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<hansard noNamespaceSchemaLocation="../../hansard.xsd" version="2.2">
  <session.header>
    <date>2026-09-15</date>
    <parliament.no>3</parliament.no>
    <session.no>1</session.no>
    <period.no>0</period.no>
    <chamber>Senate</chamber>
    <page.no>0</page.no>
    <proof>1</proof>
  </session.header>
  <chamber.xscript>
    <business.start>
      <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
        <p class="HPS-SODJobDate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
          <span class="HPS-SODJobDate">
            <span style="font-weight:bold;" />
            <a href="Chamber" type="">Tuesday, 15 September 2026</a>
          </span>
        </p>
        <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
          <span class="HPS-Normal">
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">The PRESIDENT (Senator </span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">the Hon. </span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">Sue Lines</span>
            <span style="font-weight:bold;">)</span> took the chair at 12:00, made an acknowledgement of country and read prayers.</span>
        </p>
      </body>
    </business.start>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>1</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Tabling</title>
          <page.no>1</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Tabling</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Clerk:</span>  I table documents pursuant to statute and a return to order as listed on the Dynamic Red.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-style:italic;">
                </span>
                <span style="font-style:italic;">Full details of the documents are recorded in the </span>Journals of the Senate<span style="font-style:italic;">.</span></span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>1</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">COMMITTEES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Meeting</title>
          <page.no>1</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Meeting</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Clerk:</span>  Proposals to meet have been lodged as follows:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">Joint Select Committee on Artificial Intelligence—16 September 2026</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">Joint Standing Committee on Trade and Investment Growth—16 September 2026</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>1</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Department of the Treasury</title>
          <page.no>1</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Department of the Treasury</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>1</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>1</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ayres, Sen Tim</name>
                <name.id>16913</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="16913" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator AYRES</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Industry and Innovation and Minister for Science</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:02</span>):  As I indicated the last time I appeared on a Tuesday afternoon in relation to order for production of documents No. 27, the government has complied with that order. I've advised the Senate that the minister made a valid claim of public interest immunity over documents in the scope of the order. That claim was made because they directly related to the deliberations of cabinet. I am in the sober position of reporting to the Senate that that position has not altered in any way. It cannot alter because it would be inconsistent with the approach that this government, previous governments and governments in other Westminster jurisdictions around the world have taken.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Releasing documents that relate to the deliberations of cabinet is prohibited for all of the reasons that have been set out over the centuries in the approach of democratic Westminster governments. Senator Bragg knows that. The senators who voted for this regular appearance know that. Yet it persists because it's just about partisan politics. It's widely accepted that the deliberations of cabinet should be conducted in private to preserve the freedom of deliberation of those bodies.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I understand that the Liberals, the Nationals and One Nation are opposed to the five per cent deposit scheme. I understand that position. You may be opposed to the fact that 270,000 Australians, mostly young Australians, have gotten into homeownership with the support of the Albanese government. I understand that position. I don't think it's a credible position. I don't think it's a position that mainstream Australians would support, but it's one of the many positions that the Liberals, the Nationals and One Nation hold that are out of step with mainstream Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I understand that the Liberals, the Nationals and One Nation are opposed to the government building social and affordable homes. Senator Bragg and his colleagues are opposed to the mechanism that the government is using to finance those positions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256063" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Bragg:</span>
                    </a>  We just want the modelling. We want the modelling. It's not a secret document.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="16913" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator AYRES:</span>
                    </a>  Senator Bragg sings out that he wants the modelling. I just indicated the modelling, as you well know, drove the cabinet deliberations, and it will not be released, because it should not be released, no matter how many times I have to turn up here to endure these 30 minutes of dishonest propositions about housing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">You can argue the pros and cons of the five per cent deposit scheme with the 270,000 Australian families that now have a home. You can argue it with 50,000 key workers—teachers, nurses, childcare workers, carers, defence personnel, firefighters and police officers—who are now proud homeowners. You can pursue it in estimates hearings, in the media, in the chamber or however you like. We are going to continue with the job of supporting those Australians to find their way into homeownership. We're going to continue with the job of building houses in Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Every renter in the country now has stronger renters' rights, 270,000 Australians now have five per cent deposits, home building is turning around despite pressures on the home-building sector, and our commitment to 55,000 social and affordable homes is gaining pace. There are over 7,000 completed, with over 22,000 in planning and construction. Our approach keeps building and building. Perhaps you ought to pick up a toolbox yourself and have a crack.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="30484" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The DEPUTY PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  Are you finished, Minister?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="16913" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator AYRES:</span>
                    </a>  I'm prevented from continuing.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>1</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Bragg, Sen Andrew</name>
                  <name.id>256063</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>1</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Ayres, Sen Tim</name>
                  <name.id>16913</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>2</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade (The DEPUTY PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>30484</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>2</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Ayres, Sen Tim</name>
                  <name.id>16913</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>2</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Cash, Sen Michaelia</name>
                <name.id>I0M</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="I0M" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CASH</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:07</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the Minister's explanation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">And what an explanation it was! It doesn't matter what this minister says. He can huff and puff all he likes. He can say, 'Transparency is now apparently partisan politics.' That's right, Australia. The opposition came here on your behalf, asking for modelling in relation to changes that this government has made, and, apparently, our asking for transparency is 'partisan politics'. This is coming from a government that went to the 2022 election saying that, if they were elected, Australians—guess what?—would see transparency like no other.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Guess what? Sadly, Australians are seeing transparency like no other. In other words, they are not seeing any transparency coming out of this government. Produce the documents. How hard is it for this minister to produce documents? I have to say, for those of you who are only tuning in to this debate for the first time, you would think, based on that performance by the minister, that this was the first time that the Senate had actually voted to compel the minister to produce the documents that the Senate had asked for. Well, you'd be wrong, because—guess what?—the Senate actually made this order asking the minister to produce documents over 12 months ago, on 24 July 2025. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">All we are asking for on behalf of the Australian people is the Treasury advice relating to Labor's $10 billion housing commitment and its decision to allow first home buyers to purchase with a five per cent deposit. Those first home buyers—the ones purchasing with a five per cent deposit—are also, sadly, the poor people in this country who, on a daily basis, we read, are going into negative equity.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">But it doesn't stop there. The minister and this government failed to comply, so what did the Senate do—as we are entitled to? It's not about playing partisan politics. It is about the Senate doing what the Senate is required to do. We voted to compel the minister to come before the Senate and provide an explanation. Guess what? That was in November 2025. Do you know what the minister did? He did produce some documents, and there was almost no part of one document that was not redacted. For those of you who don't know what 'redacted' means, it means you produce a document and then you just cross it all out in black and say: 'There you go. We have complied with the resolution of the Senate.' Again, that is not compliant. What it is is a lack of transparency. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The Senate has since come together and passed further motions to compel this minister to produce the documents: November 2025, March 2026, April 2026, June 2026. Now, because of this government's failure to be transparent and to comply with the will of the Australian Senate, we are in this extraordinary situation where, every Tuesday, this minister has to front the Senate and explain why the Albanese government continues to defy the order of the Senate. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Apparently, though—according to Senator Ayres—it's the opposition who are the problem. This is what he said last week. He called this process—the process of the opposition, on behalf of the Australian people, requiring transparency from the government—'yet another abuse of the Senate's time and the Senate's processes'. Previously, in another explanation, he called it 'a wilful and puerile use of Senate processes'. That's right, Australia. The Albanese government's ministers seem to think that the opposition asking questions on your behalf, and asking them to produce modelling that is actually affecting you, is a 'wilful and puerile' use of Senate processes. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Senator Ayres has also accused senators of having 'no respect for the institution'. Senator Ayres, you probably want to look in the mirror. He told Senator Bragg last time, 'Sit down, son', and he dismissed those scrutinising the policy—I kid you not—as 'spivs'. That's the Albanese government minister responding to the right of opposition senators to demand transparency. Guess what, Australia? The next time we sit on a Tuesday, we'll be back here again and we'll hold this government to account. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>2</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen Barbara</name>
                <name.id>BFQ</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="BFQ" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BARBARA POCOCK</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:12</span>):  I also rise to take note of Minister Ayres's response on behalf of the Minister for Housing. The minister has an order for the production of documents and comes here yet again this morning hiding behind public interest immunity, failing to come clean with the workings which underpin a significant part of Labor's policy—an inadequate policy, an inadequate response to our housing crisis. Last week, last time we were here, we were told it was 'wilful and puerile'. This morning, today, he says he's forced to listen to 'dishonest propositions about housing'. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This is the biggest crisis facing our country. Many thousands of Australians are living in cars or under bridges. They can't get into housing. A third of them rent properties which are unaffordable. They're in deep crisis and unable to pay for the groceries they need, and yet the minister comes here this morning and talks about 'dishonest propositions around housing'. Labor's five per cent deposit scheme deserves to have its full workings put before us so we can understand why and how it came about. We also need to better understand its implications into the future, because we are in a housing crisis like we've never seen before in living memory—no-one can deny it—and we know we need action. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We need action that goes beyond a five per cent deposit scheme that has driven prices up and increased the risk of high levels of debt for people very early in their working lives. We've seen renters across Australia, without the action that we need, hit with a 23 per cent rent increase over the past five years, while real wages under Labor have fallen by five per cent. Renters are being absolutely smashed by unlimited rent increases, and the weekly shop just keeps going up and up. The minister referred to the increased protections for renters that his government has delivered. He has not supported renters. His government has failed renters across our country.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I've talked to renters from Perth to Melbourne—across the nation. They are battling. They are battling levels of rent that place them in really significant crises in their households and in those families. Of those receiving working-age income support payments, 97 per cent renting privately are in housing stress by any definition. This is completely unacceptable. And the minister boasts about his government's achievements for renters. What a bizarre set of statements! More than half of those renters are paying over 50 per cent of their income in rent, significantly above the 30 per cent threshold for housing stress. In a wealthy country like ours, women and kids should not be sleeping in cars because of a failure of government to deliver a decent housing policy and to come clean to this Senate with the workings behind their housing policies.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Our so-called affordable housing system is anything but. 'Affordable housing' is a scam. It has definitions that benefit developers, and they are diverse definitions across our country. When so-called affordable housing is set at the market rate in a housing crisis where housing prices have increased by 400 per cent in the past three decades—that is not affordable by anyone's definition. Tying household affordability to market rates when they're out of control is ridiculous. It is wrong and it's disadvantaging millions of Australians. And, after the 25-year subsidy period ends for those so-called affordable housings, these so-called homes of affordability will transition back to market housing. Fake affordable housing built by private property developers is not going to solve the housing crisis. We need public housing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Where are the propositions coming forward from Labor? They are not there. Instead, today we celebrate the five-year anniversary of the most massively poorly structured spend in AUKUS, which is going to cost billions of dollars, and we cannot fix a housing crisis for the millions of Australians seeking a roof over their heads. The government's primary funding vehicle for social and affordable housing, the HAFF, is failing. It's too slow. It's too small. It's too complicated. We need real solutions from Labor, and we need our state governments—Labor in Melbourne and in Sydney—to stop knocking down public housing and come forward to this Senate, to this parliament, with solutions that will actually deliver for those many families who are living in serious stress that is shaping the lives of so many kids into the future.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>If you haven't got a roof over your head, it's really hard to hold down a job. It's really hard to get access to the health and education that you know you and your family need. We need to see a minister who comes to this chamber and tells us about their policies, shows us the workings and delivers on a policy that really assists those Australians in severe crisis. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>3</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
                <name.id>319142</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ON</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="319142" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BELL</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">One Nation Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:17</span>):  I rise to take note of the minister's explanation. Let me start off by saying that we're no longer dealing with one housing crisis in this country. We're dealing with four, because Australians are struggling to buy; renters are now being smashed by higher rent; recent buyers are now carrying huge mortgages, and, in growing numbers, they're watching their equity disappear; and now the pipeline of new homes we desperately need is collapsing. Housing Industry Association data released just this morning shows new-home sales in Victoria have fallen 27 per cent. Across Australia, they fell 10 per cent in August and almost 20 per cent over winter, and the HIA says that means fewer homes will be started next year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">So, when the Senate asks for more information in regard to the Labor government's five per cent deposit scheme and continues to get back documents that are heavily redacted and insufficient, then we have every right—in fact, we have an obligation on behalf of the Australian people—to continue to insist that they comply. We need to understand what it is that is at the heart of these terrible failures from this government that is so dramatically hurting the Australian people in the housing market—hurting renters and driving up prices—because that is where the Labor government's housing policy has got us. We're at the point where Labor has managed to fail Australians at every point in the housing market. This is why the documents the Senate has ordered are so important.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor's answer to unaffordable housing has been to let first home buyers enter the market with a deposit as small as five per cent. It seems that that is not making houses cheaper. It's not leading to more houses being built. It's simply allowed a buyer to take on a larger mortgage with a much thinner equity buffer. That matters a lot more now than it did when Labor was selling the scheme, because interest rates are going up and they're going to continue to go up. I think we are staring down the barrel of a couple more interest rate rises this year. The pain and suffering that's going to inflict on a lot of people who Labor claim to be helping is, I think, hard to measure at this stage. So we need to see the modelling. We need to see the detail behind this scheme to make sure that, when these problems that do arise are hurtling towards us like a steam train, we know how to deal with them. But Labor continues to hide this information from the Senate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">More analysis, from Cotality this time, shows that around one-third of homes bought since August last year are now valued below their purchase price. Aussie Home Loans say that 20.7 per cent of Australians who bought since July 2023 now have less than 20 per cent equity in their home, and the average mortgage is around $646,000. These are not people sitting on enormous gains built up over decades. These are recent buyers, many of them exactly the sorts of people Labor said they were helping. Well, it doesn't look like you're helping. It looks like you are pushing them towards more pain, more suffering, higher mortgages, less money for the groceries and less money for their future. Some are finding it harder to refinance because they now simply don't have enough equity. They are in what is termed a 'mortgage prison'—that is where the term 'mortgage prison' comes from. If you go into a home with a five per cent deposit, you have very little room for prices to move against you. A modest fall can wipe out that buffer, but the debt is still there and the repayments are still there. What did Treasury tell government about that risk? I think the Senate has every right to know. Did it model falling prices? Did it model refinancing problems for highly leveraged buyers? Did it look at what happens when rising repayments and falling values hit at the same time? If that work was done, why does Labor still refuse to release it?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This scheme goes to the heart of the mistakes that Labor keeps making on housing. It keeps treating a housing shortage as though it's a finance problem. Australian doesn't have too few mortgages. Australia has too few homes and too many migrants, and today's figures show that problem is getting worse. Yet Labor spent years driving demand higher through record migration while failing to get enough homes built. It has pushed more people into the market without fixing the shortages underneath it. Then it tries to paper over the problem—and then, when we ask to see the information behind your decisions, you refuse to hand it over, and now we're seeing the results. People still trying to buy face huge prices, renters are still paying enormous rents, recent buyers are now trapped with large debts and shrinking equity, and the supply pipeline is weakening—four crises all at the same time, and Labor needs to own every one of them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">There are other ways to deal with this. One Nation's approach is to deal with the cause: get migration back to sustainable levels, take pressure off demand and work on getting the cost of building down. But ultimately this government should release the documents and explain exactly what advice it received before encouraging more first home buyers to take on this risk.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>4</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Bragg, Sen Andrew</name>
                <name.id>256063</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256063" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BRAGG</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:22</span>):  In taking note of this ridiculous explanation, if you could call it that, I again remind the Senate that the government has actually produced extensive amounts of modelling; it's just that it's been redacted. The Treasury was commissioned by this government as an afterthought—after it announced its radical restructuring of the five per cent deposit scheme, where it abolished the place caps and abolished means testing—to do this modelling, and that basic modelling should be made available to the Australian public for their inspection. It is not a secret cabinet document; it is the modelling which may underpin a cabinet judgement, but it is the modelling which proves that the government knew that there were risks in unbundling this scheme from its means testing and its place caps. For the minister to come in here week in, week out and say, 'We're not going to give you the modelling; we're going to trample over the powers of the Senate,' shows their disdain for democracy and it shows their disdain for the process and operation of this parliament. It is not true to claim that modelling which underpins a cabinet judgement is a cabinet document. It is not true and the minister needs to go back to school and learn a few things.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We are fortunate to live in a country where we can also try and get the information through the FOI process, as established by the Fraser government. The Information Commissioner is currently reviewing this case, and I'm sure when it gets to it—because it's backlogged with all the other cases—it will find that this document should be produced for public inspection. So we won't give up on that, because, if we gave up on the task of trying to get information which is germane to policy judgements, when they go wrong, as they have here, we would be giving up on our jobs as representatives, and we shouldn't waste taxpayer funds to come to this Bush Capital to do that work.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The problem here is that the government is afraid that they will be embarrassed, but they won't be embarrassed, because they will be seen as doing the right thing by the Australian people by being transparent. They campaigned on the promise that they would be transparent, but the Centre for Public Integrity says they are the most secretive government since the Keating government, as judged by their record on responding to Senate orders and by their record on responding to freedom of information requests. I say to the government again that you are adults and that you are responsible people. You've been elected by the Australian people. Do the right thing and provide the information that has been ordered, not by the Liberal Party and not by the National Party but by this crossbench and the opposition. That is a reasonable cross-section of this parliament, which you should pay respect to, not because of who we are but because of who we represent in the Australian society.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The five per cent deposit scheme has been a massive failure, because we know that the modelling that was done, even though it's been covered up, couldn't have been right, because the Prime Minister's claim that it would push up prices by 0.6 per cent over six years was thrown out in the first six months of the scheme's operation, where we saw a 6 per cent increase in entry level house prices. So we know it's wrong, but, of course, this government has got everything wrong in housing. Their Housing Australia Future Fund has had three years, has had 10 billion bucks and has built about 1,000 houses, half of which it has bought, not built. Who could believe the government's housing scheme would buy as many houses as it's actually built itself?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Then we have these taxes, which have made a bad situation much worse. We have a new system of taxation where we have higher rents, fewer first home buyers and fewer houses. For a government which has collapsed housing supply by 30,000 houses each year compared to the last government, should we be surprised that they have a budget which designs deliberately to suppress supply by another 35,000? The answer is no. This government has a deliberate policy to reduce housing supply. Because of that, we now see fewer houses, we see higher rents, and we see fewer home loans. Last week we heard in the Senate committee that the National Australia Bank has seen a 15 per cent reduction in home loans going to owner-occupiers. You have to ask yourself: who wins from these new taxes? It's not renters, it's not homeowners, and it's not investors. It's no-one. No-one wins from high taxes, just like very few people win from the five per cent deposit scheme, which has pushed up prices for people who can least afford it. And you can bet London to a brick that no-one has won from this housing future fund, which has spent 10 billion bucks to build only 1,000 houses over two years. We will never give up on trying to get to the bottom of these things, because you are wasting taxpayer funds, you are wasting public resources, and the Australian people won't stand for it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>5</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BILLS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Wage Justice for Early Childhood Education and Care Workers (Special Account) (Extending Support and Strengthening Safety) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>5</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7529" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Wage Justice for Early Childhood Education and Care Workers (Special Account) (Extending Support and Strengthening Safety) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>In Committee</title>
