership in bigger firms with more than a hundred employees. Without this amendment, regulators can have direct vested interests in those entities they're meant to be regulating. That doesn't pass the pub test and, unsurprisingly, it doesn't work. It's astonishing that it's been allowed to go on for so long. This is a straightforward and much-needed change which will strengthen the impartiality of the TPB and its ability to regulate tax agents, without any perceived or actual conflicts of interest.</para>
<para>I'd like to thank the Assistant Treasurer and Minister for Financial Services, the Hon. Stephen Jones, and his staff for working constructively with us on this amendment and for working towards cracking down on the conflict of interest and improving the independence of the TPB. The Greens have pursued this issue because the public asked us to do it. People across the political spectrum are united in their horror of what they have learned about PwC and big consultants more broadly over the last year. I've had hundreds of emails and calls, none in support of PwC—not one. If my mailbox is any indication, this organisation has few friends, and Australians are angry. They want action, accountability and honesty.</para>
<para>The amendments we introduced to this bill are a first step, but rest assured there's more to come. The scale of the consulting scandal needs to be met with a commensurate scale of reform. The outrage of the Australian community deserves to be met with an ambitious response. We need to make sure that the unethical behaviour of big consultancies assisting multinational firms to avoid tax, and the extraordinary farming of the public dollar to line their pockets, cannot be allowed to continue. We must rebuild the public sector and put the interest of the public at the core of public spending.</para>
<para>The PwC scandal revealed the partners signed confidentiality agreements as they advised government and then went to work to aggressively and unlawfully sell information they harvested, earning at least $2.5 million in fees and growing their client list internationally. It's a scandal. Its origin and dimensions have come to light through the honesty and courage of insiders along with the work of smart, alert journalists and the efforts and persistence of this Senate, an active Senate. The PwC scandal unfolded over many years. Our regulatory machinery—the ATO, the Tax Practitioners Board, Treasury—did not have the tools and, some say, perhaps the vigour to catch unethical behaviour in a timely way. Our institutions, their regulation, their penalties, are not fit for purpose. The fox cleaned up the henhouse and took the profit home for years.</para>
<para>After hiding behind trumped-up legal professional privilege for years, the leadership of PwC failed to deal transparently with this scandal. At first they called it an administrative issue, and then they adopted what's widely perceived as a fall-guy strategy, seeing one of the partners, Mr Peter Collins, off as a sacrificial lamb when much evidence points to the sizeable number of PwC partners and personnel who shared confidential information and monetised it in Australia and globally. PwC have conducted multiple internal investigations, including the Switkowski review, the Linklaters review, the Allens review, the Mallesons review. Only one of those reviews has been made public; the rest remain a mystery. Self-regulation and secrecy remains their preference. PwC has relied on these reviews to give most of their partners in Australia and all of those in the rest of the world a clean bill of health regarding the tax leak scandal.</para>
<para>Nonetheless, the Senate, through its committees, has persisted. With the assistance of skilled journalists and whistleblowers and insiders from across the community—lawyers, big four staff and partners, contractors, consultants, employees, public servants—we have persisted with their assistance. We have persisted united across the parties in this place against the automatic, vigorous, protective, legalistic and administrative playbook reflexes of partners and CEOs in big consulting firms, those who find the power of Senate questions and of written questions on notice, protected as they are by parliamentary privilege, inconvenient. They contest and they resist them even as I speak today. However, the Australian people are watching. They will not see their Senate held in contempt. They will not tolerate their senators being picked off, pressured, briefed against, divided, intimidated or held in contempt. They will not tolerate the misleading of the Senate.</para>
<para>The protections provided by the parliament against threat and intimidation for witnesses and senators have been essential to our work to ensure we are protected from threat and intimidation and allowed to get on with the task that we have been elected to do—to investigate a massive failure in PwC affecting the public purse and so many individuals, not least thousands of employees and partners across the big consultancies, many of them innocent of any tax related confidentiality breach. Old habits in big entities die hard. They resist and push back. However, our work in the Senate is the only reason that this action is now being taken. Apologies and promises of making good and cooperation with the Senate take more than words. They are reflected in deeds and in the way you behave. Recourse to threat and intimidation, a failure to be transparent or honest, or a reflexive retreat into legal or administrative tactics to old habits are not evidence of good faith. They're not evidence of a changed culture.</para>
<para>And what of those who work for big consultants? We have seen powerful light shed on the conditions of working life within the big four through the Switkowski report on PwC and Elizabeth Broderick's meticulous review of life inside EY. The dominance of partnership structures driven by a focus on revenue and a whatever-it-takes approach to earning it have resulted in unsafe environments where unethical behaviour has fallen at the first hurdle and where speaking up has met with a punitive response too many times. The experiences of racism and sexual harassment and the impact of long hours documented in EY, for example, have cast a long shadow over many employees and their families. While big consultants like EY, PwC, Deloitte and KPMG have promised a new age of a speak-up culture and of ethical practice, I am concerned about what I'm hearing right now about some of the ways in which job losses are being experienced across the big four and the ways in which they're being implemented.</para>
<para>It is vital that any such job losses are implemented through proper processes using clear and transparent criteria, criteria that are open and fair and do not especially target, for example, those who speak up, those who have spoken up, people with health issues, those on parental leave or disproportionately hit those of diverse cultural backgrounds or women. How these decisions are being made is of interest to those of us in the Senate and more broadly in our community, who hold concerns about leadership promises made by big consultancies to the Senate, promises of new cultures, of fair, ethical leadership and management. It takes more than words. It's also what we do and how we do it.</para>
<para>Through these recent events, our tax regulatory system has shown itself inadequate in the face of wily, unethical players who chase money at any cost. The organisations responsible for raising this scandal and investigating it, the ATB and the TPB, did not communicate with each other effectively or alert other relevant agencies. Despite the ATO and TPB being aware of Peter Collins breaching a confidentiality agreement, Treasury continued to sign confidentiality agreements with him. We need to renovate these structures. After years in which this behaviour unfolded without penalty or action, finally the TPB investigated Peter Collins and PwC. However, their two-year suspension of Collin's tax licence and no penalty so far for PwC the entity or many others within PwC who shared confidential information was completely inadequate. When the ATO found serious wrongdoing on the part of PwC and their enormous use of professional legal privilege in an attempt to cover their tracks, the ATO negotiated a confidentiality agreement that cut the penalty to slightly more than half the original amount of $1.4 million, saving them a tidy $758,000. The TPB's response to PwC the entity represents no more than a slap on the wrist. The TPB should have done more. It should have investigated PwC more broadly, and we are awaiting further investigations as I speak.</para>
<para>When our regulators fail to properly uncover and condemn actions like we have seen and take action which is modest or halved in the case of fines, they send a message. They send a message to big players in the tax advisory business and consultancy that they have friends in high places, that they might escape with just a slap on the wrist. The Australian public know this is not good enough. That's why they're so angry and they're looking for stronger action. Our regulatory system has been ineffective because elements of it are captured and too often influenced by particular interests inside the big four, who exercise way too much effect. The fox has long been in the henhouse, setting its culture, convivially regulating itself and its cosy fraternity.</para>
<para>At the time of the PwC scandal, 43 per cent of members of the Tax Practitioners Board were current or former big four partners, including two former PwC partners who were receiving ongoing financial payments from PwC. When the scandal broke, these partners recused themselves from the specific board meetings that considered the PwC issue. However, their presence in the organisation gives rise to perceptions of conflicts of interest, and they should not have been at this table. The TPB is the board that's responsible for regulating tax agents and responsible for investigating elements of the PwC scandal. If you are responsible for regulating tax agents but have financial ties to those same tax agents, there is a significant and insurmountable conflict of interest. This is a text bookcase of regulatory capture. It should not be a feature of our tax system. It should not be a feature of any element of a robust democracy, and it must be eliminated in Australia.</para>
<para>Our amendments aim to address this issue and this particular problem. Through this work and this amendment, we've fixed the loophole that allows big consultants to regulate themselves, taking an important step in safeguarding tax revenue from the hungry profiteers of the big four consultancies. We thank the government and we thank Minister Jones and his staff for the work that has been undertaken to bring this to us today. We look forward to more work and more consultation into the future to fix the many other challenges. This amendment and some of the key steps in this bill will go some way, a short way of a longer distance we need to travel, to restore Australia's confidence in our tax regulatory system. We have plenty more miles to travel to fix other significant problems that continue to afflict the large consultancies in this country.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:10</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WALSH</name>
    <name.id>252157</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>It's great to see so much excitement from the opposition about the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. In general there should be more focus on our TLABs that make their way through the Senate Economics Committee. This is a pretty basic bill that's about some basic integrity measures—measures like schedule 5 on franked distributions funded by capital raisings, which those opposite announced in the 2016-17 MYEFO and then promptly did absolutely nothing about. This is a measure that's now made its way through a Treasury consultation, into legislation, through the House and across to the Senate Economics Committee. Now it's finally here, having gone through all the processes that those opposite never bothered to complete. On this side of the chamber, we are committed to integrity in our tax system: improving compliance, closing tax loopholes and enhancing transparency to ensure there's revenue for the essential services Australians need. That's exactly what this bill does—nothing more, nothing less. That's what everyday Australians expect to ensure that vital services can be funded.</para>
<para>Like any good TLAB that excites all of us on the Senate Economics Committee, this bill has a range of measures to improve our treasury laws. I chaired the inquiry into this bill earlier this year. We heard evidence from a number of stakeholders and individual Australians on these reforms. I take this opportunity to thank everyone who took the opportunity to submit their feedback. We heard why these changes are much needed, how they modernise Australia and how they increase integrity and transparency and hold our tax professionals to account. During the inquiry process we also heard about opportunities for better targeting of some of the measure. On schedules 1 and 2, the Australian Shareholders Association told us of their support for ensuring that Australia is in line with best international reporting standards. Chartered Accountants Australia and New Zealand and Certified Practising Accountants Australia consider these schedules to be an important milestone in Australia's progress to align with international advancements in consistent sustainability reporting. As has been noted in this debate, schedule 3 will help ensure that high standards of conduct are followed in the tax industry. The need for these reforms has been made very clear by the excellent work of both Senator Pocock, who spoke earlier, and Senator O'Neill, on the Senate Economics Committee. It's crucial that issues like these don't go unpunished or undetected. These reforms will empower the Tax Practitioners Board to better deal with misconduct, and they've been welcomed by industry. We welcome amendments which further strengthen the Tax Practitioners Board, as foreshadowed by Senator Pocock.</para>
<para>Schedule 4 adds greater integrity to our dividend imputation system. It ensures that some of the biggest and most profitable corporations in Australia can't exploit tax loopholes and use the taxpayer to partly subsidise their share buybacks. It is simply about aligning tax arrangements so that off-market and on-market share buybacks receive the same treatment. It's common sense. It shuts down an exploitative practice that risks government revenue, and it enhances the integrity of the tax system and ensures that shareholders are treated fairly and equitably. The Institute of Public Accountants have been advocating for these reforms since 2016, and they described the issue at hand neatly, saying:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Franking credits belong to all shareholders, and streaming credits to a particular shareholder class is usually prohibited as it is inequitable and inconsistent with the fundamental principles of our imputation system.</para></quote>
<para>Professors Brown and Davis told the committee:</para>
<quote><para class="block">We believe that the changes proposed are well founded based on economic logic, principles of fair and equitable treatment of shareholders, ease and consistency of regulatory implementation, and strongly support the proposed measures. This is good legislation.</para></quote>
<para>This bill tackles a range of important issues across Treasury laws. Schedule 5 is an example of needed reforms to continue to deter bad behaviour and ensure that it cannot resume. It will ensure that companies cannot raise capital purely for the purpose of making franked distributions, which is bad for consumers, bad for the budget, and bad for shareholders. There needs to be an economic purpose to capital-raising and we all agree on that. The work of the ATO has meant that this dodgy practice has dried up, but this bill is critical to rule it out conclusively. Our amendments, informed by the Senate inquiry in the usual process, will further target the measure to the mischief that we all agree needs to be addressed.</para>
<para>These reforms will go a long way to improving integrity, modernising Australia and treating shareholders fairly, so naturally, they're being opposed and attacked in part by those opposite. Now, this is a coalition, we must all remember, that doesn't even have a shadow financial services minister to speak on the issues at hand. I know Mr Robert, the former member for Fadden, has been gone for almost six months. There are many people who would be very well qualified to take up such a position in the Senate. There are a few of them sitting opposite me right now but we know that those opposite don't have anyone. We know that's because they're so divided they can't even agree to replace someone who's been gone for six months but they want to come in here and tell us how to handle a portfolio that they don't even have a spokesperson for.</para>
<para>We know, because they lack a shadow minister, the Senate is the only place to have a go at a basic integrity bill to audition for the role that should be filled, that needs to be filled. We know that if you took this seriously—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Walsh, please resume your seat. Senator Smith, on a point of order?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Dean Smith</name>
    <name.id>241710</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I'm hoping that Senator Walsh might fast-forward to why the Prime Minister thought it necessary to break his promise.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>There was no point of order, as you well knew, but I will remind senators that when senators are speaking in the chamber, they deserve the respect of being heard in silence. Senator Walsh, please continue.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WALSH</name>
    <name.id>252157</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Yes, I repeat: it was left up to the Labor government many years later to implement your commitment in 2016-17 MYEFO to actually implement what we have done with schedule 5 on franked distributions funded by capital raisings, and we are proud to do so to add integrity and transparency to our tax system and to the way that those measures operate. It is extraordinary that we are going to have so much opposition to, as I understand it, schedule 4 and schedule 5, again, when the opposition does not even have a person who is empowered to speak on these issues, does not have a shadow minister. We know that they're all here auditioning for the role. We look forward to all of the contributions to audition for the role which has been left vacant for six months while you show your complete disregard for integrity in our financial system by refusing that position.</para>
<para>But what we have in front of us is actually a straightforward TLAB bill. It is a straightforward bill that's gone through the usual processes. It's been consulted a lot. It's gone through the Senate committee. Perspectives have been sought. Amendments are being put. This bill gets the balance right. We are not wasting any time, unlike those opposite, delivering on transparency and integrity. Australians have voted for government that will deliver transparency and integrity, and that is exactly what we are doing with this bill. I commend it to the Senate.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:19</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BRAGG</name>
    <name.id>256063</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>It's a real pleasure to be able to rise to speak about the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. I will be talking about franking credits today. That is, I think, the most important part of this bill. The context here, of course, is that the Prime Minister said—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator, I remind you to stop interjecting and to allow the speaker to continue on. Senator Bragg, you have the call.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BRAGG</name>
    <name.id>256063</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Righto. That's good. That's very nice. Thank you. The Prime Minister, Mr Albanese, said in the last parliament, before the last election, 'We won't have any changes to the franking credits regime.' That was a good commitment from the now Prime Minister. In addition, Mr Chalmers said, 'We won't be doing franking credits. I couldn't be clearer than that.' I guess that means that the Prime Minister and the Treasurer decided that it wasn't a good idea to tell the Australian people that they would be doing franking credits. Therefore, they would only do something to franking credits if they were to win the election, and then they would be able to do what they really wanted to do, which, of course, is what the Treasury department have recommended to them, which they have swallowed hook, line and sinker.</para>
<para>The whole basis of this schedule, schedule 7, is based on pretty dodgy data. It has no real basis, and it could actually disrupt the whole franking system. For Australian companies that seek to raise capital—which, of course, is every company, because I don't know any company which has a balance sheet of 100 per cent debt—when they go to the market to raise equity capital, they will find it difficult to pay franked dividends. That is what this is all about. Can a company go to the market—a small company or a large company; it doesn't matter—raise equity capital and pay a franked dividend? That's what this is all about. The judgement of the legal experts and the people that are in the markets is that this change puts this whole model at risk.</para>
<para>It may be obvious to others who are listening today that this is happening for a particular reason. The only reason I can diagnose here is that the government decided that it would need to capture some more revenue to pay for its spending. Of course, the issue with fiscal policy is that the government has been working against the Reserve Bank. Australian families have had to endure 12 interest rate rises, more than they should have, because the government's fiscal policy does not support monetary policy. That is the core problem that the Australian economy has today. The government in Canberra is spending money and inflating the federal budget when it should be deflating the federal budget. It should be running a contractionary fiscal stance. That is what the country needs to support the tightening policy of the Reserve Bank.</para>
<para>But what we have in Canberra is a government that is not able to say no to the rent-seekers and the bloodsuckers and all the vested interests which run the Labor Party, finance their campaigns, man their polling places and run their preselections. They can't say no to these people on money. We know that the Commonwealth public servant base is swelling by the day. It's getting bigger and bigger and bigger. So Labor can't say no on money, but they also can't say no on policy. What we have seen in these last 18 months is a cavalcade of rent-seekers and bloodsuckers running the policy agenda of this government, whether it is on industrial relations or whether it is in the Treasury portfolio. What we see is a parliament clogged up with bills to suit narrow vested interests, not the national interest.</para>
<para>In fact, the first act of the minister responsible for taxation, the Assistant Treasurer, Mr Jones, in this parliament was to introduce a regulation that would strip transparency away from superannuation members so they would not be able to see if their super fund was paying a whole bunch of money to a union. He didn't want the Australian people to see that. I don't think you can find any better example of the warped agenda of 'the government for vested interests' than their first act, to remove transparency from the people to suit the super funds and the unions. So we shouldn't be surprised that the consequence of the government for vested interests running policy and the budget in favour of the rent-seekers is that we see a desire for new taxes—and that is effectively what we have here.</para>
<para>This is not a large improvement to the budget, but it is still a tax increase, which the government promised it wouldn't do. It promised that it wouldn't be doing anything to franking credits. It promised that. So we go back to 22 October last year and the government's first budget, and there it is in the budget papers—a proposal to disrupt franking credits, particularly in relation to capital raisings. The problem here is that it sets out an established practice test. That is a problem with this proposal. It may well work for you, if you're a large company that's been paying the same franked dividends for 10 years. You can probably keep doing that. But if you are a new company—and most new companies are small and disruptive—you haven't got an established practice test, so, therefore, you cannot pay a franked dividend. When you raise money—as all companies do because every company needs equity capital—as far as I can see, you won't be able to pay a franked dividend. That is the reality.</para>
<para>We did an inquiry through the Senate Standing Committee on Economics. I don't agree with everything that Senator Walsh said before, but I do think that she does a good job in chairing the Economics Legislation Committee. The inquiry looked into these issues, and the inquiry found, even in the government's own report, that there were problems with this section—that the drafting was bad and would put capital raisings at risk and would cause companies not to raise capital in Australia. Companies would seek to raise more debt and pay less tax, or they might look to establish a domicile offshore, or they might seek to raise foreign equity, where, of course, there are no franking credits paid. So that is the warped situation we have with this established practice test. It's very poorly drafted. Even the government said it was bad, and their proposed amendments do little to assist there.</para>
<para>The reality is that this measure is based on data from 2015-16, when the MYEFO costed this—if there were to be a measure like this—as a boost to the budget of $10 million. During the committee's inquiry into the bill, I asked the Treasury official, Ms Brown, 'How a big a problem is this in the Australian capital markets today?' By 'how big a problem', I'm talking about the problem the government say they're trying to solve, which is that companies are raising equity just to pay franked dividends. I think that's the proposition. It's actually not clear why this is happening, other than it's important to have more money to pay for the expenditure that we want to make, including hiring an endless group of new public servants in Canberra. Ms Brown said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Currently, because of the early action by the ATO in issuing an alert and the announcement of the former government's intention to introduce legislation and subsequently the development of legislation, there aren't any cases of this.</para></quote>
<para>So if there are no cases of this issue then why are we today debating this measure, which is going to have a significant impact on Australia's capital markets? That is the question, I think, for the chamber: why are we pursuing a measure—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator, it being 1.30, the debate is interrupted. You will be in continuation when we go back to this. We will now move on to two-minute statements.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>STATEMENTS BY SENATORS</title>
        <page.no>14</page.no>
        <type>STATEMENTS BY SENATORS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Eugowra: Floods</title>
          <page.no>14</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:30</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVEY</name>
    <name.id>281697</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I can only imagine the experience of living through a one-in-5,000 year event as the residents of Eugowra did 12 months ago, on 14 November 2022. I can only imagine the horror of living through the speed and the noise of that event. My thoughts and prayers are with the families of the two residents who lost their lives.</para>
<para>Having visited the region a couple of times at the invitation of Cabonne Council, I am always heartened to see the community spirit and the resilience. I was told about the hours of the crisis, the mass evacuations by boat and helicopter and then, in the days, weeks, and months that followed, the effort to clean up and rebuild. I was told about the local Catholic school that was absolutely devastated but then very quickly cleaned up, with temporary classrooms built and students back at school; about a pop-up cafe that was operational within days of the floods so that people could come together, swap their stories and rely on each other; and about farmers who lost everything—crops, machinery, fencing and livestock—but are back on the land.</para>
<para>The one question, though, that didn't get answered at the time was: why did the Central West of New South Wales get treated differently to the Northern Rivers? The Nationals asked this question of the Prime Minister a few months ago, not once but twice, and it was only this last week that further funding for the Central West Recovery and Resilience Package was announced. I welcome that funding, but I urge the government to progress the housing consultation program with priority so that the people of Eugowra can also have a home resilience package.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>National Agriculture Day</title>
          <page.no>14</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:32</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator CICCONE</name>
    <name.id>281503</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>This Friday is AgDay, a day to celebrate and learn about Australia's agriculture sector. I'm a proud supporter of Australian farmers, as many are in this place, and I think this year's AgDay theme of 'Grow you good thing' is very fitting, as the sector grows from strength to strength. Through the hard work of Australian farmers and their workers and by working with the government, the ag sector is inching ever closer to its goal of being a $100 billion industry.</para>
<para>In response to disrupted international supply chains and trade barriers, farmers have done an outstanding job in diversifying their export markets. But I'm also proud that the federal government is committed to reducing those trade barriers. Through our calm and considered approach, Australia's relationship with one of our largest trading partners is stabilising. Trade has resumed in cotton, timber, hay and barley, and now China is also reviewing its tariffs on Australian wine. This is all great news for our ag sector. Trade is essential for Australian farmers, as more than 70 per cent of our farm production is exported.</para>
<para>Trade isn't just about opening trade with one particular country. Last year, we recorded around 107 technical market access achievements for Australian producers, worth around $5.47 billion. The Albanese government has also improved access for Australian producers to sell avocados to Thailand, stone fruit to Vietnam, mangoes to Japan, dairy to Chile, seafood to Israel and sheepmeat to the Middle East. So the trade opportunities for Australian farmers are certainly growing, just as they grow world-class food and fibre for both domestic and international consumers. Happy AgDay to all the farmers and workers who make our ag sector such a great— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Youth Voice in Parliament Week</title>
          <page.no>14</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:34</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATERS</name>
    <name.id>192970</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I'm proud once again to be taking part in the annual Raise Our Voice in Parliament campaign, amplifying the voices of young women and gender-diverse people nationally in parliament about the issues that matter to them. Today I'll use my two-minute statement to share the words of 16-year-old Lola Hamilton from Queensland. Lola says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Our world is dying. Within the next 10 years the world will pass a dangerous temperature threshold which we cannot come back from—unless drastic action happens. Beyond that threshold, natural disasters will become so extreme that people will not be able to adapt and heat, famines and infection diseases will claim millions of lives.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Australia ranks eighth highest in the world for its emissions per capita and first for coal power emissions per capita. As a relatively wealthy country who is proud of 'punching above its weight', why has more not been done about the climate crisis? There has been decades of climate policy inaction and modest targets thus there is a lot of low hanging fruit for Australia to rachet up its climate ambition. This includes renewable energy, energy efficiency and transport.</para></quote>
<para>Lola continues:</para>
<quote><para class="block">A solution for this climate crisis would be investing more funding into climate change action from the government. It needs to be made more of a priority. The funding that has gone into climate change from the government in Australia has been labelled critically insufficient. If Australia truly wants to carry its weight as a developed country, we need to start investing more and setting more ambitious goals to create a better place for the future generations that want to thrive in this beautiful place.</para></quote>
<para>Thank you, Lola, for your thoughtful contribution. I'm really proud to amplify and echo your call for stronger climate action and to remind the chamber that the voices of young people need to be heard in this place. It would be great if we could lower the voting age and get more young people elected.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Rotary Australia Repurposing Equipment</title>
          <page.no>15</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:36</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SCARR</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to pay tribute to the Rotary Club of Archerfield for its successful delivery of another container of medical equipment to our Pacific family—in this case, to Nadi Hospital in Fiji. Now, this successful delivery of a container of medical equipment, which included beds and very technical medical equipment such as ultrasound machines, is part of an ongoing program in the northern region of Rotary in Australia, referred to as the Rotary Australia Repurposing Equipment initiative, which has been undertaken since 1 July 1990. So, for 33 years, Rotary members across the north of Australia have been consolidating medical equipment and medical supplies which are beyond their useful date in an Australian context and delivering them to our Pacific family.</para>
<para>Just consider these figures in terms of the number of containers, and we're talking large containers, that have been delivered in the course of those 33 years: 730 containers to Papua New Guinea, 156 containers to Solomon Islands, 61 to Fiji and 127 to other destinations. The total number of containers is 1,074, representing $61.9 million of medical equipment and supplies, including 9,227 hospital beds, 500 patient trolleys, 4,211 wheelchairs, 6,027 mattresses, 21,480 hospital linen bags—and the list goes on.</para>
<para>Congratulations to all the members of Archerfield Rotary and to all Rotary members who have been involved in this outstanding project. From my perspective, when we look around the world in these dark times, you represent the very best of Australian values.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Youth Voice in Parliament Week</title>
          <page.no>15</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:38</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PRATT</name>
    <name.id>I0T</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Today I put on the record the words of Ashleigh, who is aged 14, as part of Raise Your Voice in Parliament. I want to say thank you to Ashleigh for putting the needs of children in Australia on the record and helping me to do that. Ashleigh says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">A very important topic to me as a young girl living in Australia is the fact that more and more children everywhere are ending up in the streets and living in unliveable circumstances.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">it can happen to anyone but yet no one will give kids a break if they are.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">I've heard kids at my school make fun of others because their uniform is ratty or unwashed over a weekend.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">But no one ever seems to wonder why it's that way.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Is it just the way things are or is society building these terrible habits of judging before even trying to understand a person's situation.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Neither are good options, and our government is not doing enough, how is a kid meant to go to school get good grades, then come home and have to try and help their parents make ends meet.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">All while also being a normal kid.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This situation is lose lose.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Focus on school and lose the house, focus on their houses cleanliness they flunk school and lose the house anyway, work to help keep the house, the house becomes horribly neglected and your school works not done.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Why should any kid live like this?</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">If a child is in these situations their mental health will rapidly decline and leave them in a terrible condition.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">They will be stuck and continue the cycle of poverty they were either born into or thrown into.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Is this something we want for the future of our country?</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">I am calling on the government to save the youth of Australia and offer some free deep cleanings of unliveable standards of housing, without stigma.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Some extra support for children like tutoring if they can't afford it themselves and Centrelink payments raised.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We need to focus more on Australian citizens and less on tourists who will be here for a week or two.</para></quote>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Parliamentary Conduct</title>
          <page.no>15</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:40</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Over the last few months, we've tried to do the right thing by the government over here. We tried to split a bill which is terribly contentious, leaving all the contentious parts off to one side and having all the parts where we know we've got the numbers and that are not contentious. They include that first responders suffering PTSD are recognised without fighting and that domestic violence victims are not being discriminated against in the workplace. We've tried to bring silica into line with asbestos and we're making sure that workers are getting redundancy payments.</para>
<para>For our efforts to do that, this is what's happened in the last week and a half. This is what I want to show you about bullying in this place. Last week, I asked for a pair so I could go see some veterans last Friday. I gave you a week's notice. On the Friday morning, because I was out there, going for the cause for these people, because we wanted to split the bill and do the right thing, you said no. Yesterday, I asked so I could go and spend an hour last night with some veterans who are town and who are sick. You told me, no, I couldn't be paired. What you are doing Friday to Senator Tyrrell, just so you know—Senator Tyrrell would like to be paired Friday. Do you know why? Because her only niece, her sister's daughter, is walking out of police training and becoming a copper in Tasmania. But you know what you're doing? You're bastardising Senator Tyrrell. This is what you are doing. You won't give her a pair, because we don't agree with the legislation that you are putting through. You know what? That is bastardising or, as we like to call it when there is a relationship going on—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Lambie, can you please resume your seat? Can you please withdraw the unparliamentary term that you used?</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>With all due respect, it's called bastardisation in the military. It is bastardising.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I have asked you if you would withdraw that unparliamentary language. We had this conversation last week. Would you please withdraw.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I ask that you get advice from the clerk.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I don't want to take up your time that you have available to you, but I have made a ruling and I've asked you to withdraw the unparliamentary language, please.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I withdraw. Let's say you're bullying because that's what you're doing: you are bullying. After the Kate Jenkins report, this is how you present it. It's okay to do this sort of stuff to workers. It's coercive power. That is what you're using on Senator Tyrrell, and it's absolutely disgraceful. You should be disgusted with yourselves.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Before Senator Rennick starts his speech, I ask senators to refrain from using language that we know is unparliamentary, and then I don't have to pull anyone up.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Vaccination</title>
          <page.no>16</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:43</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator RENNICK</name>
    <name.id>283596</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to speak on the $100 million given to the World Health Organization by the Albanese Labor government to prevent, prepare for and respond to future pandemics. I find it quite amazing that the federal government thinks it can find $100 million to spend on bureaucrats over in Switzerland rather than addressing and trying to sort out the issues from the last pandemic. We know that the Albanese Labor government said that they were going to have a royal commission into COVID, and they've effectively backed down on that. They're going to have a bunch of bureaucrats—a professional experts team of three—look at this issue, and they won't allow a Senate inquiry to occur.</para>
<para>To put it in perspective, $10 million has been paid out so far to 155 people who have made vaccine injury claims. The budget from the year before last had $77 million for people suffering vaccine injuries. In last year's budget, it was reduced to $27 million. I think it's absolutely disgusting that we can spend so much money on bureaucrats living in other countries to prepare for the next pandemic but not address issues from the last pandemic. I speak to people injured by the vaccine every day. My office is inundated with people who have gone through the protocols and gotten specialists saying they've had an injury, and Services Australia won't address the issue. I think that it's about time they took it seriously. I've had ex-bureaucrats from the TGA themselves dispute what's going on with the way these people are treated. I think that the Albanese federal government needs to get its priorities straight. It needs to look after the people injured from the vaccine here in Australia before handing out any more money to overseas organisations.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Transport Industry</title>
          <page.no>16</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator STERLE</name>
    <name.id>e68</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I just want to clarify something. I talk to every transport operators association and union in this nation—the Western Roads Federation, the Northern Territory Road Transport Association, the Victorian Transport Association, the Tasmanian Transport Association, the Queensland Trucking Association Ltd, NatRoad Australia, the Transport Workers Union, the Australian Trucking Association, the South Australian Road Transport Association, Road Freight NSW and the National Road Freighters Association. These represent thousands and thousands of big and small companies, owners and drivers. The TWU has thousands of owner-drivers, and all of them say to me very clearly that they fully support—it's in writing—getting the closing the loopholes legislation through to address all sorts of problems in this nation and to make the trucking industry safe, sustainable, viable and profitable.</para>
<para>I've been talking to them for many, many years. I come from that industry, as everyone knows. It amazes me—I saw some footage the other night of the shadow minister for transport and infrastructure, the Liberal-National Senator McKenzie, saying the whole of industry doesn't want this bill passed. In all fairness, I don't expect her to have the contacts I have, and I understand when we have debates and differences of opinions. I have no problem with that. But, when you make a statement like, 'I've spoken to industry about that and industry have said, "We don't want this,"' well, sorry. I just want to say to Senator McKenzie, if you've spoken to industry, come and do what I do. Come and stand in the Senate—being well mannered, without using foul language—and actually tell us who you are talking to. I have a contact list of owner-drivers in this nation. No-one would come near the number of owner-drivers whose phone numbers I have and who have mine. I run the roadhouse toilets and showers campaign that we've been doing for years. But, Senator McKenzie, you're not talking to industry, and, if you are, shut me up. Come and tell me who you are talking to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Environment: Swift Parrots</title>
          <page.no>17</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:47</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKIM</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Right now, Forestry Tasmania is destroying native forest in coupe KD022C, part of the Kermandie Divide in south-east Tasmania. This is a disgraceful act of wanton destruction. The Kermandie Divide is known as a stronghold for swift parrots, being a key and recurrent nesting area for that species. The swiftie is a beautiful little bird that is listed as critically endangered by both the Australian government and the International Union for the Conservation of Nature. The latest expert advice is that there are fewer than 750 swift parrots left. That's just a handful compared to the vast flocks of the past. It is being logged into extinction by the Tasmanian Liberal government with the enthusiastic support of the federal Labor government.</para>
<para>The Bob Brown Foundation has run a citizen science project in coupe KD022C, which recorded a swift parrot in the coupe on 26 September, just before logging commenced. Since then, swift parrots have been recorded more than 20 times inside the boundary of that coupe while it is being actively logged by Forestry Tasmania. It is beyond disgraceful that Forestry Tasmania is knowingly destroying swift parrot habitat while there are birds in that coupe. I give a shout-out to the brave activists who right now are defending Tasmania's native forests in that coupe, particularly the three people that have been arrested inside that coupe while defending swift parrots and their habitat. Those forest defenders are the true heroes of our time. History will thank them, just as history will rightly condemn the politicians who are enabling the ongoing destruction of Tasmania's native forests. End native forest logging and end it now.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing and Homelessness</title>
          <page.no>17</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:50</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVID POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>256136</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>This morning I helped launch the Rental Affordability Index with National Shelter and SGS Economics & Planning. It would be no surprise to those in this place that Australia's housing system is hurting more and more Australians. Many people in communities across the country are being pushed to the brink by rapidly rising rents and mortgage payments that are making the cost-of-living crisis far more stressful. The national median rent for capital city units has risen by an extraordinary 40 per cent since mid 2021, and over the past year, those high advertised rents have been flowing through the wider rental market, with many existing tenants being hit with the biggest increases they will have ever known. The figures released today reveal new and disturbing dimensions to this crisis. They have brought together rent and income data that gives us a more informative analysis than simply viewing rents in isolation. I encourage my colleagues to look at the report that was released today.</para>
<para>The policy from the Albanese government, while welcome, is not doing anywhere near enough when it comes to housing. The increase in rental assistance announced in the budget will have slightly eased the pain for low-income renters, but a 15 per cent rise after many, many years of this being eroded is insufficient. The Housing Australia Future Fund, while a start, is insufficient. The government's national housing and homelessness plan must clearly quantify Australia's unmet housing needs and present a credible long-term strategy to fulfil them. Anything less than that would be an unforgivable policy failure. We cannot allow that to happen.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Beach Volleyball World Championships</title>
          <page.no>17</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:52</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator RUSTON</name>
    <name.id>243273</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Yesterday, I had the pleasure of meeting with Louise Bawden, who is one of our great beach volleyball athletes and an Olympic athlete, along with Volleyball Australia to celebrate the fact that my home state of South Australia has secured the 2025 Beach Volleyball World Championships, which is absolutely fantastic. This is only the third time that the beach volleyball championships have been held outside Europe and the first time in the Asia-Pacific region. It's fantastic for Australian volleyball. It's fantastic and a great opportunity for our volleyball players, for my home state and for the future of the game in Australia.</para>
<para>We know that hosting international sporting events not only provides the opportunity for our players to demonstrate their sporting prowess on the world stage and provides a critical pathway for elite athletes but inspires young people to participate, to get out there on the sand, get on the court or on the field and get active, which means that they are going to have a healthier lifestyle. This is the pipeline for our elite athletes, but most importantly, it encourages healthy and active communities here in Australia.</para>
<para>I'm super excited about the opportunity this will provide to my state. There will be $10 million worth of economic activity, and 15,000 personnel will be working on these games to showcase our city and our state on the world stage and promote our wonderful city and state as a great tourism destination. We've got a strong record of backing in good sporting events in South Australia, and we're very proud to be able to host the beach volleyball championships.</para>
<para>The South Australian government has put its money where its mouth is and is getting behind the championships and financially supporting them. I call on the Albanese government to back us in in South Australia on this important international event and make sure it supports us so that we can maximise the legacy opportunities for my state and this country through hosting another great international sporting event here in Australia.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Schools</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:54</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HANSON</name>
    <name.id>BK6</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Just when you thought it couldn't get worse in Queensland, school parents have been unpleasantly surprised by the government's suddenly allowing schools to switch to a four-day week from 2024. At a time when Australia's school education outcomes are falling against international benchmarks and teachers are leaving the sector in droves, the last thing we should do is shorten the school week.</para>
<para>Australia fell from 14th to 19th in 2023 rankings published by the OECD's Program for International Assessment, or PISA, with China and Singapore at the top. Our schoolkids are two years behind their counterparts in China and Singapore on science and maths. Back in 2017 UNICEF ranked Australian school education outcomes 39th out of 41 high- to middle-income countries. We're in the fifth year of the Gonski 2.0 reforms, a commitment to more than $300 billion dollars in additional spending, yet our standards and outcomes keep falling. Maybe if our schools stopped frightening kids about climate change or making five-year-olds write apologies for the British settlement of Australia, we'd have better outcomes. Apart from forcing COVID vaccines on them, teachers are leaving in droves because of undisciplined classrooms and heavy workloads. In addition to delivering a poor curriculum, they're taking on the roles of parents, counsellors and babysitters without adequate training or support. Cutting school hours in Queensland will only further dumb down our children. Over the decades we have allowed schools to become childcare centres and institutions to push political agendas instead of real information and useful life skills. What hope do we have for the future?</para>
<para>One Nation will fight this change at the Queensland state election, getting back to the basics that are the best foundation for a good education, and giving teachers better support. It's not about investing more money; it's getting the right people to do the job, and doing a four-day week is just absolutely— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>White Sharks Global</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:56</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WHISH-WILSON</name>
    <name.id>195565</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>We can protect great white sharks in Australia, and we can protect the people who share the ocean with them. It doesn't have to be one or the other. Great white sharks are a protected species in Australia, listed as vulnerable to extinction. But they're also the most feared predator in our oceans, rightly or wrongly. When we see a traumatic and tragic spate of events, as we've seen in South Australia in recent weeks where we've had surfers and swimmers bitten by white sharks, we inevitably get calls—populous and unscientific calls—to cull and kill sharks. I've got a lot of problems with that. Firstly, it doesn't work to reduce the risk of shark bites in Australia, and there are so many other things we can do.</para>
<para>I was lucky enough to be invited to go to Port Lincoln this weekend and speak at White Sharks Global, a meeting of 150 scientists and experts from around the world who have come to South Australia to discuss issues around white shark research, white shark behaviour, white shark conservation and, of course, how to reduce the risks of white sharks interacting with humans in our oceans. I know this is a matter of significant public importance in a place like South Australia, and I urge the South Australian Premier to get down to Port Lincoln this weekend. Take your advisers or get the relevant ministers and take the opportunity to meet with these experts who know what they're talking about. There are a lot of things that the South Australian government can do to reduce risks. Primarily, do what the Western Australian government has done and provide rebates to roll out personal shark deterrent devices. They can be very effective and make a big difference in this debate.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Middle East</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>13:58</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator VAN</name>
    <name.id>283601</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>On 7 October we were confronted by the harrowing scenes from Israel of innocent civilians subjected to brutal attacks, tragic loss of lives and the profound degradation of human dignity. Over 200 hostages were abducted, including a three-year-old toddler and a woman who has since delivered her newborn in captivity. Over a month later these innocent people have not been released or provided humanitarian aid. Hamas have even denied access to Red Cross and other aid organisations. We cannot allow this to continue. We cannot let this happen again. We have said for 70 years never again, and it's happening again. Israel asserts its right to defend itself and is dismantling the Hamas human shields, labyrinth of tunnels and command-and-control centres beneath hospitals. These are crucial steps towards achieving a lasting peace. Those calling for a ceasefire should note that Israel has already unilaterally implemented a four-hour humanitarian ceasefire each day to allow vital aid to reach those in need and to enable refugees to effectively and safely evacuate. Israeli soldiers are risking their lives in these humanitarian corridors, assisting Gazan civilians to move away from the conflict zone. Hamas are not returning that favour. Again I say, never again.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The time for two-minute statements has expired. We'll now move to question time.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE</title>