            <page.no>5</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">In Committee</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Consideration resumed.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>5</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade (The CHAIR)</name>
                <name.id>30484</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="30484" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The CHAIR</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Time">12:28</span>):  The committee is considering the Wage Justice for Early Childhood Education and Care Workers (Special Account) (Extending Support and Strengthening Safety) Bill 2026 and the deferred division on the amendment moved by Senator O'Sullivan on sheet 4098. The question is the amendment on sheet 4098 be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The committee divided. [12:33]<br />(The Chair—Senator Brockman)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>25</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>36</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>7</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived. <br />Bill agreed to.<br />Bill reported without amendment; report adopted. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Third Reading</title>
            <page.no>6</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Third Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>6</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
                <name.id>ING</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="ING" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator GALLAGHER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Finance, Minister for the Public Service, Minister for Women, Minister for Government Services and Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:37</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a third time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill read a third time.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>6</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7434" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>6</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Second Reading</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Consideration resumed of the motion:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a second time.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>6</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Brown, Sen Carol</name>
                <name.id>F49</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="F49" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CAROL BROWN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:38</span>):  I rise to support the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026. Australians can compare the prices of flights, hotel rooms or household appliances in a matter of minutes, but, when a GP refers someone to a specialist, finding out what that care is likely to cost can be harder. That is not a small problem. In 2024-25, more than 800,000 Australians delayed or missed specialist care because of cost. A 2025 Grattan Institute report found that average out-of-pocket costs for specialist attendance had risen by 73 per cent in real terms since 2010, with the average out-of-pocket costs for those who paid a bill reaching $300 in 2023. When somebody is worried about their health, they should not always have to navigate a system where the price is unclear until the bill arrives. That's what this bill is about—more information, more transparency and more protection for consumers.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Schedule 1 deals with transparency. The Medical Costs Finder was supposed to help Australians understand the likely costs of specialist care, but the voluntary model simply did not work. The former government spent $24 million establishing the website. By the end of 2022, of around 6,300 eligible specialists in the 11 specialist specialities included at the time, just six doctors had chosen to display their fee information. Even three years later, only around 88 doctors were voluntarily displaying their fees. This is not meaningful transparency. This bill fixes that problem by allowing information already held by government through Medicare, hospitals and private health insurers to be published through the Medical Costs Finder. That can include information about individual medical practitioners, the fees they charge, where they practice, relevant Medicare benefits, and the likely out-of-pocket costs for patients. Importantly, medical practitioners will not have to manually upload this information. The system will draw on administrative data already collected. Equally importantly, patient privacy is protected. No patient information will be published.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The principle here is straightforward. If people are expected to make choices about their health care, they need useful information on which to base these choices. Fees can vary significantly between specialists, between practitioners and between locations. For a Tasmanian considering specialist treatment, being able to see where a practitioner works, what they generally charge and what the likely gap might be gives them a clearer indication of the costs before they make that decision. It will not make every specialist consultation cheap, but it gives patients information they have not had before, and that gives them more power to ask questions, compare options and make an informed decision.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Schedule 2 deals with another consumer issue, product phoenixing in private health insurance. Product phoenixing is where an insurer closes an existing product and then opens an identical or very similar product at a higher premium or makes changes that reduce the value of the cover without the normal level of ministerial scrutiny. People who pay for private health insurance are entitled to confidence that the product that they are buying represents fair value and that the rules cannot simply be worked around. This bill closes that loophole. Private health insurers will be required to seek ministerial approval for premiums on proposed new products and, where certain changes are made to existing products that reduce cover, benefits or the value of terms and conditions. In other words, an insurer should not be able to avoid scrutiny simply by giving essentially the same product a new name or reshaping it in a way that leaves consumers worse off. The bill also puts the annual premium approval process on a clearer legislative footing. These measures have been welcomed by consumer organisations, and both the Australian Medical Association and Private Healthcare Australia have supported the broad direction of the legislation. This is another part of the Albanese Labor government's broader work to make health care more affordable, accessible and fair. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">For Labor, health is not an optional extra. It's one of the central responsibilities of government. We built Medicare, and we are strengthening it. We have made the biggest investment in Medicare in its history. We have expanded bulk-billing incentives. We have established Medicare urgent care clinics so Australians can receive fully bulk-billed urgent care without having to go to a hospital emergency department. We have also delivered the largest cut to the maximum cost of a general PBS script in the history of the scheme. The maximum price has fallen from $42.50 in 2022 to $25, while the concessional co-payment is frozen at $7.70 until 2030. These things matter because health is also a cost-of-living issue. A family budget does not distinguish between the grocery bills, the power bill, the cost of a prescription and the cost of seeing a doctor or specialist. They all come out of the same household income. That is why our approach to health has been practical: make GP care more affordable, make medicines cheaper, provide more free urgent care, strengthen Medicare, and, through this bill, make sure people have better information about specialist costs and stronger protections when they pay for private health insurance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Medicare remains the foundation of our health system, but many Australians also use private health insurance and private specialist care, and they deserve a system that is clear and fair. Strengthening Medicare is not only about what happens when somebody walks into a GP clinic. It's also about making the wider health system easier to navigate and ensuring patients are treated with respect when they move between primary care, specialist care, hospitals and private insurance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This bill delivers two election commitments: it delivers greater transparency on patient medical fees, and it outlaws product phoenixing. Both changes put consumers in a stronger position. Australians should be able to know more about what their care is likely to cost before they receive the bill, they should be able to compare their options, and people paying for private health insurance should know that insurers cannot sidestep the normal scrutiny of premium changes by repackaging products. This is practical health reform. It is about transparency, affordability and fairness. It's another step in the Albanese Labor government's work to strengthen Medicare and make our health system work better for Australians. I commend the bill to the Senate.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>7</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:46</span>):  I too rise to speak on the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026. Let me say right from the outset that the coalition absolutely supports transparency in health care. We support it because we believe in it and because we built the very tool this bill is seeking to expand. It was the coalition that established the Medical Costs Finder back in 2019 so Australians could go online and get a sense of what they might pay before they walked into a specialist room. So, when the government says it wants more transparency for patients, it will find no argument from us on that principle. The coalition will not oppose this bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">But supporting transparency in principle is not the same as accepting that this bill, as drafted, gets it entirely right, because it doesn't. And we are not alone in saying so. The committee heard it, the Senate Standing Committee for the Scrutiny of Bills flagged it, and stakeholders have raised it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Let's be clear about why this matters to ordinary Australians. Out-of-pocket costs in this country have reached record highs. For a visit to a medical specialist, just 28 per cent of services are bulk-billed and the average out-of-pocket cost is more than $123. For anaesthetics, fewer than nine per cent are bulk-billed and the average gap is almost $245.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It gets worse. Research by Redbridge found that around 30 per cent of Australians referred to a specialist over the past three years did not go, because they were worried about what it was going to cost them. Think about that. Almost a third of people told by their own GP that they needed to see a specialist decided that they could not afford to find out what was wrong with them. That is the human cost of a system where prices are hidden and costs keep climbing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">And the variation is extraordinary. Data from Cleanbill shows that, in the very same local area, GP fees can vary by up to 133 per cent and dermatologist fees by up to 93 per cent—the same suburb, the same service and the patient has no way of knowing whether they are paying a fair price or twice the going rate. So, yes, transparency can help but only if it is done properly.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">If you're going to put prices in front of patients, those prices have to be accurate, they have to be fair, and they have to actually help someone make the decision. As it stands, this bill falls short on all three of those things. That is why the coalition will move a series of sensible, practical amendments. The first and, to my mind, the most important, goes to whether this website will actually be useful to the person sitting at their kitchen table who is trying to use it. As drafted, the bill could see a single figure published next to a service, but a single number can be incredibly misleading. So the coalition will move to require that Medical Costs Finder displays proper context—the median fee and the typical range of fees for a given service. A patient does not just need to know what one doctor charges. They need to know whether that price is at the low end, the high end or right in the middle. Give people the range, and you give them the power to ask the one question every consumer is entitled to ask: am I being charged a fair price? </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The second amendment goes to accuracy and fairness. This website will draw on government billing data and publish information about individual clinicians. Inevitably, some of that information will be wrong. The question is: what happens when the information is wrong? Under this bill, the answer is simply not good enough. The coalition will move to require that, when information about a clinician is disputed and subject to review, it must come down off the website immediately and stay down until that review has been completed, not left up there for weeks or months quietly misleading patients and unfairly tarnishing a doctor's reputation. If the data is under a cloud, it should come down and it should be checked for accuracy. That is basic fairness, and it's exactly what stakeholders, including medical colleges, have been asking for. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The third amendment makes transparency an ongoing commitment, not a one-off press release. The coalition will move to require the minister to publish an annual report on what this data is actually telling us—the trends in the median prices and the variation between regions. Australians have a right to know whether out-of-pocket costs are going up or going down, and they have a right to know whether, in this country, your postcode is deciding what you pay for your healthcare. Sunlight should not be switched off the day after the minister's media release has been written. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">My fourth point goes to the second half of the bill, the premiums. The government says it wants to stamp out product phoenixing, where an insurer quietly closes a product and reopens an almost identical one at a higher price. That is a worthy goal, and we support it, but the drafting goes well beyond that. As written, an insurer would need the minister's approval to launch any new product at all, with no cap on the fees that can be charged to apply and no deadline for the minister to actually decide. The coalition will move two practical fixes. First, cap those application fees to the genuine cost of processing them. This is a concern of the scrutiny of bills committee as well. Second, give the minister 30 days to make a decision, with approval deemed to be granted if he sits on his hands and doesn't respond in that timeframe. The last thing Australians need is a fix for phoenixing that becomes a handbrake on choice and yet another cost quietly passed back to them through their premiums. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Let us not pretend that a website is a substitute for action on the cost of healthcare under this government. This is a government that has presided over a private health premium increase of 4.41 per cent, the largest in eight years and above the rate of inflation. This is a government under which Australians are, for the first time in Medicare's history, paying more than $50 on average for out-of-pocket costs just to see their GP. This is the same Labor Party that cut the private health insurance rebate, a decision that continues to push up the cost of cover for millions of families to this very day. It is the same Labor Party whose health minister once said in as many words that she paid for the government's promises by targeting health insurance. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">So, as I said, transparency is welcome, but transparency about a rising bill does not make the bill any smaller. Australians do not just want to see the costs. They want a government that actually does something about it. So let me be clear about where the coalition stands. We will not stand in the way of this bill. We support genuine transparency, and we always have. But we will move amendments to make the scheme accurate, fair and genuinely useful for the patient and to make sure a sensible fix on premiums doesn't become just another cost passed on to consumers.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I commend our amendments to the Senate and I urge the government and the crossbench to support them, because Australians deserve nothing less than a transparency scheme that actually works.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>9</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ananda-Rajah, Sen Michelle</name>
                <name.id>290544</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="290544" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator ANANDA-RAJAH</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">12:54</span>):  I rise to speak on the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026. Australians have been approaching their medical specialist care with trepidation. They are fearful of bill shock, burnt by highly variable out-of-pocket fees that are declared too late in the patient journey, often once the therapeutic alliance between doctor and patient has been forged. The effect has been an erosion of confidence in the private health system and, worse still, delayed care, because the current financial consent process is not working for them. This is exposing Australians to financial toxicity when they see medical specialists for care. Let's take a knee replacement. Private Healthcare Australia has the median fee for that operation last year at $1,080, but one in 10 patients was charged more than $5,300, nearly five times that price. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">So what does that uncertainty actually do? The ABS Patient Experiences survey found that more than 1.9 million Australians delayed or did not see a specialist due to cost in 2024-25. The increase in specialist out-of-pocket costs over recent years has outpaced general price growth. For example, the average out-of-pocket cost for an initial specialist consultation went from around $94 in 2016, 10 years ago, to $158 in 2025, a 67 per cent increase. By comparison, the CPI or inflation rose by 32 per cent over the same time. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Specialists will argue that their costs have increased over time, and they have, due to a number of factors: rent on rooms; consumables; equipment; staff wages; medical indemnity, which tends to track with litigation across the entire medical profession; and income protection—to name a few. They may also argue that the Medicare rebate is insufficient for some procedures, such as complex surgeries that may sometimes take between eight and 10 hours at a time. I can think of several, such as a AAA repair. That is when an aortic aneurysm is repaired. It is very long surgery. Ivor Lewis oesophagectomy is usually surgery for cancer of the oesophagus. It is a major operation. And there are types of reconstructive surgery, such as head and neck, or even other types, to name a few. They are usually for cancer.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The Department of Health, Disability and Ageing released its consultation paper on specialist affordability, and the numbers in it are telling. On six million occasions, Australians were charged between three and five times the benchmark fee to see a specialist. But on 1.24 million occasions last year, Australians were charged more than five times the benchmark fee. Out-of-hospital out-of-pocket costs have jumped by roughly 67 per cent since 2019. I want to be clear that excessive out-of-pocket fees are confined to a very small minority of specialists. The vast majority are doing the right thing. Providers recognise their ethical obligation to ensure the fees they charge are reasonable. This is shared by the AMA, who have stated that they do not support egregious charges—fees that the majority of practitioners would consider unacceptable. However, existing guardrails like professional standards and frameworks and, indeed, peer review and peer pressure for ethical billing are not preventing this behaviour. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The risk here is that excessive out-of-pocket fees can become normalised, driving up fees across the entire market. A Consumers Health Forum survey released in February found consumer fees were the single biggest cost worry when dealing with a new health issue, with 86 per cent of respondents citing it as a concern. Patients with complex chronic health conditions are particularly exposed to the cumulative impact of financial burden. These may be, for example, patients with chronic complex conditions like psychiatric conditions or cancer care. Patients with these conditions will often have limited ability to shop around or to even change providers. Often, once a therapeutic alliance is forged, it is almost impossible to change. When I say that, I mean it's difficult. Patients and doctors—it's a special bond. They become wedded. Patients become wedded to their specialist. They have confidence and so on and so forth, but they're then also, in some cases, exposed to excessive fees, particularly when public services are limited in a region or there is limited competition.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Information asymmetry is another issue, with patients having limited knowledge of what a service should cost. They may have to shop around or rely on their GP, who is also, to some degree, in the dark. The combined effect of limited transparency, the imbalance of power between provider and patient and excessive fees is compromising access to and affordability of specialist services and is undermining confidence in private health insurance. People are questioning whether they are getting value for money from their private health insurance, and this is all occurring in the context of cost-of-living pressures.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">When we came to government, we thought this problem had been fixed. The coalition spent around $24 million of taxpayers' money building the Medical Costs Finder, a website whose entire purpose was to tell Australians what their specialist would charge, and then they made it voluntary. By the end of 2022, out of roughly 6,300 eligible specialists across the 11 specialities on that site, six had published their fees—not six per cent but six doctors. Three years after, it was about 88. Again, it was not 88 per cent but 88 individual doctors, or somewhere around 1.4 per cent. On the insurer's side, it was every bit as voluntary and every bit as ignored. Only about three insurers ever bothered to volunteer their data. That's three. That is what happens when you build a website, cut a ribbon and then disappear. This bill finishes the job.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Instead of waiting for specialists to volunteer, the government will now publish the Medicare hospital and insurer billing data it already collects, backed by a $7 million investment in the technical capability to do that. There is no new paperwork for doctors. The data already exists. We are simply going to show it to the people who are paying those bills. What does it look like? Mock-ups were sought at our committee hearing on 7 April, and that's freely available, if anyone wants to have a look at them. The department has provided these to our committee, and these are early drafts, built on years of research and extensive consultation with the colleges, craft groups, consumers and insurers. These stakeholders all participated in multiple meetings helping to co-design this website and co-design this law.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">You search by service or by specialists. You put in your postcode and your fund, and what comes back is not one number. It is the typical specialist fee, then what Medicare pays, then what the insurer pays and then what is actually left up to you, with a low, a typical and a high side shown side by side, so there is a bit of a range there. There are filters for distance, for gender, for language spoken and for speciality. There is a 'last updated' date on the page, and there is a tool that lets you compare how often each insurer has a no-gap arrangement in your state. It's a range. It's not just a single figure.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I did ask the department something else during that hearing: alongside the aggregate fee and the range, would there be qualitative information—something the specialists themselves can craft—and how easy would it be for them to update it? There will be a free-text box, limited in size, for the specialist doctor to give context to their published fees. If you see more complex patients, you say so, and the provider portal already exists. It will have information like fellowships, meaning the qualifications, teaching practices, participation in clinical quality registries—all fields built off feedback from the profession itself.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I think this context is actually important. All specialists are not equal. Specialists tend to then subspecialise into very niche areas in medicine. I can give you a couple of examples. For example, there may be only a couple of people in an entire state who will have the expertise to remove pacemakers when they become infected, which is highly dangerous and very risky and can cause, for example, ventricular rupture and occasionally need to be done when pacemakers become infected. These people are not just down the road. They usually work in tertiary hospitals. They might also be in private practice, but there's only a handful of them in an entire state. That's one example. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Another example might be orthopaedic surgeons who specialise in removing infected joints. Again, these don't happen very often, but if a joint becomes infected it is a catastrophe. It is a catastrophe for the patient. It is a catastrophe for the treating surgeon and for the entire treating team, because it can take up to two years to actually gain control of an infection. What often does happen is that that joint needs to be removed and antibiotic-impregnated cement put in, and then the patient is on prolonged courses of antibiotics, which often have some pretty awful side effects. The surgeons who remove those joints, again, are a minority. They are dealing with complex patients and prolonged surgeries. Sometimes these patients need multiple surgeries. Those are only two examples. There is complexity in medicine. Even amongst, say, surgeons, there will be those who have to deal with the more complex of the complex cohort of patients. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This is not all that this bill does. Insurers must currently get ministerial approval before they lift a premium—that is a safeguard—so some funds have simply closed a popular gold or silver product and opened a near-identical one under a new name at a higher price. Loyal members go looking for the cover they have paid into for years and find that it no longer exists. It's called product phoenixing, and it is a rort. This bill calls time on that. From here, funds will need to get approval not just for annual rate rises but for new products and for any change that reduces the value of an existing one. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">While only a minority of specialists charge excessive fees, the cost impact on affected patients is significant, and there is the risk that this could become normalised and spread to the whole market. This bill improves fee transparency and gives patients more control over their healthcare choices while also protecting the integrity of doctors and confidence in private health insurance. I commend this bill to the Senate. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>10</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Liddle, Sen Kerrynne</name>
                <name.id>300644</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="300644" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LIDDLE</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:07</span>):  I rise to speak on the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026. The coalition will not stand in the way of this bill passing the Senate. However, we will be moving a series of substantive amendments to address the shortcomings identified through the committee process. While we support the principles behind this bill, principles alone are not enough. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This legislation makes two key changes to Australia's private health system. Firstly, it introduces transparency by default, with amendments allowing the Department of Health, Disability and Ageing to publish information on the medical costs finder about the fees charged by practitioners, including specialists and general practitioners, and the likely out-of-pocket expenses patients will face. It will be welcomed by consumers. Secondly, the bill regulates private health insurance premiums, requiring insurers to seek ministerial approval for new products and for existing products where certain changes are proposed. This change is aimed at addressing the risk of what's known as product phoenixing, where an existing insurance product is closed and a new near-identical new product is opened at a higher premium, deliberately skirting the approval process. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">There's no disagreement on greater transparency in healthcare pricing and the need to help consumers make informed choices about their health care. There's no dispute. Australians deserve to know before they walk into a specialist's office roughly what it's going to cost them for that visit. It's not a radical idea; it's actually common sense. But let me be clear about why this matters so much right now. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The Labor Party will tell you that all you need is your Medicare card, but Australians know that that is not true. Just last week, my out-of-pocket expense, paid for with my credit card, was $60. What about those on fixed incomes? What about those on minimum wages, struggling to make ends meet? What about them, Labor? It is those people who are affected the most by rising costs, compounded by your reckless spending, which keeps inflation higher for longer. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Australia's private health system plays a critical role in supporting our public hospitals, with the two systems working hand in hand to ensure all Australians have access to the health care they need. When the private hospital systems and aged-care systems are not functioning correctly, our public hospitals become the waiting room for those who can go nowhere else. The private system relieves pressure on our public hospitals, and right now that could not be more critical. At a time when we are seeing record levels of ambulance ramping and increasing wait times at hospitals right across the country, this is why reforms in this space must be considered carefully. Unintended consequences are very real when you weaken the very system propping up our public hospitals.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Nowhere is the failure of the Labor government in this area to manage the delicate balance more evident than in my home state of South Australia. In my home state, the ramping of ambulances is at record levels—one of the worst performances in the country. So much for the Malinauskas government, which promised it would end ramping. Only last week, it was extraordinary to go to the Royal Adelaide Hospital and see the sea of ambulances just sitting at the front waiting to get in. The Malinauskas government promised to end ramping. In fact, they said, 'Voters, your life will depend on it.' It's now worse than ever. There's another Labor lie for you.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">More than 450 older Australians currently remain in hospital despite being medically ready for discharge, leaving our public health system at breaking point. This is the reality of health care under Labor, a system where patients are stranded and hospital resources are diverted from acute care because the broader health and aged-care ecosystem is failing due to lack of care, lack of preparedness and a Labor government that can't fix it. South Australia is home to the current Minister for Foreign Affairs, as well as Labor's Minister for Health and Ageing and Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations—and another in the Minister for Trade and Tourism. There is that sort of representation from South Australia, and a Labor government in South Australia, and it's that much of a right mess.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The coalition recognised that high out-of-pocket costs for specialists are a major concern for Australians, who are struggling with the rising unaffordability of health care under this government. The out-of-pocket cost to see a GP has skyrocketed to more than $50 under this government, the highest level on record. Out-of-pocket costs for specialist appointments are spiralling too. According to the government's own most recent Medicare data, the bulk-billing rate for specialist attendances sits at just 28.2 per cent, with an average out-of-pocket cost of $124. For anaesthetics, the bulk-billing rate is just 8.7 per cent, with an average out-of-pocket cost of $245. These are not costs the average Australian can easily absorb, let alone older Australians living week to week on fixed incomes who have greater need as they age, or young families with multiple children also caught up in Labor's sick health system. This is forcing Australians to make the impossible decision to avoid seeing a doctor altogether because they simply cannot afford to seek medical attention when they need it. They're delaying it. Research conducted last year by Redbridge showed around 30 per cent of people referred to a medical specialist over the past three years did not attend due to health concerns. I'm not making it up; it's actually there. Australian families are now choosing between seeing a doctor and paying the bills. This is a choice no family should ever be forced to make.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">And then there is this government's attack on the private health insurance rebate for older Australians, which sits at the heart of everything that's wrong with Labor's approach to health care. The Albanese Labor government is cutting the additional private health insurance rebate that millions of Australians aged over 65 rely on. It's an ugly way to address Labor's spending. Older Australians who did the right thing for decades, scrimping, saving and paying their own way with private health cover, are now being hit with an $11 billion tax under Labor. National Seniors Australia's own research suggests around 55 per cent of the 3.1 million older Australians set to be hit are pensioners—those who can't just take on another job. Labor is punishing those financially exposed older Australians who have worked hard their whole lives and managed their finances very carefully.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I want to put some faces to those numbers because they are not abstract statistics. These are real South Australians, but they could be Australians anywhere. In the Labor electorate of Boothby, Robert and Debra from Glenelg wrote to me and said:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I have had private health insurance ever since I started work at age 16. I am now 75. This means that I have had 59 years of continuous payments.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">My wife Debra, age 68, and I are lucky to not have any ongoing health problems but maintain our gold private health insurance for the time when we might need to start claiming.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">They both receive a part pension and have a fixed Public Service pension, but they're finding it difficult to make ends meet. Cash flow is a problem.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Then there's Fiona from the suburb of Black Forest—again in the Labor held electorate of Boothby—who said:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I rang Bupa this morning to discuss the rebate. I told them that after a lifetime of being privately covered, I may have to reconsider and clog up the public health system.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I have worked all my life, as a midwife and a teacher, from 17 years of age to retirement, and now as a working grandma.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It's not a made-up story; it's a very real one.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Here's a story of another real South Australian. Disability pensioner Denise's private health insurance helped pay for a hip and two knee replacements, along with other surgeries. Denise called in to ABC radio to tell listeners:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It's like a security blanket. To have that taken away from me, I would be shattered, absolutely shattered.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These are just a few of the stories behind the 3.1 million Australians set to be hit by these changes. While the government hasn't done the modelling, once again, industry research suggests that more than 250,000 older Australians will downgrade or drop their cover altogether. They'll be left with no choice, and it matters enormously, because older Australians disproportionately have gold and silver cover, which are the levels that include joint replacements, cataract surgery and other procedures that older Australians genuinely need. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Older Australians pushed off gold cover do not disappear from the health system. Instead, they end up on our already clogged elective surgery waitlists. That's what they do. Every older Australian forced to drop or downgrade their cover means longer waitlists, more ambulance ramping and worse outcomes for patients right across the board. Add to that Labor's assault on veterans through the $5,000 annual cap on allied health services. This government just sees no boundaries, only opportunities to cut, cut and cut to fill its ever deepening black hole.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The only guarantee for Australians is that Labor is not listening, and, when it runs out of money, it will come after more of yours. These rebate cuts come on top of the largest health insurance premium rebate rise in eight years—a 4.41 per cent average increase in April—impacting 15 million Australians who rely on private health insurance during this enduring cost-of-living crisis. At the worst possible time, Labor is slugging Australians with high premiums while families are already struggling to keep their heads above water. The Prime Minister waved around his Medicare card and told Australians that it would be free to see a doctor. In reality, Australians are now facing the highest out-of-pocket costs on record, and they are predicted to keep rising.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The coalition is focused on ensuring that all Australians have timely and affordable access to health care. Labor, by contrast, is focused on using Medicare as a political prop—always chasing the headline instead of delivering real outcomes for the Australians who most need them. This is not a new pattern. The former coalition government was bringing private health insurance premium increases under control, delivering the lowest annual premium changes in two decades, with increases progressively getting smaller year on year. But, under Labor, that trend has completely reversed. It has changed trajectory entirely. Premiums are now rising at the fastest rate in almost a decade, driven by the same broader economic mismanagement that has seen inflation sit consistently above RBA target bands. Wages fail to keep pace and business operating costs continue to spiral.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I want to bring this back to South Australia now. My home state has the highest proportion of older Australians on the mainland, and they are the ones who will wear the cost of these changes the hardest. State Labor took a promise to fix the ramping crisis to the last election, and, as I said, it has never been worse. The private health rebate exists so that older Australians' increasing healthcare needs do not place additional pressure on a public system already buckling under Labor governments. Right across South Australia, in towns like Victor Harbor, Mount Gambier, Jamestown and Streaky Bay, there are older South Australians. They're a long way from this Canberra bubble, but they will wear the changes most directly, and it will be worse for those in country towns and centres. If visitation drops because older Australians can no longer afford their private health cover, these small regional hospitals will struggle to remain viable, leaving communities with even fewer local healthcare options and more pressure on already stretched public hospitals.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The coalition supports greater transparency in this bill and a strong private health system more broadly. The coalition will not oppose this bill in the Senate, but our support comes with a clear and unambiguous message to this government. It is time for the Prime Minister to stop waving around his Medicare card for the cameras and actually start addressing the rising affordability crisis facing Australian patients, one that his government's own economic mismanagement has directly caused. Older Australians built this country. Army, Air Force and Navy veterans fought for this country. They deserve a government that backs them, not one that taxes them, strips their rebates and leaves them with an impossible choice between their health and their household budget.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">In conclusion, this bill is in part about transparency and publishing costs for medical practitioners, but it must be said that the real issue here is that this bill doesn't recognise that consumers are paying so much more under this Labor government, and it is because of their economic vandalism.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>13</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:21</span>):  I thank senators who have contributed to the debate on the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026. It has, as is so often the case in the Senate, been a wide-ranging debate, and many senators have chosen to put on record their thoughts about Australia's health system. I want to make just a couple of points to that end.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The first is this. This government is making a record investment in Medicare, an $8½ billion investment, and that investment has been necessary because of the disgraceful way that public health was ignored and diminished under the previous Liberal government. When we came to government, in the words of our national medical organisations, bulk-billing was in freefall. As a consequence of the changes we are making, we are seeing bulk-billing rates rise again. That is incredibly important because public health matters. When you wish to see a doctor, the only card you should need is a Medicare card. Our government is unapologetic about that. That is why we are making the investments that we are.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It's also why we are investing in urgent care clinics, clinics that mean that, if you have a cut, a sprain or another injury that falls short of what would require an emergency department, you can see a doctor for free. It's important for the families and individuals that are accessing those services. It's also important for hospitals because it is taking pressure off the emergency rooms in hospitals. Again, the government understands that the cost of medicine is an area where we can intervene and make a difference, so medicines this year on the PBS are $25 per script. The cost of medicine has not been that low since 2004.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">So I say to senators that this government, unlike the last one, does in fact understand the importance of health care in the lives of Australians. We as a government consequently understand our obligation to invest in health care for all Australians. This bill is part of improving the structure of healthcare delivery in this country. Schedule 1 makes important changes to support greater transparency in healthcare pricing. It helps Australians make more informed decisions about their private healthcare choices, and it does that by providing consumers with more detailed information on the expected medical fees to be charged and likely out-of-pocket costs for their private healthcare experience.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Right now, consumers have a lot more information about routine goods and services that they purchase than they do about their healthcare choices, but those healthcare choices have a profound impact on their quality of life. Without passage of this schedule, we will continue to see many Australians not knowing what their private healthcare journey will cost and being unable to easily compare the cost of alternative providers and therefore unable to make an informed choice about their health care.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Schedule 2 strengthens ministerial oversight of private health insurance premiums and ensures that consumer interests are better protected. To allow insurers to close an existing product and open an identical or similar new product at a higher premium without ministerial scrutiny presents an unacceptable risk to private health insurance customers that needs to be stopped. This will be achieved by requiring ministerial approval not just for proposed premium changes but also when an insurer proposes to open a new product or reduces the coverage, benefits or terms and conditions of a product. Changes are also being made to formalise and enhance the process for approval of premiums. The arrangements are substantially aligned with how the annual premium round has been managed in recent years.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I very much appreciate work of the Senate Community Affairs Legislation Committee in scrutinising this bill and the report that they produced, and I thank those senators who participated in those processes and acknowledge the then chair, Senator Dorinda Cox. I also appreciate the stakeholders who have engaged in good faith with the government on this bill, and I can indicate that, when we do come to the committee stage, there is a government amendment that I intend to move.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We continue to more broadly consider reform options to improve the value of private health insurance and support consumers to make informed decisions about their health care, but these reforms before us today are an important step in helping consumers make informed choices about health care and improving confidence in private health insurance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill read a second time.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>In Committee</title>
            <page.no>14</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">In Committee</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill—by leave—taken as a whole.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>14</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:26</span>):  by leave—I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Clause 2, page 2 (table items 2 and 3), omit the table items, substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <table class="HPS-Hansard" cellspacing="0" style="&#xA;          width:471pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;        border-collapse:collapse;margin-left:16.4pt&#xA;      ;">
                  <tr class="HPS-" style="height:0;page-break-inside:avoid;">
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;border-top:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;">
                      <div class="-firstRow">
                        <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                          <span class="HPS-Small">2. Schedule 1, Part 1, Divisions 1 and 2</span>
                        </p>
                      </div>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;border-top:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;">
                      <div class="-firstRow">
                        <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                          <span class="HPS-Small">The day after this Act receives the Royal Assent.</span>
                        </p>
                      </div>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;border-top:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-bottom:none windowtext 0pt;">
                      <div class="-firstRow">
                        <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                          <span class="HPS-Small"> </span>
                        </p>
                      </div>
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                  <tr class="HPS-" style="height:0;page-break-inside:avoid;">
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">3. Schedule 1, item 3A</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">At the same time as the provisions covered by table item 2.</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">However, the provision does not commence at all if Schedule 1 to the <span style="font-style:italic;">Health Insurance Amendment (Incentive Payments and Other Measures) Act 2026</span> commences at or before that time.</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small"> </span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                  <tr class="HPS-" style="height:0;page-break-inside:avoid;">
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">4. Schedule 1, item 3B</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">The later of:</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the commencement of the provisions covered by table item 2; and</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">(b) immediately after the commencement of Schedule 1 to the <span style="font-style:italic;">Health Insurance Amendment (Incentive Payments and Other Measures) Act 2026</span>.</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">However, the provision does not commence at all if the event mentioned in paragraph (b) does not occur.</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small"> </span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                  <tr class="HPS-" style="height:0;page-break-inside:avoid;">
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">5. Schedule 1, Part 2</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">At the same time as the provisions covered by table item 2.</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 0.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small"> </span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                  <tr class="HPS-" style="height:0;page-break-inside:avoid;">
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">6. Schedule 2</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">The later of:</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">(a) immediately after the commencement of the provisions covered by table item 2; and</span>
                      </p>
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small">(b) 18 September 2026.</span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                    <td class="HPS-" style="&#xA;    width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;  border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;border-top:solid windowtext 0.5pt;border-bottom:solid windowtext 1.5pt;">
                      <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                        <span class="HPS-Small"> </span>
                      </p>
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                  <tr height="0">
                    <td style="&#xA;              margin:0;padding:0;border:none;width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;            ">
                    </td>
                    <td style="&#xA;              margin:0;padding:0;border:none;width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;            ">
                    </td>
                    <td style="&#xA;              margin:0;padding:0;border:none;width:157pt&#xA;      ;&#xA;            ">
                    </td>
                  </tr>