        <page.no>19</page.no>
        <type>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Immigration Detention</title>
          <page.no>19</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:00</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'SULLIVAN</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Wong, and relates to the High Court's ruling on immigration detention. This morning the<inline font-style="italic"> Australian</inline> newspaper reported that one of the individuals released from immigration detention following the High Court's ruling last week is 'a violent sex predator with a record of attacking elderly women in their own homes so chilling a judge branded him "a danger to the Australian community"'. Today the <inline font-style="italic">Guardian </inline>newspaper reported that one of the detainees who was released was convicted of two counts of rape and one of sexual assault. The <inline font-style="italic">Gua</inline><inline font-style="italic">rdian</inline> reports that the offence occurred at the victim's workplace when he held the victim 'up against a shelf in a blind spot without cameras in a retail store about 4 pm on a Thursday afternoon'. Last night the<inline font-style="italic"> Australian</inline> newspaper reported that one of those released was a person who was convicted of abducting a 28-year-old woman and 'fatally shooting her in a forest on the outskirts of Kuala Lumpur and blowing up her body with military-grade explosives'. What other types of offences were committed by those who have now been released?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:01</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank the senator for his question. I would make the point that the individuals who have now been released as a result of a High Court decision—which the government took a different view on in terms of the submissions; we expressed a different view—were obviously in detention at the time and no action was taken by those opposite to remove them from Australia. Of course, the Leader of the Opposition was the Minister for Home Affairs at that time. So I would make this point to the opposition, that—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Scarr</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Why couldn't they be?</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>You tell me. Why couldn't they be? I'll take that intervention. Maybe you should ask Mr Dutton that. Why could they not be removed from Australia? He didn't choose to take those steps.</para>
<para>I understand that Ms O'Neil and Mr Giles have today released a further statement in relation to community safety. We have ensured that ABF officials have briefed local, state and territory police on the possible implications of the case. That was prior to the court's final hearing. Immediately following, the AFP commissioner briefed, in person, the police commissioner of every state and territory on the outcome of the High Court's decision, including the expected numbers of individuals likely to be released by the High Court in each jurisdiction. On 10 November Operation AEGIS, which is a joint Australian Border Force and Australian Federal Police operation, was established, and it is managing the overall response of federal agencies and state and territory police. This operation was established before any person except the plaintiff had been— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator O'Sullivan, first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:03</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'SULLIVAN</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I refer to the Leader of the Government in the Senate's failure to answer a question from Senator Cash yesterday relating to the High Court ruling on indefinite detention. What are the consequences if one of the 80 people so far released under the High Court's orders violates the visa conditions the government has imposed on them? Can they be detained for breaching those conditions?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:03</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As we have made clear, individuals required to be released as a result of this decision by the High Court have been subject to a range of strict and mandatory visa conditions. These conditions include restricting the types of employment—</para>
<para><inline font-style="italic">An opposition senator interjecting</inline>—</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, I would like to invite you, if you would like to, to make a contribution about what you would do if faced with this High Court decision, bearing in mind that these people were in detention under your watch, and no resettlement, removal from Australia, was arranged.</para>
<para>Such conditions can include the restriction of types of employment, requiring regular reporting to authorities and requiring released detainees to report their personal details, including social media profiles, which are being actively monitored. In addition, the government has imposed daily reporting requirements for those with the most serious criminal history. This is in addition to any reporting requirements or orders imposed by state or territory laws. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator O'Sullivan, a second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:04</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'SULLIVAN</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, your government has moved with lightning speed to release these individuals in advance of the High Court's reasons. Australians now need to live with this risk, but the community still has no idea what you're going to do to protect them. Why can't you tell us what concrete steps you are taking? Why are you so quick to release these detainees but so slow to protect Australians?</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Cash</name>
    <name.id>I0M</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>What a great question!</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:05</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I notice that the shadow Attorney-General says, 'What a great question.' Are you seriously saying—is the opposition really saying—that they ought not comply with a decision of the High Court of Australia? Seriously? The senator says 'lightning speed'. We are required, as you would have been, to release them, because there is no constitutional basis for their detention. So, a criticism about a move at 'lightning speed' is a suggestion that the government ought not comply with the law—the Constitution. This is a constitutional democracy, whether we like the decision of the High Court or not. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Health Care</title>
          <page.no>20</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:06</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GREEN</name>
    <name.id>259819</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Health, Senator Gallagher. Minister, during the election campaign Labor committed to opening 50 Medicare urgent-care clinics across Australia. With these urgent-care clinics now being opened across the country, including, yesterday, a new Gold Coast clinic, could the minister please update the Senate on how many clinics have been opened across the country and how many people are using the centres and give any examples of how these Medicare urgent-care clinics are helping Australian families to access urgent care when they need it?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:07</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator Green for that excellent question about Medicare urgent-care clinics and how they are being rolled out across the country. I will update the chamber to let them know that there are 37 Medicare urgent-care clinics now open, including the Gold Coast Medicare urgent-care clinic, which opened yesterday. This is part of our commitment to roll out 58 urgent-care clinics right around Australia. The aim of these clinics is to make it easier for people to get the healthcare treatment they need from highly qualified health staff in a convenient and accessible way through these urgent-care clinics. They are designed to take pressure off the emergency departments, which all of us know are under extreme pressure at the moment, particularly with spring illnesses and things like that, and also to ensure that health care across Australia remains convenient and accessible through extended hours—seven-days-a-week, fully bulk billed or free-of-charge consultations. In just the months since these clinics have been opening around the country, there have been more than 60,000 presentations to Medicare urgent-care clinics. That's 60,000 presentations that either wouldn't have been seen or would have had long waits in the emergency department.</para>
<para>One of those patients—and I'm sure Senator Ruston will be pleased with this, because it's about a patient who attended a Medicare urgent-care clinic in Elizabeth, South Australia—arrived at the urgent-care clinic at 5.30 pm. He was triaged by a nurse within three minutes and seen by a doctor within 11 minutes. He left the urgent-care clinic at 6.02, just half an hour after he presented with what would have been a category 5 presentation and would have expected a long wait for treatment in an emergency department. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Green, a first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:09</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GREEN</name>
    <name.id>259819</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Urgent-care clinics is a new model of care being introduced to Australia. Why does the government consider it important to explore new approaches to health service delivery? And how do urgent-care clinics complement other steps the government is taking to strengthen Medicare?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:09</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The Manager of Opposition Business said, 'So what?' about one of her constituents being able to be seen, treated and discharged within half an hour of presenting at the Elizabeth urgent care clinic. I think that sums up everything we already knew about the opposition. We know they haven't seen a Medicare item they don't want to slash. They haven't seen a primary care budget they haven't wanted to put a GP tax on—remember that? Well, this government is different. We are big supporters of Medicare. We invest in Medicare.</para>
<para>It is a new model of care, despite what those opposite are shouting, and it is targeted to low-acuity, out-of-hours care for Australians who might otherwise have a long wait in an emergency department. We know nearly a third of the patients being seen by urgent care clinics have been under 15 years of age. Nearly a third have visited on the weekend, and on weekdays more than one in five have taken place after six o'clock. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Green, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:10</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GREEN</name>
    <name.id>259819</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, one of the aims of opening Medicare urgent care clinics is to help ease the pressure on busy emergency departments across the country. This is yet another example of how the government is working for Australians while the opposition continues to provide no solutions. Why is this important, and what policies have previous governments implemented to address these challenges?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:11</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator Green for that question. One of the big differences between the former government and ours is we want to work with states and territories to deal with and support the work that they do across the health system through their primary responsibility, hospital led care, and through how the primary care system works. We work with them, we cooperate with them, and we are happy to partner with them to make sure that Australians get access to the best type of health care in the most convenient and affordable way possible. That is what urgent care clinics do. That's why you're all so quiet now: because you know they are very popular and they're delivering exactly what we set out to do.</para>
<para>It is in stark contrast to the approach taken by those opposite. We remember it was in Mr Dutton's days as the health minister—remember he was voted, I think, the 'worst health minister in the country'—when he cut $200 million from a national partnership in public hospital services that was explicitly there to reduce emergency department wait. You cut; we invest.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Protest Activity</title>
          <page.no>21</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:12</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FAWCETT</name>
    <name.id>DYU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Wong. Minister, yesterday you declined to answer whether the Prime Minister had spoken with representatives of Australia's Jewish community since the threatening events that occurred targeting their communities in Melbourne and Sydney over the weekend. I ask the question again: has the Prime Minister spoken to representatives of Australia's Jewish community regarding those events?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:12</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I can indicate that I have. I will take on notice whether or not the Prime Minister has had engagement since the weekend, but I would say to you it is the case that Australia's Jewish community are deeply distressed, as I said this morning. There is a history, obviously, to the persecution of the Jewish people, and the 7 October attacks by Hamas was a day on which more Jewish lives were lost in a single day than in any day since the Holocaust. That of itself is traumatising, and since then we have seen a rise in prejudice and hate. We've seen antisemitism on the rise. I would also say we have seen Islamophobia and other forms of prejudice also on the rise, hence my comments this morning about division. I think it is important to affirm in this place that we all stand against those forms of hatred. We all stand against antisemitism. I would also repeat the comments I made two days ago on <inline font-style="italic">Insiders</inline>: Australians have a right to feel and be safe. Australia's Jewish community has a right to feel and be safe. As the Prime Minister has said as well, the events in Caulfield were the wrong thing to do. I think other events have been intimidating. So I do understand why it is people feel distressed, and we need to affirm our support for that—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Minister. Senator Fawcett, first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:14</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FAWCETT</name>
    <name.id>DYU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, you've just said that all Australians, including Australia's Jewish community, have a right to feel and be safe. They are expressing fears about displaying religious symbols, wearing religious garments or even wearing Jewish school uniforms in public. So what specific measures has the federal government taken to alleviate these concerns, and has the Prime Minister spoken to state and territory premiers and leaders to coordinate measures to support Australia's Jewish community?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:15</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>In part, this is a legal framework question which is obviously both federal legislation—including the Racial Discrimination Act, section 18C, which has a history in this place—and an issue of state and territory laws and police and policing conduct. What I would also say, though, is that part of how we affirm people's right to feel and be safe is also how we behave and what we say and do. I acknowledge, despite our many political differences and his occasional criticism of me, the leader of the opposition in this place and the whole opposition, who supported a bipartisan motion. I think that was very important.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Fawcett?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Fawcett</name>
    <name.id>DYU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I have a point of order. The question was specifically: has the Prime Minister engaged with premiers and leaders of the territories to coordinate actions to support our Jewish communities?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I believe the minister is being relevant. Senator Fawcett, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:16</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FAWCETT</name>
    <name.id>DYU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, the Prime Minister didn't convene a National Security Committee meeting immediately following the 7 October terrorist attack by Hamas on innocent civilians in Israel. Will he now convene a meeting of National Cabinet to address the concerns of Australia's Jewish community about their safety and to secure a joint statement of all Australian heads of government against antisemitism and in support of the rights of Australians in our Jewish community?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:17</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I would make the point that the government has made commitments which go to social cohesion within a very short period after the attacks, including a grant or funds to the Executive Council of Australian Jewry and similar funds to other communities affected, in terms of both support and security. There was also funding for targeted mental health, community and wellbeing support, as well as, as I said, security measures. There was also funding for the protection of Australians from terrorist and violent extremist content online. I would say to the senator that we are open to discussions about how we can continue to support all parts of our community at this time. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>22</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:18</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Housing, Senator Gallagher. Australia is in a rental and housing crisis, and research released today confirms that yet again, loudly and clearly. A person on JobSeeker, with a mere $22,000 in income, is forced to spend at least 78 per cent of their income to rent a one-bedroom apartment in any capital city and 100 per cent of their income on rent in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Perth and Canberra. Many areas across the country are the most unaffordable they've ever been, with rent becoming 13 per cent less affordable in Sydney and 10 per cent less affordable in Melbourne and Perth this year. In cities and regions, more families are living in tents. More people are forced to live in their cars after applying for hundreds of rental properties. Minister, will you finally act and coordinate a freeze on rental increases?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:19</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator Faruqi for the question. I saw that report released today and I think it confirms what all of us know—that is, a lot of people across Australia are doing it tough right now, including in finding rental places to live and being able to afford the rents being asked. That is precisely why the government in the last budget increased the Commonwealth rent assistance by its largest margin in the last 30 years, and it is why we increased and adjusted payments for those on JobSeeker and other payments, including parenting payment single, considerably in light of the pressure that people are under.</para>
<para>I would say that there is a very significant piece of work underway through national cabinet, where the Prime Minister has shown the leadership that's required to work with all of the states and territories to improve rights for renters, and there's quite a significant reform agenda there. I would also point out that there isn't one jurisdiction in the country, and I don't believe there is any leader of any jurisdiction in the country that believes a rent freeze is actually the way to go, but we do accept that we need to look at and address rights for renters, which is why that agenda is being led through national cabinet, the outcomes of which were announced, I think, at their last meeting.</para>
<para>The underlying issue here is supply, supply, supply. Talk to anybody in the industry, whether it be in the community sector, whether it be in the housing sector or whether it be in the construction sector and they will say the issue here is supply. As senators know, we have an extremely ambitious agenda around generating supply of housing across the country.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Faruqi, a first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:21</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>While thousands of Australians are struggling to afford to keep a roof over their heads, why is Labor's position that rent should go up indefinitely?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:21</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para> (—) (): That is not Labor's position. That is you asserting that that is Labor's position but that is not Labor's position. As I have said, no state or territory supports rent freezes, nor do experts in the housing market, including National Shelter; none of them support a rental freeze. Our policies are around boosting supply of all housing to make it easier to buy or rent. An independent analysis of our supply plan by the Grattan Institute found that it could put significant downward pressure on rents, saving renters billions over the next decade. Our agenda, whether it be the National Housing Accord, the Social Housing Accelerator, the new homes bonus, the Housing Support Program, the National Planning Reform Blueprint, the Housing Australia Future Fund, the National Housing Infrastructure Facility, I think we have shown in the last 18 months that we are addressing the housing shortage in this country. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Faruqi, a second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:22</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Over 80 housing organisations and the vast majority of people across the country called for national rent caps and strong national renters' rights. Will you stop listening to the industry? And why is the government ignoring the calls of housing experts and the Australian public to implement a freeze and a cap on rental increases?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:23</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I refer you to my previous answer. There is something constructive the Greens political party could do on this area—that is, stop running the campaigns in their own electorates against the new supply of affordable housing. For example, the member for Griffith is campaigning against the plan to build an aged-care facility in his electorate. Rather than allow 220 aged-care patients to get treatment, he wants the space used as a park. The member for Ryan is campaigning against a plan to subdivide an old chicken farm into 91 new homes, arguing against this development. We even have the member for Melbourne, Adam Bandt, also arguing against one of the new Social Housing Accelerator programs in Carlton. That is an area where we could all work together to support the increase of supply of housing to put downward pressure on rents. That is something that this chamber could support.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Skills and Training</title>
          <page.no>23</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:24</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PRATT</name>
    <name.id>I0T</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Skills and Training. Upon election, the Albanese government inherited a massive skills deficit holding our economy back. According to the OECD, Australia was experiencing the second-most severe labour shortage in the developed world. So how is the Albanese government prioritising and rebuilding the vocational education and training sector after this decade of neglect?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:25</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator Pratt, who, like so many on this side of the chamber, is a very strong supporter of training and our TAFE system. Upon the Albanese government's election last year, it was clear not only that we had inherited a $1 trillion debt from the Liberals and Nationals—and they really hate being reminded of that!—but that the opposition had also left behind a massive skills deficit, and there's one of the people responsible, Senator Cash, a former minister for skills and training, who slashed TAFE during her years in office. Not having enough skilled workers is bad for businesses, bad for productivity and bad for Australians who don't have access to the products and services they need, and Senator Cash is unrepentant for her cuts.</para>
<para>Anyone who's tried to do home renos lately knows how hard it is to get a builder or a tiler or sparky. I certainly know that myself. But butchers, hairdressers, IT specialists, ag and aged care workers—the list goes on. These are the skills deficits left behind by the former government, and that's why the Albanese government took urgent action upon being elected by funding 180,000 fee-free TAFE places in 2023 and more in future years. We brought together Australians, unions, employers and civil society at the Jobs and Skills Summit, we established Jobs and Skills Australia to underpin our response to current and emerging workforce needs and we created new energy apprenticeships to get more workers into the clean energy sector.</para>
<para>Our urgent actions are helping to address critical skills needs by expanding access to the VET sector and supporting quality training. That's good for Australians, that's good for business and that's good for our economy. The VET sector can only work to its full potential if the Commonwealth and state and territory governments work together, and that's why we're so pleased last month to see the Albanese government announce an historic agreement with every state and territory to boost investment in the Australian VET sector over the next five years. Our government is prepared to invest $12.6 billion to expand and transform access to the VET sector. We're fixing up the mess.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Pratt?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:27</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PRATT</name>
    <name.id>I0T</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>We know that fee-free TAFE is providing opportunities for Australians to skill and reskill in areas of demand without a financial burden. But not everyone supports fee-free TAFE. Minister, what has been the response to our fee-free TAFE policy in 2023?</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Before you start, Minister, I remind you to direct your answers through the chair.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:27</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, President, for the reminder. In 2023, already over 214,000 Australians have enrolled in fee-free TAFE, smashing our target of 180,000 places six months earlier than anticipated. That tells you something about the amount of pent-up demand that there was in the training system after 10 years of the coalition government and their cuts to the training sector. And, importantly, these enrolments are in areas of high priority, and they are saving Australians money.</para>
<para>Our fee-free TAFE places is one of the many steps the Albanese government is taking to assist Australians with cost-of-living pressures. In New South Wales, a student studying a Diploma of Early Childhood Education and Care could save almost $5,000 over the life of their course. While someone from Victoria studying a Diploma of Nursing could save over $15,000.</para>
<para>But you'll be shocked to hear that not everyone supports fee-free TAFE. While the Prime Minister continues to visit TAFEs around the country, the opposition leader still hasn't said the word 'TAFE' in parliament since 2004. Peter Dutton is all about saying 'no', including to fee-free TAFE.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Pratt, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:28</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PRATT</name>
    <name.id>I0T</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, the TAFE sector has endured periods of underfunding, impacts of deregulation, loose rules for market entry, a lack of national cohesion and an obsession for competition at the expense of collaboration. How have the government's actions to strengthen TAFE been informed by these lessons of the past?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:29</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Pratt, you might think, like I do, that it's common sense, but apparently it's news to those opposite that, if you don't collaborate and coordinate with the states and territories, who are responsible for huge amounts of investment in their own TAFE sectors, then it's impossible to get the best outcomes for Australians, businesses and the economy. That's what we experienced under the previous Liberal-National government. For the first time in 10 years, every state and territory has been supported by the Commonwealth in a genuine and collaborative way.</para>
<para>Madam President, it does seem that there are a few opposition members who need to take up our fee-free TAFE places. In fact, maybe we need to offer a course on how to become a shadow minister, because we know it's been nearly six months since Stuart Robert left the parliament and he hasn't been replaced. Instead of having a reshuffle, Peter Dutton just shuffles people along the deckchairs on the other side. Maybe they should have a fee-free TAFE course on how to be a backbencher, after the member for Monash resigned from the Liberal Party and went to the crossbench today.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Capital Territory: Infrastructure</title>
          <page.no>24</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:30</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVID POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>256136</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, Senator Watt. Minister, my question is about the government's new Infrastructure Policy Statement, in particular the new requirement for an equal funding split. The statement says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government's funding for nationally significant land transport infrastructure projects will be provided on a 50:50 basis with state and territory delivery partners.</para></quote>
<para>It goes on to say:</para>
<quote><para class="block">The Government may consider funding a greater share of projects on the National Land Transport Network in jurisdictions with less capacity to raise revenue on a case-by-case basis.</para></quote>
<para>Minister, clearly the ACT has a lower revenue-raising capacity. Can you guarantee that this new policy will not result in even less investment in the ACT?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:31</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator Pocock. As you stated, Senator Pocock, today the minister for infrastructure, Ms King, released the government's new infrastructure policy. What it's about more than anything is getting our infrastructure program into shape so it can actually be funded and actually be delivered. That's the case whether it be in the ACT, my home state of Queensland or anywhere else. We did see, Senator Pocock, over 10 years of coalition government, massive blow-outs of the infrastructure program. It was an infrastructure program that, under the coalition, expanded from about 150 projects to 800—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKenzie</name>
    <name.id>207825</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>It's a 30 per cent cut to the regions.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>which of course could not possibly have been delivered, with a blowout to the infrastructure budget of $33 billion.</para>
<para>Senator Pocock, you have raised the question—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Davey</name>
    <name.id>281697</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>How do the Victorians like it?</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>about what it means for the ACT. As you've noted, Ms King has made the statement that there may be some provision for smaller jurisdictions which have funding constraints. Obviously, those kinds of details will need to be worked through with the particular jurisdictions, and I'd be happy to talk with you further about that as those details are ironed out.</para>
<para>We know it pains the National Party, and that's why they're complaining now. All of those illusory projects that were never actually going to happen—they just looked really good on a spreadsheet, especially if they were coloured National Party green—were the flavour of the month, and in fact the decade, for the National Party. Do you know what? They were never going to be delivered. There was never the funding to deliver them and there were never the skills to deliver them. Now we have a government that's actually serious about delivering an infrastructure program—serious about investing in nationally significant infrastructure projects, whether they be in the ACT or anywhere else—rather than filling out spreadsheets with election commitments that could be made but were never, ever going to be delivered.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Pocock, first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:32</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVID POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>256136</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Minister. Minister King also said that this will mean the $120 billion 'can go further'. Does this mean that it will apply retrospectively to projects already announced?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:33</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator Pocock. I'm not sure that that's what Ms King had in mind when she made that statement. Of course, that would be—</para>
<para>Opposition senators: He doesn't know.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKenzie</name>
    <name.id>207825</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Hilarious! He doesn't know.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>News flash: my name is not Catherine King; I can't predict exactly what is in her mind when she's making statements. I would hazard a guess that what she meant by that, Senator Pocock, was that the move towards fifty-fifty funding—the move back towards the traditional fifty-fifty funding—would mean that states and territories joining those projects could expand the value of those projects all-up.</para>
<para>To give you an example from my state, the Commonwealth government has committed $10 billion in funding for the Bruce Highway.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator McKenzie!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>That funding remains in place. Under the old funding model, Queensland would have put in $2 billion, to take it to a total of $12 billion. Now they would take it to $10 billion, to a total value of $20 billion.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKenzie</name>
    <name.id>207825</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>They're standing up in question time right now bashing your government.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator McKenzie!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>So I think what Ms King is talking about when she says that is that the Commonwealth money can stretch further because it needs to be matched by the states and territories.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Minister. Senator McKenzie, when I call you to order, that's what I want, not for you just to continue to interject. Senator Pocock, second supplementary.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:34</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVID POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>256136</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, was the ACT government consulted in the development of this policy? What impact will it have on current infrastructure funding commitments in the ACT, from light rail to road funding? Will any ACT projects be axed in the coming round of cuts?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:34</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I am aware that Ms King, her officials and quite possibly other members of our government have spoken to all states and territories in the preparation of these statements. I think that, if they're being honest, all states and territories recognise that there are serious capacity challenges with the delivery of the infrastructure program that was never able to be funded and that never had the skills and the supplies necessary to deliver it. So all governments—federal, state and territory—are having to take a look at their infrastructure program to see what can be funded in the current environment without fuelling inflation and to see what can actually be delivered rather than just being put onto a press release.</para>
<para>In terms of the ACT, Senator Pocock, you're probably aware that in this year's budget—led capably, I might say, by a senator for the ACT, Senator Gallagher, who is always standing up for the ACT—the Australian government committed $476.4 million towards major infrastructure projects in the ACT over the 10 years from 2023-24. That funding remains in place. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Middle East</title>
          <page.no>26</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:35</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator VAN</name>
    <name.id>283601</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is for the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Senator Wong. On 7 October, Gaza erupted when the Hamas terror group rained terror on Israelis. Over 200 people were abducted by Hamas and other terror groups, and more than 1,200 were killed. Can the minister provide the chamber with the latest and accurate statistics, specifically the number of individuals abducted by Hamas, the current status of those hostages and the total number of fatalities resulting from the terrorist attacks?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:36</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator Van, for the question, and thank you for giving us a little bit of notice of some of the issues so that I could get some further details. Obviously, in relation to the first part of the question, the United Nations has reported that 1,200 Israelis have been killed in the conflict since 7 October. The vast majority of these Israelis were killed in the horrific events of 7 October. As I said, it is the biggest loss of Jewish life on any day since the Holocaust. Of course, we condemn these terrorist acts unequivocally. They cannot and should not be justified. In relation to hostages, I understand that the IDF has stated that the number of hostages still held captive is approximately 240, and I again reiterate our call, along with the international community, for the immediate and unconditional release of all hostages. I'm advised the UN reports that more than 11,000 Palestinians have been killed in the conflict.</para>
<para>This is a deeply distressing time for many in Australia, as we have talked about a number of times today. It is distressing for our Jewish community, who lost loved ones in the abhorrent attacks by Hamas. It is distressing for members of our Palestinian community who have lost loved ones in the conflict that has followed and for many more who feel deeply about this issue. I again say our first priority in this crisis must be to seek to keep our country unified. It is also to assist Australians abroad, and I have previously spoken in this chamber about ensuring that repatriation flights were arranged. Australia will continue to work with other countries that have influence in the region to prevent the conflict from spreading.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Van, first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:38</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator VAN</name>
    <name.id>283601</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Minister. Could you provide a comprehensive overview of Australia's humanitarian aid to Gaza, detailing the amount, delivery methods and organisations involved? Could you also confirm whether the International Red Cross is being granted access to the hostages and how our aid is being effectively utilised in the context of this conflict?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:38</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I describe the humanitarian situation in Gaza as dire and catastrophic, and human suffering in Gaza is widespread. Early on in this conflict, we announced $25 million in humanitarian assistance through trusted partners to address essential needs in Gaza, Lebanon and Egypt. This includes $9 million through the ICRC, the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement; $13 million to provide support through UN agencies such as UNICEF—the UN Children's Fund—and the UN Population Fund; and $3 million to respond to emerging humanitarian needs as a result of the conflict. We have also engaged with the ICRC and other UN agencies, and the government is willing to consider further requests. Some 981 trucks with humanitarian aid have entered Gaza since 21 October. Prior to this conflict, an average of 500 trucks per working day entered Gaza, which shows the dire humanitarian— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Van, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:39</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator VAN</name>
    <name.id>283601</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Could you advise what efforts are being undertaken by the Australian intelligence agencies to investigate and identify any foreign interference that may be contributing to the increasing number of horrific antisemitic campaigns across our media?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:40</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WONG</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I would say first that, obviously, we don't comment on intelligence, but you would have seen public statements which have been made by some of our respected leaders in the intelligence community about the importance of social cohesion. As I said earlier today, we must all work to maintain respect for each other's humanity. We have seen a disturbing rise in antisemitism, and that must be called out. It is abhorrent, and it has no place in this country. There is no place for prejudice, antisemitism or Islamophobia in Australia. In response to Senator Fawcett, I spoke about some of the support the government has given, including for security as well as mental health support and other support for communities, including the Jewish community and members of the Islamic community. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Workplace Relations</title>
          <page.no>26</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:41</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations. Yesterday, Minister Burke, while blocking the four closing loopholes bills that the Senate passed last week, accused the Senate, along with members in the other place, of playing 'delaying games'. Meanwhile, he has put the bills to the bottom of the business paper, giving them the lowest priority. The minister, instead of putting his big-boy pants on and taking ownership of these bills, has chosen to block the passage of bills that would give federal first responders easier access to PTSD diagnoses, stop discrimination in the workplace of victims of family and domestic violence, bring silica into line with asbestos and enable redundancy payments for workers of large businesses that are facing insolvency. Minister, why won't this government recognise that these bills were your bills, that they were good bills and that they had great capacity to help some of the most vulnerable Australians that we have out there?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:42</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As to the procedural steps that were taken in the House of Representatives yesterday, you might actually want to look at the opposition in terms of the tactics that were adopted, which may explain why certain bills were listed where they were listed.</para>
<para>Be that as it may, the point that we made last week, Senator Lambie—the point that we have continued to make and will continue to make—is that this government believes that it is important to do something about silicosis and asbestosis in the workplace. Of course, Labor governments have a very proud record in that regard. We also believe that it's important to deal with the issues around PTSD for first responders and all of the other things that were contained in those bills that you and Senator Pocock put forward last week. But do you know what? It's also pretty important to do something about labour hire workers getting ripped off. It's also pretty important to do something about industrial manslaughter, where workers are killed at work because of the negligence of their employers. It's also pretty important to do something about the safety of delivery drivers and other gig workers, and none of these matters are dealt with, as you well know, in the bills that you put forward to the Senate last week. We do think that it's important to deal with all of those issues that the two Independent senators cherrypicked from our legislation last week, but we also think it's important to deal with all those other matters.</para>
<para>Senator Lambie, I think one of the most important things that you said last week—I think it was in an interview with Radio National—was that the reason that you and Senator Pocock had put forward those items for those bills was that they were the only things that the opposition would agree to. What that means, Senator Lambie—and thank you for informing the Australian public—is that the opposition would not support provisions to deal with wage theft, to deal with industrial manslaughter, to deal with labour hire workers getting ripped off and to deal with delivery drivers getting bad safety. It's an absolute disgrace that the opposition won't back those matters. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Lambie, first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:44</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Instead of passing these bills, its own changes to law, the government is choosing to lump them into very complex and very contentious legislation, laws that go to changes to casual employees, the gig economy and a right of entry for union delegates—all this in an economy that is tanking. Minister, do you recognise that, by passing the four bills, the Senate crossbench was helping the government to do its job—that is, to make legislation better, something this government struggled to do all last week?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, Senator Lambie, I guess we have to respectfully disagree with you on this. I respectfully disagree that removing or leaving out legislative provisions that make it a criminal offence for employers to deliberately steal wages from their employees is making legislation better. I don't think that removing or not including provisions that hold employers responsible for their negligence which leads to the deaths of workers at work sites is making legislation better. I don't think that's helping the government, and I don't think it's helping workers either.</para>
<para>I don't think there is anything complex about making it a criminal offence for employers to deliberately steal wages from their workers. If a worker steals from their employers, they are rightfully charged with theft. But the law as it stands in Australia at the moment means that an employer can deliberately steal wages from their employee with no criminal punishment at all. I don't think that's a complex matter.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Lambie, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:46</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>In the closing loopholes bill, right for entry for unions is set to begin on 1 January 2024, in six weeks. The rest of the changes are due to start no earlier than 1 July next year. Why does this government think it is more important to give unions right of entry than to grant first responders easier access to PTSD support, stop discrimination in the workplace for victims of family and domestic violence, and bring silica into line with asbestos, not to mention manslaughter charges and making redundancy payments available to workers of large businesses that have shrunk? <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:46</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, Senator Lambie, again I have to respectfully disagree with you.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Lambie! Senator McKenzie!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The result of your decision, along with Senator David Pocock's, last week to cherrypick aspects of this legislation means that none of those matters will be dealt with. They could have been legislated this year in combination with all of the other matters that the government put forward in our legislation, like criminalising wage theft, doing something about industrial manslaughter—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Lambie and Senator McKenzie!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>protecting delivery drivers and other gig workers when they're at work, and supporting the rights of casual workers. I dare say, Senator Lambie, there are a few of those kinds of workers up in the north-west of Tasmania. I certainly know Senator Urquhart has been standing up for those workers, people who are getting ripped off at work.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator McKenzie!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATT</name>
    <name.id>245759</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>  Unfortunately, with the approach that was taken by the crossbench last week, those rights are not going to be observed anymore. These issues could have been dealt with this year, in totality. We could have done all of the things included in your bills, along with protecting workers from all those other rorts. Unfortunately, you teamed up with the coalition, and now none of it will happen.</para>
<para>Honourable senators interjecting—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Order across the chamber! Senator Davey, order! Senator McKenzie, I've called you about four times today. When I call you, I expect silence, and the same goes for you, Senator Lambie. I called you to order and you continued to shout out. Both of you were being disrespectful.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>28</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:48</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BILYK</name>
    <name.id>HZB</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Housing and Minister for Homelessness, Senator Gallagher. The Albanese government is delivering on its wide-reaching housing agenda. We've seen reporting today on the impact the decade of little action from those opposite is now having on Australian renters. Is the minister able to provide an update to the Senate on what the Albanese government is doing to improve the experience of renting a home in Australia?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:48</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator Bilyk for the question and for the work that she does in Tasmania in supporting access to housing and campaigning for a better deal for Australians in access to the supply of social and affordable housing and also for those who are renting.</para>
<para>While states have responsibility over tenancy laws, the Albanese government is showing national leadership, working with state, territory and local governments to deliver better housing outcomes. We were elected with an ambitious housing agenda to ensure more Australians have a safe and affordable place to call home, and that agenda includes the steps we're taking to strengthen renters' rights. We're delivering changes to make a real difference to the almost one-third of Australian householders who rent. In August, National Cabinet agreed on a better deal for renters, and states are now working on improving rental regulations in their areas, with nine agreed actions they are progressing to improve conditions for renters, including changes like: developing a nationally consistent policy to implement a requirement for genuine reasonable grounds for eviction; making rental applications easier and better protecting renters' personal information; and improving protections for tenants experiencing domestic or family violence.</para>
<para>We're also providing the one million households who receive Commonwealth rent assistance with improved support by increasing the maximum rate of this payment by 15 per cent in the last budget. This is the biggest increase in CRA in over 30 years. In the budget there were also announcements to encourage the delivery of new build-to-rent homes with some changes to tax arrangements alongside our significant investments to increase the supply of new social and affordable rental homes. These measures all combined together will make a real difference to the lives of renters right across Australia.</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Bilyk, first supplementary?</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:50</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BILYK</name>
    <name.id>HZB</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Minister, for that answer. It's encouraging to hear that the Albanese government is showing national leadership in strengthening renters' rights. Can you provide more information to the Senate on the work the government is doing to deliver on its ambitious housing reform to improve the supply of more affordable rental housing for Australians?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:50</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator Bilyk for the question. I also want to take the opportunity to acknowledge the work of Minister Collins in this area. She has been working tirelessly over the last 18 months, fellow Tasmanian, to deliver on this reform agenda. With every step of our agenda we're improving access to safe and affordable homes for Australians. To name just a few measures, they are the $10 billion Housing Australia Future Fund, the $2 billion Social Housing Accelerator, the $2 billion in additional financing for community housing providers and the $1.7 billion one-year extension to the National Housing and Homelessness Agreement. We are seeing homes under construction thanks to the $575 million we have unlocked from the National Housing Infrastructure Facility, and we have recently committed a further $1 billion to this facility to deliver even more homes.</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Bilyk, second supplementary?</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:51</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BILYK</name>
    <name.id>HZB</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>():  Thank you, Minister, for providing more information. As the duty senator for Minister Collins, I'm very aware of how much work she's put into it. In addition to boosting the supply of housing and supporting protections for those who are renting a home, what is the Albanese government doing to support more Australians to move into home ownership?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:52</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Since the election the government has now helped more than 73,000 Australians into their first home, including more than 10,000 Australians in regional Australia through the Regional First Home Buyer Guarantee. We introduced the regional guarantee in October last year, three months ahead of schedule, and made significant expansions to the wider Home Guarantee Scheme just a few months later. These changes have proven to be a success. We have made the scheme better for young people. We've made the scheme better for key workers like teachers, nurses and social workers. We've got a very ambitious housing reform agenda delivering for Australians. We recognise that this is an area of significant challenge. We recognise it's been an area that has suffered under a decade of dysfunction and being ignored by the former government. In the last 18 months we have outlined and are implementing and delivering for Australians a very comprehensive housing reform agenda that's focused on increasing supply across the country.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cost of Living</title>
          <page.no>29</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:53</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McGRATH</name>
    <name.id>217241</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>My question is to the Minister representing the Treasurer, Senator Gallagher. As has been pointed out several times in this chamber, new analysis of OECD data reveals that Australians have experienced a greater collapse in living standards than any other advanced economy, with inflation adjusted disposable incomes falling 5.1 per cent to June 2023. Why is it that the governments of the United Kingdom, France, Denmark, Poland, the United States of America, Spain, Chile, Belgium, Finland and Hungary were all able to deliver real growth to household disposable incomes last year, while the Albanese Labor government has inflicted the sharpest decline in household incomes of any advanced economy?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:54</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank Senator McGrath for the question, and my answer will be the answer that I've been giving consistently in this chamber around the plan that this government has to support households who are doing it tough because of the inflation challenge that we inherited from those opposite.</para>
<para>Opposition senators interjecting—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Order!</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>That's right. I know—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, please resume your seat. I have called the chamber to order. I should not have to keep repeating myself. The minister has the right to be heard in silence.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The inflation challenge that we inherited from those opposite—I know you don't like it, but the single biggest quarter of inflation growth was your final quarter in government. That is when interest rates had to start going up to deal with it, because we inherited—</para>
<para>Opposition senators interjecting—</para>
</continue>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, the facts don't lie. So our plan has been to deliver—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, please resume your seat. Senator Birmingham?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Birmingham</name>
    <name.id>H6X</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I have a point of order on direct relevance, because Senator McGrath's question goes to the 12 months to June this year, which is the OECD data. Senator Gallagher is trying to rely on the quarter before that—not even the 12 months of her government.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Birmingham, you are well aware that is a debating point. Minister Wong?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Wong</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I raise a separate point of order. I would just make the point that you have called for order quite a number of times, and the opposition are completely ignoring it—</para>
<para>Opposition senators interjecting—</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Order!</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Wong</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>as they are now!</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Wong</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I'm just making the point. We understand that, at times, this can be a robust chamber, but this is a repeated disregard for the President's rulings or exhortation to have the minister be heard. I'd ask the opposition to allow the minister to at least answer the question.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator Wong. I will remind people that the senator has the right to be heard in silence.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>As Senator McGrath knows—because context is important here—the decline in household living standards occurred in its sharpest form in the final quarter of the former government, when inflation was at its peak. That context is important, as is the fact that, in the countries nominated by Senator McGrath, inflation peaked earlier than it did here. It rose earlier, and it peaked earlier.</para>
<para>Opposition senators interjecting—</para>
</continue>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, again—</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, please resume your seat. Order!</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Just a moment, Minister; please resume your seat. Senator Cash, I just called the chamber to order, and the minute the minister got back to her feet, you started interjecting again. When I call the Senate to order, it does include you, Senator Cash.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>In many of those countries, inflation peaked higher than it did in Australia, but it certainly peaked earlier, and so it would make sense that our return of inflation to a target range will be later than those other countries. They're the facts. It doesn't change our plan for cost-of-living relief, getting the budget in better shape and making investments in the productive capacity of the economy.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator McGrath, a first supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:58</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McGRATH</name>
    <name.id>217241</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, you stated yesterday:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… the inflation challenge is the biggest challenge that we are focusing on in the economy. It's staying higher than we would like for longer than we would like.</para></quote>
<para>Is inflation today higher than you planned for when you delivered the budget in May?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>14:59</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I won't have the budget documents within the minute that it would take to retrieve them. But do I note that the RBA, in their statement on monetary policy, have updated their forecasts. In my recollection, it's largely in line with the Treasury forecast as at budget time. That is what the Treasurer has advised the community. If there is anything further, I will update, but it is staying higher than we would like for longer than we'd like. I don't think anyone has made any pretence about that. So the job we have to do is to not get distracted by the shouts of irrelevance over there—the shouting irrelevance that you have become—but to stay focused on what we need to do, which is roll out cost-of-living relief, get the budget in better shape and make those investments in clean energy, skills and housing. That is what we are focused on.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator McGrath, second supplementary?</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:00</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McGRATH</name>
    <name.id>217241</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>If inflation is staying higher than you would like for longer than you would like, in excess of your budget plans or forecasts, what new plans or actions is the Albanese government taking to stop the freefall in Australian household incomes?</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:00</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As I've said, it remains largely in line with Treasury forecasts. As I advised in my previous answer, what we are doing—</para>
<para>Honourable senators interjecting—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Minister, please resume your seat. Order! Minister, please continue.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>What we are doing is rolling out our cost-of-living relief, most of which you opposed; getting the budget in better shape, again fixing the mess that we inherited from you; finding real savings and banking revenue; and delivering a surplus. Remember, you printed the mugs. We actually delivered one. You had the 'Back in Black' mugs that had to get secretly put to one side and hushed up and put away very quickly. We actually delivered the first surplus in 15 years. These are all things that materially help put downward pressure on inflation. As the ABS data showed last month, our measures, which you voted against, actually took ½ per cent off CPI for that quarter. That is what we are doing. We are working in line with the bank to get inflation back towards its target rate.</para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Wong</name>
    <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I ask that further questions be placed on notice.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE: TAKE NOTE OF ANSWERS</title>
        <page.no>31</page.no>
        <type>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE: TAKE NOTE OF ANSWERS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Immigration Detention, Cost of Living</title>
          <page.no>31</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:02</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'SULLIVAN</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Minister for Foreign Affairs (Senator Wong) and the Minister for Finance (Senator Gallagher) to questions without notice asked by Senators O'Sullivan and McGrath today relating to a recent High Court decision concerning migration matters and to inflation.</para></quote>
<para>I had the pleasure of asking the first question today. It's a matter of serious concern for Australians. The issue that I raised was in relation to the High Court ruling on immigration detention. I cited three cases that have been reported recently, over the last day or so, in various Australian publications: the <inline font-style="italic">Australian</inline> newspaper, the <inline font-style="italic">Guardian</inline> and also again in the <inline font-style="italic">Australian</inline>. I want to repeat the particular individuals and the situations where people have been released as a result of the High Court's ruling last week. I quote the first one:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… a violent sex predator with a record of attacking elderly women in their own homes so chilling a judge branded him "a danger to the Australian community".</para></quote>
<para>The second one was in relation to an individual that was attacked in their workplace: it says the victim was 'held up against a shelf in a blind spot without cameras in a retail store about 4 pm on a Thursday afternoon'. The final one was, in relation to a 28-year-old woman, 'fatally shooting her in a forest on the outskirts of Kuala Lumpur and blowing up her body with military-grade explosives'. These individuals are now out on our streets. That is just chilling.</para>
<para>I realise that these are cases that go back some time and that this particular case that was before the High Court has been dealt with over the last year—I think it was sometime last year that it was first brought forward; someone might correct me if I've got that time wrong. The point that I want to make is that the government has had time to prepare. The questions that I asked Senator Wong went to what the government is now doing about it. There was nothing that went to what the government is doing.</para>
<para>This is of grave concern to Australians. About 50 people in Western Australia at Yongah Hill, which is in Northam, about an hour and a half out of Perth, have been released. I asked a question about other examples of cases where people were held in indefinite detention, and I didn't get an answer to that either. Do we now have people wandering the streets of Perth in my home state who are similar to the people in the cases that we've heard here? Sadly, we didn't get an answer to that either.</para>
<para>I'm concerned because Minister Giles, the Minister for Immigration, Citizenship and Multicultural Affairs, in question time in the House yesterday said that the government rightly argued against this particular case to overturn the two-decade-old precedent. He said, 'We were prepared for this outcome.' Sadly, I didn't hear anything in Senator Wong's response to my question that demonstrates that the government is now actually doing something about it. If they were prepared, why can't they be upfront with us and tell us about what they're doing? The minister went on to say in question time yesterday—sorry, the Attorney-General, Mr Dreyfus, went on to say that he'd confirmed that there were legislative options that were being considered. Obviously the government couldn't have known what the outcome of the High Court case would be, but if it knew that it needed to be prepared, why is there not legislation in parliament right now that we could be dealing with as a matter of urgency? This is of grave concern.</para>
<para>So far, in the response of this government, we're not seeing the steps that they are taking. We're left in the dark. We don't know who all these people are. We're not being upfront with the Australian people about the types and situations of the people who have been let out of detention. We also don't know what steps the government is taking to take this seriously. The government is distracted and is not focused on the things that matter to the Australian people.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:07</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GREEN</name>
    <name.id>259819</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I will address some of the remarks that Senator O'Sullivan made in taking note of answers and then go to some of the other questions that were asked by opposition senators. Firstly, in regard to the first question asked and the comments just made by Senator O'Sullivan, because I think it's really important, I will reiterate—and be very clear that these are very serious matters that the government is taking very seriously—that the decision to release these noncitizens was a decision of the High Court, not of the Albanese Labor government. I will be very clear about that because I have seen the mischaracterisation of the matter in the House today and I hope that I don't see the same characterisation here in the Senate. I know that senators opposite, particularly those who understand the law, and some of them are lawyers themselves, would understand that when the High Court makes a decision the law must be complied with.</para>
<para>The government argued against this decision. We argued against it. We argued that the detention was lawful. The High Court did not agree with those arguments. The decision required the release of noncitizens and in responding to this matter our ministers are working very swiftly to make sure that community safety is completely front of mind. They are waiting for the reasons to be released and are making sure that any response is dealt with quickly. That is what we are doing. What we are not going to do is let those opposite mischaracterise this as a decision of government or mischaracterise this as a process that didn't involve the government arguing against the decision of the High Court or requiring those people to be detained. That was the premise of the arguments made by the government, and it remains our position.</para>
<para>What I do want to respond to very carefully, though, are questions by those opposite regarding how households in Australia are facing the cost-of-living crisis, because that is what the government is focused on. We are prioritising these matters in this place, and we are making sure that cost of living and the way people are dealing with cost of living is front of mind. That's why I asked a question today in Senate question time about the way the government is strengthening Medicare, particularly in rolling out urgent-care clinics across the country, and we saw the pretty woeful interjections from those opposite and from the senator who I think was going to be the health minister if the opposition had been successful at the last election. Thank goodness that didn't happen, because her response of 'So what?' to urgent-care clinics really demonstrates that there is a huge divide between how this government is dealing with cost of living and taking care of people's health and the approach of those opposite.</para>
<para>We are opening urgent-care clinics across the country. That means we are making sure that people can get acute care when they need it. In Queensland we've announced or opened clinics in Bundaberg, in Ipswich, in Brisbane South and on the Gold Coast; that clinic opened yesterday, and patients are already able to go in there. We've announced one in Murrumba Downs, Browns Plains and Toowoomba. These are urgent-care clinics all across Queensland, with more to follow, where patients are able to go in and get that acute care, making sure they're able to see a doctor when they need to and preventing them from going into emergency departments. And if those opposite don't think giving people the option to go to a doctor when they need to on the weekend or after hours doesn't impact the household budget, then they really don't understand how people are struggling and how important health care is, not only to the household budget but also to wellbeing.</para>
<para>That's why we are investing in bulk billing. It's why we have tripled the bulk billing incentive. We've made the largest investment in bulk billing in the 40-year history of Medicare, and this is part of our commitment to make it easier for families to see a doctor. This is in sharp contrast to those opposite. When Peter Dutton was the health minister he put Medicare into the worst shape it had been in 40 years. He proposed a GP co-payment and was declared the worst health minister I think in history, because of the way they cut and slashed Medicare. Well, that is not what Labor governments do. When Australians are doing it tough we step up and we make sure Medicare is protected, and we invest in Medicare. Those opposite will always cut Medicare, and we'll always invest in it. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:12</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator KOVACIC</name>
    <name.id>306168</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I'm taking note of a question Senator McGrath asked the Minister representing the Treasurer, Senator Gallagher, about OECD data and inflation. It's not news to any of us here that, as we heard yesterday, the latest CPI data shows that the price of food has gone up by 8.2 per cent. That's for food. That's something people can't budget-cut on—food, groceries. Housing costs are up by 10.4 per cent. Insurance is up by 17.3 per cent. Electricity prices are up by 18.2 per cent, and gas by a massive 28 per cent. These are all things you can't cut out of your family budget. These are things you can't cut out of your household budget. You can maybe fill up half the tank with petrol for your car or turn off the heater when it gets a little bit less cold and you can throw on another blanket, or you might put fewer things in your trolley. But you still have to buy those things. You still need to use those things. They are needs. I remember doing commerce at school—I'm perhaps giving my age away here!—and we learnt the difference between needs and wants. The things we're talking about here are all needs.</para>
<para>To Senator McGrath's question, Senator Gallagher sort of just gave a mishmash of different things but particularly focused on what the former government had and hadn't done. I'm fairly new to this place but, frankly, I'm sick of hearing it. I'm sick of hearing about what other people did or didn't do, and I think the Australian public are sick of that as well. I think they're quite interested to know what this government is actually going to do in order to facilitate having the cost of living not spiralling even further out of control.</para>
<para>The other thing that struck me was that there were some conversations around things that this government had delivered versus things that they had inherited. Senator Gallagher made the comment that they had inherited inflation but they had delivered a surplus. I actually think there's a bit of confusion here. I think that's the wrong way round. I think they inherited a surplus and have delivered an inflationary environment, because that is what is being shown by the evidence that we have before us.</para>
<para>Some of the commentary that Senator Gallagher used to substantiate the fact that they had inherited inflation was very confusing to me as I stopped to think about it. She made the comment that inflation in other countries peaked earlier, so it made sense that it ended earlier. That made me think: so it peaked later here and started later here, which was kind of in line with the new government taking control of the budget and the economy here. We've heard Treasurer Chalmers say on the record many, many times that the inflationary impacts here have nothing to do with what's happening overseas; they're based on decisions that are made here. So, on that basis and on the basis of the comments that Senator Gallagher made, the fact that inflation was largely under control whilst the opposition was in government, and it has spiralled out of control whilst the current government has been in government, suggests that this is something that this government has delivered rather than inherited. But that's just my observation of some of the facts that Senator Gallagher put forward rather than answering Senator McGrath's question.</para>
<para>But the important thing to take note of here is that, by not answering these questions, the government are not telling everyday Australians when and how they are going to stop the pain that they are feeling. That hurt continues daily—at retail outlets when they go to buy things, or in the letterbox or the inbox when they get their electricity or gas bill or their insurance renewal. Everything is costing more. Interest rates increase because inflation is too high. Australian mortgage holders and small business borrowers can't continue to do all of the heavy lifting to curb inflation via increased interest rates. A family with a $750,000 mortgage is now paying $24,000 a year extra.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>287062</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you, Senator. Senator Sheldon.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:17</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHELDON</name>
    <name.id>168275</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>These people brought us $1 trillion of debt when we had a change of government. Then they come here and start lecturing about what needs to be done. Of course, we start then putting suggestions about what should be done. What do we do? The government turn around and provide the first surplus in 15 years. And what happens? There's still no credit. Then we start putting policies forward to reduce the cost of living. And what do they do? They vote against them. When we have cost-of-living reductions, $3 billion of vital energy bill relief, those opposite vote against it. If they had succeeded in stopping that change coming through from this government, then we would have seen in the September ABS quarter an 18.6 per cent increase in prices for energy. Not only are they standing in the way, but their alternative model would mean that Australians would be even harder hit.</para>
<para>We've seen their opposition on so many issues, like funding cheaper child care and fee-free TAFE. Time and time again we've seen their opposition on issues, opportunities and policies that would take pressure off the Australian public. Then you think: 'Maybe they'll start rethinking what they're doing. Maybe this is just a moment in time. Maybe it's just a blip in the thinking policy, or lack of thinking policy, on how to deal with cost-of-living pressures.'</para>
<para>But you've got to look back a little bit on the coalition, because one of the ways you actually deal with the cost of living is having those big companies that are making bit profits turning around and saying that workers can also get a fair share of it. They oppose that, and, when you look back to 1921, for example—because they have a history of this. In 1921, in the McKell report, for the increases in wages they got through their period of government up to that period in '21 to the period prior under Labor—if they had of got the same increases that Labor did, every worker would be $254 a week better off. So you've got them opposing $254 all that way back; you've got them opposing policies that give energy bill relief; you've got them opposing policies that turn around and increase the minimum wage; and you've got them proposing policies which say the secure jobs bill isn't the right approach, even though it has helped increase wages again. Of course, they're also opposing new legislation coming forward in these present bills that have been discussed over these last number of weeks.</para>
<para>What they're about is not about actually finding relief, because they voted against relief. When we came to power, they voted against relief that would have given us relief from the drama and the incompetence that they'd brought to the economy. We know that this is a tough time for everybody. We know that this is a time when we have to pull together to make those differences. But every time we put forward a proposal for a difference, every time we put forward a suggestion or a recommendation for a cost-of-living reduction, those opposite vote it down. They vote it down because they just can't help themselves.</para>
<para>When it comes to talking about new and proper legislation to make sure there's a fair bargaining field, whether it be for road transport operators, road transport workers, owner drivers or gig workers, the opposition also vote that down. They say, 'That's not something that's fit and proper,' when we're dealing with wage theft where companies are intentionally stealing from their workers, competing with companies who do the right thing, which the majority of companies do. They don't want to even keep the criminals accountable. This just keeps smelling of the same thing. You, on your side, just don't care. That's what you keep saying to the Australian public: 'We don't care how much you hurt. We haven't got solutions, and, when solutions are proposed, we oppose them.' That's either because the big end of town are opposed to them or because those across the chamber can't quite understand that the Australian public deserve something better.</para>
<para>When you start hearing about those who are opposed to some of the initiatives we put forward on the industrial relations front, you get companies like BHP and the Minerals Council and the opposition's favourite, Qantas. All of those are being supported time and time again by those opposite to suppress wages. It's in their DNA. Those opposite want wages suppressed, and they want the big end of down to town looked after.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:23</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator REYNOLDS</name>
    <name.id>250216</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>There is no greater example of the incompetence and the danger those opposite, the Labor government, present to the Australian people than them allowing 80 and possibly up to 330 people in detention, because they've been denied visas on character ground—and some of them are violent rapists and murderers. You start to think, 'Well, how could this possibly have happened?' Unfortunately, it was entirely predictable and preventable, but this government did not prepare.</para>
<para>So what's the situation? Last week the High Court overturned a 20-year precedent that has underpinned the migration policy of both sides of government. The issue the government now face—and, again, this hasn't been a secret hearing by the High Court; this has been well-known and is an entirely predictable outcome. The plaintiff in the High Court itself who made this decision committed a heinous child's sex offence. So far we've heard in the media—and not from this government—that at least 80 others have been released into the community.</para>
<para>While I said the government wasn't prepared, one minister was prepared: the minister for immigration. He prepared by ensuring that these 80 people had visas prepared for them. And not only did they have visas prepared for them; they also had hotel rooms booked for them. The government made sure they had visas and hotel rooms, but they did not think to ensure that they did not get out of detention in the first place. The High Court hasn't even delivered its reasons yet. They could have been detained a bit further.</para>
<para>While the minister for immigration was rolling out the red carpet for these 80 and possibly nearly 300 more, what was the Attorney-General doing? What was the Minister for Home Affairs doing? By their own admission, they were doing absolutely nothing. They could have started thinking, 'What happens if this does happen?'—which, again, was entirely predictable. They could have started thinking, 'We'll use the time until we get the decision from the High Court. We can prepare some legislation, possibly under our current terrorism framework, and we can have it ready,' because, guess what, the Senate was sitting last week. The House is also sitting this week. We have rushed urgent legislation through both chambers in previous years, under the previous government, and we could have done it here now. Not only has this incompetent government run down our economy in less than 18 months and made it very hard for Australians to afford their rents, their mortgages and their grocery bills but it also is not keeping Australians safe.</para>
<para>What's happened in Western Australia? We've heard from the <inline font-style="italic">West Australian</inline>, not from those opposite, that apparently 50 of those 80 were released from Yongah Hill detention centre, just out of Perth, into an outer suburb of Perth, where they're all currently sitting in a hotel. Where are they staying? Who's safeguarding them? Who would think throwing into a cheap motel 50 people who mostly have criminal records and present a threat to the Australian community, giving them a few bucks and saying, 'On your way,' was a good idea? It is almost inconceivable how incompetent and how dangerous those opposite are.</para>
<para>The refugee advocate, presumably for those 50 in Perth, warned that many were at 'huge risk of imminent homelessness'. What could go wrong once 50 people—who have all been denied visas for Australia on character grounds, many because they have committed the most heinous crimes—get kicked out of the hotel? What does Labor do? 'Let's roll the carpet out. Let's give them a visa. Let's put them in a hotel or a motel for a while. We won't worry about what happens to them afterwards.' They have no legislation in this place this week, which they could well have done, to keep Western Australians and Australians safe.</para>
<para>They've done all of this in less than 18 months. They're destroying the economy. They're destroying people's lives. They're now releasing murderers and rapists into the suburbs of Perth and elsewhere. Shame on you all.</para>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>35</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:28</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator FARUQI</name>
    <name.id>250362</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Minister for Finance (Senator Gallagher) to a questions without notice I asked today relating to the residential rental market.</para></quote>
<para>The housing and rental crisis in this country has not gone away. People and families, particularly those who are renting, find themselves caught in the relentless grip of this crisis.</para>
<para>A report from National Shelter today has revealed that the crisis has only become worse. Rental affordability has plunged in the past year, with low-income people now completely priced out of capital cities. People on low incomes are facing this especially critical and pretty horrific situation in housing. Those who are on JobSeeker and are renting in any of our capital cities are having to pay at least 78 per cent of their income in rent for just a one-bedroom apartment. In Sydney, the average rental cost of a one-bedroom apartment would amount to 137 per cent of their annual income of $22,100. How are these people supposed to live? Many areas across the country are the most unaffordable that they have ever been, with rent becoming 13 per cent less affordable in Sydney and 10 per cent less affordable in Melbourne and in Perth in the last year.</para>
<para>In cities and the regions more families are living in tents and more people are forced to live in their cars after they have applied for hundreds of rental properties. This situation is untenable, and this is in the midst of a cost-of-living crisis where the cost of electricity, fuel, groceries and other basic necessities has gone up considerably. We cannot turn a blind eye to the fact that families are being pushed to the brink, having to choose between getting fresh groceries and paying the rent. People are being driven into homelessness or are just one rent away from being forced to sleep in their cars.</para>
<para>The ever-increasing share of income spent on rent is not just a mere statistical anomaly. It is a testament to the utter failure of the current approach. Governments have the power to make change, but the Labor government has refused to do so. The policies in place have fallen woefully short in addressing the challenges of renting, affording a mortgage or putting a roof over one's head in this country. The government has deliberately refused to enact policies to make things better. Thousands of Australians are struggling to afford to keep a roof over their head, and Labor is allowing rents to just keep going up indefinitely.</para>
<para>The Greens, over 80 housing organisations and a vast majority of people across the country want a national rent cap. They want strong national renters' rights, and they want this because they want an immediate relief—not a short-term relief—to all the renters. That's why they want it, and that's what a rental freeze will do. It will give short-term relief while the government catches up with other policies which can actually address the housing and rental crisis. We do need a national rent freeze right now, but the Labor Party has chosen to let rents be increased indefinitely. And that is not good enough.</para>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>NOTICES</title>
        <page.no>35</page.no>
        <type>NOTICES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Presentation</title>
          <page.no>35</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>BUSINESS</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>BUSINESS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Leave of Absence</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:32</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator URQUHART</name>
    <name.id>231199</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That leave of absence be granted to the following senators for personal reasons:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(a)   Senator Brown from 14 to 17 November 2023; and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(b)   Senator Dodson from 13 to 17 November 2023.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>NOTICES</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>NOTICES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Postponement</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:33</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I remind senators that the question may be put on any proposal at the request of any senators. I shall now proceed to the discovery of formal business.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Public Works Joint Committee</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Reference</title>
            <page.no>36</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:34</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator CHISHOLM</name>
    <name.id>39801</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>At the request of Senator Gallagher, I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That, in accordance with the provisions of the <inline font-style="italic">Public Works Committee Act 1969</inline>, the following proposed work be referred to the Parliamentary Standing Committee on Public Works for consideration and report as expeditiously as is practicable:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Airservices Australia—PFAS Remediation of Former Fire Training Ground at Launceston Airport, Tasmania.</para></quote>
<para>I table a statement in relation to the work.</para>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Department of Home Affairs</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>36</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:34</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ASKEW</name>
    <name.id>281558</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>On behalf of Senator Paterson, I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Immigration, Citizenship and Multicultural Affairs, by no later than midday on Wednesday, 15 November 2023, the 'NZYQ dashboard document' prepared by the Department of Home Affairs, as tendered in the High Court in <inline font-style="italic">NZYQ v Minister for Immigration, Citizenship and Multicultural Affairs & Anor</inline>.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>NOTICES</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>NOTICES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Postponement</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:35</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ASKEW</name>
    <name.id>281558</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—On behalf of Senator McKenzie, I advise that notice of motion No. 375 will be postponed until Wednesday the 27th.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>36</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water</title>
          <page.no>36</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>36</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:35</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ROBERTS</name>
    <name.id>266524</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for the Environment and Water, by no later than 4 December 2023, any briefing notes, media briefing notes, file notes, emails, written communication and reports held or generated by the Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water in relation to the Minister's decision to grant approval to the Smoky Creek solar project in Central Queensland.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water</title>
          <page.no>37</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>37</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:36</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WATERS</name>
    <name.id>192970</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—On behalf of Senator David Pocock, I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Climate Change and Energy, by no later than 4 pm on Monday, 27 November 2023, the following, confined to documents and correspondence dated from 16 March 2022 to 1 July 2023:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(a) all correspondence between the Clean Energy Regulator and AnalytEcon, Stephen Beare and/ or Ray Chambers concerning the report published by the Australian National University titled 'The ERF's human-induced regeneration (HIR): What the Beare and Chambers report really found and a critique of its method';</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(b) all correspondence between the Emissions Reduction Assurance Committee (ERAC) and AnalytEcon, Stephen Beare and/or Ray Chambers concerning the report published by the Australian National University titled 'The ERF's human-induced regeneration (HIR): What the Beare and Chambers report really found and a critique of its method'; and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(c) all documents prepared by AnalytEcon, Stephen Beare and/or Ray Chambers and received by the Clean Energy Regulator or ERAC concerning the report published by the Australian National University titled 'The ERF's human-induced regeneration (HIR): What the Beare and Chambers report really found and a critique of its method'.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
<para class="italic"><inline font-style="italic">(Quorum formed)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>BUSINESS</title>
        <page.no>37</page.no>
        <type>BUSINESS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Leave Of Absence</title>
          <page.no>37</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:41</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That leave of absence be granted to Senator Thorpe from 17 October to 17 November 2023, for personal reasons.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>MATTERS OF URGENCY</title>
        <page.no>37</page.no>
        <type>MATTERS OF URGENCY</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cost of Living</title>
          <page.no>37</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:41</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I inform the Senate that I have received the following letter under standing order 75, dated 14 November 2023, from Senator Babet:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Pursuant to standing order 75, I give notice that today the United Australia Party propose to move "That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Since the 2022 election, the Albanese Labor government has committed billions in spending, which contributes to inflationary pressure and drives up interest rates. Tradies are in short supply, reducing the amount of houses that can be built.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Almost half of Australian mortgage holders are now in mortgage stress. The government must reduce spending and cancel or delay unnecessary and wasteful projects, such as Snowy 2.0, to temper inflation, build more houses and reduce mortgage stress."</para></quote>
<para>Is the proposal supported?</para>
<para class="italic"> <inline font-style="italic">More than the number of senators required by the standing orders having risen in their places—</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>With the concurrence of the Senate, the clerks will set the clock in line with the informal arrangements made by the whips.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:42</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BABET</name>
    <name.id>300706</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Since the 2022 election, the Albanese Labor government has committed billions in spending, which contributes to inflationary pressure and drives up interest rates. Tradies are in short supply, reducing the amount of houses that can be built.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Almost half of Australian mortgage holders are now in mortgage stress. The government must reduce spending and cancel or delay unnecessary and wasteful projects, such as Snowy 2.0, to temper inflation, build more houses and reduce mortgage stress.</para></quote>
<para>I rise today to speak up for the millions of Australians who are struggling to make ends meet. We've seen 13 consecutive interest rate rises, and the government continues to, in my opinion, shirk responsibility. They blame everything from the war in Ukraine to the COVID pandemic while hardworking Australians are on struggle street.</para>
<para>Over just 18 months, the cost of servicing a median Victorian mortgage has increased by—guess how much—$18,000 a year. How many families have a lazy 18 grand lying around just to keep a roof over their heads? That's nearly 350 bucks every single week. It is no wonder that the lines at the food bank are unfortunately growing. Minimum loan repayments have increased from 30 per cent, approximately, to a staggering 50 per cent of the average Victorian wage. Half of their money is being spent to pay off the mortgage—absolutely massive. The number of Victorian calls to the National Debt Helpline is up 40 per cent just this year. Many hardworking Aussies face the prospect of losing their home or never reaching that great Aussie dream of homeownership. Taxes, the mortgage, rent, power bills and groceries are robbing Australians of their hard-earned wages.</para>
<para>At a time when Australian workers are struggling, the Labor Party now wants to hit them while they are down. The closing loopholes IR bill proposes what is effectively wage theft. Hardworking Australian casual employees will be forced to become full-time or part-time employees, losing their flexibility and a generous 25 per cent casual loading. Employers will face hefty fines for employing a casual in a way that does not fit this new definition. The data shows that casual employees can earn around six per cent more than full-time or part-time employees when all entitlements are taken into consideration. A six per cent pay cut for many a casual employee is a bitter pill to swallow. If the Labor Party is successful with this bill, the financial loss on the average pay could be more than five grand a year. One can only assume that the Labor Party—backed by their union mates, obviously—is determined to destroy casual employment and help to undermine the small-business sector.</para>
<para>When it comes to inflation drivers, there is a massive elephant in the room, and that elephant is Treasurer Jim Chalmers, the Labor Party and, obviously, the big spending budgets. Mortgage holders are being unfairly punished for inflationary pressure, but the government itself is contributing to it, and it needs to stop. The flames of inflation are being fanned by higher levels of immigration and massive government spending on wasteful and unneeded infrastructure projects. People are having to cut back on essentials and work a second job just to afford a roof over their head. Meanwhile, the government continues to spend like a drunken sailor.</para>
<para>Last week the International Monetary Fund warned that Australian mortgage holders will suffer even more pain if federal and state governments don't wind back their own reckless spending. Snowy Hydro 2.0's budget has blown out sixfold to $12 billion at last count, and the government wants mums and dads with mortgages to pay for this mismanagement. If the government are serious about getting inflation under control, they need to tighten their belts and stop pumping hundreds of billions of dollars of taxpayers' money into the economy.</para>
<para>If the government did cut some of their inflation-producing multibillion dollar projects, do you know what would happen? Tradesmen would suddenly become available to build houses. That's what would happen. It's almost like the government could make headway on two of the greatest challenges faced by our nation—inflation and the housing crisis—if the government did this and just made some hard decisions about their own behaviour. Australians are, unfortunately, sick to the back teeth of hearing Treasurer Jim Chalmers blame the previous government for his own economic woes.</para>
<para>Obviously, we all—well, most of us here in this place—would like to see the government urgently cancel or delay unnecessary projects so that inflation can be brought back under control and so that Australian householders can finally get some interest rate relief. During the election campaign they told us that it wouldn't be easy under Prime Minister Albanese. In time, it seems like they have potentially been proven to be right.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:47</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PAYMAN</name>
    <name.id>300707</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>It's great to be here to speak on this urgency motion raised by Senator Babet, and I thank him for raising it. While we will agree about the importance of addressing the cost of living and not adding to inflation, we oppose this motion because our approach on these matters is responsible and measured. That's right: responsible and measured.</para>
<para>The Albanese government is working for Australia every day. We know Australians are doing it tough. World events outside of our control have caused real challenges, but Labor doesn't shy away from the challenges. Our approach has been to ease the pressure through targeted cost-of-living relief without adding to inflation. When it comes to responsible financial management—as the motion states—to temper inflation, this is also something the Albanese government is firmly committed to. When we were elected in 2022, we inherited a budget in deep structural deficit. We all remember being more than a trillion dollars in debt with nothing to show for it, absolutely nothing. That is the legacy of the former Liberal-National government. In contrast, Labor's approach to fiscal management has been disciplined and prudent. Yes, you heard it: disciplined and prudent.</para>
<para>We want to improve the quality of the government's spending, ensure taxpayers' money is spent effectively and steer the economy away from inflation. We returned 87 per cent of revenue upgrades across two budgets, an important redirection from the previous government's dismal 40 per cent average. This isn't just talk. A total of $17.8 billion—yes, that's with a 'B'—of spending in the May budget will be redirected towards high-priority government initiatives, in addition to the $22 billion in savings from the October budget.</para>
<para>The Albanese government received strong endorsements from international ratings agency Fitch, who reaffirmed our AAA credit rating. Fitch's statement aligns with the IMF's backing, with both recognising our efforts in addressing inflation. Australia is one of only nine countries to be rated AAA by all three major credit-rating agencies, and this was achieved for the first time under the last Labor government.</para>
<para>Our strategy of budget restraint, economic capacity investments and targeted cost-of-living relief is easing inflationary pressures. The most recent CPI proves that our 10-point plan is working. The ABS data shows that without the government's policies for child care, electricity and rent the CPI would have been around half of a percentage point higher throughout the year. Our primary focus is rolling out cost-of-living assistance, which, as I've just highlighted, is directly easing inflation. The ABS statistics disprove the premise of this motion. The government can walk and chew gum at the same time, and we have a responsibility to ease the pressure on Australian families where we can.</para>
<para>I know that one of the biggest challenges facing Australians right now is housing. Whether they're mortgage holders or renters, interest rate rises have put a lot of pressure on families. The Albanese government has put in place short-, medium- and long-term plans to address the challenges we're facing. With the passing of the Housing Australia Future Fund legislation, we are delivering the biggest investment in social and affordable housing in more than a decade. The $10 billion fund will create a secure and ongoing pipeline of funding for social and affordable rental housing, fulfilling the commitment the government made to the Australian people. We are working with states and territories on this issue, and I'm really proud of what this government is doing to turn the tide, despite the many roadblocks raised by those opposite. In my home state of Western Australia, in particular, the Cook government has recently announced even more steps to address the housing crisis.</para>
<para>Before I wrap up, this month we've tripled the bulk-billing incentive to support 11.6 million Australians, including children, pensioners and other concession card holders, because we know that there is much work to do to continue easing the pressure on Australians, and we're getting on with the job.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:52</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator CANAVAN</name>
    <name.id>245212</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The government put down its fiscal strategy in May in the budget, and this fiscal strategy has not even lasted until the first sightings of Santa Clauses in our shopping centres. I haven't seen Santa yet this year. I'm sure it will happen very soon. In the last few weeks, the whole government's fiscal strategy has been rubbish and in tatters, because the Treasurer and the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government have been out there admitting that their spending is causing inflationary pressures. They have announced that they want to cut or slash infrastructure spending, specifically, to take the pressure off inflation.</para>
<para>The question has to be asked: why didn't the government do this six months ago when it delivered its budget? Why didn't they get ahead of the game and cut spending back then so that they could help Australian families take the pressure off inflation and also help the Reserve Bank so that it didn't have to raise interest rates 13 times. Twelve of those 13 have happened while this government has been in charge. It did nothing in the budget. Despite what you will hear in this debate from government senators, the facts do not lie. In their own budget in May, on page 94 of Budget Paper No. 1, there is a very helpful table. It's buried, though. You've got to go looking for it. It outlines the effect of government policy decisions on the budget. The government will claim it delivered a surplus. They only really delivered a surplus thanks to the mining industry—all the coal, iron ore and gas coming in. It was nothing they did specifically. What they did can be seen in the line in this table which says, 'Effect of policy decisions.' That table shows that the effect of policy decisions from the government's budget was to deteriorate the budget in net terms, to have net spending of $20.5 billion. They added $20 billion of fuel to the inflation fires already raging through this country. That is in their own table in their own budget.</para>
<para>How much and how big is a $20 billion injection in a budget? If you take out the COVID years—obviously, COVID was different and hundreds of billions of dollars were injected in those years because we shut down the country—this is the biggest increase, the biggest injection, the biggest fiscal expansion of any government since Kevin Rudd's response to the global financial crisis. So that's for 15 years. The government is going around saying, 'We delivered a surplus.' No, your decisions added $20½ billion to the economy, which was the biggest non-COVID increase in fiscal expansion since Kevin Rudd's days.</para>
<para>At least Kevin Rudd had a global financial crisis to respond to. He was responding to a global recession. While he overegged it a bit, in hindsight, the direction was right. At that time, fiscal expansion was needed to help support the economy and avoid recession, avoid a further contraction. The environment right now is the direct opposite. There is global inflation, not a global recession. We had to try to take the fire out of that inflation—or we should have—in the budget six months ago, but, instead, the government added $20½ billion to it. Now, belatedly, they're admitting that they're spending too much. Senator Babet's motion is exactly right. It should have been done six months ago. Now we're playing catch-up, thanks to this government, and the people paying for that catch-up are those, especially mortgage holders, who are paying thousands and thousands of dollars more a month. In my home state of Queensland, the average mortgage holder is paying $1,200 more a month because of these interest rate increases. How are people affording this? It is unbelievable.</para>
<para>The other problem we've got here is that inflation hasn't fallen, as the government expected. It hasn't fallen in line with the budget forecast. The RBA the other week had to revise its inflation forecast up. So the government's plans are not working. Everything you'll hear from government senators in this debate will be about how they're providing assistance through bulk-billing relief, PBS changes or childcare support. All of those policies were announced at the election last year. They were announced before inflation got worse over the past few months. So the question Australians have to ask is: why aren't you doing more now? Why aren't you providing more cost-of-living relief, given the consequences of your actions, which have helped fuel inflation and make it even harder for Australians than it was predicted to be over 18 months ago when all these cost-of-living policies of the Labor Party were designed?</para>
<para>The Labor Party are finally playing catch-up on the spending side—or they say they're going to; we haven't seen real action yet—but they're yet to play catch-up on cost-of-living relief. There should be more cost-of-living relief. If the government are going to cut infrastructure funding, why can't they cut fuel taxes? We're paying 48.8c a litre in fuel excise. It should go into funding roads, but the government aren't going to do that anymore. They're not going to fund your roads, so why are you paying almost 50c a litre at the bowser? Give us a fuel tax cut and some cost-of-living relief. We're getting nothing from this government right now.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>15:57</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator POLLEY</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Well, what a contribution, in trying to blame everyone else and take no responsibility for being in government for almost a decade, where you did absolutely nothing except to triple the country's debt. That's what you did. Our deficit tripled over your time. You took no economic action to ensure that we were protected from any global economic shocks. You did nothing about that at all.</para>
<para>We had the contribution from the previous speaker, who was critical because, they said, we're spending too much money. On the one hand, they say we're spending too much money; on the other hand, they say we're not spending enough. Then they criticise us by saying—it's their new mantra this week—the government are full of broken promises. We just got criticised for not delivering on our election commitments. We in the Labor government, under Anthony Albanese as Prime Minister, have actually delivered on the election commitments we made to the Australian people, and we're not going to apologise for that—not today, not ever—because we believe in delivering on our commitments.</para>
<para>We've got to remember that they had nine years. What did they do to protect the Australian economy? Did they invest in skills? No. Did they invest in manufacturing? No. What have they done since they've been in opposition? They've opposed every strategy and piece of legislation to help Australian families. We know and understand, because we're out there talking to Australians, that they're doing it tough out there. Do we wish that inflation was lower and coming down? Yes, we do. But what we also know is that we have got the right policies in place.</para>