                </table>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (after line 3), at the end of section 124ZY, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(8) The Secretary may, on the Secretary's own initiative or as a result of a review under a determination under section 124ZYA, correct, update, alter or remove information published under this section.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (lines 4 to 15), omit section 124ZZ, substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">124ZYA Review of decision to publish information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Minister may, by legislative instrument, determine procedures for reviewing decisions to publish information under section 124ZY (including decisions to correct, update, alter or remove such information).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Without limiting subsection (1), the determination may provide for any of the following:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) who may, or may not, apply for review of a decision;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) kinds of decisions that are, or are not, subject to review;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) circumstances in which an application may, or may not, be made;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) who is to review a decision.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">124ZZ Use and disclosure of information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Use or disclosure to assist Secretary or reviewer</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) A person may use or disclose information for the purposes of:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) assisting the Secretary to publish, correct, update, alter or remove information under either or both of the following provisions (the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">publication provisions</span>):</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) section 124ZY;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) section 324-5 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Private Health Insurance Act 2007</span>; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) assisting a person to carry out a review under a determination (a <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">review determination</span>) under:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) section 124ZYA; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) section 324-7 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Private Health Insurance Act 2007</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) To avoid doubt, the reference to using information in subsection (1) includes a reference to linking or matching information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Disclosure to person about whom information is published</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) The Secretary may disclose information to a person:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) in the course of deciding what information to publish about the person under either or both of the publication provisions; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) in the course of deciding whether to correct, update, alter or remove information published about the person under either or both of the publication provisions; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) in order to inform the person about how information published about the person under either or both of the publication provisions was, or is to be, worked out.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Disclosure in the course of review</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) A person carrying out a review under a review determination may, in the course of carrying out the review, disclose information to the person who applied for the review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Information may relate to other people</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) To avoid doubt, information disclosed to a person (the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">disclosee</span>) under subsection (3) or (4) may include information about other people as well as the disclosee, or instead of the disclosee.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Schedule 1, item 2, page 8 (after line 14), after subsection 324-5(7), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(7A) The Secretary of the Department may, on the Secretary's own initiative or as a result of a review under a determination under section 324-7, correct, update, alter or remove information published under this section.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) Schedule 1, item 2, page 9 (lines 6 to 17), omit section 324-10, substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">324-7 Review of decision to publish information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Minister may, by legislative instrument, determine procedures for reviewing decisions to publish information under section 324-5 (including decisions to correct, update, alter or remove such information).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Without limiting subsection (1), the determination may provide for any of the following:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) who may, or may not, apply for review of a decision;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) kinds of decisions that are, or are not, subject to review;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) circumstances in which an application may, or may not, be made;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) who is to review a decision.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">324-10 Use and disclosure of information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Use or disclosure to assist Secretary or reviewer</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) A person may *use or *disclose information for the purposes of:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) assisting the Secretary of the Department to publish, correct, update, alter or remove information under either or both of the following provisions (the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">publication provisions</span>):</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) section 324-5;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) section 124ZY of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Health Insurance Act 1973</span>; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) assisting a person to carry out a review under a determination (a <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">review determination</span>) under:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) section 324-7; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) section 124ZYA of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Health Insurance Act 1973</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) To avoid doubt, the reference to *using information in subsection (1) includes a reference to linking or matching information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Disclosure to person about whom information is published</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) The Secretary of the Department may *disclose information to a person:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) in the course of deciding what information to publish about the person under either or both of the publication provisions; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) in the course of deciding whether to correct, update, alter or remove information published about the person under either or both of the publication provisions; or</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) in order to inform the person about how information published about the person under either or both of the publication provisions was, or is to be, worked out.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Disclosure in the course of review</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) A person carrying out a review under a review determination may, in the course of carrying out the review, *disclose information to the person who applied for the review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection constitutes an authorisation for the purposes of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Privacy Act 1988</span> and other laws (including the common law).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Information may relate to other people</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) To avoid doubt, information disclosed to a person (the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">disclosee</span>) under subsection (3) or (4) may include information about other people as well as the disclosee, or instead of the disclosee.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) Schedule 1, page 9 (after line 21), after item 2, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">2A Subsection 333-1(1)</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Omit "(other than section 66-10)", substitute "(other than a function or power mentioned in subsection (2A))".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">2B After subsection 333-1(2)</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2A) For the purposes of subsection (1), the Minister must not delegate any of the following functions or powers:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) a function or power under section 66-10 (approval of premiums);</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the power to make, vary or revoke a legislative instrument under subsection 324-7(1) (review of decision to publish information).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(7) Schedule 1, Part 1, page 9 (after line 27), at the end of the Part, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Division 3</span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">—</span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Contingent amendments</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">Health Insurance Act 1973</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">3A Subsection 131(1)</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Omit all the words after "other than", substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">the following powers:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the power of the Minister to make, vary or revoke a legislative instrument under subsection 124ZYA(1) (review of decision to publish information);</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) this power of delegation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">3B Subsection 131(1)</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Omit all the words after "other than", substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">the following powers:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) a power under Subdivision A of Division 6 of Part V;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the power of the Minister to make, vary or revoke a legislative instrument under subsection 124ZYA(1) (review of decision to publish information);</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) this power of delegation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(8) Schedule 2, items 10 and 11, page 27 (lines 1 to 12), omit the items, substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">10 Paragraph 333-1(2A)(a)</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Repeal the paragraph, substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) a function or power under subsection 66-6(2) (*approved application periods for applications under section 66-8 or 66-10);</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(aa) a function or power under subsection 66-8(9) or 66-10(9) (tabling reasons for refusing to approve applications under section 66-8 or 66-10);</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I also table a supplementary explanatory memorandum relating to the government amendments to this bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I'll just make a few remarks about the government amendments. They, of course, seek to strengthen schedule 1 of the bill, and that is the schedule that provides for upgrades to the Medical Costs Finder to give consumers more detailed information about medical fees and out-of-pocket costs. These amendments provide comfort in response to some stakeholder concerns by making certain powers ordinarily associated with publication more explicit. First, they support accountability and transparency by providing a nondelegable ministerial power to establish a statutory review process for decisions to publish information on the website. Secondly, they provide an explicit power to correct, update, alter and remove information published as appropriate. This should reassure stakeholders that information can be amended, removed and kept as current as possible. Third, they provide explicit power to disclose information to people about whom the information is being published, such as specialists. This will help people understand how information about them was worked out, supporting fair publication and review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Finally, technical amendments will ensure correct sequencing of multiple amendments to delegation of powers that are made in this bill and the Health Insurance Amendment (Incentive Payments and Other Measures) Bill 2026. Correct sequencing of amendments ensures that, if one amendment to delegation powers commences after another, it does not incorrectly override the previous amendment.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Importantly, this bill continues to protect patient privacy by ensuring that no personal information about patients will be published on the website. Overall, these amendments strengthen procedural fairness and quality assurance. They support accurate and effective operation of the fee transparency network while preserving the broader public interest in greater transparency about healthcare costs.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>17</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Steele-John, Sen Jordon</name>
                <name.id>250156</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250156" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator STEELE-JOHN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:29</span>):  Does the government have further plans in relation to the reduction of specialist fees?</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>17</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:29</span>):  I think that Senator Steele-John said 'reduction'. Minister Butler has spoken about this quite regularly. The government is very concerned about the impact that specialist charges are having on patients experiencing financial stress, and the minister has consistently said that all options are on the table.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="e68" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The TEMPORARY CHAIR </span>
                    </a>
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">(</span>
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Sterle</span>
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">):</span>  I apologise, Minister; as it is 1.30 pm, the committee will report to the Senate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Progress reported.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>17</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Sterle, Sen Glenn (The TEMPORARY CHAIR)</name>
                  <name.id>e68</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>STATEMENTS BY SENATORS</title>
        <page.no>17</page.no>
        <type>STATEMENTS BY SENATORS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">STATEMENTS BY SENATORS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Moon Festival</title>
          <page.no>17</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Moon Festival</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>17</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Sharma, Sen Dave</name>
              <name.id>274506</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="274506" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHARMA</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:30</span>):  Next Friday, the rising of the full moon brings the Moon Festival across Asia and, with it, an opportunity to celebrate family, harvest, ancestors and the next generation. The Moon Festival, also known as the Mid-Autumn Festival, will be celebrated right across our region—in China, in Korea, in Japan, in Vietnam—with major celebrations also being held by Chinese diaspora communities throughout South-East Asia. The Moon Festival will also, of course, be celebrated in family homes right across Australia and at lantern lit events throughout the many states of Australia—including in New South Wales, in places such as Burwood, Cabramatta, Fairfield, Haymarket and Homebush, to name just a few.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Whilst the delicacies that come with the festival may differ, such as mooncakes in China or songpyeon in Korea, the festival—no matter where you may be—will provide a chance for hundreds of millions across the region to reunite with family and give thanks for all they have. The festival also provides a time to reflect upon the immense contribution of the Australian Chinese, Korean, Japanese and Vietnamese communities, who have contributed to our nation for generations and whose contributions have undoubtedly changed our country for the better. Whether your family calls it Zhongqiu Jie, in China, or Chuseok, in Korea, or Tsukimi, in Japan, or Tet Trung Thu, in Vietnam, I wish our Asian neighbours and all Australians celebrating here in our own country a happy and peaceful Moon Festival, or Mid-Autumn Festival, with your loved ones and with your friends.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cybersafety</title>
          <page.no>17</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Cybersafety</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>17</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ciccone, Sen Raff</name>
              <name.id>281503</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="281503" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CICCONE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:32</span>):  My child isn't old enough yet to play video games, but that day isn't far off, and it's already playing on my mind. Now, for most parents, gaming is exactly what it should be: kids having fun, competing with friends and exploring virtual worlds. But, increasingly, radicalisation doesn't start with something that looks radical; it starts with an online game, then a chat, a private message and eventually an encrypted platform. That's why I've pushed for a new Parliamentary Joint Committee on Intelligence and Security inquiry into the drivers of radicalisation in Australia. The inquiry will examine the pathways, the role of algorithms, gaming platforms and encrypted apps, and what responsibility the tech companies have, to make sure we protect our children.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The threat is changing quickly, and it's reaching young people. As a parent, I find this deeply concerning. ASIO has warned that radicalisation that once took months or years can now happen in a matter of weeks. Around 20 per cent of their priority counterterrorism cases now involve young people. That is one in five.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The scale of online interaction matters. Nine in 10 Australian households play video games. Research from the eSafety Commissioner shows that 40 per cent of children who play online games have played with strangers, while more than a quarter have chatted with people that they simply do not know. This can create opportunities for people who deliberately aim to manipulate and influence our kids. Our children should be able to play online safely and connect with their friends without being drawn into something that they never went looking for in the first place.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Data Centres</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Data Centres</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>18</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Waters, Sen Larissa</name>
              <name.id>192970</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="192970" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator WATERS</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Leader of the Australian Greens</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:34</span>):  AI is bad for our neighbourhoods, bad for our climate and bad for our wallets. In terrifying headlines today, the world may end, thanks to an AI takeover. But here's the kicker: we also get to pay more for the energy that AI will use to power our demise.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Data centres are on track to consume as much power as every home in New South Wales and Victoria by 2036. Without proper regulation and a commitment to use renewable energy to power them, these data centres could raise your power bills by 25 per cent—all this to power unchecked AI expansion that some experts say has a 10 per cent chance of ending humanity. If we don't take the time now to get this right, there will be serious consequences for our energy grid, for our water, for our environment, for our climate and for us as a species.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's clear this government hasn't worked out how to regulate AI or data centres. Without regulation, AI has become a big tech free-for-all. The winners? The billionaires, as always. The losers? You—ordinary Australians. In the US, we've seen that Trump is rolling out the red carpet for AI and for more fossil fuels to power them. There are plans for more than 70 gas fired power plants just for new data centres. AI companies are desperately seeking new territory to build the data centres that they need to train and run their AI models, and now they've set their sights on Australia. We cannot follow Trump down another rabbit hole—this time on AI. We need a moratorium on data centres right now. Without one, we are sleepwalking into an AI catastrophe. It is time for this government to stop folding to big tech, to stop folding to the fossil fuel industry and to start acting in the interests of everyday Australians.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Working Holiday Maker Program</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Working Holiday Maker Program</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>18</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade</name>
              <name.id>30484</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="30484" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BROCKMAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy President and Chair of Committees</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:36</span>):  I have risen in this place before to speak on the importance of working holiday-makers to regional communities, and I will continue to rise and talk about this issue for as long as this Labor government wants to use working holiday-maker visas as a football to try and cover up its failed immigration system.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The fact is working holiday-makers are vital to regional communities, filling one in seven farm jobs nationally and 44 per cent in horticulture during peak harvest. In my home state of Western Australia, harvest in the grain industry could start as soon as a couple of weeks away. It will go through to Christmas. A large number of those who will work on farms to harvest that grain to feed not just Australia but the world will be working holiday-makers, or they would have been last year.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">At the moment Labor's pause on working holiday-maker visa processing is leaving literally hundreds of farmers in doubt as to where the labour for their harvest will come from. These are not people who permanently migrate to Australia. They are your prototypical backpackers. Ninety-five per cent plus of people on working holiday-maker visas end up going back home to their country of origin. The five per cent who don't return change their visas. They are not part of the migration problem, but Labor are using them as a football for their own failed migration policy.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Langby, Dusty, Little Wings</title>
          <page.no>18</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Langby, Dusty</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Little Wings</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>18</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Neill, Sen Deborah</name>
              <name.id>140651</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="140651" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator O'NEILL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:38</span>):  This is a good news story, which is something we don't hear often in this chamber. This morning, I was actually able to meet a young man by the name of Dusty, who's from out west in Warren. I see people here in the chamber who might wonder, 'What could a boy of 12 dream up when he's swimming in the dam on his farm with his mum?' Well, young Dusty Langby and his mum dreamed up a plan to raise $1 million to support Little Wings, which provides health access for kids from the bush. Today, he met the Prime Minister, and he achieved that dream.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Dusty has been walking for 16 days. He raised just under half a million dollars. If you have it within your wherewithal, give him a bit of support. The Prime Minister today committed to matching, dollar for dollar, every bit that Dusty has raised. Why did he do this? He's a great kid with a big heart who wanted to do something for his community in regional Australia. One million dollars is going to make a massive difference to the lives of people out in the western part of New South Wales. The government is also making sure to extend another $1 million in funding to the Little Wings organisation to help seriously ill children in regional communities access the health care that they need.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Today, Dusty wasn't alone. Of course, he travelled with the support of his mum, Sarah Langby, a registered nurse; his dad, Andrew; two local nurses, Christine Letton and Nichole Callan, who walked alongside him; his little brother, Angus; and his extended family.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">From the dam, the idea ended up on a phone in the house. The first port of call was an aunty who said, 'Yes, Dusty, you can do it.' And, today, a great Australian came to the parliament, and he did something for others. What a great leader!</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Invasive Species Management</title>
          <page.no>19</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Invasive Species Management</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>19</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:40</span>):  I rise to speak about rabbits. There are hundreds of rabbits on the lawns around Parliament House. Colleagues may have seen them on the way in and out of this building. What's happening here in Canberra is mirrored across the country. We're seeing a huge build-up of the rabbit population. For every person in Australia, we now have seven to 10 rabbits, and these populations are growing fast. Back in 2021, ABARES put the cost to agriculture at an estimated $197 million. It's likely far higher now, given the numbers. It's becoming much worse, damaging agriculture and decimating native species. Rabbits are a key threat to 322 threatened species in this great country, more than any other invasive species.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We should have seen this coming. As a country, we should have learnt from the past and seen what happens. By the 1920s, there was a rabbit plague of an estimated 10 billion rabbits—10 billion rabbits! With planning and investments, scientists were able to knock them down, first with myxomatosis and then with calicivirus. But we've become complacent as a country. We've seen R&amp;D investment decline, and we haven't been spending enough on the next biocontrol. We've only invested $12 million over the past decade, and researchers are now saying that we're at least 10 years away from being able to deploy a new control—10 years! This is what happens when we don't have long-term thinking, when we don't have constant investment in controlling invasive species and when we don't have planning for the future and for the next biocontrol and the next breakthrough in this important area.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>National Security</title>
          <page.no>19</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">National Security</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>19</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bragg, Sen Andrew</name>
              <name.id>256063</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256063" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BRAGG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:42</span>):  Regrettably, Iran has become a pariah in our world and here in Australia. Given it was the architect of the attack on the Adass synagogue in Melbourne, we know how active the Iranian regime is in our country. It seeks in Australia, just as it seeks to do at home and elsewhere abroad, to engage in terrorism, murder, blackmail and threats. This government is only going to be eliminated from our planet with an alternative that has credibility and the respect of the opposition forces. So I'm very pleased to report to the Senate that, in the coming days, the members of the opposition shadow ministry will be meeting with Reza Pahlavi, the former crown prince of Iran, who is living in exile in the United States. I make the point that this is not an endeavour in imperialism; this is an endeavour in trying to thread together the forces of the opposition that are going to be necessary to bring down this terrorist regime.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I am very touched and have been very moved by the amount of support that we have received from the Persian community, from the Australian Iranian community, across our country. It has been a very troubled community in many ways because it has been targeted by elements of the regime here in beautiful Australia. This is going to be an important meeting with the former crown prince of Iran that members of the shadow cabinet will have in the next few days. I'm very much looking forward to seeing Australia play its role in helping rid the globe of this terrible terrorist government.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Manufacturing Industry</title>
          <page.no>19</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Manufacturing Industry</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>19</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Marielle</name>
              <name.id>281603</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="281603" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator MARIELLE SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:44</span>):  This is a difficult time for the people of Whyalla. The announcement by the administrator of the steelworks that the efforts to restart the blast furnace over recent months were unsuccessful will impact workers, their families and the broader community. What is clear is that years of failure to invest in the steelworks mean it is now beyond repair. Whyalla is a resilient community, but we cannot underestimate how disappointing this announcement from KordaMentha will be for many.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I want to reiterate that our government stand firmly with workers in Whyalla, and we acknowledge how tirelessly they have worked throughout this challenging period. We are focused on supporting them and on ensuring that no-one is left to navigate these circumstances alone. Staff from Minister Amanda Rishworth's department, the Department of Employment and Workplace Relations, are on the ground assisting the local community. From coordinating local support to guiding workers and their families to assistance, these officials are there to help. The $10 million Whyalla blast furnace response plan will also help those affected through workforce support.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor is committed to a domestic steel manufacturing industry and to securing the long-term future of the Whyalla Steelworks and the local jobs and the families which rely on it. We are working hand in hand with the Malinauskas government as we do so, with two bidders currently shortlisted. This is a complex transaction, and it needs to be done right. I know this is a disappointing time for Whyalla community, and all South Australians feel it too. We stand with Whyalla, and we are committed to the economic future of this town because it matters to all of us.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Gender and Sexual Orientation</title>
          <page.no>20</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Gender and Sexual Orientation</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>20</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McKim, Sen Nick</name>
              <name.id>JKM</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="JKM" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McKIM</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australian Greens Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:46</span>):  At the last election, one in three Australians gave their first preference vote to the coalition. One in three also happens to be the number of queer Australians who've attempted suicide in their lifetime—one in three. The coalition is prepared to risk increasing that number in pursuit of increasing their vote. They are hunting for votes by hunting vulnerable people. They are introducing dangerously transphobic legislation which targets trans people and deliberately exposes them to harm.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Spare me the claim that this is somehow about protecting women. The threat to women is not trans people. The threat to women is One Nation giving a job to a convicted rapist. The threat to women is the Liberal and National parties trying to totally undermine education on consent. They themselves are the very danger they claim to be warning against. These people are not to be trusted—not around our kids, not around trans kids and not around women's safety. They have a problem with the very existence of trans people, and, mark my words, they will throw as many of them under the bus as they can in a race to the bottom with One Nation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Trans Australians are paying the price, and some of them are paying it with their very lives. But I want trans people to know this: the Greens will always have your back, and we will fight to drive these culture vulture warriors all the way back into the Dark Ages where they belong.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Early Childhood Education and Care</title>
          <page.no>20</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Early Childhood Education and Care</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>20</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
              <name.id>300707</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>AV</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:48</span>):  I'm extremely fortunate to be able to bring my daughter, Aaliyah, to Canberra with me. Having her here means I don't have to choose between serving my family and my constituents. Most Australian parents, unfortunately, don't have that choice. For them, whether they can work depends on finding child care and affording it. Around 82 per cent of working families rely on early childhood education and care. This isn't a luxury for the few. It's the basic infrastructure that lets Australian families work and live, yet care is increasingly unaffordable or simply unavailable. Nearly a quarter of Australians live in a childcare desert, where three children compete for every place. This hits regional families hardest, forcing them to overpay, travel long distances or go without care and without work. We know that quality early education gives children a better start in life and that investing early pays dividends for our economy and our community.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The problem is we've put profit at the centre of a service that should put children and families first. Care is unaffordable. Educators remain undervalued and underpaid, while large for-profit providers pocket public investment. Yesterday, the government voted to extend the worker retention payment, but extending a payment is not fixing a system. It won't deliver the relief families and workers actually need nor address the cost and access crisis facing families nationwide.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We need to think differently about child care. It should be affordable, accessible and publicly owned, something families can rely on as essential infrastructure. I call on my colleagues to support my case for a national child care system. I'm lucky to bring my child to work with me every day, but luck should never determine whether Australian families can work, raise their children and build a secure future.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Exclusive Brethren</title>
          <page.no>20</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Exclusive Brethren</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>20</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Sheldon, Sen Tony</name>
              <name.id>168275</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="168275" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHELDON</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Chief Government Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:49</span>):  At the last election the Liberal Party worked hand in glove with the Exclusive Brethren to influence, coerce and intimidate voters and candidates across the country. The Exclusive Brethren secretly flew their members to seats across the country to campaign, often in an aggressive and un-Australian manner. Many of us in this chamber saw it with our own two eyes, and that is worrying enough. But this week we've seen new, even more extraordinary revelations in the media. The Liberals and the Exclusive Brethren were coordinating with known Neo-Nazi associates throughout the campaign. The Brethren senior leadership were paying these Nazi associates to stalk members of parliament and candidates and to harass them as they engaged in their communities or in media events. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">One of these associates, Laurence McIntyre, is a member of Neo-Nazi groups on Telegram and has attended their gatherings in Melbourne. When McIntyre wasn't hanging out at Neo-Nazi meetups, he was being paid by the Brethren to stalk and harass members of parliament. And when the Brethren weren't handing duffel bags stuffed with cash to Nazis, they were coordinating campaign tactics with Peter Dutton's office. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I know many of those opposite would be horrified to know that they are only one step removed from financing Neo-Nazi associated political campaigns. Some of them have claimed that about talking about this is anti-religion. Well, I can promise you I am not antireligion, but I am anti-Nazi. That should be a bipartisan position in this Senate. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>21</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Housing</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>21</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Whitten, Sen Tyron</name>
              <name.id>317026</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="317026" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator WHITTEN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:51</span>):  The <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian</span> newspaper has confirmed the disaster that this Labor government has brought down on any Australian looking for a roof over their head. According to the Housing Industry Association, sales of new homes have crashed by almost 20 per cent in the last three months and are eight per cent lower than the same time last year—you know, the houses that Labor's tax grab was meant to be boosting. Labor's big tax grab in the last budget came for everyone that had an investment, no matter what it was. But on housing they came after negative gearing too, with the exception of new properties, ostensibly to increase property supply. But to get their idiotic changes through they had to recruit their favourite coalition partners, the Greens, who managed to lock out self-managed super funds from borrowing to buy new properties. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">What we have ended up with are rate rises, fewer builds and rising rents and falling house prices. The people who could least afford higher costs are getting slugged. And this latest data means it's going to get worse. New research indicates that, thanks to Labor's changes, 10,700 fewer homes will be delivered over the next decade. All this while they continue with their mass immigration obsession. Less supply and more demand—a year 8 economics student could tell you what that would do to prices. Yet with all of their advisers, Labor can't get its head around the basics. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">On the other hand, One Nation has a plan to bring migration under control and relieve the pressure on housing. We will be cutting immigration by more than 750,000 people over three years, relieving pressure on Australian renters who are struggling to keep a roof over their heads. Labor can't fix supply, and they love driving up demand. One Nation is here to fix Labor's housing disaster. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Discrimination: People with Disability</title>
          <page.no>21</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Discrimination: People with Disability</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>21</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Steele-John, Sen Jordon</name>
              <name.id>250156</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250156" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator STEELE-JOHN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:53</span>):  Uber enables the discrimination of disabled people. Uber enables disabled people to be discriminated against every single day in this country. Now I want to be really, really clear. These comments are not directed at any one particular Uber driver. I have spent a lot of time talking with drivers who are literally making ends meet, working in rideshare jobs in the gig economy. I know it's tough. I know that Uber takes so much of a cut that sometimes it's hardly even worth the work that you put in. I know that you often feel as a driver that you don't have agency or control over your work. I want to acknowledge that as a reality.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>And we must talk about the fact that, every day in this country, Uber enables the discrimination that is experienced by so many disabled people. I want to make this real for the parliament. I have experienced discrimination at the hands of Uber drivers, enabled by this app, time and time again. I cannot tell you what it feels like to sit, after waiting ages for anyone to turn up, and see somebody then clock that you are in a wheelchair and just drive off. I've had this happen to me three times in a row once. Drivers pressure you to cancel the trip. Once you get on board, they try to get you to increase the amount of money that you'll pay them just because you have a chair. They decide that they won't take you halfway through you getting on board. This is not okay. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Prime Minister</title>
          <page.no>21</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Prime Minister</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>21</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Collins, Sen Jessica</name>
              <name.id>297964</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="297964" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator COLLINS</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:56</span>):  The Prime Minister is incompetent, and Australians now know that his word is not his bond. He told Australians over 90 times that they would get $275 off their power bill. They didn't. He told Australians 50 times he would rule out changes to negative gearing and capital gains tax. For the record, to the question of negative gearing and CGT changes, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese said, 'Yes. How hard is it—for the 50th time,' that he wouldn't make changes. Then, he fell off a stage and then told Australians it didn't happen. We all saw the video. As for the crude 'melons' gesture demeaning Japan's first female prime minister—'just an innocent hand gesture' he said, while the rest of us said 'gross'.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Now, we have the latest example: the Marrickville Golf Club scandal. Australians might ask why the Marrickville Golf Club was the only golf club selected for Labor's invitation-only funding program, receiving more than $6 million in Commonwealth funding. Perhaps it's because the club is in the Prime Minister's electorate and is one with which he has a decades-long relationship—a club that hosts Labor Party functions and is only 200 metres away from a multimillion dollar property owned by the Prime Minister. Maybe it's because the Prime Minister holds an undeclared honorary membership at the club, something that—you guessed it!—he now claims he knew nothing about, despite using the club for decades.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Prime Minister wants Australians to believe he should be held to a completely different standard than everyone else. Australians deserve better than a prime minister who refuses to admit when he got it wrong. I tell the Prime Minister to show a bit of character, but this is the pattern of Prime Minister Albanese. When someone else is under scrutiny, he demands the highest possible standards, and, when the question lands on him, there's always an excuse.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Football League, Western Australia: Goods and Services Tax</title>
          <page.no>22</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Australian Football League</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Western Australia: Goods and Services Tax</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>22</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Whiteaker, Sen Ellie</name>
              <name.id>316555</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="316555" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator WHITEAKER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:57</span>):  I thought this would be a good opportunity to remind senators that Western Australia is the best state in this country. We have the best beaches, the best sunsets and, of course, the best footy team in the Fremantle Dockers, whose home is just down the road from where I live in Cockburn. I want to apologise to any Cats supporters in this chamber and to the Deputy Prime Minister for what happened at Optus Stadium on the weekend—I said I want to, but I'm not going to! What I will do is congratulate the Dockers on an absolute ripper of a season and wish them all the best against the Sydney Swans on Friday night.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">While I'm on the topic of WA success stories, I want to talk about the fight for WA's fair share of the GST. For too many years, WA was getting less than 30c in the dollar. That simply doesn't add up. Our economy is the engine room of the nation. We have the critical minerals the world is lining up for; our exports help pay for the hospitals, the schools and the roads in states right across the country; and we're building the defence manufacturing future the country needs. All we ask for is our fair share.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">That's why I am so proud to be part of the Albanese Labor government that has backed in WA every single day since coming to government, whether it's on making sure we get our fair share of the GST, whether it's opening Medicare urgent care clinics right across the country, whether it's delivering tax cuts for every taxpayer across Western Australia or whether it's building the Henderson Defence Precinct just down the road in my local community for the shipbuilding jobs of the future. That's what an Albanese Labor government's delivering for WA. The east coast can't beat us on the footy field, and they're not going to beat us on the GST either.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE</title>
        <page.no>22</page.no>
        <type>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Manufacturing Industry</title>
          <page.no>22</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Manufacturing Industry</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>22</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Liddle, Sen Kerrynne</name>
              <name.id>300644</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300644" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LIDDLE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">13:59</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Wong. The blast furnace at Whyalla has been permanently shut down. Up to 500 workers will lose their jobs. This follows a $500 million commitment from the government's Future Made in Australia's Green Iron Investment Fund, part of a $2.4 billion package announced in February 2025. The Prime Minister said Future Made in Australia would mean, 'We can secure the jobs of workers in energy and mining and manufacturing,' yet under Labor we have seen the closure or bail out of Whyalla, Tomago, Nyrstar, Bell Bay and Nickel West. Is this government able to deliver anything more than a future of destroyed industry and job losses?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>22</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:00</span>):  I thank the senator for the question. I obviously have a fair bit of personal knowledge about Whyalla. I recall being a young organiser there when in fact it was BHP Long Products Division, which is some years ago—probably showing my age here!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">What I would also say is I welcome a question on manufacturing from a South Australian Liberal. We all remember Joe Hockey on the floor of the other place goading the car industry to leave Australia, and they did. We know, and our government will not make the same mistake as a Liberal treasurer standing on the floor of the House goading the car industry to leave. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="I0M" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Cash:</span>
                  </a>  Gotta get personal.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  I'll take the interjection, Senator Cash. What I would say to you is we know who is on the side of blue-collar manufacturing jobs, and it ain't you. It's never been you. We are committed to a Future Made in Australia. That is why Senator Ayres is doing the work he is doing, including in relation to Tomago. I do recall some of those opposite complaining about the bailout of Tomago, complaining about how we were saving jobs. We will work with the unions and the workers at Whyalla because we want a future for Whyalla. We will do so sensibly, and we will do it in consultation with working people, which is not what you have ever done.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Liddle, first supplementary.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>22</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Cash, Sen Michaelia</name>
                <name.id>I0M</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>22</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>22</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>22</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Liddle, Sen Kerrynne</name>
              <name.id>300644</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300644" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LIDDLE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:02</span>):  Whyalla. Labor found $150 million to send officials to a luxury beachside resort but could only find $10 million to help Whyalla's workers. Minister, is a five-star overseas junket really worth more to this government than food on the table in your home state of South Australia? Whyalla.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>22</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:03</span>):  I'm not sure what you're referencing. What I would say to you is that we have been very clear about our willingness to put government funds into supporting key industries and key sectors.</span>
              </p>
              <a href="I0M" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Cash interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  I will take your interjection, Senator Cash, because she scoffs at that. I remember the day we announced the Tomago package and what that meant for the jobs in Hunter and the communities in the Hunter. I remember, over here, the complaints about funds being used, about taxpayers' money—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Wong, please—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  When you've quite finished, Senator McKenzie. I do hope I'm not going to spend that next hour repeatedly calling your name because you are so disrespectful. Senator Ruston?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="243273" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Ruston:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, on a point of relevance. This is a very serious issue to the town of Whyalla—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Ruston, get to your point.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="243273" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Ruston:</span>
                  </a>  and nowhere else.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  I remind the chamber that interjections are disorderly, but the senator is entitled to address them.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  The announcement that has been made is deeply disappointing for many workers in Whyalla and their families. I would say that the failure to invest in Whyalla Steelworks by GFG Alliance has had enormous negative consequences for workers, for their families and for the Whyalla community. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <a href="144138" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Paterson interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <a href="16913" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Ayres interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  I should not have to call senators by their names, Senator Ayres and Senator Paterson! You are being disrespectful to me. Senator Liddle, a second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>22</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Cash interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Paterson interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Ayres interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>23</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Liddle, Sen Kerrynne</name>