<para>Those opposite talk about mortgages and mortgage interest rates going up. Yes, they have. No-one is denying that. Why are interest rates going up? Because of the Reserve Bank of Australia, who are independent. Let's not forget that while the Liberals, who are now here moaning in the background, were in government interest rates had already started to go up. We are not responsible for international events, things which are happening globally, and inflation has impacted globally. But all of a sudden they think that we can just wave our magic wand and everything is going to be A-OK because we want it to be.</para>
<para>We are taking sensible decisions based on the best interests of Australians. We are delivering on our commitments. And we are mocked because we have actually reduced the cost of medication. We're mocked because we've actually delivered on child care. We've supported childcare workers to get an increase in their pay. We've supported aged-care workers to get an increase in their pay because of the work that they're doing. We have a policy of wanting to see Australian workers getting paid more. At the same time, it was a deliberate policy of the former Liberal governments to keep wages down. But they want to come in here now and try and rewrite history. What they won't tell you is that last week the international rating agency Fitch reaffirmed Australia's AAA credit rating, describing our fiscal stance as 'supportive of reducing inflation'. That's not us saying that; that is the international rating agency who are saying that.</para>
<para>We know inflation is moderating in our economy, and we would like to see it moderate more quickly and go down. We welcome that progress, but we have to be realistic that that is not going to change overnight. But, if they were still in government, it would be no better. In fact it would be worse, because they have never supported wage growth in this country for Australian workers.</para>
<para>This month we have tripled the bulk-billing incentives, giving support to 11.6 million eligible Australians—including children, pensioners and concession card holders—to access a GP with no out-of-pocket expense. At the same time, we've introduced our urgent care clinics. Over 60,000 people have already accessed those clinics. <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:02</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKIM</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The Australian Greens do support some of the points raised by Senator Babet in his urgency motion—such as, for example, the need for government to build more houses. However, we do not support this motion, primarily because we cannot support the proposition that the government should cut spending while so many people in our communities are struggling to cope with the escalating cost-of-living crisis. The latest <inline font-style="italic">Rental affordability index </inline>report shows that renters in every capital city around the country are in a worse position now than they were before the pandemic, and rental affordability right around the country is continuing to worsen. Food insecurity is increasing across the country. A recent report released by Foodbank Australia showed that as many as 3.7 million Australian households have been struggling with food insecurity in the last year. More and more people are having to decide between keeping a roof over their head or putting a decent meal on the table for their family.</para>
<para>So, instead of cutting spending, the government should be supporting people who are doing it tough right now, and they could do that in a range of ways—for example, by putting mental and dental health into Medicare; capping rent increases; increasing income support; making early childhood education and child care more affordable; and wiping student debt. Those are some of the things the government could and should be doing in order to help people get through a cost-of-living crisis. When people in our communities are struggling, it is not the time to reduce government spending; it is time to invest in providing genuine cost-of-living support.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:04</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ROBERTS</name>
    <name.id>266524</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As a servant to the many different people who make up our one Queensland community, I agree with Senator Babet that the government's spending is wrongheaded and is causing more harm than good. The Albanese government's announcement this week to cut back on real infrastructure spending to make way for nonsensical net zero spending is counterintuitive, a wrecking ball for future generations. Taxpayers have already paid for the national electricity grid through their tax payments and through their electricity bills. Taxpayers have already built beautiful, cost-effective baseload coalfired power stations and the associated poles and wires.</para>
<para>Instead of using the annual share of the budget that goes to infrastructure to build something new and useful, the Albanese government is tearing down what has already been built and building it again—and, much like this Prime Minister, building it with something that is not fit for purpose. Wind and solar are the most unreliable and expensive forms of power, once everything is factored in, including transmission lines. Wind turbines last for 15 years and solar installations about the same. All the nature-dependent power installed under this and previous governments has to be replaced before we get to 2050 and then replaced again and again every 15 years after that—again and again and again: insanity, a permanent black hole that benefits nobody except the predatory, parasitic billionaires who pull this government's strings.</para>
<para>Speaking of fit for purpose, Snowy Hydro 2.0 has proved that city bankers like Malcolm Turnbull are crap at picking infrastructure projects. To continue throwing good money after bad with this failure will come at the opportunity cost of funding sensible infrastructure projects like Big Buffalo dam and hydro, Hells Gates Dam, Koombooloomba hydro, Urannah Water Precinct, Emu Swamp and South East Flows Restoration. These are all worthwhile infrastructure projects that One Nation will build. And inland rail to the Port of Gladstone, the east-west rail line and a steel park at Abbot Point are projects One Nation will continue to push and support and build.</para>
<para>Then there are the road projects, schools, rural hospitals and so much more that this government is shelving so it can waste money on the UN's net zero fairytales—nightmares. Weather-dependent generation needs batteries to back it up—more expense. The environmental destruction is finally getting attention, after scars have already been cut across national parks all over this beautiful country. Each gigawatt of coalfired power has to be replaced with five gigawatts of wind or solar. No amount of solar will provide power at night without expensive batteries that are dirty to manufacture and last an even shorter time than the solar panels they so positively affirm.</para>
<para>The net zero alliance puts the cost of 100 renewables with no blackouts by 2050 at $1.5 trillion—260 gigawatts of installed capacity to replace 60 gigawatts of coal. No wonder the infrastructure minister, Minister King, announced that the Albanese government would require state governments to pay for at least half of any infrastructure project in their state. And new infrastructure projects must be over $500 million before the federal government will fund their half. That will leave the states to pay for most infrastructure projects entirely. That's Victoria done for, with all the debt Labor Premier Andrews left behind.</para>
<para>What next, a state levy to pay for infrastructure that the federal government should rightly be paying for now? This is socialists taxing the life out of the public. Australia already ranks 57th out of 62 of the largest economies for income tax levels, with first being the lowest tax rate, and 56th for company tax. We're nearly the highest. Foreign corporations, of course, are not included. They're token. Tax payments are only for public relations. Successive governments have been unable to deal with multinational tax avoidance—because they're not really trying. Electoral donations keep getting in the way—funny how that works!</para>
<para>According to the OECD, Australians' average annual wage growth from 2019 to 2022 was the seventh lowest among the 38 OECD nations, at less than three per cent. Inflation is now six per cent, after being at eight per cent. If everyday Australians feel like they're working harder and going backwards, it's because they are. As Senator Babet quite rightly pointed out on this motion, if it feels like your mortgage and rent are a struggle to pay, it's because they are—thanks to Labor. Tax cuts for upper-income earners are coming next year. Here's a better idea: index the tax thresholds so that Australians don't pay tax when their wages rise to compensate for inflation and push them into a higher-rate tax bracket. We should be indexing taxes to the inflation rate to prevent bracket creep.</para>
<para>The Prime Minister has wrung every cent out of everyday Australians, and the political polls are saying quite clearly that people are jack of it. One Nation are now the party of workers. One Nation are the party of sensible economic management for the benefit of all Australians. We have one flag. We are one community. We are one economy. We are one nation.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:09</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DUNIAM</name>
    <name.id>263418</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Rear-vision-mirror-itis is an affliction of this government, sadly. Since the election, I've not heard a contribution made by a government speaker that is purely about looking forward and how they're going to solve problems, without referring to the past. It's as if they have no control over anything and will therefore take no responsibility for anything. To that end, the coalition does support Senator Babet's motion in general terms, because it is right to say that the current government and their terrible approach to budget management, their lack of fiscal restraint, are causing huge problems in our nation, particularly for households and businesses.</para>
<para>I will point out that in the second paragraph Senator Babet refers to an example of a project: 'such as Snowy 2.0'. That's one we don't agree with, of course; we do support that project. But you only have to look a little bit further to see some of the terrible things the government are doing in terms of wasteful spending. We just spent nearly half a billion dollars on a divisive referendum. That's not a good use of taxpayers' money. We told this parliament that it didn't need to happen, but it was money spent all the same. What do we think that did to the economy and to inflation? What kind of impact do we think $1 billion on extra public servants is going to be having on the economy? Churning more money into jobs in this city is not going to ease inflationary pressures.</para>
<para>It was interesting to hear one of the Labor speakers earlier on, Senator Payman, mention that the government can walk and chew gum. Well, clearly they're walking in circles, because, frankly, nothing is getting better. The cost of living is going up, but we keep hearing that they've got it under control. Thank goodness there's this Labor government in charge now, making lives better and easier for all Australians! I hope Senator Payman gets out and about and understands from her community exactly what is going on, because I don't think there's a single person that's telling her or any of her colleagues that the world is a better place since the election.</para>
<para>We copped a lot of stick at the last election for saying it wouldn't be easy under—the surname of the Prime Minister—Mr Albanese, and we were right. Power prices have gone up. Mortgage repayments have gone up. The cost of insurance has gone up. And the government continue to plough money into measures that will have an inflationary impact, because they are economically illiterate as a government. They have been every time they have been in power, and the impact on Australian households and business is always the same. The people that pay the bill at the end of the day are the people of Australia. It's the taxpayers who struggle to pay their power bills, who struggle to pay their mortgage repayments, who struggle to put fuel in the car to get their kids to school. They miss out because of Labor decisions and sometimes, dreadfully, Labor-Greens decisions. We support the motion, with the exception, as I said before, of the reference to the Snowy 2.0 project, because we believe that is a good one.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>112096</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The question is that the urgency motion as moved by Senator Babet be agreed to.</para>
<para> </para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<division>
          <division.header>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:16]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
            </body>
          </division.header>
          <division.data>
            <ayes>
              <num.votes>25</num.votes>
              <title>AYES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Antic, A.</name>
                <name>Askew, W.</name>
                <name>Babet, R.</name>
                <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                <name>Cadell, R.</name>
                <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                <name>Davey, P. M.</name>
                <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                <name>Fawcett, D. J.</name>
                <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                <name>Hughes, H. A.</name>
                <name>Hume, J.</name>
                <name>Kovacic, M.</name>
                <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                <name>O'Sullivan, M. A. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Rennick, G.</name>
                <name>Reynolds, L. K.</name>
                <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
              </names>
            </ayes>
            <noes>
              <num.votes>28</num.votes>
              <title>NOES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                <name>Bilyk, C. L.</name>
                <name>Chisholm, A.</name>
                <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                <name>Lines, S.</name>
                <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                <name>Payman, F.</name>
                <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                <name>Polley, H.</name>
                <name>Pratt, L. C.</name>
                <name>Rice, J. E.</name>
                <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                <name>Shoebridge, D.</name>
                <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                <name>Urquhart, A. E. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                <name>Whish-Wilson, P. S.</name>
              </names>
            </noes>
            <pairs>
              <num.votes>0</num.votes>
              <title>PAIRS</title>
              <names />
            </pairs>
          </division.data>
          <division.result>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived.</p>
            </body>
          </division.result>
        </division></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>MATTERS OF PUBLIC IMPORTANCE</title>
        <page.no>43</page.no>
        <type>MATTERS OF PUBLIC IMPORTANCE</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cost of Living</title>
          <page.no>43</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:18</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>140651</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The Senate will now consider the proposal from Senator Hughes, which is also shown at item 12 on today's Senate Order of Business:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Pursuant to standing order 75, I propose that the following matter of public importance be submitted to the Senate for discussion:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Australians are being hit with a triple whammy of skyrocketing costs of essentials, falling real wages and now an interest rate hike, which demonstrates a clear failure of the Albanese Government to deliver a plan to ease the cost of living.</para></quote>
<para>Is the proposal supported?</para>
<para class="italic"> <inline font-style="italic">More than the number of senators required by the standing orders having risen in their places—</inline></para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>140651</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>With the concurrence of the Senate, the clerks will set the clock in line with the informal arrangements made by the whips.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:18</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HUGHES</name>
    <name.id>273828</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I thank all the colleagues on this side, as I rise to bring a matter of public importance to the chamber, that it was so overwhelmingly supported, and I know that's because every person in this place—or certainly every person on this side of the chamber—is willing to recognise that the single most important issue facing Australians today is the cost of living. You would also hope it would be the top priority for this Albanese government. We know that on 4 May 2022 Prime Minister Albanese put out a tweet:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Australians are being hit with a triple whammy of skyrocketing costs of essentials, falling real wages and now an interest rate hike. They need a government with a plan to ease the cost of living.</para></quote>
<para>Do you know what? Never a truer word was spoken. Australians are now being hit with a triple whammy of skyrocketing costs of essentials; falling real wages, not that 'real' is a word that can pass the lips of those opposite; and now another interest rate hike, the 12th under this government. This demonstrates a clear failure of the Albanese government to deliver a cost of living plan.</para>
<para>Now, you would think that those opposite would be nodding along in fierce agreement, but they cannot bring themselves to acknowledge the full effect of pain and hardship being felt by households all over the country. They absolutely cannot bring themselves to do anything but partisan politics, and the Australian people are growing sick and tired of this, and it really is starting to show. The <inline font-style="italic">Sydney Morning Herald</inline> led a story, 'Voters' gloomy outlook worsens.' Aussies are bracing for hardship, according to the article. They're expecting price hikes and falling wages, despite the government's empty promises. Even the <inline font-style="italic">SMH</inline> can see through it:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Only 8 per cent of voters expect the economy to improve over the next three months and 50 per cent believe it will get worse …</para></quote>
<para>Fifty-two per cent of people say this is the highest priority issue for their vote, and that's up from 32 per cent last year. <inline font-style="italic">The Australian</inline> today has an article entitled 'PM pays the rise for rising costs.' It says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Anthony Albanese's standing among voters continues to tank amid rising cost-of-living pressures, 13 rate hikes and the voice referendum fallout, with a new poll revealing the Prime Minister's net favourability has plunged by 37 points since May.</para></quote>
<para>They are two very different mastheads with very similar conclusions.</para>
<para>This is a government that's failing, and the people know it. Business knows it. The <inline font-style="italic">AFR</inline> reports today that our economy has taken a major plunge in a resilience ranking, that we have fallen from first place in 2004 down to 20th place in 2023. It has determined:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Australia dropped further than comparable countries including the United States, the United Kingdom, Canada and New Zealand in the same period. It plummeted 15 places on economic competitiveness, and from 21st to 52nd place on quality of energy infrastructure.</para></quote>
<para>This is all indicative of the total inaction and obfuscation of this government on the economy. The Prime Minister is missing in action or, when he's seen, he is out there acting on ideological crusades.</para>
<para>We are now seeing the highest rates since 2011—not surprisingly, when the Labor government was last in power. When we left government the rate was 0.33. What is it now? It's 4.35. We know that an average family with a mortgage of $750,000 has to find an extra $24,000 a year. Rents are up. Nationally, we have seen a three-bedder go from $440 to $665 week and we know that on the east coast it's significantly higher than that. Inflation is way too high, higher than almost every other advanced economy. Electricity prices are up, and people are going to suffer this summer, particularly if it is as hot as predicted, choosing whether they can put food on the table or have a little bit of air conditioning. Insurance is up. Food is up. These issues all continue to compound on each other, making the pain worse for Australian families every day.</para>
<para>Mr Albanese, your own words condemn you. The triple whammy you spoke of falls squarely at your feet, and you were spot on. Australians deserve a government with a plan and it's clearly not yours.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:24</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHELDON</name>
    <name.id>168275</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>():  Again we have those opposite talking about cost of living. Included in the MPI, of course, is wages. As has been said, they clearly want to turn around and say that this is about getting real change, but what they're about is making sure that they just join in a class war with the Minerals Council of Australia. They want to turn around and jump in with people that spent $24 million to make sure that the Australian public, the Australian community, has no further wage increases of any real nature. That's what they've been about all the way through whilst they've been in opposition. They opposed a dollar-an-hour minimum wage increase for the lowest-paid workers. They opposed a 5.4 per cent increase for minimum-paid workers. They opposed aged-care workers getting better wages, because it's just part of their class war. They can't help themselves.</para>
<para>Why do I say it's a class war? Because the Australian public says to those across the way very clearly what they expect of them. There was a recent survey that came out today. I suggest they read it. Essential Research says that, despite millions of dollars of advertising by big business lobbies supporting the oppositions position of a class war, the vast majority of the public—64 per cent—believe that big business has too much power. So here they are, spending tens of millions of dollars to suppress wages across the economy. At the same time, they're turning around and bankrolling and astroturfing the entire Australian economy, turning around and making sure that the National Farmers Federation, ACCI, AIG—all these people they're funding, because they're on the side of big business.</para>
<para>Roy Hill published just today as part of answers—partly answered, not fully answered questions that were put as a result of the inquiry into the closing the loopholes legislation. They said today, 'We will continue to do all we can to have this bill voted down by parliament,' because you're on the side of the most powerful people, the billionaires in this country, rather than hardworking Australians who are trying to get a decent living.</para>
<para>Opposition senators interjecting—</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHELDON</name>
    <name.id>168275</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>They always get upset about this one. The reality is that, time and time again, they vote with Qantas, with Alan Joyce, Richard Goyder and the wonderful board. They probably even said to their mates on the board, 'Make sure that all those recalcitrants get re-elected,' because they backed this class war. You guys over there are part of the class war strategy, which most of the people in this country find absolutely ridiculous. They keep voting with their feet in every survey of what their view is. Eighty per cent of Australians agree that measures to protect workers from wage theft should be brought in. They oppose that. Sixty-five per cent agree that employees and labour hire workers should be paid the same if they are doing the same job. They oppose it. Sixty-five per cent want the government to change workplace laws to close labour hire loopholes. They oppose it because they're on one side. They're on the billionaires' side. They're on the side of the ones making all that money, who want to bankroll everybody else in the employer group, who hold the same philosophy that working people should have their wages suppressed.</para>
<para>I'm going to say there are exceptions to that, because there are good businesses out there. One of those good businesses is Whitehaven, who just recently bought three coalmines from BHP up in Queensland. Now, BHP is, of course, one of the recalcitrants about suppressing wages and on their side for this class war that they're so adamant about waging against the Australian public. When I say 'class war', I don't mean this class or that class; I mean they're for them at the top. They're against everyone else in the middle and further below. Even Whitehaven, to their great credit, when they bought three mines off BHP—a substantially larger operation than Whitehaven that had an operation that turned around and paid between 30 and 40 per cent less for labour hire doing the exact same work. Guess what. They're not labour hire engaged by another company. They're labour hire engaged by their own company. To their credit, when Whitehaven bought those three mines, they said, 'We'll pay the highest rate to every miner working on that site.' They decided that, unlike the class warriors on the other side, they would turn around and make sure they gave a fair day's pay for a fair day's work for every other worker. Good on you, Whitehaven. Let's fight the class war together.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:29</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKIM</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>When interest rates go up, as they are in Australia at the moment—and I remind people we have had a record number of consecutive interest rate rises from the Reserve Bank of Australia, something we've never seen in Australia's history—some things inevitably flow. What inevitably flows is pain for people who are carrying debt, and in Australia overwhelmingly that means pain for mortgage holders, particularly mortgage holders who believed the former governor of the RBA, Dr Philip Lowe, when he said that interest rates would not go up for years. We are still within the period in which Dr Lowe promised interest rates wouldn't go up and yet we're on the back of 13 consecutive interest rates rises.</para>
<para>Another thing that happens when interest rates go up is rents go up. Ultimately, property speculators who own rental stock end up paying higher repayments because the interest rates are going up on their mortgages, and, therefore, they pass that pain on to the people that are renting from them. That is one of the reasons we should make sure that houses are not considered, as the Australian Labor Party believes they should be, as an asset class but, in fact, are considered as a human right. We're a rich enough and wealthy enough country to ensure that every person in this country has a home, and it is a disgrace that neoliberalism has turned houses from homes into an investment and asset class.</para>
<para>Something else that happens when interest rates go up is they put people out of work. Australians need to understand that, when the Reserve Bank of Australia says that it wants to slow down the economy, what it's actually saying is it wants more Australians to be made unemployed. Interestingly, the Labor Party agrees with that strategy, and Labor's budget from May last year was predicated on more than 100,000 extra Australians being forced out of work. Those are the numbers in Labor's budget.</para>
<para>Something else that happens when interest rates go up is bank profits go up. Surprise, surprise, we have seen the banks over recent weeks announce massive multibillion dollar profits while they are gouging people who have mortgages. So what we need in Australia is a government that is prepared to step up and respond to these massive pressures facing millions of Australians and millions of Australian families. The first thing Labor should do—</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>296331</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Your time has expired, Senator McKim.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKim</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Oh—</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>296331</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>You were just getting started! Senator Reynolds.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:32</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator REYNOLDS</name>
    <name.id>250216</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I listened with great interest to Senator Sheldon speaking on this, and even though this is about the cost of living, real wages and interest rate hikes, he couldn't utter a single one of those words. Let me share with those opposite what in 18 months the government has done to this nation's economy and to the workers Senator Sheldon professes to be so supportive of. Real household gross disposable income per capita, per Australian, is back this year 5.1 per cent. It has gone backwards over five per cent, and that is the worst performance by this hopefully one-term government—because people aren't going to be able to afford this mob too much longer—in the OECD. When we left government, pretty much every OECD indicator post COVID was at the top or almost at the top. And in 18 months you've managed to plunge workers into a cost-of-living crisis.</para>
<para>On this side let us talk about what those opposite cannot bear to mention anymore. What have they done? As Senator Hughes said, the Prime Minister laid out his goals just before the last election. He said Australians would be hit with a triple whammy of skyrocketing costs of essentials, falling wages and interest rate hikes. Well, guess what? That has all come true under this Prime Minister. If only he spent less time worrying about truth and treaty T-shirts and jetting overseas and his dance moves in the Pacific, if only he were here to look after and oversee his Treasurer, who is absolutely sending this country backwards at a rapid rate of knots. What won't they talk about? Let's talk about some of the facts.</para>
<para>Interest rates under this Labor government are at their highest since 2011. Unsurprisingly, guess who was in government at that point? Those opposite were in government. A family with a $750,000 mortgage under this government is now $24,000 a year worse off with extra mortgage repayments. That's an extra thousand dollars per fortnight that hundreds of thousands of families now have to find.</para>
<para>As if that were not bad enough for families, the price of food is up 8.2 per cent. The price of fuel is up 7.2 per cent this quarter alone. The cost of electricity is up 18.2 per cent and the cost of gas is up 28 per cent. And, under this mob, productivity has fallen by 6½ per cent in less than 15 months. As those on this side of the chamber know, when productivity falls, inflation goes up, putting pressure on the economy, and, yes, interest rates keep rising.</para>
<para>What we have seen today is more shame on those opposite. The Rental Affordability Index from National Shelter and SGS Economics & Planning shows that renters in each capital city are worse off than they were before the pandemic. That is appalling. Not only can Australians not find a house to rent anymore; many people cannot afford their mortgage and are increasingly making decisions: Do they fill up the car, do they pay their insurance or do they go without food? Do they give up on their mortgage? That is all under the Labor Party, in less than 18 months.</para>
<para>As a senator for Western Australia, I'm here with two great Western Australian Senate colleagues. We've been going out and talking to Western Australians, and I can tell you—</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator REYNOLDS</name>
    <name.id>250216</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>As Senator O'Sullivan said, they are hurting. We visited Foodbank, which has had a 50 per cent increase in the number of people coming on a daily basis. The majority of them are double-income families who cannot afford their mortgage and food anymore. We've heard from Anglicare WA during the Senate cost-of-living inquiry. In January, for example, the service received 3,752 calls for support, which was a 52 per cent increase in one single month. People are hurting under this mob.</para>
<para>Not only, in Western Australia, has the Prime Minister bungled and let 50 people—murderers and rapists—loose in Perth, but they cannot— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</continue>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>296331</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator O'Neill.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:37</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'NEILL</name>
    <name.id>140651</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you very much, Madam Acting Deputy President Grogan. Can I thank you for taking the chair so I'm able to participate in this afternoon's matter of public importance discussion.</para>
<para>Cost of living is something the Albanese government have always taken very seriously, and we are more than up for the task of ensuring that Australians can manage the onslaught of the global economic headwinds that face us. We will make sure that Australia comes out of this situation more financially and fiscally secure. Members of the Liberal and National parties have a very self-indulgent perspective. They think that because they're antiworker they're somehow the superior economic managers. That could not be further from the truth. In the Labor government we have a very robust mix of workers, business owners, economists, unionists and individuals who truly do understand the reality of what it's like to count every dollar and every cent. We've got a diverse caucus. The member for Fenner, a former ANU economics professor, provides excellent expertise that's both wise and well founded. My friend on the coast the member for Hunter, a five-time Olympian and Commonwealth Games medallist, worked as a coalminer and as a manager for a small to medium enterprise in the mining business. The Deputy Prime Minister, the member for Corio, a strong statesman and local member, has experience as a legal officer at the Transport Workers Union and as Assistant Secretary of the ACTU. Anthony Albanese, Australia's 31st Prime Minister, grew up in council housing with his mother, a single parent who was solely dependent on the pension, before going on to study economics at Sydney uni. You don't forget the things that you know from the world. We understand; we absolutely understand.</para>
<para>I know a thing or two about hard work and counting every dollar and cent that's spent. I was born to Irish immigrant parents in Western Sydney. My mum worked in a factory and my dad was driving machinery on the Warringah Freeway. When I was born we ended up living in a caravan in a family friend's backyard so they could save and get themselves ahead. By the age of nine I was changing my siblings' nappies, and by 11 I was doing the bookkeeping for my father and mother's family business. We worked hard, but we built a secure life, and there were times when it was tough. Senator Hughes, the long-term political staffer turned senator, when I say that I know that people are doing it tough, I really mean it, and so do all my Labor colleagues. We deeply understand. We know the challenges Australians are facing.</para>
<para>The reductionist dogma that we're getting from the LNP is both unhelpful and confused. In the same breath the LNP claim that the Albanese government are not doing enough to support working Australians doing it tough, yet the shadow Treasurer, Mr Angus Taylor, also wants the government to cut the spending, presumably starting first with Medicare, then education, then aged care. Our Medicare reforms are helping 11.6 million Australians to get to see a doctor when they need it and to get them into urgent care and not have to wait at an emergency ward. When you can't afford to see the doctor, there are real repercussions. We understand. They wreck Medicare; we have to rebuild it every time we come in. That is taking care of the people of this nation, because health matters. The shadow Treasurer directly advocated for spending cuts on 9 May 2023.</para>
<para>Those opposite are so devoid of talent after the teal wave swept most of the sensible members out to sea, leaving only a Morrison inspired marketing-agency shell of the party in their wake. They will say anything and everything in a rampant attempt to find some relevancy. But Australians have good memories. Australians remember the former Prime Minister Scott Morrison standing against Labor's pledge to increase the minimum wage by $1 an hour. That's how much the LNP care about working Australians. Australians remember the shadow Treasurer's and Senator Hughes's opposition to increasing bulk billing. Australians remember the member for Hume's and Senator Hughes's opposition to increasing the eligibility of the single parenting payment. To the member for Hume and Senator Hughes, I provide a fee-free piece of advice about practical action: helping single mothers is good economics. It's good for Australia. It's also the right thing to do, and it's helping people who are under stress. Expanding the eligibility of the single parenting payment for the youngest child from being eight to 14 provides more opportunities to save and live a secure life. It's not just about supporting the parents; it's about supporting the children too. We understand. Labor won't leave Australians hanging— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:42</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ROBERTS</name>
    <name.id>266524</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As the servant to the many different people who make up our one Queensland community, I agree with this matter of public importance from Senator Hughes. I'm not sure about 'triple whammy'. Perhaps a more appropriate term is a perfect storm of government incompetence and callousness. Food essentials are dearer because successive Liberal-National and Labor-Greens governments have taken water off farmers to give to kill trees, driving up the price of irrigation water and, with them, the price of food. Profiteering from Coles and Woolworths is not helping. Both have just booked record profits on behalf of their foreign owners, including BlackRock and Vanguard. Real wages are falling—five per cent in the last year alone. Yet the inflation we're currently experiencing is on the heads of the previous Liberal government, who, along with Labor, Greens and teals, destroyed the economy to control people and transfer wealth during COVID, in the process printing so much money that inflation was the inevitable result, as I said over and over across 2021 and 2022.</para>
<para>Interest rates were always going to rise from an artificial low of 0.1 per cent. The reason they've risen so quickly and so high is on both sides of this chamber. The largest single cause of our economic woes is the net zero fairytale. Today even the Bank of England accepts that net zero is inflationary. Former Liberal Treasurer Peter Costello and Australia's Reserve Bank accept that net zero is inflationary. When baseload power is replaced by fairytale weather-dependent power, energy costs rise. The sun and the wind are free, true. The materials to capture that very low density energy are not. That's why the cost per unit of energy is so high. Australians are seeing the result of net zero in their mortgages or rent payments, at the shops and in their utility bills. Money doesn't go far enough to pay for the net zero fairytale, yet this government continues down that path regardless, despite the financial suffering this is causing everyday Australians—callous behaviour indeed.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:44</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BROCKMAN</name>
    <name.id>30484</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I too rise to speak on this matter of public importance. First of all, as I often have to do in this place, I have to set the record straight for those listening in the gallery or on the broadcast or reading the <inline font-style="italic">Hansard </inline>in a few days. Real wages increased under the last coalition government. You wouldn't know that if you just listened to what the Labor Party said, because they don't speak the truth. Real wages grew under the last coalition government, and real wages are plummeting under this Labor government. Real wages are plummeting, at a time when costs for families and businesses are skyrocketing. I could table information to show that this is a fact. It is a fact. It's in the ABS statistics. No-one can actually doubt what I am saying. But I don't need to table the information, because every family out there who is listening to this knows it. They know it when they get their pay cheque at the end of the two weeks. They know it when they go to the grocery store to buy the basket of groceries that used to cost them $200 and now costs them $250, if they're lucky. They know it when they go to the petrol station and fill up. Where they used to fill their tank to the brim, they now have to stop halfway because they have to watch their pennies. They know it when they see the money come out of their account every month or every two weeks on their mortgage repayments, which for an average mortgage holder in this country have gone up anywhere from $15,000 to $25,000 a year.</para>
<para>So, when they hear the Labor Party trot out their trite lines about how they've done this, that and the other to assist with the cost of living, every Australian family listening knows that what they have done has done nothing to improve the lives and livelihoods of Australian families. It has done nothing to address the serious cost pressures that small business in this country is under. It has done nothing to alleviate the pain that so many families are feeling in having to make very tough decisions about whether to send their kids to the weekend sport, whether to think about that holiday over the Christmas period, whether they have to perhaps do more hours at work and miss out on time with their kids. These are the difficult decisions that Australian families are having to make.</para>
<para>I find it ironic. I looked back through the <inline font-style="italic">Hansard</inline>transcript just before giving this speech. It is now 14 months ago—and I think my good friend Senator O'Sullivan was actually in the chamber at that time too—that I gave a speech, a little bit tongue in cheek, where I said, thinking back to that great television show<inline font-style="italic"> The West Wing</inline>, that Labor had a secret plan to fight inflation. I think you were here for that speech, Senator O'Sullivan. That was 14 months ago, well over a year ago. 'A secret plan to fight inflation'—I said it a little bit tongue in cheek. I thought it was so secret because Labor weren't telling us what their plan was. And here we are 14 months later, and I think the Australian public would have every right to think that that plan is still secret, because they're not seeing it. They're not seeing any plan from this Labor government to tackle the very serious challenges that are facing Australian small businesses and Australian families every time they go to the grocery store, every time they go to fill up their car with petrol, every time they think about a little bit extra for their kids, every time they look at the basket of goods they're going to buy this week and think, 'What do we have to leave out?' These pressures are real. They're not something that those on this side have magically made up. These are real pressures on real Australians.</para>
<para>All governments need to be able to make tough decisions. That's what government is all about. But all this government seems to want to do is to look back to the past, to throw hand grenades across the chamber, to blame everything on the coalition, when in fact they've now delivered two budgets. They're the ones with their hands on the levers of power. They're the ones who have to make the tough decisions about expenditure—and they can't. They've shown that now. Two times, at least, the Reserve Bank have paused interest rate rises and looked at this government, looked at the settings in the economy, and said, 'Where are we going next? Do we raise interest rates or do we stay on hold?' And twice now—once with this government's last budget—the Reserve Bank have paused, waited and then raised interest rates.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>140651</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The discussion on the matter of public importance has concluded.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>48</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Consideration</title>
          <page.no>48</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>48</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Public Works Joint Committee</title>
          <page.no>48</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Report</title>
            <page.no>48</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:50</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator PRATT</name>
    <name.id>I0T</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>On behalf of the Chair of the Parliamentary Standing Committee on Public Works, I present the committee's eighth report of 2023.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Public Accounts and Audit Joint Committee, Law Enforcement Joint Committee</title>
          <page.no>48</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Government Response to Report</title>
            <page.no>48</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:50</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I present two government responses to committee reports: the Joint Committee of Public Accounts and Audit on its inquiry into the Commonwealth financial statements for 2021-22, and the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Law Enforcement on its inquiry into public communications campaigns targeting drug and substance abuse. In accordance with the usual practice, I seek leave to incorporate the documents in <inline font-style="italic">Hansard</inline>.</para>
<para>Leave granted.</para>
<para class="italic"> <inline font-style="italic">The documents read as follows—</inline></para>
<quote><para class="block">Australian Government response to Recommendations 3 and 4 in the Joint Committee of Public Accounts and Audit Report 497:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"> <inline font-style="italic">Inquiry into Commonwealth Financial Statements 2021-22</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">October 2023</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Response to the Committee's recommendations</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government notes the Committee's recommendation.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government notes the contract termination payment made by the Department of Defence in relation to the Attack Class submarine project was found to be made from a legally valid appropriation source and was correctly accounted for in Defence's financial statements.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Department of Finance (Finance) will continue to support entities, and Chief Financial Officers (CFOs) in particular, build the technical knowledge and capability of staff in relation to the appropriations framework. For example, during 2022-23, Finance:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">• delivered a series of masterclasses, including two on the appropriations framework, to over 1,000 APS staff;</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">• delivered a targeted series of agency outreach sessions on the appropriations framework to around 1,000 CFOs and APS staff; and</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">• continued to provide support and advice to Commonwealth entities via quarterly Portfolio Department CFO Forums and quarterly Financial Stewardship Forums (targeted at CFOs and their staff), with a focus on accounting, budgetary, audit, legal, workforce planning and other operational matters of interest to each portfolio.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government notes the Committee's recommendation.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">As part of the 2023-24 Budget, the Government revised the Explanatory Memoranda supporting the 2023-24 Appropriation Bills (as well as the Explanatory Memoranda supporting Appropriation Bill (No. 4) 2022-2023) to clarify the intended use of equity injection funding provided through the even-numbered Appropriation Bills. This practice will continue to be used for future Appropriation Bills</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Further opportunities to clarify the use of non-operating funding will be considered as of future economic updates.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Australian Government response to the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Law Enforcement Inquiry report:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Public communications campaigns targeting drug and substance abuse</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Introduction</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government welcomes the Final Report of the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Law Enforcement Inquiry on <inline font-style="italic">Public communications campaigns targeting drug and substance abuse</inline>.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government would like to thank all those who were involved in the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Law Enforcement (the committee) and those who made written submissions and gave evidence at the public hearings.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government acknowledges that illicit drugs continue to have a significant impact on individuals, families and communities across Australia and is committed to preventing the uptake and reducing the harms associated with use. Illicit drugs are also a cause for concern given the involvement of serious and organised crime syndicates producing and trafficking them.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government also acknowledges the ongoing need for targeted public communications campaigns in reducing the demand for illicit drugs and encouraging behavioural change. Drug use is often influenced by an individual's beliefs and attitudes and the socio-cultural environment within which they find themselves. By increasing awareness of the harms of drug use and encouraging behaviour change, campaigns may reduce people's motivations towards drug use.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government undertakes a range of reduction and prevention activities focusing on harm minimisation of drug use in Australia, through the overarching framework of the <inline font-style="italic">National Drug Strategy 2017-2026 </inline>(the Strategy). The Strategy includes 'targeted communication strategies' as a method to achieve its overall aim of preventing and minimising drug-related harms, consistent with the priority action of '<inline font-style="italic">preventing uptake, delaying first use and reducing use.'</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The committee's Final Report made four recommendations addressing a range of areas across communications, including the efficacy of different approaches to drug-related campaigns, best practice approaches to designing and implementing campaigns and other related matters.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government notes the recommendations of the Final Report. This response specifically addresses the recommendations identified in the Final Report. It has been coordinated and prepared by the Department of Health and Aged Care, with input from the Attorney-General's Department and the Department of Home Affairs.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Australian Government Response to Final Report</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"><inline font-style="italic">Recommendation 1</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"> <inline font-style="italic">2.90 The committee recommends that the Australian Government implement a new public communications campaign via the National Drugs Campaign that will support law</inline>  <inline font-style="italic">enforcement agencies' efforts to reduce current and future illicit drug demand. The campaign should include the targeted use of social media.</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Response:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government supports this recommendation.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government has a strong history of campaigning against the use of illicit drugs, beginning in 1985 with the 'National Campaign Against Drug Abuse' followed by a series of targeted campaigns in the 1990s under the branding 'The Drug Offensive'. There are clear benefits and economies in developing and implementing these initiatives at the national level, maximising opportunities afforded by the cost-efficiencies and agenda-setting and a consistent approach with national media and stakeholders.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">To date, the National Drugs Campaign (NDC) has been based on a harm minimisation approach and plays an important role as an awareness-raising and prevention initiative. There have been many phases of campaign activity addressing different audiences and specific drugs to respond to current and emerging drugs.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Any campaign developed to reduce current and future illicit drug use and demand would likely include the targeted use of social media. This channel was particularly effective in reaching crystal methamphetamine (ice) users during the most recent phase of the NDC under the National Ice Action Strategy.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">In line with Australian Government advertising requirements and best practice, final media placement decisions are based on formative research recommendations and expert advice from the master media buying agency, currently Universal McCann.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"><inline font-style="italic">Recommendation 2</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"> <inline font-style="italic">3.75 The committee recommends future Australian Government communications campaigns include the following characteristics:</inline></para></quote>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">contain targeted </inline> <inline font-style="italic">messages on the dangers of illicit drug use to key cohorts</inline></list>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">reflect the lived experiences of illicit drug users and also the experiences of trusted people, such as teachers and healthcare workers, to establish behavioural change</inline></list>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">provide </inline> <inline font-style="italic">information on addiction treatment off-ramps</inline></list>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">include a national schools' element that will take a multi-component approach to developing protective factors and involve the national education community in its design and implementation</inline></list>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">be based on appropriately detailed and considered research and, prior to commencement, have in place both quantitative and qualitative measures for efficacy</inline></list>
<list> <inline font-style="italic">take a long-term approach of at least 3-5 years and include a sustained approach to key cohorts over that entire period.</inline></list>
<quote><para class="block">Response:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government supports this recommendation in principle, noting that specific components will be dependent on formative research recommendations and requirements under the Guidelines on Information and Advertising Campaigns by non-corporate Commonwealth entities (the Guidelines).</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">All Australian Government campaigns are informed by market research that identifies the need for the campaign, the relevant target audiences and the kinds of messaging and channels that would be most appropriate. This typically involves both quantitative and qualitative methodologies.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">In accordance with the Guidelines, creative materials undergo concept testing with the target audiences to ensure they are appropriate and likely to meet the campaign's objectives. Campaigns need to ensure they do not unintentionally further marginalise or stigmatise people who are at higher risk of experiencing alcohol, tobacco and other drug related harm.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Under the whole-of-government arrangement for evaluation research, benchmarking is conducted prior to campaign launch, with ongoing tracking research while in market. This assesses the effectiveness of the campaign by monitoring changes in the target audiences' attitudes, knowledge and intended/reported behaviour in relation to the key campaign messages.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"><inline font-style="italic">Recommendation 3</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"> <inline font-style="italic">4.18 The committee recommends the Australian Government establish a formal mechanism to ensure that Commonwealth, State and Territory law enforcement bodies have a strong equal voice in developing policies and </inline> <inline font-style="italic">strategies to reduce illicit drug demand, including drug treatment services.</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Response:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government supports this recommendation, noting the importance of cross- agency and cross-jurisdictional collaboration and coordination and the need for a balanced approach between health and law enforcement.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government's approach to preventing and reducing harms associated with drug use is set out in the overarching framework of the <inline font-style="italic">National Drug Strategy 2017-2026</inline>. The Strategy guides action by health and law enforcement agencies at both the Commonwealth and state and territory government level, in partnership with service providers and the community. The Strategy outlines the Government's commitment to supporting the principle of harm minimisation, through the three pillars of supply, demand and harm reduction and a balanced approach between health and law enforcement. Cooperation between law and enforcement, policing, justice and health sectors is essential in delivering effective responses under these three pillars.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"><inline font-style="italic">Recommendation 4</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block"> <inline font-style="italic">4.19 The committee recommends the Australian Government support research, potentially by the Australian Institute of </inline> <inline font-style="italic">Criminology, into the efficacy of addiction treatment programs in reducing drug-related crime recidivism.</inline></para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Response:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Australian Government supports this recommendation. The Australian Institute of Criminology will undertake a cost-benefit analysis of addiction treatment programs to ascertain their efficacy in reducing drug related criminal activity within an Australian context.</para></quote>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>51</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>National Environmental Laws and Standards</title>
          <page.no>51</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>51</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:51</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—I table documents relating to the order for the production of documents concerning national environmental laws and standards.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>51</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Law Enforcement Joint Committee</title>
          <page.no>51</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Government Response to Report</title>
            <page.no>51</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>16:52</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHOEBRIDGE</name>
    <name.id>169119</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I seek leave to move a motion in relation to the Australian government response to the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Law Enforcement report on public communications campaigns targeting drug and substance abuse.</para>
<para>Leave granted.</para>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHOEBRIDGE</name>
    <name.id>169119</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That the Senate take note of the document.</para></quote>
<para>The government's response to the PJCLE report indicated support for the recommendations of the committee. I'm a member of that committee, but I'll be quite frank: I thought the recommendations when it came to public communications regarding drug and substance abuse were largely unhelpful and didn't address one of the most significant problems that we've seen, which is communications that have come out of the Australian Federal Police.</para>
<para>Recommendation 2 was that future Australian government communications campaigns include the following characteristics: targeted messages to key cohorts; messages that reflect the lived experience of illicit drug users and that use the experience of trusted people; providing information on addiction treatment off-ramps; and including a national schools element. I'm not suggesting that those aren't useful considerations. But one of the key things that were missing was a clear consideration of how the AFP's previous communications and often quite expensive public campaigns on drug use have been utterly without any kind of evidence base. In saying that, I do note that there was a reference to the need for some considered research and quantitative and qualitative measures for the efficacy of communications.</para>
<para>The reason I raise these concerns is that the Australian Federal Police spent millions of dollars of public money running a campaign called Faces of Meth, and the Faces of Meth campaign was a rebranding—a shameless rebranding—of a US education campaign that commenced in the state of Montana. It shows shocking images of corpselike faces of people that are asserted to be addicted to methamphetamines. The purpose of the Montana campaign, which was obviously dreamt up in some small office in Montana, in the United States, was to shock people into not using methamphetamines.</para>
<para>Now, let's be clear: methamphetamines are dangerously addictive drugs and can drastically negatively impact people's lives, including significant addiction and behavioural responses. No-one's minimising the impact of methamphetamine. But the Faces of Meth campaign, which commenced in the Montana Meth Project and then ran in a series of states in the United States, was the subject of significant academic and research review in the United States. That research was publicly available at the time that the Australian Federal Police spent millions of dollars of public money on running the exact same campaign in Australia. Indeed, the exact same faces that were used in the US campaign were just replicated in the scare campaign being run by the Australian Federal Police. Millions of dollars of public money was spent on it—money that, therefore, couldn't be used for actually effective addiction programs, for treatment programs or for things we know work.</para>
<para>Worse than that: the research on the Faces of Meth project shows that it's not only not effective but also directly countereffective, particularly with young people or cohorts of people who are potentially considering taking methamphetamines. When they see the Faces of Meth advertising—the scare and fear campaign—it does two things. It increases interest in the drug and it decreases, particularly for young people, belief in the validity or credibility of public advertising on drugs. I know this because one of the key professors from the National Drug Research Institute at Curtin University told our committee this in evidence. Professor Lee said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">There are some studies in the US that relate to Faces of Meth, which the police have copied here. I think the Montana Meth Project is what it is referred to as, and there has been some outcome research. Young people in particular actually showed an increased interest in drugs. It actually advertises the drug. The tendency is to sensationalise and go to the very extreme of what drug use might look like, and young people are like, 'Well that's never going to happen to me,' so they don't connect with that message. But now they know that meth is a thing—that you can take it, that you can get it—and they start to get interested in it. So there is actually research from that Faces of Meth activity that shows that not only does it not reduce harms for users; it increases interest among young people. I think that is a huge problem.</para></quote>
<para>All of this research was available to the Australian Federal Police before they rolled out the Faces of Meth campaign in Australia—all of the research that says it's not only not effective at reducing drug use but actually communicates to young people the availability of the market and that the government's not to be trusted in this space. The extreme images being shown by the AFP do not resonate with the experience of the majority of young people with drug-taking. Therefore, those extreme messages simply lead young people not to trust any of what might otherwise be credible information coming in public information campaigns.</para>
<para>I asked Professor Lee:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Do you think, at a minimum, there should be a requirement for law enforcement agencies, before they spend significant amounts of public money on communications about drugs, to actually have an evidence base for their communication strategy?</para></quote>
<para>Professor Lee said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Absolutely. Everybody should be using evidence based approaches. In particular, something so dramatic and expensive that it not only doesn't help but actually does harm is a waste of public money, at the very best.</para></quote>
<para>I utterly endorse Professor Lee's comments.</para>
<para>I find it astounding, though, that nobody in government has sought to get any accountability from the AFP on this. It appears that the AFP just had access to a couple of million dollars of public money without ever having to go through any credible process to justify the expenditure. Even when it was identified as being actively negative and harmful advertising, nobody in government asked for an explanation from the AFP. The Attorney-General hasn't. The secretary of the department hasn't. Nobody has asked for an accounting from the AFP about not only their squandering of public money but the active harm that they caused in their Faces of Meth campaign. I think it goes to show the lack of intellectual engagement with these issues in the government and the lack of accountability for the AFP in their day-to-day projects and their use of public money.</para>
<para>Australia knows from history that fear campaigns don't work. We know from our own history that fear campaigns don't work. We know that from the campaign in relation to HIV. The studies have shown that the communications that worked and continue to work for HIV are not the Grim Reaper scare campaigns. In fact, they disengaged people. They didn't work for HIV. What worked was providing credible information from trusted sources that people could engage with and trust. How is it that the Australian Federal Police have not learnt this lesson? I don't know. How is it that the government doesn't seem to care about the waste of money and the dangerous and harmful use of public money by the AFP? I can't explain that either, but I can say this: unless the government and the AFP come to grips with these actual issues, not only will the AFP be ineffectual in this space but it will continue to cause harm. I would have thought that all of us could agree that that's a poor outcome.</para>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Parliamentary Library Joint Committee</title>
          <page.no>52</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Membership</title>
            <page.no>52</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:02</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The President has received a letter nominating a senator to be a member of a committee.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:02</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator GALLAGHER</name>
    <name.id>ING</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—I move:</para>
<quote><para class="block">That Senator Waters be appointed as a member of the Joint Standing Committee on the Parliamentary Library.</para></quote>
<para>Question agreed to.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>52</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>National Occupational Respiratory Disease Registry Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>52</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7053" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">National Occupational Respiratory Disease Registry Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Returned from the House of Representatives</title>
            <page.no>52</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo></subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>53</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Rural and Regional Affairs and Transport References Committee</title>
          <page.no>53</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Reference</title>
            <page.no>53</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:08</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>283585</name.id>
    <electorate></electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As nobody is seeking the call, I'll put the question. The question is that the motion moved by Senator Cadell and Senator Colbeck be agreed to.</para>
<para> </para>
</speech>
<division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [17:08]<br />(The Acting Deputy President—Senator O'Sullivan)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>26</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Askew, W. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Babet, R.</name>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Davey, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Fawcett, D. J.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hughes, H. A.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Rennick, G.</name>
                  <name>Reynolds, L. K.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Van, D. A.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>29</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Bilyk, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Pratt, L. C. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Rice, J. E.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Urquhart, A. E.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Whish-Wilson, P. S.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>0</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names />
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division></subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>54</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>54</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r6979" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>54</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:11</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BRAGG</name>
    <name.id>256063</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As I was saying earlier today in the debate on this bill, we effectively have a situation where the government is pursuing a reform of the tax system which puts the whole franking system at risk. It is doing that on the basis of data from 2016, when there were market conditions which the ATO at the time believed were going to give rise to some integrity issues. Those issues, in the Treasury's own evidence to the committee, have now been addressed. So you have to ask yourself: why would you pursue a reform—and I use the term 'reform' very loosely—of the tax system, and why would you pursue this particular amendment, if the market issue you were concerned about no longer exists? Secondly, why would you pursue this issue if it were going to put the franking system at risk, which has incentivised investment in Australian companies? That is a key point. Dividend imputation and franking have incentivised Australians to invest in companies here. They have incentivised companies to use equity rather than debt and encouraged the payment of taxation. It seems very strange that the government would seek to raise $10 million a year based on a costing from five or six years ago, when that market activity no longer exists, therefore putting at risk the ability of companies to raise capital and pay a franked dividend. That is the key point here.</para>
<para>We did do a good report in the Senate committee that set out these issues in detail.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Scarr</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>It was a very good report.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BRAGG</name>
    <name.id>256063</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Thank you very much. I note here that the law firm King & Wood Mallesons have looked at the government's amendments, which were designed, of course, to address the government's admission, in their own report, that the bill was pretty ordinary. King & Wood Mallesons have said that the current hurdle of the operation of the provision, which I referred to before is in relation to the established practice test, is based on any variance from the existing dividend policy, irrespective of its materiality. King & Wood Mallesons go on to say that the government's amendments are meaningless and worthless, because the established practice test remains intact under this particular suite of amendments from the government.</para>
<para>So, you have to ask yourself: why would the government be pursuing amendments that are not going to be effective? Of course, the proposition that was accepted by the government and by us in the report—I thought—was that imputation should not be disturbed if it is going to massively disrupt the ability of companies to raise capital and then pay a franked dividend. If these amendments are only going to be effectively window dressing so the government can say, 'Yes, we responded to the Senate's report with some sort of amendments', but they have no market impact, and the capacity of a company to pay a franked dividend remains imperilled, then what is the point of these amendments?</para>
<para>I know that some people will have a view on whether these amendments improve the position in relation to dividend reinvestment programs. If that is the case then that may be worth looking at closely. But the substantive point here is that these amendments, according to all the legal advice we've been able to obtain in the past few days, are rubbish—these are rubbish amendments on a rubbish bill designed to a fix a problem that was solved six years ago. The reality is that the government wouldn't be doing this—wouldn't be rustling around down in the Treasury trying to find a few bucks here and a few bucks there—if they weren't running a fiscally irresponsible budget stance.</para>
<para>That is what this is all about. It's about going around and accumulating a few bucks here and a few bucks there because they've got to pay for their big spending, which the Reserve Bank itself is telling the government to stop doing, because the government's major problem is that it is not running a contractionary fiscal problem when it should be running that, to complement the Reserve Bank. As a result, the Reserve Bank is ratcheting up interest rates on Australian families because the government is not doing its job, which is to run a sensible, prudent fiscal policy.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:16</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator DAVID POCOCK</name>
    <name.id>256136</name.id>
    <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>It's always a tough act to follow Senator Bragg on franking credits—or superannuation, for that matter—with his keen interest and knowledge. But I rise to speak on schedule 5 of the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023, in relation to small business. This is another bill that, when introduced, presented potential unintended consequences for small businesses—consequences that small-business owners weren't made aware of. Thankfully, key accounting and tax bodies noticed the risks and raised them with my office. I want to thank Chartered Accountants Australia and New Zealand, Certified Practising Accountant Australia, the Tax Institute and the Institute of Public Accountants for their engagement on these matters. I also want to thank the government for revising the explanatory memorandum to address the concerns raised on behalf of small businesses.</para>
<para>It's common practice for small businesses to use capital raisings and franked dividends to facilitate the departure of one or more shareholders from a company—for example, when a new generation of family members invests in the family business and a franked dividend is paid to the departing generation of shareholders. Those are franked credits that the departing shareholders have legitimately earned, and they deserve to be treated as legitimate. The government has offered assurances that such practices are not intended to be captured by this measure and has amended the explanatory memorandum to clarify this point as well as making substantive amendments to refine the scope of the measure. Given these changes, I am now in a position to support the amended bill.</para>
<para>I'll also be moving a second reading amendment on the small and family business concerns related to this bill. I hope that, moving forward, my parliamentary colleagues will commit to consulting the small business community on legislative changes that have the potential to negatively impact them. Too often legislation is introduced and passed without small businesses being made aware of how they might be affected. We know that most small-business owners are flat out running their small businesses and not necessarily checking in on what the parliament is discussing. We can and must do a better job in this place of consulting directly with the people impacted by our decisions, and I'd argue that we need to do so early in the process rather than at the last moment or, worse, after legislation has passed.</para>
<para>This was one of the clearest messages we heard from small-business owners at a breakfast I hosted with Senator Maria Kovacic and Allegra Spender MP here at Parliament House. Over 120 people came along at 7.30 on a Monday morning to discuss the challenges small businesses are facing and how policy can be better designed to support them rather than hindering them and the work that they are doing. Many of those in attendance were Canberra small-business owners who've never been invited into this building. They drive past it all the time, but they've never actually been invited in here to voice their concerns and opinions or to learn how proposed government policies might change their lives for better or worse. We heard firsthand how small businesses are struggling post-COVID to make things work and are struggling to try and increase wages to ensure that staff can pay for the things they need and to be able to retain staff. As small-business owners in a competitive environment with the challenges we're facing, that often means that they have to pick up extra shifts. They have to do nights where they're doing payroll or spend a Saturday or a Sunday working on their business. This is one of the things that often isn't acknowledged when we impose additional requirements on them when it comes to legislation—often well-meaning requirements, and even changes that small-business owners would agree with. We need to understand and consider the impact that that has on them and their ability to run their small businesses.</para>
<para>We heard at our small-business event that when costs rise small-business owners are hit twice. Their power bills go up at the office and at home. Their supplies go up in cost, as do their groceries. Their margins shrink as the pressure grows to make ends meet. Interest rates rise and their mortgage repayments climb, as do their business loans. Then they're forced to refinance to bring capital into the business and cover the squeeze on revenue. A Treasury report released last December found that one in five small-business owners had been diagnosed with a mental health condition in recent months. These people and the businesses they run are the lifeblood of our economy. They're vital to the prosperity of our communities and to addressing Australia's productivity slump. Most small-business owners are inherently optimistic, but we know that behind the scenes many are burning themselves out, sometimes wondering why they went into business in the first place and asking themselves if they'd be better off just shutting up shop.</para>
<para>This has to change, and that starts with involving small-business owners in the policy development process, consulting them every step of the way. Instead of making their lives harder, we should be looking for opportunities to support the great work they do. The decisions we make here should remind people who start their own businesses that they are right to be optimistic and that we in this place want them to bet on themselves, to back themselves to start that business, to create new things, to take calculated risks and to play their part in shaping the future of our economy and our country.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:23</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator O'NEILL</name>
    <name.id>140651</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to make a contribution on the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. This bill aligns with the Albanese government's measured and careful improvements to the Australian financial and taxation system to ensure that it works as intended for all Australians. The bill also advances the interests of ordinary Australians and helps ensure that their retirements are secure. Schedule 1 makes a technical alteration to enable ASIC to approve applications to register the same relevant provider when the relevant provider has an existing registration in force. This tidies up the existing legislation that resulted in accidental compliance breaches by financial advisers. It also allows the corporations regulator, ASIC, to use assisted decision-making processes when processing and considering applications for financial advisers to be registered. The use of assisted decision-making processes, including computer automated and computer assisted decision-making, must be carefully monitored. This particular part of the bill will enable ASIC to deliver a high standard of service in an effective and efficient manner.</para>
<para>Schedule 2 creates the building blocks for the implementation of sustainability reporting standards in Australia. This reflects the reality of our changing climate and our altering financial industry towards environmental sustainability governance priorities, looking more broadly than at mere profit to see the impacts of investment on the sustainability of the planet. This movement is already underway. However, there remains an issue in that there is no definition of what sustainable investment looks like, leaving some investors scratching their heads when trying to decide how best to invest their superannuation. The schedule will partially implement the 'Restoring Treasury's capability on climate risk and opportunities—modelling and reporting standards' measures from the October 2022-23 budget. As sustainability reporting in Australia is currently undertaken on a voluntary basis, the proposed sustainability standards would provide general guidance, assisting relevant industries to prepare systems and processes for eventual transitions to mandatory climate-related financial disclosures. The objective of this is to ensure entities provide Australians and investors with greater transparency and accountability in relation to their climate related plans, financial risks and opportunities.</para>
<para>Schedule 3 of this bill, which is of particular importance to me, increases the independence and effectiveness of the Tax Practitioners Board to ensure high standards of ethics and competency in the tax profession and streamline the regulation of tax practitioners. Schedule 3 of the bill amends the Tax Agent Services Act 2008 to increase the independence of the TPB via a special account. This will provide the Tax Practitioners Board with the ability to control its own budget and manage its regulatory functions. It recognises that the TPB has distinct functions and powers, separate from the ATO. It will support tax practitioner and community confidence in the TPB's regulation of the profession. These changes will implement recommendations from the final report of the Tax Practitioners Board review and ensure high standards in the tax profession, enhancing community confidence in the regulation of tax practitioners and the integrity of the system as a whole.</para>
<para>The chamber will be well aware of my ongoing investigation with colleagues in this Senate into the government audit and consulting sector. It was the TPB that finally investigated and took action against Mr Peter-John Collins of PwC Australia and rightfully brought the spotlight to the murky affairs of PwC both in this nation and overseas. While the ATO and the AFP were hamstrung by limited legislation, the TPB actually did the hard yards. I personally, as an Australian, want to thank them for that work. As I speak, the Australian Federal Police are continuing their investigation into PwC and the actions of Mr Peter-John Collins. But it was the Tax Practitioners Board that did the hard work. It is the TPB's insistence and constant pursuit—as evidenced in the recent ATO time line provided in response to my questions on notice—that has led us here today. I welcome the increased financial independence of the TPB from the ATO. A strong and independent TPB is in Australia's national interest.</para>
<para>The amendments seek to address an identified gap in the regulation of tax services. The introduction of the proposed new obligations under the TPB Code of Professional Conduct for tax practitioners would regulate and, importantly, prevent disqualified entities from providing tax agent services, providing a further barrier to those nefarious actors who outwardly attempt to be credible while simultaneously providing dodgy services to clients.</para>
<para>This comes alongside the recent announcement by the Treasurer, Dr Jim Chalmers, to raise the penalty for firms promoting tax exploitation schemes to $780 million. This changes the calculus for those who would engage in disreputable behaviour and tax exploitation schemes: from a slap on the wrist to, suddenly, a business-ending punishment. It's crucial that when government seeks to engage external experts with vast industry knowledge for support in crafting legislation, such individuals will not betray that trust, nor will they use the information against the Commonwealth of the country to which they owe service simply as citizens.</para>
<para>Taxation collection and dispensation is crucial for Australia to pay its bills, to fund hospitals, to fund our schools and to strengthen our military. When actors limit this possibility, national security is at risk. When Peter-John Collins and PwC partners advertised tax exploitation to multinational firms all over the globe, our national security was at risk. Tax and audit are so important to how the Australian financial system operates. Without proper and measured advice on the financial facts of a firm, trust in the system falters, with negative consequences for everyone, especially workers whose future is tied up in superannuation. This stuff—about tax and about these financial matters—actually really matters to Australian people.</para>
<para>We know that the big four companies—PwC, Deloitte, KPMG and EY—audit 96.5 per cent of the top 200 companies in Australia, or 193 out of 200. Their impact is significant. Their reach is large. Hardworking Australians who see parts of their pay cheques going towards their retirement deserve the very best information for operating in the financial market in which their retirement savings are being invested, either directly by them through an SMSF or indirectly through a retail or industry fund.</para>
<para>The market is responding to the challenges that are now a matter of public record with regard to the big four auditing companies. Westpac Group recently announced that it is no longer appointing PwC, a firm who, through its previous iterations and under the banner of PwC, has audited Westpac since 1968. That's an extraordinary period of time for one audit company to be with a particular company of the scale of Westpac. Previous iterations of the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Corporations and Financial Services—on which I serve with Senator Scarr and Senator Barbara Pocock, who are both in the chamber and who know how important the work of those parliamentary committees are—recommended a review of how long these large audit companies should stay as the external auditor for any of the companies that they are engaged with.</para>
<para>PwC and other consulting firms, we've seen, treat the taxpayer funds that they are receiving in great volume with contempt. KPMG, a firm that is at pains now to point out how it's not PwC, has itself been caught directly misleading the Senate. They claimed on notice not to be mapping public servants by their power ratio or how likely they were to select KPMG as a consultant. However, recently an org chart of Transport NSW which categorised senior public officials scoped out by KPMG staff, who described them as 'sponsors' of KPMG work, suddenly appeared in a hearing. 'Sponsors'—that's how KPMG sees some members of the public service and taxpayers' funds, as a bank to be tapped for their personal profit. It's contemptuous and it's just wrong.</para>
<para>Recently I also heard very concerning testimony from Mr Luke Sayers, the well-connected former CEO of PwC. He was the CEO when the Project North America scam and the legal professional privilege cover-up took place. Mr Sayers is certainly well connected. He counts the former Treasurer Josh Frydenberg as a good friend. According to his evidence before us, his new firm, humbly known as Sayers Group, counted the former finance minister Mathias Cormann as an investor. But it has come to the attention of the committee in recent hours that Mr Cormann no longer has shares in Sayers Group, and the documentation to clarify that is available on the F&PA committee website. Apparently, he was potentially going to be a partner, but, since Mr Sayers gave us evidence, the status of Mr Cormann's investment seems to have changed. Sayers—the company and the man—has already amassed millions of dollars in government contracts. Sayers is the same man who Mr Ziggy Switkowski, in his review of PwC, stated had tolerated 'aberrant behaviour' from those who brought in large revenues. Mr Sayers did that in his role as the CEO of PwC Australia over nearly a decade. I'm very concerned—and I put that on the record here in this chamber—that Sayers Group is considered a trusted adviser to government, given Mr Sayers's long association with PwC during the period that is of sufficient concern to warrant an ongoing Australian Federal Police inquiry.</para>
<para>Through my work as the Chair of the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Corporations and Financial Services and as a substitute member of the Senate Finance and Public Administration References Committee, I pursued every lead and scrutinised every aspect of these secretive firms, and I have taken very seriously the evidence provided to me by whistleblowers who have said, in so many of the submissions to me in confidence, that they ended up leaving the audit sector because they had witnessed practices that they simply couldn't live with anymore. 'I had to leave because my conscience wouldn't allow me to continue in this firm,' was one of the most common sentences. What I fear I am finding, with my colleagues, is a system that not only is rife with conflicts of interest but has built its business model on conflicts of interest. Audit and consulting firms infect firms and spread to every vessel. Indeed, just yesterday, concerns that I raised some time ago about information being used with regard to the Honda dealerships were the subject of an article by Jessica Sier in the <inline font-style="italic">AFR</inline>. The conflict-of-interest concern lingers over so many of these entities.</para>
<para>In the language of Mazzucato and Collington, we see these large companies employing a model known as 'land and expand'. What many whistleblowers have reported to me is that these large audit firms will start with their very best staff and soon swap those staff out for inexperienced members, thus undermining the quality of the work that can be done. It's a classic bait-and-switch move. Even worse, in some cases the best absolutely never show up. Instead, the firms choose to churn through an endless supply of graduates who are overworked and underpaid. One only needs to read the ghastly accounts that are embedded in the Broderick report into EY to know the suffering that these companies impose on their staff. There is much, much more to do in this investigation.</para>
<para>This corporatocratic style of government that relies on profiteering firms to do our core functions is coming to an end. I commend the Minister for Finance for her recent announcement that all external consultancies will be removed from core Public Service work, and I look forward to continuing this work with my colleagues in the government.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:39</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SCARR</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>At the outset I'd like to acknowledge the important work that Senator O'Neill has been doing, along with Senator Barbara Pocock, in relation to the matters arising from the terribly disappointing lapses by PwC. I want to pick up, and perhaps emphasise and buttress, one point Senator O'Neill made, and that is with respect to the important role of whistleblowers. I passionately believe that doing our best to empower whistleblowers, both in the public sector and in the private sector—in particular, in relation to matters at a federal level that touch on compliance with federal laws—is of crucial importance. Those whistleblowers who have reached out to Senator O'Neill and to Senator Barbara Pocock are courageous individuals, and there should be somewhere they can go to get support and guidance as to how to navigate the very complicated maze of their duties and obligations as employees, as partners and as professionals and be given the assistance to navigate those important issues and the support needed.</para>
<para>No doubt those whistleblowers who've reached out to Senator Barbara Pocock and to Senator O'Neill were under—and perhaps are still under—immense personal strain, dealing with all the mental pressures associated with arriving at a decision, such that they were left with no option but to reach out to parliamentarians, people outside of the firm, to bring their attentions into the public domain. They have to deal with the issue of whether they're going to continue to have a job. They've got to deal with the issue of whether they'll be able to fine another job after they've potentially been exposed as whistleblowers. It's a very complicated thing.</para>
<para>It is in the best interests of our civic society that support is provided to those people who are considering being whistleblowers and those who become whistleblowers. Not only is it important for the whistleblowers themselves; it is also important that both the public sector and the private sector know that those whistleblowers will have support, will have someone in their corner who can enforce the statutory obligations on their employers not to intimidate or harass them. That is vitally important, because the protections for whistleblowers on the legislative books at the moment are simply paper protections. What hope does an individual whistleblower have in exercising those protections on the face of the statute when they don't have the resources that their employer has and they're trying to deal with all those other pressures?</para>
<para>I know the Joint Standing Committee on Corporations Law and Financial Services—on which I serve and am very happy to serve, under the chairing of Senator O'Neill, and Senator Barbara Pocock is also a member of that committee—has in the past recommended the establishment of a whistleblower protection agency that covers not just the public sector but also the private sector. And the area of domain in relation to the private sector, if it wanted to be limited, could be limited to matters touching upon federal law. That includes the Corporations Act. That includes financial services. That includes aged care. That includes many other areas of law, such as the disability sector, where issues continually arise, and I think that would be a very welcome step forward. So, I just wanted to make those preliminary comments—which went for nearly five minutes; as senators can forgive me, it's a matter I'm extremely passionate about, because I think it would be a wonderful thing if this Senate could progress laws of that nature to set up an agency in that regard.</para>
<para>I want to talk about schedule 5 of the TLAB. It is a schedule that causes me considerable concern as someone who used to be a company secretary and general counsel of an ASX 200 company and who's been involved in my fair share of capital raisings over that time. I think I did about six capital raisings in the middle of the last global financial crisis, in quick order. So I do bring to this discussion some immediate relevant experience.</para>
<para>The first point I want to make is that Senator Walsh, in her contribution, talked about integrity and raised the integrity of the opposition with respect to its contributions in relation to this bill. Whilst I respect Senator Walsh, the integrity we on this side of the chamber are focused on is the integrity of the then opposition leader, now Prime Minister Albanese, in promising in January 2021 not to make any changes to franking credits, when now we have these changes in TLAB schedules 4 and 5. What about the integrity of the Prime Minister saying on ABC Radio on 30 March 2021 that Labor wouldn't have any changes to the franking credit regime? What are schedules 4 and 5 other than changes to the franking credit regime? What about the integrity of the then shadow Treasurer, Jim Chalmers, saying on 17 January 2022, when it came to tax changes:</para>
<quote><para class="block">We won't be doing franking credits … I couldn't be clearer than that.</para></quote>
<para>Well, he couldn't be clearer than that, and it couldn't be more clear that schedules 4 and 5 depart from those commitments of both the Prime Minister and the Treasurer not to interfere with the franking credit regime. What do we have now in this TLAB? Interference with the franking credit regime.</para>
<para>I want to commend my colleague Senator Bragg in relation to the coalition senators' dissenting report, which I found incredibly useful in preparing this speech. I want to quote from the report on some of the organisations, stakeholders, who have registered their deep concern with the amendments that have been proposed in TLAB schedule 5:</para>
<quote><para class="block">The Corporate Tax Association suggested that there would be great uncertainty for companies 'who have no history of payment of dividends, such as where a company is recently listed'.</para></quote>
<para>Shaw and Partners referred to data that had been generated in the United Kingdom following the abolition of a similar system in the UK:</para>
<quote><para class="block">It was called the advance corporate tax. It was abandoned in '99 after 26 years in operation. From the stats that I've read, in 2000, the UK pension funds and insurance companies owned 39 per cent share of total UK stock market. Fast-forward to 2020 and that figure had fallen drastically to just four per cent.</para></quote>
<para>When you fiddle with things such as the franking credit regime, when you interfere with prior practices regarding the raising of capital and the paying of dividends by listed public companies, they will consider whether or not it is worth their while, especially if they have options, to shift somewhere else, like Singapore. I can remember that, during my period as a company secretary, we were repeatedly approached by the Singaporean government to shift our headquarters and listing from Australia to Singapore. That's what's happening. It's a competitive market in terms of capital, and changing policies like this has consequences.</para>
<para>I note in the report's paragraph 1.23 this statement from Wilson Asset Management: 'Large Australian companies with mature franking account balances are put at an advantage over small to medium-sized entities.' This is one of my particular concerns about this legislation. When you look at the relevant section in the bill—207-159, 'Distributions funded by capital raising'—there's a latent bias towards large companies which have a history of paying franked dividends. It is going to be very hard for new companies, small and mid-sized companies, that do not have a long history of paying franked dividends. Why? Because when you read the test it says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">(1) This subsection applies to a distribution (the <inline font-style="italic">relevant distribution</inline>) of a kind made by an entity if all of the following conditions are satisfied:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(a) either:</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(i) the entity has a practice of making distributions of that kind on a regular basis and the relevant distribution is not made in accordance with that practice; or</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">(ii) the entity does not have a practice of making distributions of that kind on a regular basis;</para></quote>
<para>The necessary meaning of those two subsections, when you read them together, is that if you're a company that has, say, just recently been listed and you've been going through a development phase in building a commercial enterprise—it could be an IT company, it could be a mining company, it could be any new venture—you are simply not going to have a practice of making particular types of distributions. And when do you actually achieve this threshold of 'a practice'? Is it after two distributions or three distributions? Do four distributions mean a practice? What happens if, say, it's a mining company and we go through something like the GFC? It makes a half-year distribution and an end-of-year distribution, and then it suspends distributions for two years because the market falls out of the relevant commodities, and then it recommences paying distributions. Is that a practice? I wouldn't have thought so. Compare that with the situation of a large bank which typically makes regular distributions and has done so over a number of years.</para>
<para>So, almost by definition, under this section it is going to be much, much harder for a small or medium-sized company to meet that test than it is for a large company that is in the ASX 50 or ASX 20. We're actually setting up a disincentive. This is a disincentive to a company to list on the ASX. This is a disincentive.</para>
<para>There will be people making a decision about where to list their company—on the NASDAQ, on AIM in London, in Singapore, on the DAX in Germany—and they will be considering their options. They will look at this test when they're doing their due diligence, and it is going to be very hard for any startup or new venture to meet this test—impossible. Therefore, when they make a dividend payment, when they engage in a capital raising in close proximity to the dividend payment, they're going to come under the scrutiny of this section. The smaller and mid-sized companies that have newly listed are the ones who are going to fall within the province of this section—not the big ASX 50 companies who have got a regulatory practice but companies who don't have that history. And they're exactly the sorts of companies we should want to attract to our financial markets. They're exactly the sorts of companies we want to list on the ASX or any other market that is operating in Australia. We want to attract their investment. Yet this is a disincentive—another disincentive. We've seen barrier to investment after barrier to investment erected by this government since its election in 2022. You can add this one to the list.</para>
<para>All the expert stakeholders—the brokers, the Corporate Tax Association, professors, the Tax Institute, the SMSF Association, the lawyers advising big companies—all raise exactly the same point. This is going to be a disincentive to investment, and there will be people making decisions in boardrooms around this country who will look at this piece of legislation, once it's introduced, and say this is just another reason not to invest in Australia or another reason not to list in Australia. You are sending exactly the opposite of the message we should be sending to people.</para>
<para>Too often, senators sitting on the other side of the chamber forget that companies have options. They don't have to do business here. They can invest their capital somewhere else. They can list somewhere else. They have options. Capital has options. It can go across borders. It can find a home somewhere else. It's the employees who don't have options. The employees of those companies don't have those options.</para>
<para>So, essentially, because you're hurting, you're providing a disincentive to companies to set up in Australia and to list in Australia, and eventually you're going to hurt the whole Australian economy. Most of all, you're going to hurt the potential and current employees of those companies—Australian employees of companies that decide it's all too hard to invest in Australia and invest their capital overseas.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>17:53</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator KOVACIC</name>
    <name.id>306168</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I also rise today to speak on the Treasury Laws Amendment (2022-23 Measures No. 1) Bill. Whether it's franking credits or superannuation—or your salary—it appears that the Albanese government is after what little money people currently have left. We heard time and time again before the election from Anthony Albanese, the Prime Minister, that there would be no changes to franking credits and no changes to superannuation under his government. Let me repeat that. We heard time and time again that there would be no changes to franking credits and no changes to superannuation.</para>
<para>Well, then what is this? This is the bill that we're talking about today. I'm sorry to disappoint everybody, but this bill represents sweeping changes to superannuation and franking credits, changes that will impact hardworking ordinary Australians the hardest. The bill is five schedules of changes to super and franking credits in 48 pages. This bill also has a 220-page explanatory memorandum on changes to super and franking credits. This bill is over half a billion dollars in changes to super and franking credits. Let's have a think about that: that is half a billion dollars being taken out of the retirements, the savings and the superannuation accounts of Australians. All this is in the middle of a cost-of-living crisis where Australians don't have very much money left, costs are going up all around them, yet their wages are not going up. And now the government is consciously deciding to make things worse. They are taking a sledgehammer to the savings of Australians. They are taking this money to fund their mismanagement of our economy.</para>
<para>During Senate estimates on Wednesday 8 November, the Minister for Finance, Katy Gallagher, appeared not to realise a change to the franking credit policy was in her budget, denying 10 times that there was a change to franking credits in the budget. The minister later had to correct the record. When asked about the measure in question time on 6 March, the Prime Minister couldn't give a straight answer. The finance minister doesn't know what's in the bill, does the Treasurer know, or are they turning away as they let Stephen Jones pursue his vanity project of raiding the savings of hardworking Australians? Who does know? On 1 January 2021 the <inline font-style="italic">West Australian</inline> reported that our now Prime Minister said, 'We will not be taking any changes to franking credits to the next election.' On 30 March he then said on ABC Radio, 'We won't have any changes to the franking credits regime which is there.' That's exhibit A of the changes that we're not having. On 15 December 2021 our now Prime Minister told Tasmania Talks, 'We've made it clear that, on areas like franking credits and negative gearing, we won't be taking those policies to the next election.' On 4 March 2022 he said in relation to franking credits, 'We are not touching them.' On 17 January 2022 the Treasurer said, 'We won't be doing franking credits, and I couldn't be clearer than that.' And yet here we are.</para>
<para>Labor's broken promise on superannuation taxes just means that, with the soaring cost-of-living pressures, Australians will be worse off. This is not just another broken promise; this undermines our superannuation system. It undermines the confidence in our superannuation system. Superannuation is your money; it is our money; it doesn't belong to any government. It is your money to deliver quality of life in retirement; it is not a piggybank for governments to leverage tax and spend. How many times does this government want to tax this money earnt by ordinary Australians? Despite promising no changes to superannuation before the election, Prime Minister Albanese is proposing to double super taxes on one in 10 Australians by the time they retire; to stop companies from offering franking credits to Australian investors, super funds and charities; and to tax unrealised capital gains in super, meaning Australian retirees will pay tax on money they haven't even made yet. Let's think about that—paying tax on money that you have not even made or earnt. That's extraordinary.</para>
<para>It is obvious that this government was dishonest about changing super and about franking credits, and it's been dishonest about how many Australians will be affected by these changes. Despite the claim that fewer than 80,000 Australians will be affected, independent research has shown that, by retirement age, more than 500,000 Australians will be hit by this tax. Australians are right to be wondering what will be taxed next. How can we trust this government when it says one thing before an election, over and over again, and then does something completely different? The government is unable to explain how these changes will work. They can't explain how many people will be affected. The Prime Minister says it will impact one in 200 people. The Finance Minister says it will impact one in 10 people. If the government can't explain it, how can Australians be expected to understand it?</para>
<para>The two measures which limit the ability for companies to offer franking credits to shareholders are estimated to raise at least $600 million over the next five years. The tax will fall overwhelmingly on older Australians and superannuation funds. The Tax Expenditures and Insights Statement released last week found that the biggest beneficiaries of franking credits are older Australians, Australian companies—who, as outlined very clearly by Senator Scarr, are employers of everyday Australians—Australian super funds and Australian charities. The budget acknowledged that a substantial portion of the revenue from this measure will fall on Australians' superannuation:</para>
<quote><para class="block">New tax policy measures announced since PEFO also increase superannuation fund tax receipts by $1 million in 2022-23 and $467 million over the 4 years to 2025-26. This includes the impact of the <inline font-style="italic">Improving the integrity of off-market share buy-backs</inline> measure, which is not expected to significantly impact tax receipts in 2022-23, but is expected to increase tax receipts by $400 million over the 4 years to 2025-26.</para></quote>
<para>That's from Budget Paper No. 1 for the October 2022 budget, page 159.</para>
<para>Page 49 of the explanatory memorandum for the bill makes it pretty clear: the bill ensures that arrangements can't be put in place to release franking credits. That's what it states:</para>
<quote><para class="block">…the Bill … ensures that arrangements cannot be put in place to release franking credits …</para></quote>
<para>The tax increase is despite the Prime Minister ruling out changes to the franking credit regime before the election, over and over again. The Treasury's own talking points, obtained under FOI, confirm that there were significant concerns raised by the public. Over 2,000 submissions were received during consultation. Treasury also says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Concerns were raised over retrospectivity, policy objective and potential for the legislation as drafted to capture legitimate commercial practices.</para></quote>
<para>Treasury's own document says:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Shareholders … may argue the policy is effectively a tax increase or a winding back of dividend imputation.</para></quote>
<para>Let me repeat that. Treasury's own document states:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Shareholders … may argue the policy is effectively a tax increase or a winding back of dividend imputation.</para></quote>
<para>Schedule 1 amends the Corporations Act to close a loophole in the post-royal-commission requirement for financial advisers to register with ASIC's Financial Advisers Register. The amendments close a loophole to minimise the risk of inadvertent breaches of the law when offence provisions on providing unregistered financial advice commence. The amendments allow ASIC to streamline applications where a provider is authorised by more than one licensee to provide financial advice. Schedule 2 gives the Australian Accounting Standards Board, the Auditing and Assurance Standards Board and the Financial Reporting Council the power to develop climate and sustainability standards. Schedule 3 implements five recommendations from the 2020 Tax Practitioners Board review. This bill also introduces two changes to the franking credits regime that the government estimate will raise more than the half a billion dollars that I outlined earlier. They are contained in schedules 4 and 5 to the bill.</para>