              <name.id>300644</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300644" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LIDDLE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:05</span>):  Again on Whyalla, yesterday Minister Ayres admitted he was 'not in a position' to put a dollar figure on how much of that $2.4 billion kept the blast furnace running. Minister, can you tell the Senate what taxpayers actually received for that money? </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>23</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:05</span>):  Do you want us to make sure we put our shoulders to the wheel on Whyalla or not? The reality is they want both, don't they? They want to be critical of taxpayers' funds being used to shore up manufacturing in this country, but they also want to point the finger when it comes to closure of the blast furnace. The reality is we understand how important Whyalla is to South Australia. As South Australians, we understand it. Minister Ayres understands it. The Prime Minister understands it. We are committed to working with industry, with the workers and with their union to find a way through this because we recognise the importance of it.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I would again note that those opposite can't decide whether they're for jobs or whether they're against funds being used by government to support industry. They keep criticising the latter but, at the same time, pointing the finger— <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Economy</title>
          <page.no>23</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Economy</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>23</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:06</span>):  My question is to the Minister for Finance, Senator Gallagher. It is clear the conflicts in the Middle East and Ukraine are creating a challenging environment and challenging global economic circumstances, but the Albanese Labor government is working every day to support Australians and grow our economy. How is the government's approach helping to strengthen our economy, repair the budget and provide cost-of-living support to Australians?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>23</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
              <name.id>ING</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ING" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator GALLAGHER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Finance, Minister for the Public Service, Minister for Women, Minister for Government Services and Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:07</span>):  I thank Senator Ghosh for a question on the economy. The global economy is presenting challenges here at home, particularly—</span>
              </p>
              <a href="207825" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator McKenzie interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ING" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator GALLAGHER:</span>
                  </a>  I'm sorry. I can't hear over the yelling.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator McKenzie, I will name you.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ING" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator GALLAGHER:</span>
                  </a>  It's just constant, President. I wouldn't mind it so much if it was an interjection, but a constant stream does make it a little bit difficult to concentrate. The global economy is presenting challenges here at home. In particular, people are feeling it with petrol prices and other cost pressures. While the initial impact from the conflicts came from fuel, we're now seeing it broaden into other areas of the economy.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We're seeing global headline inflation has increased 4.7 per cent this year. Here, inflation has come down considerably despite those global pressures being placed on it, particularly by the war in the Middle East. But the Australian economy has shown enormous resilience, as shown in the recent economic data. The government are focused on making sure we can provide cost-of-living help where it's responsible and doesn't add to inflation and getting the budget in better shape over time.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We have seen faster economic growth in Australia than in Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the United Kingdom and about the same as the United States. We have a lower unemployment rate than Canada, France, Italy and the UK. We've had stronger employment growth than Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom and the United States and a higher participation rate than many of those countries. Australia also has a smaller budget deficit as a percentage of GDP, around one per cent. We know it's much bigger in other countries around the world. So we do come to meet some of these challenges with those in our favour.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Ghosh, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator McKenzie interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
                <name.id>ING</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>23</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
                <name.id>ING</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:09</span>):  Despite heightened global uncertainty, how has the Albanese Labor government's actions ensured our economy is resilient and well positioned to respond to global pressures?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
              <name.id>ING</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ING" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator GALLAGHER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Finance, Minister for the Public Service, Minister for Women, Minister for Government Services and Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:09</span>):  I thank Senator Ghosh for the supplementary. While there are significant challenges across the global economy and there are challenges here in our economy that we have been upfront about, our budget in May was carefully targeted to ease pressure on households while continuing to repair the budget over time and, indeed, respond to some of those challenges in the economy—for example, in the area of productivity. The budget was $44.9 billion better than the mid-year update and more than a quarter of a trillion dollars better than what we inherited. The fiscal discipline that we have shown over all of our budgets becomes even more important at a time of heightened global uncertainty, and we will continue to take the same approach, meeting the pressures that we have to meet but always looking for savings and being able to reduce the pressure on the budget and, indeed, lower the debt and lower the interest payments on that debt. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Ghosh, first supplementary? </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:10</span>):  Why is the Albanese Labor government's approach to managing these global challenges and repairing the budget the right approach for Australians? </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Gallagher, Sen Katy</name>
              <name.id>ING</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ING" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator GALLAGHER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Finance, Minister for the Public Service, Minister for Women, Minister for Government Services and Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:10</span>):  I thank Senator Ghosh for that supplementary. We've had to manage a higher inflation environment than we would have liked since coming to government. When we came to government, inflation was six per cent and rising. It peaked in the December of that first year. It's come down considerably since then, but it remains higher than we would like and has done so for longer than we would like. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We know that some of those pressures overseas are having an impact here, but we have been able to repair the budget. Significant budget repair—savings that we've brought to the budget, returning upward revisions to revenue, lowering debt and lowering the interest that we are paying on that debt have all been part of our approach, and we will continue to make those decisions because it's the right approach to get that budget in better shape. When you see it against those international comparisons, you can see that the work we've done over the last four years has been the correct decisions. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Ghosh, second supplementary? </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:11</span>):  President, I've actually asked three questions. I'm happy to have a fourth, but— </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  No, thank you. Thank you for reminding me. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </question>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Taxation</title>
          <page.no>24</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Taxation</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>24</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
              <name.id>123072</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>LNP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator McDONALD</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Nationals in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:11</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Wong. Yesterday, Whyalla closed their blast furnace—yet another example of the deindustrialisation campaign that your government is overseeing—thanks to skyrocketing energy costs and your safeguards tax.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="16913" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Ayres:</span>
                  </a>  You guys are so dishonest!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order! Senator Ayres. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  Could we start that again. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order! I'm waiting for silence. Senator McDonald, if you wouldn't mind, please start again and we'll restart the clock. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator McDONALD:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you. My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Wong. Yesterday, Whyalla closed their blast furnace—yet another example of the deindustrialisation campaign that your government is overseeing—thanks to skyrocketing energy costs and your safeguards tax. Your government had allocated $2.4 billion to a taxpayer funded bailout of the facility, which is cold comfort to the workers who have now lost their jobs. Only the Albanese Labor government could justify taxing a business to death with the safeguards tax, then using taxpayer funding to attempt to bail it out only to then watch it fail. When will you axe the safeguards tax and remove the shackles from our industrial sector? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="16913" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Ayres:</span>
                  </a>  When will you start with an honest approach? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order, Senator Ayres! </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ayres, Sen Tim</name>
                <name.id>16913</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>24</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
                <name.id>123072</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>LNP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ayres, Sen Tim</name>
                <name.id>16913</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>25</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:13</span>):  First I'd say, Senator—and I understand that there's a desire to play a bit of politics and a bit of ideology in this—what we are very clear about is that securing Whyalla is essential. It is essential because we do want to continue to see domestic structural and long-steel capability. We are prepared to work with the South Australian government, the workers, their union and the community to ensure a future for Whyalla. Yes, we are prepared to invest taxpayer funds because we believe industrial capability matters to our country. Senator, I would make the point that a number on your side—and I can't recall if you were one of them—were highly critical of the government stepping in to secure the future of Tomago, but we did that. We did that because it is critical not only to have that capability but also to the regional economy and—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Wong, please resume your seat. Senator McDonald. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator McDonald:</span>
                  </a>  I specifically asked about the safeguards tax. Could you please redirect the minister. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, Senator McDonald. There was also the preamble. I believe the minister's being relevant to your question, and I'll continue to listen carefully.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  Senator, if you look at the challenges of Whyalla, the challenges of that particular facility and the underinvestment by the previous owner, I think you will see the reasons why the blast furnace is in the state that it is. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But the point I'm making is an important point, because there is a difference between your side of politics and ours. We believe that a future made in Australia matters. We believe that jobs in these heavy industries matter, and we believe that it is important for governments to ensure that those industries can make the transition and be a long-term, sustainable part of the Australian economy, and it is your side of politics who have complained long and hard about government stepping up, stepping in and investing in these sectors.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Macdonald, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
                <name.id>123072</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>LNP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>25</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
              <name.id>123072</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>LNP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator McDONALD</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Nationals in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:15</span>):  Minister, last night, on <span style="font-style:italic;">7</span><span style="font-style:italic;">.</span><span style="font-style:italic;">30</span>, Minister Bowen said that he 'never quite bought all the hype on green hydrogen', despite giving promises to the workers of Whyalla that they had a future in green steel. Will you now apologise to the workers in Whyalla who have lost their jobs in your home state?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>25</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:16</span>):  I'm not sure that the quote is fully accurate and I have even less confidence that the assertion as a consequence of the quote is accurate. I will again go back to the primary proposition: we support a future for Whyalla. We are working with the workers, their unions and the communities and with the Malinauskas government to secure a future for Whyalla.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Macdonald, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>25</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>25</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
              <name.id>123072</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>LNP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator McDONALD</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Nationals in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:17</span>):  Minister, your energy policies have failed, your industry policies have failed, your migration policies have failed, and your emissions policies have failed. Will you axe net zero and the safeguards tax and stop the deindustrialisation of Australia?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>25</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:17</span>):  Senator, I would say a few things to that. The first thing I would say is that we are focused on helping the workers in Whyalla, not playing politics with their future. That's the first point. The second point I would make is that generations of Liberal politicians on that side of the chamber and National politicians have complained about Labor's investment in the industrial sector, and you continue to do that. As I said, we all remember Joe Hockey in the other place goading the last of the car industry to leave Australia, and we know what that meant in my home town of Adelaide. We all remember that. We all remember that, and you haven't changed, because we saw the same thing when we brought forward the Tomago package. You complained.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Waste Management and Recycling: Plastic Packaging</title>
          <page.no>26</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Waste Management and Recycling: Plastic Packaging</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>26</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
              <name.id>310860</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator HODGINS-MAY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:18</span>):  My question is for the Minister for the Environment and Water, Minister Watt. Minister, Labor has spent years promising stronger federal plastics packaging regulation. In 2023, Minister Plibersek conceded that voluntary targets are not working. Now this Labor government is walking away from the national packaging reforms that it promised. This Friday's meeting of environment ministers is an opportunity for Labor to do what it said it would do. Minister, how many more rivers need to choke, how many more landfills need to overflow and how much more plastic needs to end up in our bodies before you finally do what industry, environmental groups and Australians are calling for and mandate a national packaging scheme?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>26</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:19</span>):  Thank you, Senator, for the question. I wasn't really expecting a question from the Greens political party about the environment this week, certainly not one about whether the Greens political party deliver on things for the environment, because only a week ago we saw the Greens completely incapable of deciding whether they support native forests or not.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Hodgins-May:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order on relevance, I don't need a preamble; I want an answer. Stick to the question.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, Senator Hodgins-May. I will listen carefully, but the minister is being relevant to your question. I'll continue to listen, and, if he is not relevant, I will draw him to the question. Minister Watt, could you address your response to me.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, President. I am very proud of the record of this government when it comes to protecting the environment, including when it comes to matters of circular economy, recycling and waste, because it was this government that invested over $200 million in building over 70 new recycling facilities right across the country, including dozens of new plastic recycling facilities. It wasn't the Greens political party who did that; it was the Australian Labor Party who did that, because it's only the Australian Labor Party that has ever taken serious action on these issues.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I don't know whether Bob Brown is going to take up Senator Canavan's invitation to join the National Party, after Bob Brown was encouraging Greens senators to vote with the National Party only last week to stop protection of native forests. The idea that members of the Greens political party would come in and try to lecture us about protecting the environment within days of getting in the way of the most significant step to protect native forests—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="169119" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Shoebridge:</span>
                  </a>  We know you're embarrassed, buddy, but answer the question.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  You want to talk about being embarrassed, Senator Shoebridge? You want to talk about being embarrassed about failing to protect native forests?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Watt, direct your answers to the chair, please.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  We intend to build on our record regarding the circular economy and the packaging issues at this week's Environment Ministers' Meeting by taking a package of reforms to that meeting, seeking greater harmonisation of the rules and regulations that apply to packaging across states and territories. I would expect that we would have support for that from the Greens political party, but perhaps they're too busy holding hands to work out what their position is on packaging at the moment as well. I'd certainly expect to see support for that from the Liberal Party, given they claim to support regulatory reform. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time</span><span style="font-style:italic;"> expired</span><span style="font-style:italic;">)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Hodgins-May, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
                <name.id>310860</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Shoebridge, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>169119</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>26</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
              <name.id>310860</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator HODGINS-MAY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:22</span>):  A complete insult to the intelligence of the industry and environmentalists and people who have been pushing for this—you've cited the cost of living as the reason for Labor's backflip—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Wong?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order! Minister Wong.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order, what I was going to say was Senator Hodgins-May is entitled to make that contribution, but not as a—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Hodgins-May:</span>
                  </a>  This is not a point of order.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  Point of order!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  I'll decide that.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order, this is not consistent with the standing orders—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  Are you allowed to just interrupt while I'm on my feet, when you complain about—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  Fine! The hypocrisy!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">An honourable senator interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Wong:</span>
                  </a>  Oh, the smartest man in the Senate is speaking again! So good to hear from you—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Wong, please resume your seat. Senator Hodgins-May, I'm going to ask you to get to your question, please.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator HODGINS-MAY:</span>
                  </a>  You've cited the cost of living as the reason for Labor's backflip, but Australians are already paying for this broken system through higher council rates and waste charges. Minister, this reform would put the costs of plastic waste back onto producers instead of households. It sounds fair to me. Does that sound fair to you, Minister?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
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                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
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            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
                <name.id>310860</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>26</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            </talk.text>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
                <name.id>310860</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            </talk.text>
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        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>27</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:23</span>):  Thanks, Senator Hodgins-May. Again, it is only the Labor government that has ever taken action on these issues, including by significantly investing in dozens of new recycling facilities. It wasn't a Greens political party government that was doing that. It was a Greens political party that was holding up a few signs, while we were actually getting on with the job of making these investments and building the recycling industry in Australia. Now, if you want to split into two groups and some of you hold hands and some of you refuse to hold hands around protecting native forests or taking action on plastic—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Hodgins-May:</span>
                  </a>  I raise a point of order, President. Can you get him to speak through the chair but also be relevant? This is not relevant to my question about fairness.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Minister Watt, I will ask you to address the chair, and I remind you of the question.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  I know it's a matter of profound embarrassment for the Greens political party that last week they couldn't decide if they wanted to save native forests or not. I know that they want to move on from that—and here's one of them.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Please resume your seat. Senator Shoebridge?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="169119" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Shoebridge:</span>
                  </a>  It is a point of order, on relevance but also on the fact that the minister just flouted your direct ruling. He just ignored you.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Shoebridge—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="169119" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Shoebridge:</span>
                  </a>  You're the President and I'd hold him to account if I was you.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, Senator Shoebridge. I would also state there are many senators in here who flout my rulings when I make them. Minister Watt, I will remind you to address your comments to the chair. I have previously, Senator Shoebridge, directed the minister, as you would have heard, back to the question.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  As I was saying, through our investments in waste and recycling, Australia's recycling capacity is increasing by more than 1.3 million tonnes per year. So we'll leave it to the Greens political party to disagree amongst themselves about whether they want to protect the environment or protect native forests or do something about packaging. We're getting on with the job. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Hodgins-May, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