<para>Schedule 4 amends the Income Tax Assessment Act to limit the ability of listed companies to offer franking credits on off-market share buybacks, raising $200 million a year in tax clawbacks. Schedule 5 amends the Income Tax Assessment Act to limit the ability of listed companies to offer franking credits on capital raisings, raising some $50 million over five years. These two measures will limit the ability for companies to offer franking credits to shareholders. The tax will fall overwhelmingly on older Australians and superannuation funds. The tax expenditure and insight statement released by the government in March found the biggest beneficiaries of franking credits are older Australians, Australian companies, Australian super funds and Australian charities, and yet these are the people who are going to be impacted by the changes contained in this bill. Even the October budget acknowledged that a substantial portion of the revenue from this measure will fall on Australians' superannuation. New tax policy measures announced since PEFO also increased super fund tax receipts during that same period. This includes the impact of improving the integrity of the off-market share buyback measure.</para>
<para>Franking credits are granted against company tax already paid by restricting the offering of franking credits. The increase on tax is not from the company issuing the credits but from the individual shareholders who benefit and receive corresponding reductions on their tax. King & Wood Mallesons have described the measures as, 'The federal government is seeking to prevent entities from providing franking credits to shareholders' in what it considers are 'inappropriate circumstances'. The measure reduces the ability for companies to offer franking credits on new capital-raising activities. There is genuine concern that the measure will have unforeseen impacts and wider application than Treasury claims. This tax increase is despite the Prime Minister ruling out changes to the franking credit regime before the election.</para>
<para>As Senator Scarr noted, the coalition senators' dissenting report in relation to this bill is an impressive document, and it is something that should be read and should be considered before any changes are made. One section that I want to read in particular from that report is something that comes from evidence given by Professor Robert Nichol talking about flow-on effects from tax, profitability and shareholder returns as a result of this measure. He states:</para>
<quote><para class="block">If implemented, I expect off-market buy-backs will be discontinued and some companies will choose not to take the on-market option, resulting in some instances of less than optimal capital management, reduced profitability, less tax paid and reduced shareholder returns.</para></quote>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>18:09</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HANSON</name>
    <name.id>BK6</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I'm not sure Labor learned its lesson from the 2019 election. They were so confident of winning under Bill Shorten. Their $11 billion attack on Australia's franking system was one of the issues which cost them that election. They conveniently ignored that it was their own Paul Keating who, in the 1980s, introduced the current system to prevent Australian investors from effectively being taxed twice, the system we have worked with to encourage investments by Australian individuals and investment or superannuation funds in Australian companies. It reduces the cost of capital-raising for Australian companies and stimulates job creation. It encourages Australian companies to fund their operations by using equity instead of debt. It provides incomes that offset the need for more government welfare in the form of pensions, so it needs to be left alone.</para>
<para>Why does Labor hate Australians who work hard and save and invest their money in additional income? Why does Labor hate aspiration and individual enterprise? Why does Labor feel the need to micromanage the way private companies raise capital? Labor insists on imposing increased red tape on the private sector that not only costs and harms our economy but wastes so much more of our own money in profligate, useless spending. Government spending under Labor has risen $188 billion, increasing federal debt and driving inflation and interest rates higher. Our priority should be ensuring accountability for this spending, not double-taxing investors who are supporting Australian jobs.</para>
<para>Labor needs to abandon its obsession with attacking Australian mum-and-dad investors who dare to seek financial independence just because they mostly don't vote Labor. If Labor needs more revenue, it only needs to implement reforms that ensure that foreign owned multinationals operating in Australia pay their fair share of tax. It would raise a lot more money than this latest attack on Australian investors. Labor never puts Australia and Australians first. Labor policies are hurting Australians, not helping them, as evidenced by the 13th straight interest rate rise since the election last year.</para>
<para>One Nation will be supporting amendments regarding schedule 4 and schedule 5 of this legislation. Schedule 4 relates to off-market share buybacks. Labor keeps saying that it's big business which does this, but in reality it's mostly retirees and low-tax investors like charities. The only large investors are super funds, and any benefits they gain go to their members—the same mum-and-dad investors. Labor's change means that companies which may use an off-market share buyback for a restructure or recapitalisation will lose part of their franking account balance or be forced to pay a franking deficit tax. They would permanently lose the amount of franking that would have gone to their shareholders. So I'm going to support the proposed amendment to schedule 4.</para>
<para>Schedule 5 relates to franked distributions funded by capital-raising. There is substantial concern that this change will have a major impact on Australian jobs and Australian investors and will encourage big companies to increase tax avoidance, deferment or minimisation. There is also concern that it will impact the sustainability of smaller Australian companies. The change is likely to discourage the reinvestment of company profits at a time when it is very much needed to arrest the rapid decline of Australian productivity. National productivity has already fallen by more than six per cent since the election of the Albanese government. The last thing we should be doing is making it worse. The committee inquiry into this bill, chaired by a Labor senator, acknowledged that schedule 5 needed clarification in response to almost universal feedback. This part of the bill was flawed—another one of the government's bills that's flawed! You have to wonder, then, whether the government has properly modelled the impact of increased company debt and higher costs of capital-raising.</para>
<para>Schedule 2 of the bill is yet another example of Labor's obsession with international climate change ideology and how this cult has infiltrated the highest levels of unaccountable international bodies seeking to dictate law in Australia. I refer to the so-called International Sustainability Standards Board, or the ISSB, created at the COP26 meeting in Glasgow in 2021. The following year, the ISSB developed standards for companies to disclose sustainability related financial information and climate related disclosures. While most large Australian businesses already do this sort of useless reporting on a voluntary basis, Treasurer Jim Chalmers last year signalled Labor's intention to make it mandatory. He said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Our initial view is that mandatory reporting requirements should be phased in over time—both in terms of entities covered and the reporting that is required.</para></quote>
<para>He said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… we think the standards should be mandatory for large firms … they should be aligned as far as possible with global standards.</para></quote>
<para>Labor puts the wishes of unaccountable international bodies before the interests of the Australian people and the Australian economy.</para>
<para>Schedule 2 of the bill inserts a new definition of 'international sustainability standards' into the Australian Securities and Investments Commission Act 2001. These are the ISSB standards. One Nation does not consider that our independent, sovereign country is answerable to these unaccountable international organisations. My colleague Senator Roberts will be moving an amendment to get rid of this change, and I urge the Senate to support it. Indeed, we won't be supporting this legislation unless all the amendments I've mentioned are approved. Government must get out of the way of Australian investors and the companies they support and let them do what they do best: create jobs and prosperity for our nation.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>18:15</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HUGHES</name>
    <name.id>273828</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Whether it's franking credits or superannuation, you just can't trust Labor on tax. Before the election, the current Prime Minister and the current Treasurer both ruled out changes to franking credits. Before the election, the current Prime Minister and the current Treasurer ruled out changes to super. I note that in Senator Hanson's contribution she asked whether the Labor Party had learnt their lesson from the 2019 election. I think that maybe they did learn a lesson. In 2019 they were upfront and said, 'We're going to change franking credits.' The lesson they learnt was: 'Let's not tell them this time. We won't tell them. We'll promise not to change them, we'll wait until they elect us, and then we'll change them.' It is like a flashback to—oh, God! I've got a blank on his name. He sang for Midnight Oil and was a member of the other place. He was caught on camera saying, 'Don't worry; we'll change it all after we get in.' This is exactly what we're seeing yet again. Peter Garrett—there we go. Here we are. They just can't help themselves. It's completely in their DNA to simply tax you more. They can't have their higher-spending agendas without increasing the taxes.</para>
<para>Labor constantly talk to us about the top end of town, but I say to them: look around you. Wake up to yourselves. Your policies to date have only hurt small-business owners and battlers. You've eroded middle Australia. In fact, it's almost worse than that. You have created a class of working poor, and that class of working poor is consistently growing under this government's inability to rein in inflation and cost-of-living pressures. Families who have two working parents on average incomes are being put in a position where they can't afford to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table. Now we know they're going to be hit again with increased taxes. Labor talk to us about the big end of town. We heard Senator Wong or Senator Farrell the other day listing the names of big companies they were trying to support, and we heard during the referendum campaign about all the big companies coming out to support them. We know who is cosying up to the big end of town. This is all happening at a time when the banks are recording record profits—more than $7 billion each for CBA, ANZ and Westpac. The Australian dream of having your own patch to call home has pretty much gone up in smoke. According to the ANZ today, only the wealthy can now afford a mortgage. Talk about the top end of town. This government has done wonders for those people. You can't trust Labor to keep promises and you can't trust Labor to run the economy.</para>
<para>The coalition will move amendments to strike out from the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023 the measures that would break these promises. But, if the government doesn't accept these amendments, we will not be supporting this bill, because it is just another broken promise from the Albanese government. I say to the government: you can keep the promise of a referendum, wasting $450 million of taxpayers' money on something that was clearly going to fail, but you can't keep the promises of lower power prices and easing cost-of-living pressures. So enough is enough.</para>
<para>It's a cost-of-living crisis, but Labor's priority seems to be only coming after your money. The Prime Minister and the Treasurer went to the election promising Australians that they wouldn't touch franking credits, and yet in six months they've added two tax grabs on Australian shareholders. This is just another tax on super, another tax on retirement savings and another broken promise on tax. Whether it's franking credits or superannuation, Labor can't control its spending, so it's going to go after the hard-earned dollars of Australians to pay for its pet projects, spending taxpayer money at odds ideologically with two-thirds of the country and only to virtue-signal to its inner city elites, while real Indigenous Australians who need help continue to be ignored. Then, to add insult to injury, you vote down two inquiries—into land councils and into sexual abuse. Then you have the audacity to stand here and act like you care about the plight of innocents in the Middle East. You can't even muster enough energy to care about your own people who you have a duty to serve.</para>
<para>Labor promised retirees and shareholders that, after the 2019 election, franking credit changes were off the table—false promises again. Currently companies that undertake off-market share buybacks and capital-raisings can offer franking credits to investors. But, under Labor's laws, they won't be able to do so. Labor's budget is clear that this is a tax that will raise half a billion dollars. And we know, from Treasury's tax expenditure and income statement, that this disproportionately hits Australians over 75, not-for-profits and Australian super funds, who will no longer be able to access these credits. So work hard all your life, contributing to this country, only to get shafted by this government for all your efforts.</para>
<para>On 1 January 2021 the <inline font-style="italic">West Australian </inline>reported that the Prime Minister said, 'We will not be taking any changes to franking credits to the next election.' On 30 March 2021 the Prime Minister, on ABC radio, said, 'We won't have any changes to the franking credits regime which is there.' On 15 December 2021 the Prime Minister told <inline font-style="italic">Tasmania Talks</inline>, 'We've made it clear that, on areas like franking credits and negative gearing, we won't be taking those policies to the next election.' On 4 March 2022 the Prime Minister said, in relation to franking credits, 'We're not touching them.' And on 17 January 2022 the Treasurer said, 'We won't be doing franking credits,' and 'I couldn't be clearer than that.' These were clearly not slips of the tongue from the PM and the Treasurer. It was an agenda of deceit: say what you have to say to disarm the public and then keep on doing what it is that you want to do. Well, I think it's becoming pretty clear that Australians are very much starting to see through it.</para>
<para>Labor's broken promises on superannuation taxes just mean that, on top of soaring cost-of-living pressures, Australians are going to be even worse off than they already are. This government continues to exacerbate cost-of-living pressures and then slugs you again on top of it. Don't worry, because, during their press conferences, they can contort their faces and tell you how much they feel and understand the hurt that Australians are experiencing. Superannuation is your money, not the government's. It's your money to deliver quality of life in retirement, not a piggy bank for government to tax and spend. This government is proposing to double super taxes on one in 10 Australians by the time they retire, stopping companies from offering franking credits to Australian investors, super funds and charities, taxing unrealised capital gains in super, meaning Australian retirees will pay tax on money they haven't even made yet.</para>
<para>Labor were dishonest about changing super, and they've been dishonest about how many Australians will be affected. Despite Labor claiming that fewer than 80,000 Australians will be affected, independent research has shown that, by retirement age, more than 500,000 Australians will be hit by this tax. So Australians are right to be wondering just what this Labor government will tax next. It is just more broken promises. Remember the promise to cut electricity bills by $275? Broken. Remember the promise of cheaper mortgages? Broken. Remember the promise of lower inflation? Broken. And now the promise of no changes to super: broken. What more evidence do we need to know whatever it is this government is doing isn't working? You are flying pilotless, and we need an emergency landing before it all comes crashing down.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>18:25</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKIM</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>There are two components of the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023 I want to address. The first is schedule 2, which will give the Australian Accounting Standards Board power to create sustainability standards, and the second is schedule 3, which will implement selected recommendations from the government's review into the Tax Practitioners Board.</para>
<para>Schedule 2, which is effectively the introduction of climate risk reporting, has the capacity to represent a significant step towards driving a change in corporate culture in Australia. Directors and executives of companies will have to turn their minds to how their businesses are changing to respond to a carbon constrained economy. This is about the old business management saying 'if you are not measuring it, you can't improve it'. These changes will start to quantify a company's exposure and therefore, in the case of publicly listed companies, investors' exposure to both climate transition risks, such as being stuck with stranded assets like coal or oil or gas, and physical assets, which are caused, for example, from turbocharged disasters like floods and fires on company assets and things like skyrocketing insurance premiums on company cash flows.</para>
<para>A climate risk framework will focus the minds of companies who are trying to reduce their exposure to coal, oil and gas, and, likewise, it will focus the attention of investors, particularly big investors like super funds, to ensure that they know what they are buying into. And that is critical for them, because a well-informed decision, a decision based on a broader suite of information, is more likely to be a good decision. But, critically, a climate based financial framework will expose companies like Woodside, Santos and Whitehaven for the fact that they actually have no plans to diversify out of coal and gas. Make no mistake: companies like Woodside, Santos and Whitehaven are pure planet cookers. They will be forced to abandon their current market deception that they are on their way to net zero. Let's be really clear about this: if you are a coal or a gas company, you cannot actually be on your way to net zero. That is a nonsensical proposition, and investors and everyone else in this country have a right to have that deception exposed and have a right to understand the truth of the situation, which is that fossil fuel companies like Woodside, like Santos, like Whitehaven are deceiving the market at the moment by claiming they're on their way to net zero. A robust climate risk reporting framework will expose that deception.</para>
<para>The people that are running these companies are driven by greed and the profit motive, driven to engage in activities that they know are massively contributing to global heating, that they know are going to massively contribute to the collapse of the ecological systems that ultimately underpin life on this planet, that they know will result in the likely displacement of billions of people from their homes this century and that they know will massively compromise the opportunities of our children, our grandchildren, their children, their grandchildren to live a good and dignified life. That's what those companies are doing, and at the same time that they're doing that they are deceiving the market and pretending they're on their way to net zero. They are not on their way to net zero, and a properly constructed climate risk reporting framework will expose that deception.</para>
<para>Without a standard definition of 'climate disclosures' being in place so that investors and activists can hold companies to account, corporate disclosure will remain too generalised, too ad hoc, too removed from financial performance indicators and too prone to greenwashing. That is what we are seeing from a range of big companies at the moment: a concerted effort to greenwash, a concerted effort to deceive the market, a concerted effort to deceive investors and a concerted effort to deceive government, through their greenwashing spin. And it needs to end. So we welcome what we believe is a first step on the way to a genuine climate risk disclosure framework in this country.</para>
<para>On schedule 3, earlier this year the Australian people found out that PricewaterhouseCoopers partner Peter Collins shared secret government information with PricewaterhouseCoopers partners to advise PricewaterhouseCoopers clients on how to structure to get around upcoming laws designed to crack down on tax avoidance. PwC made millions of dollars from this. The companies that restructured could have cost the public purse in Australia up to $180 million in forgone tax revenue each year. I well remember when this scandal broke and how horrified many people in this building and, critically, many people out in the community were. The ins and outs of how big consulting works in this country had never—or very rarely—been the subject of discussions in pubs, at barbecues or over the back fence, but suddenly millions of people in Australia were talking about it.</para>
<para>And I well remember asking questions in Senate estimates of departments like the home affairs department. When I asked the then secretary of the department, Mr Pezzullo, what action his department had taken to tighten its frameworks around the risk that not just PwC but other big-four consulting companies—Deloitte, KPMG, EY—were actually monetising confidential information in the way that Mr Collins did for PricewaterhouseCoopers, his answer was: 'Well, I've rung up the CEO of PricewaterhouseCoopers and I've been assured that it's all fine.' I couldn't believe it. Well, of course PricewaterhouseCoopers are telling him it's all fine! What else would they say?</para>
<para>I want to thank and congratulate my friend and colleague Senator Barbara Pocock for the role she has played, for her dogged pursuit of this issue, of Mr Collins and of a range of other issues that have been exposed. And I thank Senator Scarr for the support he's just indicated for that statement. Senator Pocock has been relentless in her pursuit of this and I believe has done the hard yards with the utmost integrity in exposing this and done a massive solid not just for the Australian taxpayers but for all Australians who want to have confidence that government processes are respected and that big corporations are not getting away with metaphorical murder. So I want to place on the record the magnificent job Senator Barbara Pocock has done over many months to chase this matter down and get us here today, through her negotiations with Minister Jones, to a situation where Greens amendments will be accepted and will pass through this place—that we'll actually start to chase the fox out of the henhouse and ensure that the Tax Practitioners Board remains free of the worst kind of influence and the worst kind of effect that big-four consulting firms had on it.</para>
<para>While I have the opportunity, I also want to make a few observations about the business model of big consulting firms. Make no mistake, the business model of big consulting is based on things like conflicts of interest. We've all heard it time after time from the big four consulting firms that they have in place these internal firewalls which mean the work they're doing for the government over here is separated completely from the advice they're providing to clients over there. Don't believe a word of it, because these supposed firewalls are absolutely porous. They are like the old foamies we used to ride in the six-inch-high waves on Blackmans Bay beach when I was growing up. You kept them in the water for an hour and they'd be totally waterlogged and they'd sink underneath you. These firewalls are absolutely porous. The big four consulting firms have made massive bank over the decades by taking confidential information provided to them by government, monetising it and passing it on to their clients.</para>
<para>The issue with PricewaterhouseCoopers is they got busted. They got caught. There's a reason why you've heard nothing out of the other three of the big consulting firms—Deloitte, KPMG and EY—over the last six to nine months. They have been in the middle of the biggest bush they could find, rigid with the most minor tremors of fear, hoping that nobody actually remembers that they exist. They know that's part of the business model of big consulting, and they didn't want to be dragged through the mud like PricewaterhouseCoopers was dragged. This is the sharp end of neoliberalism. The public sector has been hollowed out to the extent that it can't actually provide advice that governments need, and the only way they can get that advice, particularly on complex issues, is by going to the consultancy firms. Senator Scarr's going to come in and defend big consulting. This will be good!</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>287062</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>Senator Scarr on a point of order?</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator Scarr</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>I don't believe it's the 'sharp end' of neoliberalism. I believe it's a distortion of neoliberalism.</para>
</interjection>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>287062</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>That's not a point of order, but you may wish to reflect on that part in your debate, Senator McKim.</para>
</interjection>
<continue>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKIM</name>
    <name.id>JKM</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>As I was saying, the public sector has been hollowed out by big consulting firms. They hire the brightest and the best, and, in many cases, they make them offers that simply are too good to refuse. They hollow out the public service to such a degree that the only place that the public service can go to get the advice it needs to provide to the government is to the big consulting firms that are actually responsible for hollowing out the public sector in the first place.</para>
<para>The other point I want to make about the business model of big consulting is that it's not just based on conflict of interest; it is actually based on monetising confidential information. That is one of the ways that big consulting has been so massively successful over the years. A year or so ago, I read <inline font-style="italic">When McKinsey Comes to Town</inline>. I recommend that book to Senator Scarr, who I know likes a good book because he's often waving them around in this place. That is a credit to him. I admire a reader. I do refer <inline font-style="italic">When McKinsey Comes to Town</inline> to you, Senator Scarr. I can assure you some of the revelations in that particular tome about the unethical behaviour of McKinsey will curl your toenails, and I have no doubt that behaviour is reflected across a number of big consulting firms.</para>
<para>The government has made it very clear that it condemns the actions of PwC, and so it should. At the time the scandal broke, 43 per cent of Tax Practitioner Board members were former partners of the big four consulting firms, including two ex-PwC partners who were receiving ongoing financial payments from PwC at the time. That is the fox in the henhouse, colleagues. The Greens amendment—that will pass with government support today or tomorrow—kicks the foxes out of the henhouse. It fixes the loophole that effectively allowed big consultants to regulate themselves. Never again, thanks to Senator Pocock and the Australian Greens, will we have members of the Tax Practitioner Board financially tied to those same large tax agents that they are regulating. This is the first regulatory step to respond to the PwC scandal. I sincerely hope it won't be the last.</para>
</continue>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>18:40</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ROBERTS</name>
    <name.id>266524</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>As a servant to the people of Queensland and Australia, I speak on the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. One Nation supports an efficient, honest and fair tax system. An important aspect of a fair system to is to make sure tax is not double-charged. That's what franking credits do. They make sure a tax is not double-charged. They ensure that Australians don't pay income tax on the parts of dividends on which the government has already collected company tax. That's fair. There's no reason to allow the government to double-dip on Australian profits and then again on Australians' income.</para>
<para>In the 2019 election campaign, Labor proposed changes to the franking credits system. Australia completely rejected those thought bubbles. Labor learnt from that lesson and for the 2022 election, promised there would be no changes made to franked dividends if Australia voted them into government. Yet, now that Labor is in government, schedules 4 and 5 make a number of wholesale changes to how the dividend, share buyback, and franking system currently works. It is a broken promise, yet another to add to Labor's list of broken promises. Just like when they promised to reduce your power bills by $275, Labor's promise that they wouldn't touch franking credits was a lie. As always, the government claims that these are simply modest changes. They're anything but modest, with large implications for companies and for capital markets. The government hasn't been able to articulate the need for these changes, nor quantify how big an impact they will have. They're doing it, and they don't even know what will happen. We cannot legislate on a hope, a vibe or a wish that it will be okay. While that is, according to some in government, Prime Minister Albanese's modus operandi, it's not a responsible way to steer a $1.7 trillion economy. It's highly irresponsible. One Nation will be opposing these changes in schedules 4 and 5 and cannot pass the bill if they remain part of this package.</para>
<para>Schedule 2 lays the groundwork for standards that align money to climate goals. This would presumably be to create alignment with the greatest scam in finance: ESG standards—environment, social and governance. The powers that be call them 'sustainability standards', yet there's nothing sustainable about them. In fact, UN sustainability policies survive only as parasites on subsidies from the real economy—subsidies: that makes them unsustainable. So-called sustainability standards talk about protecting the financial system from risks. Yet they cannot quantify what those risks are. The idea that the government or, worse, a single bureaucratic department can ever predict and quantify risk to the financial system is sheer lunacy. A brief analysis of history shows that. Did the government and regulatory agencies see the risk of the dot com bubble coming in the 2000s? No. They had no idea. Did the American regulators see the risk of subprime mortgages leading to the global financial crisis? No. They arguably participated in and make it far worse. Did any regulator around the world predict the risk of almost every government in the world going certifiably insane in response to COVID, a bad flu? No, they did not. Over the last three years, the Reserve Bank created $500 billion in electronic journal entries, money concocted out of thin air. Did any regulator predict the risks that would lead to the skyrocketing inflation that we're still trying to get under control? No, they did not. Actually, some did, and we were ridiculed by the experts.</para>
<para>The point here is very simple. The government and the regulators cannot quantify the risk of financial system shock. History shows governments are hilariously bad at it. They certainly won't be able to do it for supposed climate risks that are nothing more than fabrications concocted from inherent, natural, cyclical variation. By the way, everything in nature—everything in existence—varies, yet understanding of variation is not taught in schools and rarely taught properly, if at all, at university. That's why Green, Labor, Teal and, sadly, some Liberal-National members and senators spout nonsense in this parliament and in public, concocting and spreading imaginary fears of climate apocalypse, when reality shows simply inherent, natural, cyclical variation.</para>
<para>They cannot even come up with the only sound and essential basis for policy—that is, they've never quantified the specific effect of carbon dioxide from human activity. That means they have no basis for climate and energy policy, no specific quantified goals for climate and energy policy and no means of measuring progress towards those goals. We're flying blind. Australia is flying blind. Energy costs and climate policies are out of control and needlessly imposing huge costs on families, small businesses, our country and our nation's future. Anyway, the only thing we can do to protect against systemic risks is to make sure that financial intermediaries are well capitalised and diversified to survive any risk that comes to fruition. Doing anything else encourages a lack of diversification and actually increases risk.</para>
<para>I don't believe in this climate apocalypse nonsense, this climate fraud, yet even for those who do fall for this illusion there's no serious risk to anything. Let's look at the supposed science around climate risk. When I ask the government why we need to cut human production of carbon dioxide, they point me to the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, the UN IPCC. They're a dodgy bunch—proven over 40-plus years—yet I don't think anyone in here has actually read the IPCC reports they claim as proof the climate is going to collapse. If you go to the IPCC's assessment report 6, you'll see chapter 12 is the summary of Working Group I, who looked at the actual science around natural disasters. Table 12.12 summarises all of the available evidence on the frequency of extreme weather events. Let me read out the types of natural disasters where even the United Nations has said there has been no detectable increase in the number of natural disasters. I repeat that: no detectable increase in frost, river flood, rain measured in terms of mean precipitation or heavy precipitation, landslide, drought, fire weather, wind speed, windstorm, tropical cyclone, dust storm, heavy snowfall, hail, relative sea level, coastal flood, marine heatwave—and on and on. Although I do not put any trust in the United Nations, government claims it does, and the United Nations says there has been no increase in severe weather events in those categories—none.</para>
<para>Even better, table 12.12 in the IPCC's AR6 says the United Nations doesn't expect to see any detectable increase in those categories in the next 80 years under its worst-case scenario. There's no risk to the financial system from climate change because there's no need to cut human production of carbon dioxide—end of story.</para>
<para>As an aside, I ask: on what basis does Minister Watt get his frequent fanciful, scary claims of increasing extreme weather events? Wild imagination, Senator Watt? From where do the Greens get their dishonest claims? From where does Senator Pocock get his pseudoscience to support his Kermit green fantasy policies? Is it the family money of Simon Holmes a Court, who now relies on the millions of green subsidy dollars that support otherwise unsustainable and failing wind and solar net zero projects—parasitic subsidies from energy users and taxpayers who pay through needlessly higher prices.</para>
<para>Recently in this chamber I heard Senator David Pocock cite scientists who said they have fears for the climate. Significantly, he did not provide any science to back it up, apparently because he seems to just swallow their words because they claim to be scientists. That's what's happened repeatedly in this chamber. People don't produce the science; they say what scientists conclude and don't analyse it. Those scientists are on major grants to push the climate fraud. Real scientists don't peddle unsubstantiated fears. Scientists present science, presenting the empirical scientific data as evidence within logical scientific points, proving cause and effect. Never has anyone done that. Senator David Pocock never presents any such science nor references the specific pages providing such logical scientific points—never. Extreme weather has always been with us. It remains with us and will always be with us. It's natural and often cyclical.</para>
<para>So what's the real reason for implementing so-called sustainability standards and ESG? The Assistant Treasurer, Stephen Jones, said it in his second reading speech to this bill: the purpose is to 'align capital flows towards climate and sustainability goals'. I'll say it again: the purpose is to 'align capital flows towards climate and sustainability goals'—political goals, not scientific. Those are the goals of predatory globalist billionaires and the rent seekers who are flogging wind, solar and battery products, billionaires peddling parasitic mis-investments in solar, wind and batteries and transferring wealth from families, small businesses and employers to billionaires, often overseas.</para>
<para>Despite claims that these solar and wind products are the cheapest, the free market has utterly failed to adopt them, because they simply cannot survive in the wild on their own, without subsidies. In other speeches in recent weeks, I've documented the huge number of failures in wind and solar projects overseas and here in Australia. They're falling over like flies. Billionaires behind the climate push are panicking now that their parasitic investments won't get the return they need. The teals' sugar daddy, Simon Holmes a Court; Andrew 'Twiggy' Forrest; Johnny-come-lately to climate fearmongering Mike Cannon-Brookes; and old stagers Alex Turnbull and Ross Garnaut—having failed with climate scams in the free market, these climate doomsayers now need the government to direct money their way through implementation of 'climate standards'—they're going to standardise the climate!—to, as the Assistant Treasurer said, 'align capital flows'. This is more of the crony capitalism that has ruined Australia. If it weren't so serious, it would be laughable. This is why I've circulated an amendment to strike out schedule 2 of the bill. There's no reason to even start down this path of folly and pretend that, hidden away in the cupboard somewhere, the government have a crystal ball they can use to predict the future. If they do, they clearly haven't used it before.</para>
<para>A final concern I'll raise is with schedule 1, part 2, of the bill. This gives ASIC the power to use 'assisted decision-making' processes. That's their label. This amendment is incredibly broad and vague, and we can assume this will involve some level of automation and, eventually, the implementation of AI, artificial intelligence. It's incredibly concerning that the explanatory memorandum includes, at 1.24: 'ASIC may change a decision made by an assisted decision-making process if it is satisfied the decision is wrong.' Can you believe it? This very heavily implies that a human will not be involved in the decision-making process. An assisted decision-making process should only be in place to assist a human in making a decision. There should not be a robot using artificial intelligence to make the decision itself. The fact that Labor would introduce this blank cheque to the new robot overlords in the wake of a royal commission they called into robodebt is a stunning revelation. If the robots get it wrong, there's no clear avenue of appeal for a person who is subject to the wrong decision. They'll simply have to rely on ASIC deciding to look at it on their own motion and finding out it's wrong. Good luck with that. This change is too broad, and One Nation is raising its concerns now so that these issues can be monitored in future.</para>
<para>To summarise, the government would be better off going back to the drawing board on this con hiding behind the label 'Treasury laws'.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>18:53</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator RENNICK</name>
    <name.id>283596</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to speak on the Treasury Laws Amendment (2023 Measures No. 1) Bill 2023. I'll first focus on schedule 2 and the sustainability standards. Having spent many hours preparing financial statements, I know the last thing we need to be worried about is trying to measure impacts and sustainability and all those fluffy things that are very hard to actually quantify. As an accountant, I know financial reports should be just that: they should be about the finances of a company rather than having a lot of words. If you read a set of financial reports today, it's more like reading<inline font-style="italic"> War and Peace</inline>, and there is next to no information on the actual internal workings of the company. By that, I mean there's not enough management accounting information in there. I would vote against all of this bill just on the basis of schedule 2.</para>
<para>I will call out the hypocrisy of Labor. I've said this a few times now, but we have 40 different models to calculate net zero, and the CSIRO is not prepared to acknowledge the risks and benefits of the model that we use versus the other 39 models out there and whether or not there's any regulatory arbitrage between countries on that. For example, they don't include phytoplankton. Just last week, we spent the entire week talking about legislation that's going to look at putting carbon dioxide in the bottom of the ocean whilst we completely ignore phytoplankton in our ocean, which absorbs 70 per cent of CO2. But, despite the fact that the bureaucrats don't want to be held to account on the way they measure carbon dioxide, you're talking about bringing in legislation that seeks to hold the private sector to account on their sustainability practices and how they're going to deal with climate change, measure CO2 emissions et cetera. It's a bit rich for the government to be asking the private sector to measure all of their impacts on the environment whilst at the same time not being held to account on how they calculate net zero.</para>
<para>I'll move to the other sections of the bill. Personally, if it wasn't a broken promise, I'd actually probably support schedule 4, but it is a broken promise. The Labor Party said that they weren't going to touch franking, and they are now touching franking. The reason I would actually support schedule 4 is that, for big Australian companies who have large foreign ownership holdings, those franked dividends aren't distributed when they pay dividends offshore. So the franking credits accumulate in the franking accounts, and every five or six years or every decade BHP will do a share buyback or a capital raising and effectively redistribute or stream those dividends out to domestic shareholders.</para>
<para>The problem I have with that is that franking in itself is nothing but one great big paper shuffle. There have been reports over the years—I followed this closely throughout my finance career—that the real net company tax rate is, depending on what you read, somewhere between 13 and 17 per cent. We're seeing over time that the superannuation funds get bigger and have a much larger shareholding of our ASX 200 blue-chip companies. That means that when they pay out dividends to super funds the franking credits then get refunded. So, overall, companies are paying less and less tax, and we're also seeing that with charities and everything like that.</para>
<para>But, in the means of collecting and distributing the dividends, a company will pay its tax in May one year. There's an enormous amount of paperwork in calculating that tax, doing the accounting on all the franking credits and maintaining those franking credit accounts. Then, about eight months later, when the individuals go and lodge their tax returns, they get the money refunded to them. Let's take halfway between 13 and 17 per cent. Let's say it's 15 per cent. That means that half the company tax that gets collected in Australia—I haven't looked at it in a while, but I think it's pushing close to $100 billion, so half of that would be $50 billion—gets refunded or recycled back out. So, if you really wanted to reform the tax system—and I'll qualify all of this by saying that, whatever you do with the tax system, you've always got to cut income tax first and make sure that the rate of income tax for the average wage is always lower than the company tax rate—you should get rid of franking credits altogether and just have a lower, flatter company tax rate.</para>
<para>The reason for that is that we cannot compete with offshore capital. We currently have an onshore tax rate of 30c in the dollar, but, generally speaking, our offshore tax rates with most of our major trading partners, depending on the tax treaty, are between zero and 15c in the dollar. That creates what they call a 'taxation arbitrage', where the rate of tax on onshore profits is 30c in the dollar and the rate of tax on offshore profits is between zero and 15c in the dollar. That encourages companies to shift their profits offshore, and we saw that just recently. I think the tax office has cracked down on this, but for a long time, for most of this century, the three major iron ore companies had marketing hubs for their iron ore in Singapore. As far as I'm aware, Singapore has never produced one tonne of iron ore, yet somehow these people were the experts in selling it on to China. That was nothing but a tax scheme to shift profits offshore to Singapore. It's that profit shifting that we need to stop, and the only way we can do that is, ideally, by lifting the rate of withholding tax.</para>
<para>I noticed earlier today that Senator Walsh was talking about streaming. Let me tell you, there is no greater streaming in this country when it comes to taxation than the streaming of profits offshore for a much lower rate of tax than what a good patriotic company who wants to keep their profits onshore has to pay here. We need to deal with this taxation arbitrage because it is killing the ability of companies who have their domestic equity here in Australia—and that's mainly small business—to compete with offshore businesses. We have to look at fixing that.</para>
<para>I want to give you a couple of examples of how the system's being rorted. I have here a copy of Google's accounts for 2020. Their overall income for the year ending—and you've got to pay for this, by the way; this isn't public. You can get it, but you've got to pay about 50 or 60 bucks for a set of these accounts. In 2019 Google had $1.2 billion in revenue, and they ended up making a paltry $133 million, so their operating margin was about 10 per cent. In other words, for them the cost of doing business here was about 90c in the dollar. I find it very hard to believe that Google would be incurring 90c in every dollar they earn here. What they do is basically boost or increase their above-the-line profits offshore—interest, royalties and rent—because they know that, if it's paid offshore to the US, they don't have to pay 30c in the dollar, because the withholding tax rates for most items in the US are somewhere between zero and 10c.</para>
<para>I've got another one here, from my favourite company, Pfizer! Their 2022 total revenue was almost $1.4 billion, yet they only made $90 million profit that year, so their operating margin was only seven per cent. If you compare that to their worldwide set of accounts, they made $100 billion in revenue and had an operating profit before tax of 34c in the dollar. You have to ask yourself why Pfizer had an operating profit or an operating ratio of 34 per cent on their worldwide income, but here in Australia their operating profit was only seven per cent.</para>
<para>The reason for that is that they shifted their profits or their above-the-line profits—interest, royalties and rent—offshore. Ironically enough, they were shifted offshore to Ireland. If you look at their related-party balances for the year end with Ireland—and that's the trick; you've always got to look at the related-party transactions because what often happens is that they'll shift those profits offshore to a subsidiary, or it might be to a holding. If we look at the related-party transactions for Pfizer, for Pfizer Service Company Ireland it was $1.1 billion. My father-in-law caught COVID, and they gave him a dose of that molnupiravir, and on the box it was $1,000. Pfizer want you to believe that it cost $930 of the $1,000 sale to make that tablet and that they only made a tiny seven per cent profit, or $70 profit, on that $1,000 tablet. I don't think so. That is profit shifting 101. I've already written to the Treasurer about this and I'm looking forward to getting a reply, because that is a breakdown in our transfer pricing.</para>
<para>Those of you who follow tax will know that a few years ago Chevron got busted. It's always very hard to prove transfer pricing, but Chevron got busted because they had intercompany loans charging the Australian business nine per cent interest when the interest rates were two or three per cent. The only reason they got caught was that there was an email from one of their staff talking about a scheme to avoid paying tax by bumping up the interest paid here in Australia and shifting it offshore. They got caught under part IVA of the Income Tax Act.</para>
<para>All of this stuff is very traceable. When you do your tax return, those of you who have a rental property will do a rental property schedule. If you have a capital gain, you'll do a capital gains schedule. If you have transactions with offshore businesses, you have to do what's known as an international dealing schedule. All of that is recorded by the tax office, and they are quite capable of tracing this information. You'll see here on page 3 of the international related party dealing section A it actually asked these questions: did you have any related party dealings involving royalties or licensees? Did you have any related party dealings involving rent or leasing? Did you have any service arrangements with international related parties? You all remember the name of that Irish company, Pfizer Service Company. The reason they like to go through Ireland is that Ireland has a company tax rate of 12½ per cent. Of course, the EU isn't too happy with that either. I think Apple was forced to pay $20 billion or something. What happens because they've got such a low company tax rate is that all the companies set up their head offices in low-taxing jurisdictions. That's one of the reasons I'm adamantly against giving income tax rates back to the states. If that happened, I assure you that head offices would all come back to Canberra and the ACT would charge a very low company tax rate. We do not want a system here in Australia like they've got in the States whereby a lot of company head offices are set up in Delaware. I've offered my services to whoever wants to take me because of my experience in tax and about how to reform the tax system.</para>
<para>We're going to talk about streaming, and I just want to talk about a couple of other sections of the Income Tax Assessment Act that I'd love the Labor Party to look at. Those sections of the tax act are sections 59, 15 and 50 that basically say that land councils don't have to pay tax on royalties and native title payments made to them. Section 50.50 of the 1997 Income Tax Assessment Act says universities don't have to pay income tax on the fees that they collect. It's one thing maybe in terms of Australian students because they shouldn't have to collect fees. But, when it comes to international students, they should be taxed on the profits they make from international students. Then there's subdivision 855, the non-real-asset test. Basically, if you're a foreigner and own less than 10 per cent of the shares in a company, you don't have to pay any capital gains tax. The ATO did a ruling a couple of years ago where they have applied that also to water rights. The name of that title is non-real-assets portfolio test, and if you have a portfolio interest of less than 10 per cent as a foreigner you don't have to pay capital gains tax. That's not right.</para>
<para>Another good one is section 25.90 where you can claim an interest expense against non-assessable non-exempt income. An example is when my old employer, Westfield, built those big shopping centres in London and Westfield in Australia lent the money through Ireland into the UK. The income that those shopping centres made was assessable in the UK, as it should have been, but the interest tax deduction was actually offset against our Australian business here. That meant they paid less tax here in Australia. That's not the right thing to happen either. The last one, of course, is 128b of the 1936 Income Tax Assessment Act, the public offer test. That was the whole reason why, when I was sitting at the University of Sydney Law School doing my masters of tax, I decided I needed to run for politics. That effectively says that if foreign banks lend money into Australia through the primary market—and to be in the primary market you've got to have a financial securities licence and a minimum parcel of $500,000 or $1 million, I think—you don't have to pay withholding tax. I think it's totally wrong that our pensioners or anyone that earns interest income here in Australia has to pay tax on that income, yet we give foreign banks a break. They don't have to pay any tax on the interest we pay them offshore. We need to get rid of that because we don't have a corporate bond market here in Australia. We've got $3 trillion in superannuation. If you want to tap capital, tap domestic equity rather than foreign debt.</para>
</speech>
<speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:08</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McCARTHY</name>
    <name.id>122087</name.id>
    <electorate>Northern Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Firstly, I'd like to thank those senators who've contributed to this debate. Schedule 1 to the bill will reduce the risk of inadvertent breaches of the law if a financial adviser is authorised by more than one licensee. Schedule 1 also allows the Australian Securities and Investments Commission, ASIC, to use assisted decision-making processes to deliver a high standard of service in an effective and efficient manner. Schedule 2 to the bill is an important step towards delivering the government's commitment to ensure that large businesses provide Australians and investors with greater transparency and accountability when it comes to their climate related plans, risks and opportunities. This measure lays the necessary foundations to allow the development and implementation of sustainability reporting standards in Australia to meet this commitment. These amendments will facilitate the development of sustainability standards while longer term governance arrangements for sustainability related financial reporting, including climate disclosure, are developed and implemented.</para>
<para>Schedule 3 to the bill amends the Tax Agent Services Act 2009 to increase the independence and effectiveness of the Tax Practitioners Board, ensure high standards of ethics and competency in the tax profession and streamline the regulation of tax practitioners. I take this opportunity to thank the Australian Greens, and Senator Barbara Pocock in particular, for their constructive engagement on this bill. The government was outraged by the revelations about PwC's misuse of confidential information, and we are glad to be supporting amendments to strengthen the TPB's powers, improve its make-up and place new obligations on tax and BAS agents to report suspected breaches of the Code of Professional Conduct. These changes will uphold confidence and support high standards in the tax profession. The government also proposes minor amendments to schedule 3 to change the commencement date, given the bill has remained before the Senate beyond 1 July 2023.</para>
<para>Schedule 4 to the bill will continue to enhance the integrity of the tax system by aligning the tax treatment of off-market share buybacks undertaken by listed public companies with the tax treatment of on-market share buybacks. Off-market share buybacks will continue to be available to companies as a capital management option, but the tax outcomes will now be the same as for on-market share buybacks. Listed public companies will no longer be able to buy back their own shares at a discount subsidised by Australian taxpayers. In recent years, the incidence of off-market share buybacks has been irregular, but the value of shares purchased has been large. Since announcing this measure, we've been pleased to see that large corporates are choosing to shift to on-market share buybacks, acknowledging that the main rationale for off-market was a tax loophole. The government proposes minor amendments to schedule 4 to change the start date in relation to selective reductions of capital.</para>