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                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
                <name.id>310860</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
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                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Shoebridge, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>169119</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Shoebridge, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>169119</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>27</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>27</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
              <name.id>310860</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator HODGINS-MAY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:25</span>):  Minister, did the Prime Minister make a captain's call to throw out federal packaging reform because one of Labor's largest corporate donors opposes it?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>27</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:26</span>):  I'm not sure whether that question was written by Duncan Turpie, because we know that the Greens like to talk about donations but they don't like to talk about donations that they receive. We know the Greens don't like gambling, but they do like taking gambling donations. We know the Greens like talking about native forests, but then they're split about whether they want to protect those native forests. Labor, on the other hand, is actually taking the action that the Greens are calling for, by investing in recycling facilities and increasing our amount of recycling capacity by 1.3 million tonnes per year. We are getting on with the job. We're not sitting on the sidelines throwing stones and we're certainly not holding hands while we disagree amongst ourselves.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Medicare</title>
          <page.no>27</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Medicare</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>27</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Dolega, Sen Josh</name>
              <name.id>316935</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="316935" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DOLEGA</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:26</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Health and Ageing, Senator McAllister. Labor created Medicare because we believe every Australian deserves access to quality and timely health care. Last year, the Albanese Labor government delivered the single largest investment in Medicare since its creation over 40 years ago so more Australians could see a GP for free, where and when they need it. How is the government delivering real change by strengthening Medicare and helping Australians get the care that they need?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>28</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
              <name.id>121628</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="121628" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:27</span>):  I thank Senator Dolega for his advocacy for public health and, in particular, for the health of Tasmanians. The senator is right—Labor does believe that Australians should see a doctor when they're sick, not merely when they can afford to, and it is why we're delivering the biggest investment in Medicare in its history. After a decade of neglect by the Liberals and the National Party, we are restoring every dollar that those opposite cut from bulk-billing, and we're seeing results. Since our bulk-billing investment kicked off on 1 November, over 3,800 GP practices are now fully bulk-billing. That is two years ahead of schedule. In Tasmania, Senator Dolega will be interested to know, that means more than eight out of 10 visits to the GP are for free, and that is up 5½ percentage points from last year. But that is not all. We're also making sure that Australians have somewhere to turn when they need urgent care. We've delivered 137 permanent Medicare urgent care clinics nationwide. In Senator Dolega's home state, enough Tasmanians have received care at Medicare urgent care clinics to sell out the UTAS stadium more than 10 times.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But it is more than just the numbers, senators. It means that, if your child wakes up with a high fever on a Sunday, if you get injured at a social sports game or if you need stitches, you do have somewhere to go without paying a bill. It also means you don't have to sit for hours in an emergency department for something that is not life-threatening, and it means that our hospitals can focus on the patients who genuinely need it.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">So, when we talk about strengthening Medicare, it's not abstract for us. We are talking about sick children seeing a doctor. We are talking about a family getting urgent care without a bill. Labor will always protect and strengthen Medicare.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Dolega, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>28</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>28</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Dolega, Sen Josh</name>
              <name.id>316935</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="316935" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DOLEGA</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:29</span>):  When you're sick, the only card you need is your Medicare card, not your credit card. The PBS is a cornerstone of our health system, helping Australians access the medicines they need at an affordable price, because getting sick shouldn't mean having to choose between buying your medicines and paying the bills. Minister, how is the Albanese Labor government making medicines cheaper and more affordable for more Australians?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>28</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
              <name.id>121628</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="121628" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:30</span>):  The senator is right. When you're sick, the last thing you should have to worry about is whether you can afford the medicine that you need. That has been the simple guiding principle of our government to deliver real change for Australians. It is why, in 2023, we delivered the largest cut to the cost of medicines in the history of the PBS. And we didn't stop there. From 1 January this year, we went further, making sure that Australians will pay no more than $25 for a PBS medicine. The last time that medicines were this cheap was in 2004. As a reminder, Shannon Noll was topping the charts. <span style="font-style:italic;">Kath </span><span style="font-style:italic;">&amp;</span><span style="font-style:italic;"> Kim</span> was on TV and Facebook was created. This is what real cost-of-living relief looks like.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">If it were up to those opposite, if it were up to the Liberals, the Nationals and One Nation, the maximum PBS payment would in fact be more than $50. Labor made medicines cheaper, and those opposite would actually have you pay more.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Dolega, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>28</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>28</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Dolega, Sen Josh</name>
              <name.id>316935</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="316935" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DOLEGA</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:31</span>):  It's clear that the Albanese Labor government's investments in Medicare are delivering real change for Australians, making it easier to see a doctor and get the medicines they need. We on this side of the chamber will always protect and strengthen Medicare. Minister, why is it important to protect and strengthen Medicare, and what risks are there to the government's approach?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>28</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
              <name.id>121628</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="121628" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:31</span>):  On this side of the chamber we do know how important Medicare is, because it means Australians seeing a GP for free and cheaper medicines when they need them. But it seems that Medicare is a more mysterious concept for those opposite. Senator Ruston recently wrote to the department, asking, 'What is Medicare?' Well, Senator, Medicare looks after Australians when they need it the most.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Funnily enough, when we look around the chamber today, those opposite are showing some signs of needing Medicare themselves. The Liberal Party is presenting with a textbook and worrying case of policy malaise. The symptoms are very obvious—no aged-care policy taken to the election last time, a bizarre enthusiasm for higher taxes and now the entire party running a fever trying to out 'nation' One Nation. They're well past bulk-billing; this is a case for emergency. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Defence Procurement: Submarines</title>
          <page.no>29</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Defence Procurement: Submarines</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
              <name.id>250026</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>JLN</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:32</span>):  My question is for the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs, Minister Watt. The Australian Federal Police has been tasked with providing the protective security framework for the AUKUS submarine program and, in response, has established the AUKUS Command. Noting that by the end of 2027 Australia will not have any nuclear submarines and there won't be any nuclear submarines under construction in Australia then, the task seems to be totally focused on protecting American and British submarines rotating through Australia. The AFP has been allocated an additional $199.1 million over the 2026-27 and 2027-28 period. What additional annual funding will the AFP need to provide a protective security framework for the AUKUS nuclear submarine program from financial year 2027-28 to financial year 2035-36, and how much of this funding will be met by the defence budget?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:33</span>):  I thank you, Senator Lambie, for the question. I'll certainly provide you with the information that I have on this matter and, if there's anything further I can provide, I'll come back to you on that. I'm advised that the budget has made provision for the protective service framework that you've referred to over the budget years. It's certainly not just a one-off set of funding.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">As you mentioned in your question, Senator Lambie, the AFP was assigned $199.1 million to deliver 199 PFO and a total of 245 ASL to provide force protection at HMAS <span style="font-style:italic;">Stirling</span>. This was in the 2025-26 budget. That extra staffing is being delivered and is well on track. That's what I'm advised. The reason this funding was provided is that much of our national security work can only be done by the professionals in the AFP. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These are important AUKUS jobs, and this government takes security very seriously. We have enormous respect for the AFP. The AFP has not engaged and is not engaging any contractors to provide this force protection capability, but, more broadly, Senator Lambie, I am advised that the budget has made provision for the protective service framework that you've referred to across the budget years, and, if there's any further information I can provide to you, I'll certainly do that.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Lambie, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>29</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
              <name.id>250026</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>JLN</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:35</span>):  The AFP has previously stated 199 protective services officers will be required at HMAS <span style="font-style:italic;">Stirling</span>. For perspective, in June 2025, the AFP had a total of 838 protective service officers, so AUKUS protection requires 24 per cent of the AFP's total protective service officers, even with a total workforce headcount increase of 101. How many sworn officers have been pulled from other tasks to cover security obligations at HMAS <span style="font-style:italic;">Stirling</span> and Osborne?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:35</span>):  Senator Lambie, as you have mentioned in your questions, the AFP was assigned additional funding to be able to undertake this work. I'm not aware of existing officers being taken away from their ordinary duties to perform this kind of work. If that is not the case, again, I will report back in the usual way. I'd also make the point that, in this year's federal budget, we did not only made those provisions that I've already referred to. The AFP was provided an extra $205 million in funding in 2026-27, compared to the previous year. I'm also advised that the headcount for the AFP overall increased by about 435 between June last year and June this year. We recognise that the AFP perform really valuable services across the community, including this AUKUS role, and we want to make sure that they are well resourced. That's what we're doing through the budget.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Lambie, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>29</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
              <name.id>250026</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>JLN</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:36</span>):  I'll just to get this clear. During estimates in May this year, the AFP advised the AFP headcount was as large as it had been at 8,666—a bit of a surprise compared to the 8,094 for the financial year 25-26 and the forecast of 8,195 for the financial year 26-27. Has the AFP been allocated an increase to the overall headcount and the average staffing level to specifically undertake the AUKUS nuclear submarine protection role?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:37</span>):  Thanks, Senator Lambie. As I say, the information that I've been provided with is that the AFP was assigned $199.1 million and a total of 245 ASL to provide force protection at HMAS <span style="font-style:italic;">Stirling</span>. That was provided in the 2025-26 budget. That would seem to mean that that was additional funding. Again, I'll take advice on that and come back to you if there's anything I can add.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Artificial Intelligence</title>
          <page.no>29</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Artificial Intelligence</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>29</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:37</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Attorney-General, Senator Farrell. Minister, I note reports in the media today that OpenAI has issued an ultimatum to your government saying that it will not even consider investing in domestic AI training or renewable energy if the government refuses to water down copyright laws. Has the government recently undertaken consultations on an opt-out option that puts the onus on rights holders to digitally protect material online if they don't want it to be used in training without a licence?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Farrell, Sen Don</name>
              <name.id>I0N</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="I0N" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator FARRELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Trade and Tourism, Special Minister of State and Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:38</span>):  I thank Senator Pocock for his question. Obviously, the government has taken a deep interest in the issue of artificial intelligence with a view to, on the one hand, maximising the benefits for Australia that come from this new technology and, on the other hand, ensuring that whatever happens in this space is protected and that we get the best possible results for the Australian community.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In terms of the specifics of what you've asked there, Senator Pocock, this is obviously not my direct portfolio area. As I said before, the government, including the Prime Minister, has made very clear statements about this area. I'd be happy to consult with the Attorney-General and come back to you with an answer on the specific question that you have raised this afternoon.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>30</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:39</span>):  Thank you, Minister. I'd love an answer from the Attorney-General and for them to specifically clarify on copyright. As you said, the Prime Minister has made commitments on this, but is your government canvassing a statutory data training authorisation model that grants AI companies statutory permission to access material on the internet for training purposes?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Farrell, Sen Don</name>
              <name.id>I0N</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>
                  <a href="I0N" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator FARRELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Trade and Tourism, Special Minister of State and Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:40</span>):  I thank Senator Pocock for his first supplementary question and for his interest in this important area of technological change. Artificial intelligence represents significant opportunities for Australia, our economy and our national security, but we want to ensure that Australian creatives and the media benefit from these opportunities as well. As the Prime Minister stated in his recent address on AI in Australia's interests, the government wants to attract frontier AI investment but to do so in a way that allows us to set the terms on AI in Australia. This includes terms regarding control and payment for copyright owners in relation to the use of their material for AI training and strong protections for Australian artists and media. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>30</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:41</span>):  Thank you, Minister. I appreciate that this isn't your portfolio and that you've undertaken to get specific info from the A-G. Can you confirm that it remains the government's commitment to not water down copyright protections for Australian creatives?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Farrell, Sen Don</name>
              <name.id>I0N</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="I0N" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator FARRELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Trade and Tourism, Special Minister of State and Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:41</span>):  I thank Senator Pocock for his second supplementary question. I think I started to answer that particular question when I was responding to the previous question, but I'll repeat it. The terms and conditions under which we are seeking to get benefits for Australia in terms of AI include terms regarding the control and the payment for copyright owners in relation to the use of their material for AI training. Strong protections for Australian artists and the media will remain a core part of Australia's approach to artificial intelligence.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Migration</title>
          <page.no>30</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Migration</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
              <name.id>319142</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="319142" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator BELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">One Nation Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:42</span>):  My question goes to the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs, Senator Watt. Minister, the Prime Minister's handpicked economic reform expert, Professor Robert Breunig, says that One Nation's proposal to stop people visa hopping after their temporary visas expire is a good idea that 'should be implemented'. Professor Breunig also stated:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">It's entirely sensible and acceptable to require overstayers to leave the country. They came under an agreement to be here temporarily and they need to honour their side of the agreement.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Will the government adopt One Nation's policy and commit to ending visa hopping across all temporary visa categories and send the many thousands of people who are engaged in this unhelpful behaviour home?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>30</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:43</span>):  Thank you, Senator Bell, for the question. It is a matter of record that the government is considering a range of changes to our migration system to build on the work that we've done over the last four years to dramatically reduce the migration numbers we inherited from the coalition.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Opposition senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  Well, it's a fact.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245212" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Canavan:</span>
                  </a>  What a joke! They peaked under you!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  Do we want to go back to the review that was done of the migration system under that bloke whose name you don't ever mention, Peter Dutton, which found that the migration system presided over by the former coalition government was completely rorted, completely broken and needed to be fixed?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's by fixing that migration system that this government has brought down net overseas migration by 45 per cent over the last four years, compared to the spike that we saw shortly after coming to government. In addition, it is a matter of record that we are considering further changes to our migration system. We won't be taking instructions from One Nation when it comes to our migration policy. We won't be adopting a migration policy that is destined to send the Australian economy into recession. We won't be taking up One Nation's suggestions to have a migration policy that means that hospitals and aged-care facilities in our suburbs and regions will not be staffed. We won't be taking up suggestions for migration that drive the economy into recession, meaning that people will be out of work, because, when economies go into recession, that tends to lead to unemployment. That's what One Nation wants to see happen to Australian workers right across the country.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>It's not just the government saying this; we've seen comments from the Business Council of Australia, the Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry, and the National Farmers' Federation, who said that One Nation's policy would have a terrible impact for farmers. We won't be taking those suggestions. We'll be coming up with good ideas, not bad ones. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Bell, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>30</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>30</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Canavan, Sen Matthew</name>
                <name.id>245212</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>NATS</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>31</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
              <name.id>319142</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="319142" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator BELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">One Nation Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:45</span>):  Professor Robert Breunig, again, an expert for the Labor government, whose immigration policy has also received Treasury funding, said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">Another good One Nation idea is to stop the inflows of students who are doing low-quality courses.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Will the government adopt One Nation's policy here and refuse student visas for low-quality courses and take that direction?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>31</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:45</span>):  Senator Bell, I realise you haven't been here that long, but this government has already reduced international student numbers, and my recollection of that is that it wasn't supported by all sides sitting over on that side of the chamber when our government reduced those international students. Senator Henderson, I think, might have been the shadow minister at the time, and she had all sorts of good ideas about reducing international student numbers until it came to the time when she had to come in here and vote, and she voted against our efforts to reduce international student numbers.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ZN4" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Henderson:</span>
                  </a>  No, you haven't! They've gone up. They haven't gone down.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  Oh, here we go! I knew that would work.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Henderson?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ZN4" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Henderson:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order on direct relevance, the government withdrew the bill—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Henderson, please resume your seat.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="ZN4" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Henderson:</span>
                  </a>  There was no vote. He doesn't even know what he's talking about.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Henderson, please resume your seat. You know very well that it is a debating point.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Henderson, if only you could see your colleagues' faces when you take points of order—it really is something to behold.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>As for One Nation, I've already made the point that One Nation's policy would have a terrible economic impact on the Australian economy. But the irony of this is that not only does One Nation want to stop skilled migrants coming into Australia; they also oppose training Australians by investing in free TAFE. So they don't want Australians to fill jobs in hospitals, aged care, abattoirs and farms and they don't want migrants to. They want no-one to have a job, and they want the Australian economy to fall apart. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Bell, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
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            <talk.start>
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                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Henderson, Sen Sarah</name>
                <name.id>ZN4</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
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                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