<para>Schedule 5 to the bill prevents companies from making franked distributions funded by capital-raising for no commercial purpose. The distributions of concern occur on an ad hoc basis outside established business or industry practice. The government is also proposing to make changes to schedule 5. The government's amendments remove retrospectivity. As a result, the measure will apply from the day after royal assent. Our amendments also add a test for substantiality. A distribution will be considered to have been funded by capital raising if that capital raising funds at least a substantial part of the distribution, rather than any part of the distribution. Furthermore, we're adding a proportionality effect so that only the portion of the distribution that is funded by the capital raising will be unfrankable. We are confirming that responses to regulation aren't affected. So where an equity issue is in response to a regulatory requirement, directive or recommendation, that distribution will not be unfrankable merely because of the amendments in schedule 5.</para>
<para>The government notes the recommendations made by the Senate Economics Legislation Committee and expects that the proposed amendments will ensure that schedules 4 and 5 to the bill appropriately address feedback provided to the committee. The government also thanks Senator David Pocock for his engagement on the bill. We have amended the explanatory memorandum and supported your second reading amendment to confirm that ordinary family or commercial dealings in private companies, such as succession planning and shareholder exits, will not be affected by this measure. We've listened to the views put forward during the Senate inquiry, and we've worked constructively with the crossbench and made amendments to address that feedback. I commend this bill to the Senate.</para>
<interjection>
  <talker>
    <name role="metadata">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT</name>
    <name.id>296331</name.id>
  </talker>
  <para>The question now is that the second reading amendment on sheet 1856, in the name of Senator Hume, be agreed to. A division is required, but, given that it is after 6.30, the division will be deferred until the next sitting day.</para>
</interjection>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Inspector-General of Live Animal Exports Amendment (Animal Welfare) Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>71</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7034" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Inspector-General of Live Animal Exports Amendment (Animal Welfare) Bill 2023</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>71</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:15</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McKENZIE</name>
    <name.id>207825</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>On behalf of the federal coalition, I rise to speak on the Inspector-General of Live Animal Exports Amendment (Animal Welfare) Bill 2023, and, in doing so, I affirm that on this side of the chamber we're committed to upholding and preserving the highest standards of animal health and welfare while supporting a lawful and sustainable live export trade. The federal coalition is proud of the exemplary animal welfare measures that underpin Australia's world-leading live export industry. We appreciate that the humane treatment and wellbeing of animals is an important issue in our communities, our society and the broader agricultural sector. It's also a big part of our international reputation as a nation.</para>
<para>Before we get into the detail of this particular legislation in the Senate, it's worth recognising that in Australia we have a live export system that already operates extremely well. It is defined by the high standards of animal welfare and demonstrated through record-low mortality rates. Our live export industry makes an enormous contribution to our economy, to our $90 billion agricultural sector and to the social fabric of so many communities across regional, rural and remote Australia.</para>
<para>The numbers demonstrate its strength. In 2023 we exported nearly 1.3 million head of livestock, which included more than 614,000 head of cattle and almost 64,000 head of sheep. Live exports currently have their lowest mortality rates ever. In 2022 for cattle it was 0.05 per cent. I'd argue that's as good as any paddock. And for sheep it was 0.14 per cent. This success extends to our export abattoirs. In 2020 just 0.0066 per cent of animals sent to these facilities had an animal welfare report raised, and in 2021 it was only 0.005 per cent. For those who weren't paying attention through year 8 maths, that's very, very low. When we were in government, the federal coalition's approach was to work constructively in partnership and in collaboration with the live export industry to deliver improvements in animal welfare outcomes, and this was achieved. And it's a legacy we are very, very proud of as a coalition government.</para>
<para>That brings us to the bill before the Senate today. This legislation will seek to expand the functions and arrangements of the existing Inspector-General of Live Animal Exports to include animal welfare related objectives. The office would be rebranded—and, Madam Acting Deputy President Grogan, pardon the pun—as the inspector-general for animal welfare and live animal exports. We note that it was the former coalition government who established the office of the inspector-general through an act that we passed in 2019, and its role was to review the performance and exercise of powers by the department of ag, fishing and forestry in regulating livestock exports. Importantly, the inspector-general was a recommendation of the independent Moss review, which affirmed the need for an external watchdog on the work of the regulator, the department.</para>
<para>Senators would be aware that this bill was introduced by the government into the House of Representatives in May. In the House, the coalition did not support this legislation on the basis that it potentially constituted an overreach into state and territory animal welfare responsibilities, and on this point it needs to be noted that under current constitutional arrangements state and territory governments are responsible for animal production and welfare laws and their enforcement. The federal government's role is limited to trade issues, including the oversight of live animal exports and at export meat abattoirs. Our concerns on this front were based on a provision in this bill for the inspector-general to review the effectiveness of Commonwealth reporting for potential noncompliance with state and territory laws, as reported to state and territory governments.</para>
<para>But it wasn't just this bill's potential interference with state and territory responsibilities that needed clarification from the Albanese Labor government before the point where we are here today in the Senate. We in the coalition also sought assurances about the remit of the inspector-general's power. It was important that we were strenuous and methodical in our approach to this legislation, not just because our live export system and animal welfare standards already work very efficiently but also because we know how easy it is for Labor to just slide the thin end of the wedge into the animal welfare agenda, particularly in partnership with their coalition partners, the Australian Greens.</para>
<para>So, after carefully considering the uncertainty presented by these provisions in the bill, in August the coalition supported its referral to a Senate inquiry, and the Senate could do the good work of the Australian people. It was led by the Rural and Regional Affairs and Transport Legislation Committee, ably deputy chaired by Senator Matt Canavan. And at a public hearing during the inquiry the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry stated that 'the only substantive addition to the remit of the current inspector-general of live animal exports was reviewing the Australian standards for export of livestock'. The ASEL outlines the minimum animal welfare conditions that exporters must meet through the entire live export supply chain, which includes the sourcing, preparation, transport and onboard management of livestock.</para>
<para>Importantly, it was also clarified during this inquiry process and through correspondence to Minister Watt that the inspector-general will review the effectiveness of departmental officials reporting noncompliance with state and territory animal welfare regulations only in the livestock export supply chain. While departmental officials may also witness animal welfare incidents outside that export supply chain, and it's the case that these incidents must also be reported to the relevant authority, it has been confirmed that these cases will fall outside of the remit and scope of the inspector-general. That's a very important clarification that would only have been achieved had this legislation gone through the appropriate review process through a Senate inquiry.</para>
<para>Overall, the federal coalition decided it was both important and appropriate to clarify the inspector-general's remit under this legislation to ensure that there is a very clear delineation of Commonwealth, state and territory responsibilities—to prevent duplication, obviously, but also to avoid any perverse outcomes for Australian agriculture as the inspector-general, without that clarification, may have sought to expand their scope of practice, shall we say, into areas that were not constitutionally appropriate. We note that when this bill was originally introduced the coalition's reservations were shared by major industry stakeholders, and they've welcomed the clarity that we sought and subsequently have received from the department as part of our efforts to protect and preserve the integrity of our live export system.</para>
<para>There are people in this chamber who would seek to shut down that system and decimate rural and regional communities as a result and who also would seek to deprive not only our northern neighbours of Indonesia but also our Middle Eastern trading partners from the vital source of fabulous Australian protein, whether it be sheep or whether it be cattle, which can hold its head up high and be subjected to intense scrutiny and be very proud that our animal welfare system stands up. I put ours against that of Romania and any others that those in this chamber would like to suggest as an alternative substitution for the protein needs of those nations.</para>
<para>Throughout this process, we've been diligent, professional and meticulous, because we take animal welfare and the health of our export supply chains extremely seriously, as we do keeping those trade relationships robust but also authentic and confident. When its report was handed down on 30 August, the Rural and Regional Affairs and Transport Legislation Committee recommended that the Senate support the bill. Therefore, with this inquiry having now concluded and with the clarity having been confirmed, I can advise the Senate that the federal coalition will not be opposing this bill.</para>
<para>But we've also sent a strong message to Labor, when it chooses to listen to the Greens in particular but also when it comes to live exports in general, because we have every right to question this government's commitment to this essential industry. Already we're witnessing the devastating consequences of Labor's move to shut down live sheep exports and the impact that is having in saleyards and regional communities every single day, let alone what it's doing to WA as a result of this blind, ideologically driven policy position where the minister won't even get out of Perth to sit on the ground in saleyards and communities right across Western Australia and hear from producers and their communities about the impact that this will have on them.</para>
<para>The live sheep export industry is worth $85 million and employs more than 3,000 people. Those across the chamber here talk a huge game on local jobs and the need to protect local jobs. Whilst, on one hand, they talk about that, on the other hand Minister Watt is shutting down and closing up 3,000 local jobs related to the live sheep export industry in WA. It is a shame on the Labor Party, and do you know what? The Australian public is awake to the absolute hypocrisy from the Labor Party on wanting to protect local jobs and, at the same time, having policies before this chamber that seek to shut them down.</para>
<para>When this Labor government seeks to shut down the live export trade in sheep, this can't be predicated on evidence of animal welfare outcomes, because we have delivered major reforms. If you actually cared about outcomes, you would be talking about the science and understanding that these reforms have included industry initiated moratoriums on sheep exports during the Northern Hemisphere summer, increased space for animals, improved ventilation requirements, better data collection, temperature monitoring, the presence of independent government observers on deck, and public reporting. The amount of work that both industry and the former government did to assure the public that our live export industry was up for the task is exceptional. This government's decision to end live sheep export contradicts the proclaimed intent of this bill, which is to strengthen animal welfare. If the live sheep trade is destroyed, perverse animal welfare outcomes are the direct result, because our trading partners won't be buying Australian product, which is protected by the very measures I've outlined. They'll be buying product from elsewhere. But you don't care about animals, actually. You only care about the political outcomes that animals and their welfare issues will provide to you in capital cities.</para>
<para>It's not just the detrimental animal welfare consequences that need to be recognised; it's the human toll, because the enormous stress that our sheep producers are currently experiencing as a result of this decision, especially in Western Australia, is tragic. Since Labor embarked on shutting down this trade, confidence in the whole market has fallen. Prices for sheep in WA have plummeted to dismally low commercial value. We've heard in the Senate inquiry and in public and private conversations that sheep producers across this country are actually having to shoot animals in the paddock rather than pay the livestock transport costs to get them to saleyards, because shooting them is cheaper. You can truck 600 head to saleyards. It costs seven bucks a head to get them there on the truck and another seven to get them back, for a total of 14 bucks a head, because no-one would buy them. That is the economic reality of the Labor Party's agriculture policy. It beggars belief, and you've done it to protect inner-city seats from attack by the Greens. And you'll do it again. You will sacrifice rural and regional Australians and our industries each and every time to buy political favours in capital cities, and we on this side of the chamber, the Liberal and the National parties, are here to call it out. I seek leave to continue my remarks.</para>
<para>Leave granted; debate adjourned.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>74</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Research Council</title>
          <page.no>74</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><subdebate.2><subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>74</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:30</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McCARTHY</name>
    <name.id>122087</name.id>
    <electorate>Northern Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>by leave—I table documents relating to the order for the production of documents concerning the Australian Research Council.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.2></subdebate.1></debate>
    <debate><debateinfo>
        <title>ADJOURNMENT</title>
        <page.no>74</page.no>
        <type>ADJOURNMENT</type>
      </debateinfo><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Postcards to the Front</title>
          <page.no>74</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:31</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator BILYK</name>
    <name.id>HZB</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Tonight I want to provide the Senate with a brief update on the Postcards to the Front campaign, which I've spoken about in this place previously. To remind senators, Postcards to the Front is a global campaign aimed at sending messages of support and encouragement to brave Ukrainians on the front line of the war with Russia. In the last couple of weeks, the Russia-Ukraine war has been knocked off the front pages of the newspaper, which I find a bit unfortunate. The issues there have not changed; they have not improved. It's really important that we don't forget what Ukraine is going through at the moment and we don't let the issues there become overshadowed by recent events. It's really important that we remind people that that war is ongoing.</para>
<para>The messages in the Postcards to the Front campaign are a reminder that the world does stand with those at the front in Ukraine and has not forgotten their struggle. Australia and Canada have been the most active national branches of this initiative, and I'm really pleased to report that the Australian branch has so far sent over 7,500 postcards, which is a phenomenal achievement, to the front. I congratulate the Australian coordinator, Peter Ramadge, on his huge efforts, as well as the campaign's Ukrainian founder, Tamara Levit.</para>
<para>A postcard may sound like an empty gesture, but the feedback from the defenders of Ukraine have been so overwhelmingly positive. One person said, 'Nothing warms the soldiers' hearts like a handwritten letter,' and another said, 'The postcards make us calm and motivated. The darkest day would be a bit brighter because somebody handwrote their sincere support to us.'</para>
<para>It's not hard to do. As senators would be aware, I've written to all parliamentarians to encourage their participation, and I sincerely thank all members and senators of the parliament, including the Prime Minister, who have contributed. Anyone can send a postcard to the front. You can also send more than one. In fact, you can write regularly. For guidance on what to write, visit postcardstothefront.com.au, where you can also find the Australian address to forward them to. If you live near my electorate office in Kingston, in Hobart, or work in the parliamentary building—it's open to staff as well, not just politicians—feel free to drop by my electorate or parliamentary office, pick up a postcard, write a simple message and leave it with my staff, who will forward it on.</para>
<para>I don't think I can reiterate enough tonight how welcome these postcards are to those on the front line. It's not just professional soldiers but also civilians who've joined up to protect their country against the immoral invasion by Russia. I've had a lot to do with Ukrainians over the 40-odd years that I've been married to my husband, and they're a very strong people. They're a very dignified people. They want to support their country. They believe—as do I and I think most people in this parliament, if not all—that the Russian invasion was immoral and illegal. They're such a strong national group of people. I really find it hard to put into words exactly how strong they are, but they will defend their country to their deaths. You can be sure of that.</para>
<para>All I'm asking is that people write a simple postcard to these people. It can just be, 'We are thinking of you in these awful times.' It doesn't have to be an essay. It doesn't have to be a book. It's simply a postcard. So I would encourage people to do that. As I stated earlier, the message reminds those people that the world stands with them. In this geopolitical landscape that we've got, with the issues involved in other countries that have conflict going on, I would just ask people to remember those Ukrainians that are supporting their country.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Communications Legislation Amendment (Combating Misinformation and Disinformation) Bill 2023</title>
          <page.no>74</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:36</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator CHANDLER</name>
    <name.id>264449</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The Albanese government's proposed censorship law, the Communications Legislation Amendment (Combating Misinformation and Disinformation) Bill 2023, is a two-card trick on the Australian people. First, the government label criticism of their policies and edicts as 'misinformation'. Then, they enact laws threatening to issue massive fines if what they call misinformation isn't 'disappeared' from the internet. We've already seen the first phase of these authoritarian tactics being rolled out by government ministers, who've used the catchphrase 'misinformation and disinformation' over and over again in response to legitimate criticism and questions of their policies and priorities from Australians. Now, they're seeking to ram through the second part of their plan—changing the law to censor Australians. To do that, they plan to team up with the Greens. Two political parties, who think that men can be women and have implemented numerous laws around the country to punish women who say otherwise, want to give themselves the power to decide what is true and what is false.</para>
<para>The Labor government's censorship bill was rightly slammed in submissions by thousands of Australians and experts because of the inevitable chilling effect that it would have on freedom of speech. The reason this bill is so dangerous is very simple. A government which seeks to control what its citizens can say and where they can say it is deliberately undermining the freedom of speech on which our democracy depends. It is the domain of dictators and despots to censor the internet and to control what their citizens can see. That's what the Chinese Communist Party does, and it's what the Putin dictatorship does. The barbaric Islamic Republic of Iran regime constantly cuts off internet and communications as a tool to suppress dissent and opposition—to silence and control Iranians and leave them with few ways to organise political opposition and communicate with the rest of the world. We certainly hope that the Australian population is never at the mercy of such a merciless regime as the Islamic Republic, but we have no guarantee. The fact that we have seen so many people in recent weeks marching down the streets of our major cities chanting propaganda, which has been pushed by the likes of the Islamic Republic regime, is a stark reminder of that. When you start undermining the very principles which protect democracy, you are making it easier for that type of regime to emerge.</para>
<para>Freedom of speech is one of those core foundations that true democracy cannot survive without. Freedom to say only what the government and the big tech companies allow you to say is not freedom of speech. Controlling what people can say and where they can say it is precisely what Labor's proposed censorship laws intend to do. That's not a side effect or an unintended consequence of these laws. It is a core premise of the bill in question. The quiet announcement by the Albanese government last weekend that it intends to make a few tweaks and push ahead with its bill will do nothing to make Australians more comfortable with government censorship, and nor should it. We have seen clear examples from all over the world where governments see social media as a useful tool to censor their critics. We've even had some of these social media companies admit that they did it and then admit that they got it wrong.</para>
<para>Many people are realising that the ability of these companies to control the flow of information is incredibly dangerous to our democracy. That danger only becomes greater when those in authority seek to capture and direct that censorship power themselves, and, no matter how they try and spin it, that is exactly what the Albanese government are proposing: unelected government bureaucrats, appointed by the government of the day, able to hold the threat of millions of dollars in fines over the heads of social media companies if they don't disappear what the government claim is misinformation. The Albanese government do not have the right to accuse their own citizens of spreading misinformation, let alone to censor us. The real danger to our democracy doesn't come from citizens; it comes from governments, including our own, seeking to remove avenues for them to be challenged and held to account.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Tasmania: Salmon Industry, Maugean Skate</title>
          <page.no>75</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:40</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator WHISH-WILSON</name>
    <name.id>195565</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>The foreign-owned Tasmanian salmon farming industry and our state's Premier are on the warpath, determined to let nothing, not even the extinction of a wild and endangered marine species, get in the way of their corporate profiteering. Macquarie Harbour is the last place on earth you will find the ancient and critically endangered maugean skate. The salmon industry have claimed they don't support or believe the best scientific advice showing that salmon farming is a key contributor to poor dissolved oxygen levels in the harbour, which are pushing the skate to extinction, or the recommendation that salmon biomass must be significantly reduced to give the skate the best possible chance of survival. Apparently, it differs from the industry's own science—presumably paid for by the salmon industry—but you'd expect them to say that, wouldn't you?</para>
<para>The expansion of industrial salmon farming on the west coast of Tasmania in Macquarie Harbour should never have been allowed in 2012. The Greens opposed this from day 1. We have been consistent in our concerns and warnings on threatened species and the damage to World Heritage values in the area. We didn't trust a totally captured state government to properly regulate the industry, especially given the significant uncertainties that existed in our understanding of this complex body of water. History has proven us right, and it wasn't just the Greens who warned of this.</para>
<para>The salmon industry themselves went to war in 2017 over this issue, fighting themselves in court over poor industry practices and lax regulation, with the CEO of Huon Aquaculture at the time warning the harbour was a ticking time bomb for endangered skate if fish biomass was not reduced and properly regulated. She also said if the regulator didn't do its job then it would ruin it for all of them and there would be an impact on the whole industry and its future in the harbour. She has been proven right also.</para>
<para>How convenient and frustrating it is that now the salmon industry—with their new industry association and corporate owners—and their full-throated supporters, like Mr Gavin Pearce and Jeremy Rockliff, are attempting to politicise this old, sad affair and deflect blame onto others, like the federal Minister for the Environment and Water and hardworking scientists within the Threatened Species Scientific Committee, who are just doing their jobs protecting our environment—and I am glad of that. I have been urging various environment ministers and the committee to act on this for years.</para>
<para>Any regrettable loss of jobs or economic impacts that may flow from stopping a species going extinct on the west coast of Tasmania are a mess entirely of the making of the salmon industry and the state government—not that I've heard a single word from the Tasmanian Premier, West Coast mayor Shane Pitt or the cheerleaders in the Liberal Party acknowledging this fact. Nor have I heard any public commentary on the dangers of an extinction event to the future sales of the industry, its brand, the local tourism economy or even Brand Tasmania. In fact, disappointingly, I've heard not a public word of worry, reflection or acknowledgement of the sad reality we face with the imminent extinction of a species that has been with us for millions of years. I look forward to this public sentiment being forthcoming.</para>
<para>The salmon industry has proposed an untested oxygen bubble machine to avoid removing fish from the harbour, but they recently misled us on this, saying that it had federal government support. We found soon after that that was not the case. There is a captive breeding program to try and breed the ancient skate in a tank and, if it works—and that's a big 'if'—to put any last surviving skate in ponds or back into the wild. But where? The only place on the planet that was found was Macquarie Harbour, which is too polluted to put the skate back into.</para>
<para>How sad is it that it has gotten to this? A critically endangered species is being pushed to the brink of extinction by an introduced, invasive species, the Atlantic salmon. It was totally avoidable, and it was all because one industry had too much power over government and the regulator—and it still does. It seems like the story of Tasmania. What is next—the swift parrot? Is it the handfish? This is one of the great moral challenges of our time, and we can't afford to fail. The world is watching. I implore the federal government to continue their efforts to save the skate.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Tasmania: Renewable Energy</title>
          <page.no>76</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:45</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator POLLEY</name>
    <name.id>e5x</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise as a proud member of the Albanese Labor government that is making important reforms to make our country stronger, fairer and safer, for this generation and the next. I'm proud to say that consultation is open in my home state of Tasmania for an offshore wind zone in the Bass Strait, off Tasmania's north coast. This has the potential to unlock secure, regional job opportunities and cleaner, cheaper energy for Tasmanians. This is an exciting opportunity for jobs, education and training and cheaper power bills through renewable energy. It builds on Tasmania's proud renewables history, and it puts us at the top as a world leader in renewable energy generation. It builds on the current five wind farms located in the regions in Tasmania.</para>
<para>This new potential zone could support thousands of jobs during construction as well as ongoing jobs for Tasmanian residents. Importantly, those jobs will be in regional Tasmania, in our very important regional communities. Once complete, offshore wind will support good, well-paying jobs, providing plenty of cleaner, cheaper renewable energy with engineers, electrical technicians, cable installers, crane operators, riggers, divers and administrators, which is why the Commonwealth government is seeking feedback on the proposed zone, which is at least 20 kilometres from shore at its closest point and 10,136 square kilometres. Submissions to the consultation can be made any time from today until 31 January, and the consultation will include five community drop-in sessions along the north coast of Tasmania, from Burnie to Bridport and Whitemark on Flinders Island in December, with more sessions to come in late January 2024.</para>
<para>Minister for Climate Change and Energy the Hon. Chris Bowen has said that consultation would support a genuine opportunity for communities to have their say in the first part of the process for developing an offshore wind industry in Tasmania. I agree with the minister that this is a game changer for Tasmania, and it builds on our strength as a clean, green power. We have always led the way in this country with hydro. We will continue to do that, because we're investing in jobs for the future. We want to have renewable clean energy, we want to bring electricity prices down, and this is a major step towards doing that. The Bass Strait is renowned for its offshore wind resources, and this potential zone could transform Tasmania into a new clean energy powerhouse, spurring investment in Tasmanian communities, providing energy security for decarbonising heavy industries and creating thousands of jobs. The benefits of this project will be ongoing and will change our community for the better. In addition to the consultation period opening, these processes provide multiple future opportunities for our community to have their say on these individual projects.</para>
<para>I welcome this project. It's great for jobs, great for our community and will put downward pressure on electricity prices. It means more opportunity for education and training in engineering, the sciences and trades. It supports TAFE and training. As part of the Albanese Labor Government I take great pride in the fact that we are investing in TAFE. We are providing fee-free TAFE courses for the sectors where we need more skilled workers. We are investing in our people, and this project means that young Tasmanians can aspire to work in the renewable energy space. I hope it will lead to more Tasmanians staying in Tasmania instead of leaving for jobs on the mainland. Tasmania is a place of opportunity. We need to ensure every Tasmanian understands this sentiment, understands our green energy image and serves our state for the better, and this project is clean, green and job-ready. I commend Minister Bowen for his leadership in this very important sector. I'm proud to be a part of this government and proud to be Tasmanian. I want to see Tasmania take full advantage of this— <inline font-style="italic">(</inline><inline font-style="italic">Time expired</inline><inline font-style="italic">)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>South Australia: Health</title>
          <page.no>77</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:51</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ANTIC</name>
    <name.id>269375</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Throughout the COVID period we learnt a lot about our bureaucratic class, and one bureaucracy we learnt about was the South Australian Department for Health and Wellbeing, otherwise known as SA Health. But SA Health's problems didn't just begin with COVID because in 2019 the Hon. Bruce Lander KC, the then South Australian Independent Commissioner Against Corruption, published a report entitled <inline font-style="italic">Troubling Ambiguity: Governance </inline><inline font-style="italic">at</inline><inline font-style="italic"> S</inline><inline font-style="italic">A</inline><inline font-style="italic"> Health</inline>, which details his concerns about SA Health being 'ripe for exploitation by corrupt employees'. This report led to a taskforce being established to investigate corruption, mismanagement and 'a toxic workplace culture at SA Health'. In his report, Mr Lander, a former Federal Court judge, wrote:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… that poor conduct and practices are common and accepted within SA Health. I cannot quantify the extent to which this is happening or the cost to the taxpayer. However, I can confidently state that it is not insignificant.</para></quote>
<para>The report is replete with damning findings about SA Health's workplace culture and practices including:</para>
<quote><para class="block">A significant cultural problem is demonstrated in that 51% of SA Health respondents reported encountering bullying and harassment. In addition, 78% of SA Health respondents rated SA Health as vulnerable to bullying and harassment.</para></quote>
<para>It's hard to think of a more clear example of bullying and harassment than SA Health's recent treatment of the 145 nurses, social workers, scientists and healthcare professionals, many of whom are in the process of being terminated because of their refusal to receive a COVID-19 vaccination. That's right: in 2023 SA Health are still discriminating against their staff based on their personal medical decisions. All of this is despite SA Health having acknowledged that COVID vaccination has no impact on infection or transmission.</para>
<para>SA Health has been experiencing staffing shortages for several years now, and it's funny how that happens after dismissing hundreds if not thousands of staff members for refusing a COVID vaccination. They have even been advertising overseas for healthcare workers, yet there are plenty right there in SA who are willing to work if only they were allowed to work by SA Health. Of course, we are not stupid. This decision is not arbitrary. It is spiteful retribution designed to weed out those who simply won't dance to the beat of SA Health's drum. The message is clear: if you don't march to the beat of their drum then you are out. Vaccine mandates have always been unjustifiable and inexcusable, and anyone who says otherwise is frankly in denial. In fact, Queensland Health is set to remove its vaccine mandates for healthcare workers. SA Health, one of the nation's largest healthcare departments, really must now follow suit, but will the state Labor government address these issues? Of course they won't. South Australians deserve better from their public health bureaucracy than this hot mess.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Veterans: GO2 Health</title>
          <page.no>77</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:54</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HANSON</name>
    <name.id>BK6</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to speak about an innovative and extremely effective holistic treatment model for Australian Defence Force veterans and their families. GO2 Health in Brisbane is providing comprehensive care to veterans and their families as they transition out of military service and into the community. The aim is to help veterans and their families to manage the transition and ultimately establish the personal agency they need to lead normal lives.</para>
<para>I visited GO2 Health a couple of weeks ago and met with their medical doctor, Dr Kieran McCarthy, and their managing director, Rod Martin. More than 6,000 veteran patients are being cared for at the clinic, with about 1,500 visits taking place every week. It's not only medical care but also complementary treatments such as psychology, psychiatry, clinical Pilates, skin cancer treatment, hydrotherapy, remedial massage, dietitian advice and physiotherapy. It brings veterans' families with them on the same journey.</para>
<para>Today's ADF personnel are not the rank-and-file soldiers and sailors who comprised the armed forces of the 20th century. They are highly trained experts in what they do, following a regimented existence with comprehensive logistical supports. They apply this training, often at great risk to themselves, on behalf of our nation, and many veterans today have also experienced the horrors of war and combat. It's not easy to make the transition to civilian life, and many veterans and their families really struggle with it. The Australian Institute of Health and Welfare says that, in comparison with the national population, suicide by ex-servicemen is 27 per cent higher and, for ex-servicewomen, it is a staggering 107 per cent higher.</para>
<para>Claims by veterans are rising. In the last budget, an additional $4.8 billion was provided for veterans' claims and another $64 million was needed to help address the backlog of claims. GO2 Health's focus is preventive health care, and I consider that, if their model were fully adopted as the benchmark in veteran health care that it is, this could save taxpayers and the economy a great deal of money, in addition to the tangible benefits for individual veterans and their families.</para>
<para>However, this model is at risk due to inequities in funding. GO2 Health bulk-bills its services. As a business, it is operating on a wafer-thin margin while facing increased operating costs, with a recent 5.9 per cent wage rise triggering more payroll tax liability. The practice is having difficulty retaining people, especially mental health experts, because of lower payments under the Department of Veterans' Affairs schedule and partly due to unfair competition from high payment rates offered in the National Disability Insurance Scheme. GO2 Health's experience is that its GPs, physiotherapists, exercise physiologists and psychology services experience an average 35 per cent loss under the DVA schedule. This is effectively a form of discrimination against veterans and their families. Health practitioners favour private patients or those funded by WorkCover and the NDIS over patients under the DVA schedule. This is because the former can be billed at market rates and don't involve the same high level of compliance. The solution, of course, is to lift the DVA schedule in line with more competitive WorkCover rates.</para>
<para>I also agree with their proposal that the Albanese government fund a national expansion of this model. This would involve opening similar clinics in each state, with the potential to treat up to 24,000 veterans at a cost of only $2,500 per veteran and their family. That's only $60 million per year. This would be for a treatment program lasting 18 months: six months before leaving the ADF and 12 months after. In the long term, this preventive medicine approach would potentially save taxpayers a great deal of money in comparison to treating veterans long-term. You'd be forgiven for thinking the veterans' affairs minister, Matt Keogh, would be keen to talk to GO2 Health and visit their clinic. However, I am informed that, while he's had plenty of opportunities, the minister hasn't made the effort, and it appears his office has even asked GO2 Health to stop calling. This is very short-sighted, and I call on the minister to examine this model with an eye to adopting it.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Western Australia: Health Care</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>19:59</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator STEELE-JOHN</name>
    <name.id>250156</name.id>
    <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Western Australia's healthcare system is in crisis, and it has been in crisis since before the pandemic because of the systemic undervaluing of healthcare workers and the under-resourcing of what is literally one of the most important government services. The most recent annual survey of WA healthcare workers paints a bleak picture of the healthcare system and those who are trying to keep it running. Only a quarter of healthcare workers thought their organisation cared about their wellbeing. Feelings of burnout and being overworked are far too common, especially among our nurses. Our community cannot function without nurses, without orderlies, without techs and doctors. Yet these are the people who are feeling the most pressure from a healthcare system that is understaffed and overrun by a global health crisis that continues to this day.</para>
<para>The decision by successive Labor and Liberal governments, both in this place and back in Perth, to pursue ideological cost cutting has had an enormous impact on patients. In the southern suburbs of Perth just one per cent of ED patients are being seen in the recommended triage time frame. In one tragic case we saw a child die of sepsis while waiting to be seen in the emergency room of PCH. People are being forced to attend emergency departments because they simply cannot afford to attend a GP, a dentist, or a specialist to get medical help before it becomes an emergency. These issues are not confined to the provision of care at hospitals. Ambulance ramping, for example, has seen an increase of 800 per cent since 2016. Gutting of the healthcare system during a global pandemic, understaffing and undervaluing of healthcare staff and refusal to give public healthcare workers what they need when they need it are decisions that cost lives; they cost human lives.</para>
<para>It's time we remembered that once upon a time in Australia we were world renowned for public health care and accessible health care. Our system was once world leading. Now most people can't afford a GP visit, can't afford to go to the dentist or specialist, have problems paying for medications and are therefore left with unaffordable options that they have to pursue to get some kind of care outside of an emergency department.</para>
<para>It is not too late to turn this situation around. We can address these issues and make sure our system does not become an American model of health care where only those who can afford it get proper care. The Greens have heard from our community, and we want to build a thriving public healthcare system. To achieve this, we will, and we can together: reinvest the more than $1 billion that is currently paid to private health insurance rebates and to corporations back into the public system; ensure that everyone can get what they need when they need it by funding our hospitals and ensuring that we clear public hospital surgery waiting lists; make telehealth a permanent part of our Medicare system, increasing access to essential care for all; and fund team based health care for people with chronic conditions, improving outcomes and quality of care.</para>
<para>We can make the decisions here at the national level that would enable the reinvestment of some $114 billion into the public healthcare system by legislating for equal funding of hospitals between the Commonwealth and the states and territories, ensuring faster and more-accessible services. And we can pay our nurses, our orderlies, our doctors and our techs—our healthcare workers—what they deserve. It is to them that we turned during the pandemic. It is upon their work that we placed so much. They deserve to be paid properly and fairly for their expertise, for their determination and for their courage in service to our community.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Northern Territory Indigenous Economic Development Forum</title>
          <page.no>79</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:04</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McCARTHY</name>
    <name.id>122087</name.id>
    <electorate>Northern Territory</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I'd like to talk about the Northern Territory Indigenous Economic Development conference that took place towards the end of last week. It was an honour to be the keynote guest speaker there on Friday and to be able to attend the conference with more than 600 participants from not just the Northern Territory but across Australia, proving again the length and breadth of experience that there is in so many areas in terms of economic development.</para>
<para>It was good to see the many communities represented there from across Arnhem Land and also those from interstate, who came to sell their wares and to talk about the challenges of having a business, owning a business and how they could work their way forward to become so much more sustainable in terms of not only their business but also their family and their livelihoods. Many of those who were present were also able to talk about the referendum and what the 'no' vote meant for them and its impact. I thought it was an important moment—that hundreds and hundreds of First Nations people could come together to talk and to reflect and also to show solidarity and support for one another and the many millions of Australians who supported them.</para>
<para>In my address to the conference, I reminded the audience that the key thing for me certainly here is to remember that it's about respect, to accept the results of the referendum and to remember resilience. 'Respect' and 'resilience' are two key words that I shared with those at the conference to show that we can move forward. As First Nations people we have, over thousands of years, been able to come through many difficulties and hardships. This was something that was really important to be able to talk about at the conference.</para>
<para>Minister Linda Burney also came to the Northern Territory to spend some time with the Tiwi islanders and their local member Marion Scrymgour, and that was important. The Tiwi islanders welcomed the minister and were also able to feed back to her where they were at in terms of the referendum outcome and also what they'd like to see in terms of steps going forward. This was really productive and quite important for the Tiwi community—to be able to talk on many levels about the many issues impacting them.</para>
<para>We also had time with students of Charles Darwin University and to encourage more First Nations students to attend university, especially here in the Northern Territory. We were able to meet two incredibly impressive young people: Stuart and Yasmin. Stuart is well-known in the Northern Territory, having been a young Indigenous Australian recognised in the Australia Day honours for the Northern Territory. Yasmin is studying law and is inspiring other First Nations people to come forward and study at university. They were very encouraging meetings, Again, it was also important to reflect on people's learnings throughout the referendum, what they experienced, what they felt and what their hopes are for the future. I thank Yasmin and Stuart for having that time with us, and I thank Charles Darwin University for the work that it is doing with not only students from across the Northern Territory and across Australia but also international students. Keep up the good work, and I look forward to working more with you going into 2024.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Members of Parliament: Staffing</title>
          <page.no>79</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:08</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator TYRRELL</name>
    <name.id>300639</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Imagine this: you're in a fight. Your opponent picks their weapon and then they pick yours. You don't get a say. Whatever they choose, that's what you're working with. That's politics today, and that's how office resources work. The Prime Minister picks his party's weapon and then he picks for everyone else—not the government, not the cabinet, just the Prime Minister. He picks how many staff he gets and then he picks the opposition's staff and the crossbenchers' staff. He can give or take staff. He can add more for himself and his mates and take from others. He could decide that only the Labor Party gets staff from now on. That's within his power. This isn't fair. It's risky. It hurts democracy, where every voice matters.</para>
<para>Staff are a resource. People talk about how important they are—and they are—but they're basically there to help you do your job. I couldn't do my job without a phone or a computer or an office printer. I couldn't do my job without tables or chairs. All of those things are supplied to me as office resources. It's the same with staff. They help you do your job. The Prime Minister can say, 'If you vote my way, your office gets more resources; if you don't, you will lose office resources.' It's all legal. No politician can do everything alone. You can't answer every phone call or reply to every email. You can't read every page of legislation about every policy that's before the parliament. Staff are there to help us to help you. I don't need to convince the Prime Minister of the value of staff. It's something he and I agree on. After all, he's added 50 adviser positions to his side of politics since his election, and he's cut 41 from the crossbench. That kind of thing lingers with you.</para>
<para>Think about a key vote. If it doesn't go the government's way, the Prime Minister of the day could take away our staff, and there would be nothing we could do about it. So, every vote I take, I take it knowing I could be punished for it. It's like opening a box of chocolates: you're just never sure what you'll find on the inside. No politician could honestly say that such a threat has absolutely zero influence on them. I'm not accusing our current Prime Minister of anything. I'm just saying that, for our current Prime Minister and every Prime Minister that will follow him, this power is a recipe for corruption. Our system is supposed to let voters pick who represents them. But one person, the Prime Minister, can decide how good you are as a representative.</para>
<para>When I ask them if they think there's something wrong with the current model, the Labor Party says: 'This is fine. It's always been this way.' I don't get it. We change how things are done all the time. That's how progress gets made. What's the point of being in government if you're there to do things the way they were done when you were in opposition? Staff allocations are office resources. They should not be decided by anybody who stands to benefit from the decision. It is an obvious, blatant conflict of interest. It's a corruption risk, and it's a problem that we can fix in an instant.</para>
<para>An independent body should decide what's fair, openly and without bias. The Remuneration Tribunal is such a body. It's already responsible for the pay and conditions of members and senators. Why? Because we decided that politicians shouldn't be deciding their own pay and conditions. How would you feel if the Prime Minister could decide it for everyone? If he decided to give me an extra $100,000 a year because he liked me but cut the pay of someone else on the crossbench by $100,000 because he didn't like them, we'd call it a scandal. We'd be up in arms, because that would be an abuse. So why do we trust the Prime Minister to set office resources?</para>
<para>Nobody's offered me extra staff. Nobody's threatened to cut them. I'm not accusing our Prime Minister of anything corrupt. All I'm saying is that the rules allow for it. He's not responsible for the current rules. He didn't decide them. But, if he decides to do nothing about them and he doesn't change anything about them, that's something he will have to wear. This is not just about fairness. It's about integrity. It's about making sure that our political system is not at the mercy of the whim of one person. It's about making sure that every representative, no matter their party, has the resources they need to serve their constituents well. We need an independent decision-maker to have the power to decide what's fair. Without it, every decision we make risks being compromised.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Paramedics</title>
          <page.no>80</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:13</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McLACHLAN</name>
    <name.id>287062</name.id>
    <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Paramedics are exceptional Australians. When they choose this life of service they know, unlike most of their university friends, that when they complete their studies they will face trauma, danger and stress, but their desire to serve their fellow Australians in need drives them on to join their paramedic colleagues. It is this same desire that sustains them when they reach the point of exhaustion and as they struggle to withstand the pressures of their work while also balancing the needs of their own families and loved ones. They are the heroes of our community. They quietly work to keep us safe night and day, shift after shift. All governments, both federal and state, must do all that they can to support first responders and their families. Governments put first responders into harm's way; therefore, they are under a moral obligation to ensure that first responders are cared for when they suffer the inevitable effects of their service. I know firsthand, from my volunteer work with St John Ambulance, how paramedics and their families are impacted by their service.</para>
<para>Last week the Senate passed the Fair Work Legislation Amendment (First Responders) Bill 2023. This bill reverses the burden of proof so that first responders are no longer required to prove that they have developed post-traumatic stress as a result of their service when making a workers compensation claim. The bill only applies to Commonwealth and ACT employees. This is an encouraging start on the long road to properly caring for our first responders in Australia. The Commonwealth has taken the lead. It's now up to the states and territories to follow.</para>
<para>Psychological injuries can manifest themselves in first responders long after an initial exposure to trauma, and this link can be difficult to prove. Throughout a first responder's career, the effects of ongoing exposure to trauma can be cumulative and often go unrecognised, even into retirement. Making a workers compensation claim in relation to post-traumatic stress can be complex, demanding and time-consuming. The claims process can aggravate the pain the first responder and their family are experiencing, and it creates barriers for first responders in accessing treatment in a timely manner.</para>
<para>Importantly, the coalition has supported this bill. I would like to thank the Liberal and National parties federally for their support of this bill, and I would like to think that the Liberal and National parties in each state and territory will follow a like policy position. In South Australia a similar bill is currently before the Legislative Council, having been moved by the honourable Frank Pangallo. There is no reason that the South Australian Labor government and Liberal opposition should oppose the passage of this bill now that this Senate has passed similar legislation, with the support of all major parties.</para>
<para>In 2018 the Senate referred to the Education and Employment References Committee an inquiry into the role of government in addressing the high rates of mental health conditions experienced by first responders. The committee's excellent report was handed down in February 2019. Two recommendations are yet to be fully progressed. The committee recommended a national action plan be developed for first responders' mental health. It also recommended that the federal government establish a stakeholder working group to assess the benefits of a harmonised national approach to presumptive legislation. I call on all Australian governments to work harder to implement these recommendations.</para>
<para>There is no reason that a paramedic in one state should be treated differently in another. Paramedics have higher rates of post-traumatic stress and work related mental health disorders than the general population. It is time for all governments to accept their moral obligation to care for those whom they send into harm's way. I thank all the paramedics and volunteers in my own state of South Australia and acknowledge what they and their families have sacrificed to ensure that we have remained safe.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>McLean, Mr John Barry, AM</title>
          <page.no>81</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:17</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SHELDON</name>
    <name.id>168275</name.id>
    <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I rise to celebrate the life of the late John Barry McClean AM. All who knew John knew that he was a hardworking and thoroughly decent man. Throughout every aspect of his life, he demonstrated tremendous strength of character, strength of personality and strength of mind—a true gentleman, driven by a determination to give working men and women, and their families, a voice equal to their bosses. I knew John as a great union leader. Those who were close to John knew that he could always be relied on.</para>
<para>John was born in Arncliffe, at the Rosslyn Hospital, on 13 September 1934, to parents John and Mabel McLean. He started school at Arncliffe primary school, then went to high school at Newington College, where he was a boarder while his father was serving in the Army during World War II. After completing his Intermediate Certificate and leaving school, he started working for the Shell Oil Company as a pump boy, refuelling sales vehicles and trucks at Pyrmont. He was offered as a job as a tanker driver and moved to Queanbeyan, before being transferred to Wollongong, transporting fuel up and down the notorious Bulli Pass. Later he went to Darwin as an aircraft refueller, where he met Thelma, who was a nurse in Darwin at the time. Of course, she later became the love of his life.</para>
<para>John returned to Sydney and became a local TWU delegate in a fuel yard in 1968, and then, in 1974, he became a full-time Transport Workers Union official. He was appointed the Sydney sub-branch secretary in 1982 and was elected as New South Wales secretary in 1989. John always aimed to deliver progressive but stable leadership in the union and believed that solidarity is everything. As he wrote in the <inline font-style="italic">Voice of the Transport Worker</inline> in 1992:</para>
<quote><para class="block">The premise underpinning the Transport Workers Union of today is that change involves all of us working together for the same goals. Co-operation and progress underpins everything we believe as a union and everything we fight for.</para></quote>
<para>I remember him helping one big personality from Qantas who was fighting to get his job back after he played hooky from the airport and ended up at the rowers club. The manager sent a supervisor to pick the fellow up, but they ended up both getting drunk and were unable to return to work, let alone drive. This Qantas worker had suffered a few setbacks in his life. John knew that the loss of his job, on top of everything else, would devastate his family, so he went out of his way to ensure he got his job back, and get his job back he did.</para>
<para>When it came to dealing with employers, John was always tough but also genuine, and he was respected. I know Thelma and family were greatly moved by transport giant Lindsay Fox's words of condolence on John's passing. They were words that conveyed that John was just as respected by the employers as he was by the workforce. As a union official, John never forgot who he was and why he was there. His guiding principle was always doing what was right by tough workers in a tough industry.</para>
<para>He was a staunch democratic progressive when it came to matters of economic justice but a fierce opponent of communist influence in the union movement. Professor Mark Hearn interviewed John in his historical account of the TWU, <inline font-style="italic">Organising Union</inline>. On John's turbulent years fighting Left political influence he asked, 'You were getting threatening phone calls at the time, weren't you, John?' John answered:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Yes. Of course, you never knew who it was, but that was par for the course, I suppose. You cope with lots of things yourself, but when it's your children and your family, it's things they shouldn't have to put up with. But the wife was unbelievable with the support through all that she gave.</para></quote>
<para>John went on to say, 'I'm very lucky Thelma is a highly trained nurse, and that's what helped me through all my illnesses. She's been exceptional and still is.'</para>
<para>When John retired for health reasons after 30 years of service, he rightly said he was proud of the legacy he left in the union. In 1993, he was deservedly appointed a Member of the Order of Australia for services to the trade union movement, particularly through the Transport Workers Union.</para>
<para>John knew and understood the importance of Labor governments for working families. He joined the Australian Labor Party in 1954, at 20 years of age. While John had all the makings of a great MP, he never sought a seat in parliament, believing he could do more for the people of Australia, first and foremost, by continuing his role in the union movement. At the New South Wales Labor Party conference in 2016, John was awarded life membership of the Australian Labor Party, formal recognition of his continuous active and committed service to the party, its principles and its values for more than 40 years, including as a trustee of the New South Wales branch of the ALP.</para>
<para>More than anything else, John was a family man. John was described by his children as a brilliant father, tough but always fair, with plenty of kindness. With Thelma working night shifts while in obstetrics, she needed a family out of the house so she could sleep. So John would take the children on weekend adventures: seeing his beloved Dragons play, visiting relatives, visiting the Menangle Rotolactor, watching the hang-gliders at Stanwell Tops, mini bike riding at Menai and many days getting burnt at Cronulla Beach.</para>
<para>John's kindness was extended to many others as well. One of his children's friends gave him the nickname 'Pa', as the McLean family home was a place where everyone was welcome and Pa was a father figure loved by many. This nurturing and caring spirit was evident throughout John's life, as he and Thelma fostered 40 children over the years.</para>
<para>When John retired early, it was perfect timing for him to become a grandfather, a role he was made for. With his never-ending patience, he would keep his grandchildren entertained for hours. Driveway picnics in the Trakka, choccy milks, feeding the dogs, and wooden train networks that stretched from room to room are early memories that will endure. As the grandchildren grew, John and Thelma would always be at special events such as grandparents days, music or dance performance, and weekend soccer and cricket.</para>
<para>When 14 members of the family visited Parliament House, MPs and senators came to pay tribute to the late, great John McLean. The Hon. Richard Marles, Deputy Prime Minister of Australia, said: 'He was a giant in the industry, respected by the workers and the employers. He had a conciliatory approach, a way of bringing people towards agreement.' The Hon. Tony Burke MP remarked, 'I was just one of the many thousands of people standing on the shoulders of John McLean.' Senator Glenn Sterle, senator for Western Australia, stated: 'John was an aspirational leader. His passion and commitment to the men and women of the transport industry inspired a generation of future union leaders.'</para>
<para>John loved his family, he loved his work and his union, he loved the Labor Party and he loved his team, the Dragons. He loved life and he lived it to the fullest—loving husband to Thelma for over 60 years; caring brother of Joyce and Fred; devoted father to John, Francis and Rodney; and doting grandfather for Georgia, Siobhan, Lachlan and Amanda. John passed away on 11 August 2023 at the age of 88. Perhaps John's brother Fred sums the man up best when he says: 'John had a reputation as a man of honour and integrity. He was a strong man when he saw injustice, but also a gentle man and a gentleman.' Vale John Barry Maclean, AM, friend and mentor.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Immigration Detention</title>
          <page.no>82</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:26</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator SCARR</name>
    <name.id>282997</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Before I commence my contribution, let me say to Senator Sheldon: that was a beautiful contribution, and I suspect the family will be extraordinarily grateful. I don't think you could have done better.</para>
<para>During question time, quite often when one fails to control oneself, as my good friend Senator McGrath does far more often than I do, the President will exhort us to perhaps save our interjections for a contribution later in the day. I listened carefully to the President, and I'm taking this opportunity to follow her exhortation. So, President, if you're listening there somewhere, I do listen to you and deeply respect your guidance in these matters.</para>
<para>My colleague Senator O'Sullivan asked a question of the Leader of the Government in the Senate, Senator Wong, earlier today, and on that occasion I couldn't help interjecting. I will just lay the foundation for this. It was in relation to the High Court's recent decision on those in detention. Senator Wong made this comment:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Of course, the Leader of the Opposition was the Minister for Home Affairs at that time.</para></quote>
<para>Actually, I'll go back a bit earlier. She said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… no action was taken by those opposite to remove them from Australia.</para></quote>
<para>That was the comment she made that's relevant here:</para>
<quote><para class="block">… no action was taken by those opposite to remove them from Australia.</para></quote>
<para>We're talking about the people who were in detention. I interjected, 'Why couldn't they be?' Senator Wong responded:</para>
<quote><para class="block">You tell me. Why couldn't they be? I'll take that intervention. Maybe you should ask Mr Dutton that—</para></quote>
<para>et cetera. Senator Wong does this very effectively from time to time when someone makes an interjection. She will challenge them to tell the chamber why it is not the case that something is the case. I obviously, respecting the President as I do, take that as a rhetorical invitation to get up and advise the chamber, much like a rhetorical question—that is, Senator Wong didn't really expect me to stand up and explain why my good friend the Leader of the Opposition was unable to remove the individual who was the subject of a High Court case from Australia at that point in time. But I think it is important that the record be corrected, because the plaintiff in the relevant High Court case, NZYQ, could not be removed from Australia.</para>
<para>First I turn to the chronology of documents that was presented during the hearing in the High Court. This was lodged in the Sydney registry, and this chronology is very important. The plaintiff was born in Myanmar sometime between 1995 and 1997. On 17 September 2012 the plaintiff arrived in Australia by boat. On 6 July 2013 the minister made a residence determination in respect of the plaintiff. On 18 September 2014 the plaintiff was granted a bridging visa E (class WE). On 9 January 2015—this is the first date of great import—the plaintiff was arrested and charged with one count of sexual intercourse with a person aged between 10 and 14. On 16 January, seven days later, the plaintiff's bridging visa was cancelled by the government on the basis that the plaintiff had been charged with a sexual offence. The previous coalition government rightly cancelled the bridging visa. On 28 January, just 12 days later, the plaintiff pleaded guilty to the offence with which he was charged on 9 January. There were only three weeks between the commission of the offence and when the plaintiff pleaded guilty. On 31 August 2016 the plaintiff was sentenced to five years imprisonment with a non-parole period of three years and four months. On 8 May 2018 the plaintiff was released on parole. By my arithmetic, the plaintiff was released at the end on that non-parole period—or would have been released, subject to the plaintiff not having a visa. On 30 July 2020 the plaintiff's application for the protection visa was refused. On 4 March 2022, the AAT affirmed the delegate's decision to refuse to grant the plaintiff a protection visa.</para>
<para>This was going through the court system all this time. Whoever the minister was at the relevant time through all of this was unable to remove the plaintiff from this country during all of this time, and Senator Wong should know that, and now this chamber knows that. On 9 May 2022, under the current government, the plaintiff wrote to the department and requested that he be removed from Australia to another country. On 20 May 2022 the plaintiff was interviewed. On 22 August 2022 the Federal Court dismissed the plaintiff's application for judicial review of the tribunal's decision. There was no opportunity under the previous government for this plaintiff to be removed from the country—absolutely none. On 7 February 2023 the minister personally decided that he did not wish to consider intervening under section 195A or section 197AB of the act, grant a visa or make a residence determination in respect of the plaintiff.</para>
<para>No doubt that was then the trigger for the High Court case—nothing that occurred under the previous government. The relevant facts occurred under the current government, not the previous government. The red flag should have been put up on 7 February 2023 for the current government that they needed to take action. This is supported in the appellants submissions in the High Court Case. I actually read the submissions in the High Court Case, paragraph 5: 'It is in that context, as detailed in the special case, that the parties agreed,' so both the government and the plaintiff agreed:</para>
<quote><para class="block">that, as at 20 May 2023, there was no real prospect or likelihood of the Plaintiff being removed from Australia in the reasonably foreseeable future …</para></quote>
<para>Why? If you go to the transcript of the hearing on 8 May, which I also have: he is not a citizen of Myanmar; he's unable to obtain citizenship of Myanmar; he's not a citizen of any other country; he has no travel document; he is stateless. Paragraph 165 says, 'The department has never successfully removed a person who has been convicted of an offence involving sexual offending against a child to a country other than a country which recognises the person as a citizen.' The department did not have one example of having successfully removed a person who has been convicted of a sexual offence against a child from this country to a country except a country of which that person is a citizen.</para>
<para>The plaintiff in this case was not a citizen of any country. So it was impossible to remove this person. That was the whole point of this case. It was totally disingenuous of the Leader of the Government in the Senate to suggest that during the tenure of the coalition government it had in some way failed to remove this person. It was impossible to remove this person. That's why we're now in the situation we're in. It was extraordinary to read the answers in the House of Representatives during question time today when Minister Giles said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">I said yesterday that 80 such people were required to be released; a further person was released yesterday, and I have imposed similarly strict visa conditions on that person.</para></quote>
<para>But when the Leader of the Government in the Senate was asked earlier today by my colleague Senator O'Sullivan what the consequences of a breach of visa conditions would be, she did not respond to that question. Why? Because a breach of visa conditions, in all likelihood, would not lead to that person being put back in detention. That's the whole point. The people of Australia are not protected against the murderers and the sex offenders who have been released onto the streets of Australia. It is an absolute disgrace that the government was not prepared for this decision and was unable to introduce legislation into this place this week for consideration.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Royal Commission into the Robodebt Scheme, Middle East</title>
          <page.no>84</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:36</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator RICE</name>
    <name.id>155410</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Let's speak simply. Australia's social security system is a bonfire. It is a convoluted, inaccessible, rotting zombie of a system that is harming people across the country. I need to speak simply because the Labor government and many governments before it are constantly working to obscure a core truth, which is that they are not willing to help people out of poverty.</para>
<para>We saw that yesterday in the government's response to the Royal Commission into the Robodebt Scheme. The disparity between Labor's vision statements and the reality of their social security system is wild. We heard from the government that they accept all the royal commission's recommendations. We heard that they care about and believe in the value of a fair, accessible and ethical social safety net. Let me read from some of the government's response:</para>
<quote><para class="block">The social security safety net is also fundamental to our economy. The system allows Australians to get on with their lives in the understanding that support is available if circumstances change. This empowers people and helps build prosperity.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Government is committed to putting people back at the centre of program design and service delivery. The Department of Social Services and Services Australia are investing in more training for officials and will seek regular feedback on service and program delivery from front-line staff and the community.</para></quote>
<para>Let me speak simply again. The system, as it stands, does not allow Australians to get on with their lives. It only offers payments that are below the poverty line. It requires people to undertake punitive mutual obligations and use privatised employment service providers that cancel their payments at shockingly high rates.</para>
<para>The Labor government say they are committed to putting people back at the centre of income support: more staff, more training and more feedback—that's all good to hear. But I can tell you what the feedback is from the community: more money! The feedback is to raise the rate of income support above the poverty line. We heard that feedback at our Senate inquiry into the extent and nature of poverty in Australia from people living on income support, from service providers, from advocates and from academics. They all told us that the core problem in this rotting social security system is that the rates are too low and that they are trapping people in poverty.</para>
<para>Robodebt was a callous and illegal scheme, but it is not a strange anomaly. It is symptomatic of a system that keeps people in poverty and chases those same people for debts. One constituent from New South Wales has shared their experience of JobSeeker with my office, and succinctly described the problem with robodebt. He said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Robodebt was the icing on the cake, people were already traumatised by their unemployment, by the poverty, by the political and social discrimination, by being told they were bludgers when they complied with job application requirements and desperately wanted to work but couldn't get another job, by not being able to afford any kind of meaningful life, so when they received a Robodebt notice, what was there still worth living for in this country, with no hope of anything getting better, nobody actually giving a damn? Nothing.</para></quote>
<para>I'm glad the Labor government appears to be taking seriously the shame and humiliation that is built into our social security system. I welcome Minister Shorten's words that people on income support will no longer be treated as second-class citizens, but these words mean nothing if people cannot afford a meaningful life. They mean nothing if they can't afford the very basics they need to live that life. Those very basics obviously include housing. Across news outlets today we saw reporting of this year's rental affordability index. For someone on JobSeeker in Sydney, rent costs 137 per cent of their income. In Melbourne is it 100 per cent; Brisbane, 106 per cent; and Perth, 126 per cent. It is unacceptable. Our social security system and unlimited rent increases are not, as Labor say, empowering people and helping build prosperity; they are helping us to create homelessness.</para>
<para>And that's just if you're seeking a job. Never mind if you have caring responsibilities. Never mind if you live with a disability. Peter, from Victoria, contacted my office and shared his experience navigating our convoluted system while living with disability. He said:</para>
<quote><para class="block">I lost my employment in 2018 and I haven't worked since. I have injuries and chronic medical conditions which occurred after a pedestrian accident. I made numerous attempts to return to work which were unsuccessful. I was initially on the then Newstart, now called Jobseeker, before I could access the Disability Support Pension … I have lodged an NDIS application but have been unsuccessful. On a pension, which is very limited income, I cannot afford such services. For years I went without hot water as it broke down and I could not afford to replace it. The DSP is not enough. Yet Jobseeker is even lower.</para></quote>
<para>Can the Labor government see how more training, more staff and more feedback have zero impact on the lives of people like Peter? Will more training raise the rate of JobSeeker? Will more staff remove unfair restrictions on who can access payments? Will more feedback abolish mutual obligations? I'll hazard a guess that they won't. You can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear. It is simple: Labor does not have the political courage to take the action that they could: to make the political choice to end poverty.</para>
<para>The attack by Hamas on 7 October that killed 1,200 people and where 240 people were taken hostage was horrific and a war crime. I and the Greens condemn that attack. But nothing could excuse the subsequent war in Gaza and the ongoing war crimes being committed by the State of Israel. The Israeli Defence Forces have killed 11,000 Palestinians, including 4,000 children, in 38 days. This is more than were killed in Srebrenica, more than in Myanmar, more than almost two years of fighting in Ukraine.</para>
<para>Our government has condemned the first but not the second. Whereas the House and the Senate passed a motion saying we stand with Israel, condemning the attacks on Israel by Hamas as the heinous acts of terrorists, our government abstained from the United Nations resolution calling for a ceasefire. The one-sidedness is stark and reflects the active denial of 75 years of oppression of the Palestinian people and occupation of lands by the State of Israel. What has happened in the 38 days since 7 October is not self-defence, with one child killed every 10 minutes, intentional starvation of the whole population, the bombing of hospitals and bodies in the street being eaten by dogs. These are crimes of collective punishment, crimes against humanity, but, with regard to these war crimes in Gaza, all our foreign minister has been able to bring herself to do is call for 'steps' towards a ceasefire in Gaza, including 'greater restraint' from Israel towards medical facilities, and say she is 'deeply concerned' about the 'humanitarian catastrophe'—this in the face of an invasion that has led the UN special rapporteurs to say that the Palestinian people are at grave risk of genocide.</para>
<para>Australia has obligations under international law when we observe such heinous war crimes. Yet all we are seeing are weasel words along with ongoing military exports and the use of Pine Gap to direct rockets in attacks on civilians. We are complicit. We say that we stand for the rule of law and the international rules-based order. What hypocrisy! It's only when it suits the United States. Every day, this war continues takes us further away from a just and lasting peace. Every day we continue to be complicit in this war, we are trashing our commitment to international law. The Australian government must call for a ceasefire now and an end to the illegal occupation of Palestine.</para>
<para>In the time that I have left, I wish to record the names of some of the people killed in Gaza: Aisha Khalil Hamdan Al-Astal, aged 72; Wahba Abdullah Hussein Al-Astal, aged 65; Ibrahim Hamid Hussein Al-Astal, aged 62; Muhammad Suleiman Turki Al-Astal, aged 61; Nadia Yassin Hussein Al-Astal, aged 60; Salwa Muhammad Khalil Al-Astal, aged 60; Hanaa Ibrahim Naeem Al-Astal, aged 59; Suleiman Muhammad Suleiman Al-Astal, aged 58; Yousry Ahmed Youssef Al-Astal, aged 55; Shafiqa Shehada Bahri Al-Astal, aged 54; Anwar Muhammad Ali Al-Astal, aged 54— <inline font-style="italic">(Time expired)</inline></para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Middle East</title>
          <page.no>85</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:46</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator McGRATH</name>
    <name.id>217241</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Over 200 hostages are being held by Hamas. Here are their names: Eden Yerushalmi, 24; Noga Weiss, 18; her parents, Shiri Weiss, 53, and Ilan Weiss, 56; husband and wife Gad Haggai, 73, and Judy Weinstein, 70; Elia Toledano, 27; Doron Steinbrecher, 30; Soussana Amit, 40; Almog Sarusi, 26; Ada Sagi, 75; Hila Rotem Shoshani, 13, and her mother, Raaya Rotem, 54; Ofelia Roitman, 77; Noam Or, 17, his sister, Alma Or, 13, and their father, Dror Or, 48—their mother, Yonat, was murdered—and their cousin Liam Or, 18; Nili Margalit, 41, and her father, Eliyahu (Churchill) Margalit, 75; Aisha Alziedana, 17, her brother Bilal Alziedana, 21, their brother Hamza Alziedana, 22, and their father, Youssef Hamis Alziedana, 53; Sujith Nissanka, 48—a caregiver from Sri Lanka whose patient was hurt.</para>
<para>Yosef Chaim Ohana, 23; Michel Nisenbaum, 59; Tamir Nimrod, 19; Omer Neutra, 22; Yonatan Mordechai Samerano, 21; Shlomo Mansour, 85; Lobanov Alexander, 32; Andrey Kozlov, 27; Dror Kaplun, 68; Segev Kaflon, 26; Maya Goren, 56, whose husband was murdered; Itzhak Gelerenter, 53; Ori Danino, 24; Nimrod Cohen, 19; Sagi Dekel Chen, 35; Itai Chen, 19; Tal Chaimi, 42; Rom Braslavski, 19; Ziv and Gali Berman, both 26; Ariel Baruch, 35; Liat and Aviv Atzili, both 49; Tomer Ahimas, 20; and Tamir Adar, 38.</para>
<para>Gali Tarshansky, 13; Shani Goren, 29; Jimmy Gelienor Pacheco, from the Philippines; Judith Waiss, 65; Sahar Baruch, 24; Ravid Katz, 51; Emily Hand, eight; Itay Svirsky, 38; Noralin Agojo, 60, from the Philippines; Guy Iluz, 26; Yagil Yaakov, 12; Or Yaakov, 16; Meirav Tal, 53; Yair Yaakov, 59; Sasha Trupanov, 27; Irena Tatti, 73; Elena Trupanov, 50; Arye Zalmanovich, 86; Sapir Cohen, 29; Amit Buskila, 28; Romi Leshem Gonen, 23; Yotam Haim, 28; and Ofra Keidar, 70—her husband, Sami, was murdered.</para>
<para>Clemence Felix Matanga, 22, from Tanzania; Orion Hernandez Rado, 30, from Mexico; Vivian Silver, 74; Kong Salao, from Thailand; Ofir Tzarfati, 27; Bipin Joshi, 23, from Nepal; Lior Rudaeff, 61; Yagev Buchshtab, 34; his wife, Rimon Kirsht Buchshtab, 36; Idan Alexander, 19; Yair Horn, 45; his brother Eitan Horn, 37; Arbel Yahod, 28, and her husband Dolev Yahod, 35; Amit Shani, 16; Ohad Munder, nine; his mother, Keren Munder, 54; her mother, Ruth Munder, 78; Ruth's husband, Abraham Munder, 78; Samer Fuad El-Talalka, 22; Kaid Farhan Elkadi, 53; Joshua Loitu Mollel, 21; Chaim Peri, 79; Yarden Roman Gat, 35; and Elad Katzir, 47, and his mother, Hanna Katzir, 77—his father, her husband, was murdered.</para>
<para>Oded Lifshitz, 83; Amiram Cooper, 84; Ronen Engel, 55; his daughter Yuval Engel, 11; his daughter Mika Engel, 18; his wife, Carina Engel-Bert, 51; and Avigail Idan, three—both her parents were murdered. Channa Peri, 79; Nadav Popplewell, 51; Emilia Aloni, five; her mother, Daniel Aloni, 44; Yuly Konio, three; her sister, Ema Konio, three; their mother, Sharon Aloni Konio, 34; their father, David Konio, 33; Shlomi Ziv, 39; Yahel Gani Shoham, three; Nave Shoham, eight; their father, Tal Shoham, 38; their mother, Adi Shoham, 38; Noam Avigdori, 12; her mother, Sharon Avigdori, 52; Shoshan Haran, 67; Itzhk Elgarat, 69; Alexander Dancyg, 75; Inbar Haiman, 27; Omer Shem Tov, 21; Ilana Gritzewsky, 30; Tsachi Idan, 49; Elma Avraham, 84; Or Levy, 33; Guy Gilboa-Dalal, 22; Margalit Mosez, 78; her husband, Gadi, 79; Adina Moshe, 72; Tamar Metzger, 78; Yoram Metzger, her husband, 80; Noa Marciano, 19; and Roni Krivoi, 25.</para>
<para>Tal Goldstein, nine; his brother Gal, 11; his sister Agam Goldstein, 17; their mother, Chen Almog-Goldstein, 48; Daniella Gilboa, 19; Eitan Yahalomi, 12; his dad, Ohad Yahalomi, 49; Ella Elyakim, eight; her sister Dafna Elyakim, 14; Evystar David, 23; Raz Katz Asher, four; Aviv Katz Asher, two; their mother, Doron Katz Asher, 34; Alon Lulu Shamriz, 26; Maya Regev, 21; her brother Itai Regev, 18; Omri Miran, 46; Alon Ohel, 22; Hersh Goldberg-Polin, 23; Maya Leimberg, 17; her mother, Gabriela Leimberg, 59; Fernando Marman, 60; his wife, Clara Marman, 63; Bar Kuperstein, 21; Ofir Angel, 18; Eli Sharabi, 55; his brother Yossi Sharabri, 51.</para>
<para>Time has overtaken my reading of the names. Let us pray that time does not overtake the hostages, who should be coming home. I will complete reading these hostages' names for all to know them at a later date.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Protest Activity</title>
          <page.no>86</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>20:56</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator LAMBIE</name>
    <name.id>250026</name.id>
    <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>I would like to ask every Australian how they would feel if their children were afraid to go to school. How would they feel if their children were wearing raincoats on a hot day because they didn't want to be identified by their school uniform? How would they feel if their teenagers were attacked in the street because they looked a certain way? This is what has been happening to Jewish kids in Australia since the Hamas terrorist attack on 7 October. On Friday night in Melbourne a rally in support of Palestine was held in Caulfield, in the heart of Melbourne's Jewish community. This rally was held across the road from a synagogue during Shabbat. On Saturday, during observations of Remembrance Day ceremonies, similar pro-Palestinian protests were taking place through Sydney. Every Australian has a right to protest peacefully, but holding rallies that raise the temperature and spread hate is just so unacceptable, and it is so damn right un-Australian. We are a multicultural country, and it is one of our greatest strengths and something that every Australian should be proud of, but there is a much deeper thing that is happening here. I want to call it out today, and it's called racism.</para>
<para>Two weeks ago, of all things, Hitler posters started to pop up around Sydney's eastern suburbs. Swastikas appeared on walls near synagogues. There were attacks on Jewish schools, businesses and people, and they are not just happening here. They are happening all over the world. I had the opportunity to speak to a Jewish mother on Friday who had to explain to her six-year-old why there was a police van parked at the front of her school in this country. And by the way, this school already has security. How sad is that in this country? Other Jewish schools around Australia have the same thing, once again in this country. How shameful. Why do so many Australian schools, synagogues and museums need to have 24-hour security? I will tell you why: it's called antisemitism, and antisemitism has a long and horrid history that goes back thousands of years. It is the reason that Jews have been persecuted across the centuries. It's the reason that Jewish people fought so hard for a Jewish state.</para>
<para>It's also the reason why the brutal slaughter of 7 October hit Jewish people so hard, whole families being murdered in cold blood just because they are Jewish. It is a heartbreaking story, no matter who you are or where you come from. There will probably be activist that will accuse me of not caring about the deaths of innocent Palestinians. Of course, I care about that, like many other Australians. I have said it before in this place and I will say it again: Hamas does not represent or care about Palestinians. In my speech after the 7 October attacks I made it very, very clear that innocent Palestinians should also be protected. And let's be really, really clear about this: Hamas are nothing less than criminals and cowards and murderers. They are terrorists. And they not only say that they want to destroy Israel but that they want to kill all Jews. They are terrorists, and these attacks seem to be giving anti-Semitic people an excuse to attack and intimidate our Australian Jewish community. Since my speech after the attacks, I can assure you that Jewish Australians have been reaching out to me and my office sharing their family's stories, and some of these stories are harrowing.</para>
<para>I will share one with you tonight about a lovely 97-year-old Jewish grandmother who survived the horrors of a concentration camp as a young girl. She was in palliative care, and her memory was going. The nurses raised the bars around her bed. The second night they did this, this woman was found by the nurse standing at the end of her bed, ramrod straight, her arms down by her sides, repeating over and over again: 'I can work. I can work.' These are the lived experiences of many Jewish Australians, and for generations they have lived this. The trauma of their ancestors' lives is in their DNA.</para>
<para>There are Jewish and Muslim families out there that have been in Australia for well over 100 years, and often these families come here to escape persecution, to make a new life, to start a better life. They may not be in Gaza or Israel right now, but they understand what happens when good people don't stand up and speak out. It is true: good people are standing up in Australia right now. Good people are peacefully speaking about the horrible situation in Gaza. Good people are calling on language here to be calm, not to contribute to hate and to avoid raising the temperature. The people inciting hate in Caulfield, in Coogee and in other places are not heeding this call. But you must. Your community leaders must take control and seek to cool this situation down. That is your responsibility. That is why you are a leader. Start showing it. I call on those leaders to speak to their communities and discourage any action towards hatred. It is not the Australian way.</para>
<para>I'd also now like to talk about the calls for a ceasefire. A ceasefire needs arrangements from all sides of conflict. There is no point whatsoever in calling for a ceasefire when one side is intent upon wiping out the other. Hamas is calling for the destruction of Israel. While the river-to-the-sea calls are being made, a ceasefire cannot take place. Despite this, the Israeli defence force has been pausing hostilities to allow people to escape Gaza and to allow aid in. These pauses are helpful to those innocents caught in the crossfire. We are in a war. And, unfortunately, the innocents always pay the price. So, to you armchair critics calling for political solutions to an active conflict, I suggest you start paying a little bit more attention to the actions of Hamas. They are terrorists, and you cannot negotiate with terrorists.</para>
<para>We do not have the picture in front of us that the Israel defence force has in front of it, especially how and where Hamas are using innocent civilians as human shields, launching rockets from schools, mosques and hospitals, and storing weapons inside critical civilian facilities. They should pay attention to what Hamas's actions mean in international law, especially article 19 of the fourth Geneva convention.</para>
<para>While they're at it, they should have a look at what is taking place in Pakistan. Right now, Pakistan is arresting and deporting more than one million Afghan refugees. Afghans who fled the war and headed to Pakistan for safe harbour have been told they are no longer welcome there. They are being forced to leave while their homes are being bulldozed in front of them. Afghan women and children are being forced back into the arms of the Taliban terrorists, back to the men of the Taliban who don't allow Afghan girls to go to school and don't allow women to work, back to the Taliban terrorists who kidnap Afghan girls, raping them and forcing them into marriage, back to the Taliban terrorists who beheaded journalists and Western soldiers and then put it on the internet for all of us to see.</para>
<para>The same thing is happening in Lebanon to Syrian refugees. Syrian refugees have been terrorised and murdered by ISIS. Human Rights Watch has reported that deportations of Syrian refugees from Lebanon this year have been the most severe yet.</para>
<para>Police raids, arrests and deportations of people seeking refuge from war: where are the armchair critics on that? Where are you? You've gone silent. You are not calling out these terrorist groups. You are not calling out Hamas, the Taliban and ISIS. You're always saying, 'They're terrorists; they're murderers.' Why aren't these actions being called out, like those against Israel defending itself? The Israel Defense Forces are one of the most scrutinised militaries in the world, and I am confident that, if the Israel Defense Forces do anything wrong, they will be held to account; there is no doubt about that.</para>
<para>Israel has said it will not consider a ceasefire until all the hostages from 7 October have been released. In the meantime I, like many other Australians, in peace, support Israel's humanitarian pauses. I understand why they simply cannot have a ceasefire to appease the calls of the armchair critics here in Australia and in other places.</para>
<para>I want you armchair critics in Australia to know this: you are part of the problem. You are part of the problem that is going on out in our streets. Have a good think about that and have a good look at yourselves in the mirror tonight, because, seriously, I've had a gutful of you. And there are way too many of you critics out there. You know what? If you've got so much to say, I say this to you: we are absolutely screaming for people to join our defence forces. Feel free to go and sign up and do something useful with your life, once and for all.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Defence Force</title>
          <page.no>88</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>21:06</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator ROBERTS</name>
    <name.id>266524</name.id>
    <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>Tonight I'll read a letter from a constituent, a special forces veteran who chose to leave the Australian Defence Force after seeing Defence leadership callously throwing soldiers under the bus. It's a long letter, a clear and scathing indictment of Defence's supposed leaders. Here's the letter:</para>
<quote><para class="block">Dear Senator Roberts</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">On the 19th of November 2020 a certain number of SASR soldiers were accused of having a toxic culture with the release of the Brereton report.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This was a sound bite Chief of the Defence Force General Angus Campbell, AO DSC, repeated to the world. He accused Australian special forces non-commissioned officers of attempting to fuse excellence with Ego, Elitism and Entitlement.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Brereton report, written by General Campbell's subordinate, absolved successive defence force leaders of anything other than 'moral responsibility', including the CDF.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">It wasn't written in the report, but the message was loud and clear: there was another "E" in the equation. That of Exemption, Exemption for defence force senior leaders.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Inspector General Australian Defence Force investigation and media campaign was clearly endorsed by ADF leadership.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">In contrast, we have seen the lower ranks of those who served Australia in the Special Operations Task Force/Group in Afghanistan systemically abused, disempowered, marginalised and their valuable service denigrated.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Many of these men and women have since medically discharged due to poor mental health caused not only by aspects of their active service, but more damagingly, their treatment by defence and the media on returning home.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Treatment akin to that of a bygone era.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We have seen ADF leaders recuse themselves from command responsibility and the very laws and standards established after World War 2.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The Yamashita standard saw the Allies demand a Japanese General be hung for crimes committed by his soldiers.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Now, after losing our war, and in the hope of avoiding scrutiny from the International Criminal Court for their failures, it is OUR military leadership who demand their soldiers who fought under their command be punished while they refuse to accept anything other than meaningless 'moral responsibility.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">During the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, the combined total cost to the Australian taxpayer was approximately $13.5 billion.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">During that same time frame Australian soldiers fought with substandard and rented ISR, Intelligence Surveillance and Reconnaissance equipment.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">They had no integrated close air support and borrowed US helicopters.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Both Government and Defence 'procurement specialists' wasted three times the cost of both wars on failed and failing procurements.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Now, we see the failed MRH-90 Taipan helicopter procurement feature in the tragic loss of life, devastating defence families and the serving community.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We have seen veterans abandoned by defence and given no choice but to defend themselves in court without financial, legal, moral, or any other form of support from the same leaders they once served.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This situation demonstrates complete disregard for those who loyally fought the wars of our generation and of the families who supported them.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This ongoing treatment by defence leadership is yet another failure in their duty of care to the people they proclaim to value.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Leadership then took their disregard a step further giving tacit approval to journalists by failing to correct the lies and fabrications they published.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We saw the CDF and his service chiefs demand that senators' questions in relation to the failure of the MRH90 helicopter be considered and respectful due to the families impacted by loss.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This is a stance in complete contradiction to his grandstanding on the release of the Brereton Report, an uncaring act ignorant of the thousands of families impacted, and without consideration of the accuracy of the unproven and untested allegations, or of jurisprudence.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We saw a victim falsely labelled a perpetrator by the cold and dispassionate Royal Australian Airforce chief.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">When offered the chance to set right the incorrect and damaging slur, the chief instead doubled down on his untrue statement with impunity.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This further damages all victims in defence, while simultaneously highlighting to Australia the class distinction between an out of touch but untouchable leadership, and those they supposedly lead.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">We have seen defence leadership use national security as an excuse to cover their lies, mistruths, and omissions.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">And we have seen how the same leaders hide behind the 'in consideration of the impact on families' excuse, selfishly treating grieving families as human shields to protect their reputations.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">These families are strong families, they have supported loved ones through their years of service to this country, they don't need protection, they need the truth.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">And now, we have seen elected senators voicing the concerns of their constituents and veterans, be labelled as divisive and bullied by the leader of Australia's Military.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">If a lower ranked service member had publicly acted in the same way the CDF did at Senate Estimates, they would likely be charged with prejudicial conduct.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">If the civilian overseers, the elected senators responsible for scrutinising defence force activities and spending, are not immune from the wrath of our Defence force leaders, is there anyone in Canberra able to hold them to account?</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">People do not leave bad jobs; they leave bad bosses. Defence has been pushing woke agendas to appease minorities leading to so many poorly conceived and implemented reforms.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Furthermore, due to the defence leadership's damaging use of the media to denigrate its veterans whilst recusing themselves, they have sidelined and denigrated ADF's best assets, its people, and they are leaving in droves.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This devastating recruitment and retention crisis is weakening Australia's defence capability and national security, the very thing our leaders say they are protecting.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">This exodus of people from the ADF creates a vacuum that will take years to replace. These men and women are patriots; they are not leaving defence due to the promise of better-paid jobs.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">They are leaving because they are not valued and because of the incompetence, failures, double standards, blame-shifting, and lack of support from defence leaders.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">What has been the leadership's answer to the current recruitment and retention crisis?</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">To appoint yet another general to investigate why those who did, and those who normally would serve our great nation, no longer wish to do so.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">It's a weak, box-ticking exercise to avoid leadership accountability and fails to resolve the issues.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">To Defence leadership, I say, if your medals are so important to you, keep them, and take ours back; there are more pressing items on the agenda.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Over two decades, incompetence in a Defence hierarchy more intent on accolades, awards, and power, has mismanaged Australia's defence force into its weakest ever position, and done so at a time when the world is in its most volatile and dangerous state since World War 2.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">These leaders leave us poorly defended, and solely reliant on another nation with a dubious track record for supporting its allies in war.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Those of us who have been to war, who have been 'in action', don't relish another one, especially one fought at home, that require our children to fight.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">On releasing the IGADF Brereton report into war crimes allegations, Angus Campbell was reporting as saying, "We are a nation that stands up when something goes wrong and deals with it and that is what I intend to do."</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Well, as a concerned special forces veteran and father of Australian sons, this is me standing up, hoping someone in government will deal with this crisis.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Or am I right with the final E? Exemption: Are our Defence Force leaders truly exempt from their failures and above international and domestic laws?</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">The sorely needed Royal Commission into veteran suicides is a direct reflection of the poor leadership that has mismanaged defence over decades.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">A Royal Commission into ADF leadership, specifically the failures in leadership during the Afghanistan war, and subsequent to it, is now imperative to ensure the same failures are not repeated. The Government fails the nation if it does not.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Signed: A concerned father and ADF Veteran.</para></quote>
<quote><para class="block">Name and address supplied.</para></quote>
<para>Anyone who hears the letter I just read into the Senate <inline font-style="italic">Hansard</inline> record will understand why many soldiers, veterans and senators, including me, have called for the Chief of the Defence Force, General Angus Campbell, to be fired. There are too many examples of hypocrisy, failure and incompetence from Defence leadership to list them all in one letter or one speech. Get rid of every single general who isn't completely focused on making sure our Defence Force is as capable and lethal as possible. The safety and sovereignty of the entire nation require it.</para>
<para>The state of the Defence Force is the fault of many successive governments and shiny generals, yet the responsibility for the current state of Defence must lie with the current head of the organisation, and that is General Angus Campbell. The Defence Force is going backwards—literally, when it comes to headcount—and the Special Air Service Regiment is facing an unprecedented capability crisis. One Nation believes warriors should be welcome in our military. We don't need to spend time making sure drones are gender neutral. How about we just buy enough drones to defend ourselves? Spend money on ammo for our defence personnel to train with, not more gender advisers. Give medals to the heroes who show bravery in combat, not the bureaucrats who sit in air conditioning and shine their arse for half the war. The safety and sovereignty of our entire nation require that our ADF, the Australian Defence Force, starting at the top, tell the truth and be held accountable.</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1><subdebate.1><subdebateinfo>
          <title>Jewish Community</title>
          <page.no>90</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo><speech>
  <talker>
    <time.stamp>21:17</time.stamp>
    <name role="metadata">Senator HENDERSON</name>
    <name.id>ZN4</name.id>
    <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
  </talker>
  <para>It is more than a month since Hamas terrorists brutally attacked innocent Israelis. Since this time, with no end in sight to this horrific conflict, we have seen an alarming rise in antisemitism here in Australia and around the globe. This is causing deep, deep fear amongst Jewish Australians, including school students who don't feel safe walking to school and university students who hide in the shadows on campus and dare not display symbols of their faith. Whether it's on hateful signs, appalling chants at protests, families in fear of sending their kids to school or shocking attacks on businesses, all Australians must stand up to this abhorrent antisemitism.</para>
<para>This morning, I attended the Bring Them Home rally outside Parliament House in Canberra. On display were the details of 239 men, women and children taken hostage by Hamas, their names and faces, empty prams and empty shoes. I thank the group United with Israel and those Jewish Australians who gathered to share their stories. They included a group of Jewish university students from the Australian National University here in Canberra, who spoke about how they feel unsupported and frightened.</para>
<para>I raise particular concerns about Jewish students because they are the ones being targeted, particularly at universities. One student told me he had been verbally abused and even spat on in recent weeks. He said he felt that university administrators and the student union were not taking proactive measures to protect those of Jewish faith. Another student told me she would rather stay at home than head to classes. This is happening in our country, and it is devastating. Every Australian, including those of Jewish faith, has the right to feel safe in their own country.</para>
<para>Despite the assurances I have received from the Minister for Education and Universities Australia, not enough is being done to guarantee the safety of Jewish students at Australian universities. Tomorrow at Melbourne university, students and staff are holding a pro-Palestine protest calling on the university to cut its ties with the US defence company Lockheed Martin and rescind the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance definition of 'antisemitism', which protesters claim is being used punitively to suppress political activism. So what measures is the university delivering to keep Jewish students safe tomorrow? Why would any Jewish student risk attending a lecture at Melbourne uni?</para>
<para>Next week, a group called Free Palestine Melbourne is encouraging a Melbourne-wide school walkout. The Albanese government must act to ensure that no school participates in next week's proposed school strike for Palestine. Students must not be used as political pawns by any group. Our kids need to be in school. This protest not only is completely unacceptable but risks heightening antisemitic behaviour across communities. That's why I called on Minister Clare to ensure that no school participates and also asked the minister to obtain such assurances from state and territory education ministers.</para>
<para>I am pleased to say that Minister Clare has made it clear that he opposes this school strike, but I am horrified that the Victorian Premier, Jacinta Allan, has defended this planned school walkout in support of Palestine. This extreme-left-wing premier, just like her predecessor, Daniel Andrews, has defended the so-called democratic rights of students to come together and hold this rally, which is a disgrace. This puts Victorian schoolchildren, arguably, in danger. I believe this Premier has shown a flagrant disregard for the safety and welfare of these children and demonstrates that she is not up to the job. I also condemn the Greens statement, the statement from Senator Allman-Payne, which has called on the Minister for Education, Jason Clare, to retract his comments, and I'm not going to dignify those comments by making any further reference to them.</para>
<para>I make the coalition's position crystal clear: we stand resolutely with Israel and its right to defend itself from the ongoing terrorist attacks by Hamas, Hezbollah and their supporters in Iran and elsewhere. The Albanese Labor government needs to live up to the commitments it made in supporting the bipartisan motion on 16 October in Australia's parliament, which unequivocally backed Israel's inherent right to defend itself and called for the hostages to be released. The Albanese government needs to explain how it is upholding those commitments when it fails to lay the blame for Palestinian deaths at the feet of Hamas terrorists using civilians and civilian infrastructure as human shields. While the loss of any innocent life is a tragedy, there is no moral equivalence between the deliberate targeting of innocent civilians by Hamas and Israeli actions to disable the terrorist organisation Hamas.</para>
<para>I refer to the terrible protest that occurred outside the synagogue in Melbourne last Friday night, in Caulfield. These types of scenes are abhorrent in our country, and I raise serious concerns that some in this place have not condemned this protest for what it was: an abhorrent act of antisemitism. As I say, the safety of all Australians is paramount. Many Jewish Australians have not ever witnessed or experienced the type of antisemitism which is now happening in our country. The Albanese government should not mince its words. It should condemn antisemitism when it occurs without qualification and without drawing any equivalency by suggesting, as occurred with the Caulfield protest, that there should be no Islamophobia, when clearly there was no Islamophobia on display outside the synagogue in Caulfield.</para>
<para>I say to Victorian school students: please don't allow yourselves to be used as pawns by those who seek to drag you into this terrible protest that's planned for next week. I say to the Victorian Premier: please retract the comments that you have made to safeguard the security and safety of all school students in Melbourne.</para>
<para>Senat e adjourned at 21:25</para>
</speech>
</subdebate.1></debate>
  </chamber.xscript>
</hansard>