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                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Henderson, Sen Sarah</name>
                <name.id>ZN4</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
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                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Henderson, Sen Sarah</name>
                <name.id>ZN4</name.id>
                <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>31</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>31</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
              <name.id>319142</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="319142" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator BELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">One Nation Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:47</span>):  In the 2025-26 budget, the government forecast a net overseas migration of 260,000 for the last financial year. With the actual numbers soon to be revealed, what are the government's current figures for net overseas migration for the last financial year, and why does the Albanese government continually get its migration forecasts so badly wrong?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>31</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:47</span>):  Senator Bell, you've answered your own question by saying that we haven't yet revealed the figures for net overseas migration. That will be updated at the mid-year financial review. That's what happens. They get updated in the budget, they get updated in MYEFO, and that will occur again this year. In the meantime, the government will continue doing the hard work to come up with a sensible migration policy that does continue to build on our efforts, which have already reduced net overseas migration by 45 per cent. But we will do it in a way that doesn't plunge the Australian economy into recession, that doesn't leave our hospitals and aged-care facilities short of the workers that they need—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="319142" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Bell:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order on relevance, I did ask about the latest prediction for net overseas migration.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  And the minister's being directly relevant to your question. Thank you, Senator Bell.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WATT:</span>
                  </a>  As I say, those figures will be updated in MYEFO, and our migration policy will not plunge Australia's economy into recession, leaving people unemployed. It will not deprive Australian hospitals, aged-care facilities, construction sites or the hospitality industry of the workers that they need, and it will certainly not turn Australians against each other in the way that One Nation is determined to do.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>32</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
                <name.id>319142</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ON</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>32</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>32</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
                <name.id>245759</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Apprenticeships</title>
          <page.no>32</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Apprenticeships</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>32</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Marielle</name>
              <name.id>281603</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="281603" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator MARIELLE SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:49</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Skills and Training, Senator Watt. The Albanese Labor government wants Australians to have access to secure, well-paid jobs, and apprenticeships are a great pathway to getting them. New national apprenticeship data, released today, has found that the Albanese Labor government's focus on priority trades, particularly in housing construction, is paying off. Can the minister outline the impact that the government's policies are having on trade apprenticeship completions and commencements?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>32</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:49</span>):  It's very good to know that Senator Smith's mother and stepfather were both proud TAFE teachers—that's how much Senator Smith believes in the TAFE system. Wouldn't it be nice to have one person over on the other side who believes in the TAFE system!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Albanese Labor government believes in the TAFE system, and we're delivering real change to ensure Australians get the skills they need to fill the jobs we need. We're targeting investment where it will have the greatest impact and in the areas where we face our most pressing challenges, particularly housing construction.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The National Centre for Vocational Education Research released new data today which tracks apprentice and trainee numbers in the 12 months to 31 March 2026. I know the opposition is always interested in the number of people completing their training, and this new data that came out today found that the number of trade apprentices completing their apprenticeships rose 10 per cent—the best result in a decade—while trade commencements are up two per cent year on year for the March quarter in what is the third consecutive quarterly rise. In the March quarter, apprentice commencements in critical occupations saw significant year-on-year jumps: a 19 per cent increase in electrical, a 10 per cent increase in carpentry and joinery, and a five per cent increase in plumbing. The report also found a 15 per cent jump in apprenticeship trade commencements by school students. Commencements by women in construction trades were up nine per cent and in electrotechnology and telecommunications trades they were up seven per cent year on year.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These results demonstrate that the Albanese government's strategy to focus on delivering targeted incentives for apprentices and employers in priority industries is making an impact. Since coming to office, we've worked to better target government investment in apprenticeships into pathways where the apprenticeship is the primary pathway into that occupation, to ensure that investment in priority areas is balanced with spending that's focused and effective. The Albanese government wants Australians to have the first crack at jobs available here, and that's why our government continues to invest in training and apprenticeships.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Smith, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>32</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>32</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Marielle</name>
              <name.id>281603</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="281603" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator MARIELLE SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:51</span>):  Thank you, Minister, for the shout-out to my mum and stepdad. The Albanese Labor government is delivering real change for Australians by providing world-class qualifications through greater access to TAFE. How are the government's incentives for apprentices helping to get more aspiring tradies the skills and training they require for the jobs our country needs right now?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>32</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:52</span>):  Nick is one of the 38,000 new housing construction apprentices backed by our government's $10,000 incentive in the first 14 months of the program. Nick is a first-year carpentry apprentice who's completing a certificate III at Beenleigh TAFE in the electorate of Forde. On the $10,000 incentive, Nick said: 'Yes, it definitely helps. Being an apprentice is pretty tough. I think it's a brilliant idea.'</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We know that one person who doesn't back the incentive, or Nick the carpenter, is the Liberal shadow minister Senator Nampijinpa Price, who has previously opposed these incentives. She might need to reconsider that if she wants Nick's support, because, according to this Saturday's edition of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian</span> newspaper, Senator Nampijinpa Price is eyeing a move to the lower house in the seat of Forde, which of course is home to the Beenleigh TAFE. Queenslanders take well to people from other states parachuting in and expecting to have a seat! All the best, Senator Nampijinpa Price! <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Smith, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>32</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Marielle</name>
              <name.id>281603</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="281603" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator MARIELLE SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:53</span>):  The Albanese Labor government is backing more Australians to pick up the tools, become a tradie and get to work to help build more homes. How is the government supporting tradies to complete their apprenticeships, and are there any alternative policy positions to these successful programs?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Watt, Sen Murray</name>
              <name.id>245759</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="245759" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WATT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the Environment and Water</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:53</span>):  The Albanese government does want to give Australians the best chance of filling the jobs that we need, and that means giving them the training that they need. We know that the right-wing coalition of the Liberals, the Nationals and One Nation want to cut TAFE and make it harder for chippies, sparkies and plumbers to get the qualifications they need.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">One Nation, of course, also want to massively cut the number of skilled migrants, which will send the Australian economy into a deep recession and deprive our suburbs and regions of the nurses, aged-care workers and hospitality staff they need. One Nation also want to stop Australians from filling those jobs, because they also want to cut the training programs that Australians depend on. This is the Australia that One Nation wants: zero skilled migrants building homes, zero Australians being trained to build those homes and zero new homes. Zero plus zero equals zero in One Nation's world. That's because One Nation have zero ideas for taking Australians forward.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Only the Albanese Labor government is backing our tradies to get the skills and training they need to get ahead. They won't get it from the Liberals or One Nation. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>33</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Housing</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
              <name.id>283585</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="283585" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:54</span>):  My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Minister Wong. New analysis by Aussie Home Loans shows that 20 per cent of Australians who bought a home in the past three years are now trapped in mortgage prison, facing higher repayments, falling property values and, for some, negative equity. What does the Prime Minister say to Australians who bought a home under Labor and are now financially worse off—'We know you're in pain'?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:55</span>):  The first point I'd make is that we know that the problems in the Australian housing market are fundamentally an issue of supply and demand and the failure of governments to invest in—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Opposition senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order on my left!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  As I was saying, the fundamental problem with the housing market in Australia has been that supply has not kept up with demand, which is why we saw the extent of price increases over so many years, which did make homes unaffordable. So this government has, firstly, focused on what we have to do to increase supply so that we can get more people into their own homes and more Australians have the opportunity to own their own homes. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Secondly, we have ensured, through our tax changes, that there is a stronger investment incentive for building new housing supply. I would make the point that I know that those opposite don't care about more supply, but investor loans for new builds show a 27.5 per cent increase and construction loans show a 20 per cent increase. What that shows is that the market is responding to the fact that there are now more tax incentives for new builds—that is, to bring more supply into the market—than simply giving investors a tax break to compete against first home buyers with already existing builds.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In relation to making sure more young people can enter the market, you will know that our five per cent deposits has ensured that many Australians have been— <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator O'Sullivan, first supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>33</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>33</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>33</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
              <name.id>283585</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="283585" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:57</span>):  For Australians now trapped in negative equity—that is, owing more on their mortgage than their home is worth—how many more Australians does the Prime Minister expect will fall into negative equity if house prices keep falling and interest rates stay where they are?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>33</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:57</span>):  I would make the point that, when you were in government, just over two per cent of borrowers were in negative equity. According to the Reserve Bank of Australia, less than one per cent of mortgage holders are, in fact, in negative equity, and I don't recall you, as a backbencher, or anyone else on that side at that stage talking about negative equity on those occasions. We did not see outrage from the coalition when it came to the situation where more than twice as many Australians were in negative equity under them, and I think that says something. It says something to Australians that those opposite are very happy to champion the tax breaks for investors, giving them a competitive advantage against first time buyers. But they really can't stand it—can they?—when a government works to ensure that more first home buyers get into the market. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator O'Sullivan, second supplementary?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>34</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </answer>
        <question>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>34</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
              <name.id>283585</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="283585" type="MemberQuestion">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberQuestion">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:58</span>):  The Prime Minister promised Australians that he would make housing more affordable. Was this—that is, higher repayments, falling house values and Australians trapped in negative equity—Anthony Albanese's idea of making housing more affordable?</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </question>
        <answer>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>34</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberAnswer">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberAnswer">Senator WONG</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for Foreign Affairs and Leader of the Government in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">14:59</span>):  Senator, the key to housing affordability is, first and foremost, additional supply. That is the key to housing affordability, and we've seen the price of houses in this country be unsustainably high for so many Australians. That has meant that Australians have been locked out of the housing market and it has meant a 400 per cent increase in the past 25 years. You may think that is a good thing, but we think it is important to bring more supply into the market so that we give more young Australians the opportunity—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Opposition senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order! The constant interjections from those on my left are discourteous and disorderly.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="00AOU" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator WONG:</span>
                  </a>  I know you don't like it, but, actually, bringing more houses into the market and making sure that we don't give investors a competitive advantage over first home buyers is the right thing to do. I know you can't bear the fact that this is about increasing the opportunity for young people in this country. On that note, I ask that further questions be placed on the <span style="font-style:italic;">Notice Paper</span>.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>34</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>34</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Wong, Sen Penny</name>
                <name.id>00AOU</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
        </answer>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE: TAKE NOTE OF ANSWERS</title>
        <page.no>34</page.no>
        <type>QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE: TAKE NOTE OF ANSWERS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE: TAKE NOTE OF ANSWERS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Answers to Questions</title>
          <page.no>34</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Answers to Questions</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>34</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Sharma, Sen Dave</name>
              <name.id>274506</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="274506" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHARMA</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:01</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the answers given by ministers to questions without notice asked by coalition senators today.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">What we have with Labor's housing policy today, explained to us in question time, is a series of misses and own goals. We've got fewer homes being built. We've got higher repayments, if you're a mortgage holder. We've got higher rents, if you're in the rental market. We've got falling house values, and, increasingly, we've got home borrowers in the situation of either negative equity or mortgage prison, as it's called.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Foreign minister was quite right to point out that this was a supply issue, fundamentally an issue of supply and demand, but, if you agree with that diagnosis, then the prescription needs to be more supply. What we've seen from this Labor government is less supply. We're seeing fewer homes being built—173,000 homes last year versus a requirement of 240,000 homes a year to meet Labor's own housing accord targets. We've got builders in the construction industry going broke. We've had 13,000 construction businesses become insolvent since Labor came to office, and we're seeing more and more collapses in the construction industry. Builders are not building right now, because, in a falling market, they can't pre-sale. They can't pre-sell apartments and properties. They find it harder to raise capital, and they can't guarantee a return on their investment, so you've got builders putting down their tools.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We've got a lack of investor confidence. The changes to tax settings, the abolition of negative gearing and changes to the capital gains tax discount regime, in Labor's budget of broken promises is causing investors to withdraw from the market. Labor's own predictions in the budget said that there would be fewer homes and higher rents and a moderation in house price growth, but what we are seeing is all of those things happen at a much faster rate and in a much more pronounced way than we expected. In the situation we've got right now, if we've got falling house prices, we've got investors sitting on the sidelines, because they don't want to invest into a falling market. Further, we've got institutional investors and individual investors no longer able to enter the market in the same way, because of the changes to the negative gearing treatment of investment property and existing homes, so we've got less investment in the market. We've got builders building less because of less confidence in the market, and we've got fewer homes being built.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">You put all that together—the housing market is in crisis here in Australia. This isn't just a cyclical correction. This is a fundamental change to the structure of the housing market. Just today, there are reports that it's now going to take new homeowners some eight additional years to save for a house deposit, if they're doing so through vehicles like shares or like managed trusts or investments, because of changes to the capital gains tax regime. Reports again today are showing that a large number of Australian households are in so-called mortgage prison, owning less than 20 per cent of equity in their home because of the deterioration of values. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">If you're a renter right now, you're paying more. All the indications are that, with the rental market tighter—with markets like Sydney and Perth with about one per cent vacancy—landlords are going to have to put rent up even further because they no longer get the benefit of negative gearing. If you're a mortgage holder, you've endured something like 15 interest rate rises—including three this past year and the very strong possibility of a fourth later this month—which means you're paying more in interest every month. Even if you own your own home, you've seen the value of that asset, the most important asset that many families own, deteriorate remarkably. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This is an issue of supply and demand. In Labor's policies, what they're doing is they are crimping supply and they're doing nothing to introduce demand. The Liberals' approach is the opposite. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>35</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Dowling, Sen Richard</name>
              <name.id>55842</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="55842" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DOWLING</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:05</span>):  We hear a lot being thrown around right now. It's really not helpful to use emotive language like 'mortgage prison' and 'trapped'. There's nothing unusual in many buyers finding themselves in a temporary period of so-called negative equity. That means at a particular point in time you owe more than the notional value of the house under your mortgage. That's always been less than two per cent in Australia. It was much higher under the previous government. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Current figures are around one per cent, and the RBA and many real estate analysts have pointed out that this is not an issue for long-term investors. Most people who buy a house are doing it for the long term, and what matters is the valuation five, 10 or 20 years down the track. A temporary period of negative equity is a silent issue, according to the Reserve Bank of Australia. It is not one that we should seek to make political hay out of. It is something that is not unusual. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">For decades the Australian property market has had cyclical features about it, so there will always be periods where house prices do not go up in a straight line. House prices have a period of moderation. Particularly over the rapid growth in the post-COVID period of low interest rates, we saw a huge spike in house prices. Therefore, it's only understandable that at some point there would be a cyclical correction and we would start to see house prices moderate. That means, if you bought a house at a particular time, you may find in the immediate period afterwards that the price goes back somewhat. It doesn't actually have a direct economic consequence unless you're in a position to sell—unless you are forced to sell. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">One of the great things that we've achieved in recent times is record generational low unemployment in Australia, very much in the low 4½ per cent range, which is almost considered full employment. When you have those levels of strong employment, you don't have the levels of mortgage stress and forced selling. That is one of the really important things to underpin: the very responsible approach that Australian households and mortgage holders take. They are in very strong balance sheet positions to be able to service their mortgages. Whether households are able to continue to service their mortgages—that is what really matters, not a notional valuation compared to the loan book. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I think it's helpful to get some facts on the table around that, and there's a reason why we're acting on housing in the first place. I cannot see how anybody could say the status quo was acceptable. We've seen house prices grow by 400 per cent since 1999—400 per cent. Wages have probably grown by around half of that amount. It's made homeownership totally out of reach for a whole range of middle-range professions that used to aspire to homeownership and now no longer have that opportunity. We are trying to correct that and give ordinary working people an opportunity to get into their own home. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">That is not just an equity issue or an intergenerational equity issue; it's also a productivity issue. Workers need to be able to find housing where employment is, and we want to be able to have affordable housing so people can tap in to the employment opportunities that are out there. One of the most important ways, as was outlined in question time, is increasing supply. Supply is the main game here. Yes, there are some tax measures, but supply is what this is all about in this debate and will continue to drive more housing. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>35</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Antic, Sen Alex</name>
              <name.id>269375</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="269375" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator ANTIC</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:09</span>):  We're taking note of all answers given to coalition senators this afternoon, but there was one answer that stood out to me as a South Australian. It was the answer given by Minister Wong about the closure of the Whyalla blast furnace which was recently confirmed by the administrators of the plant. They confirmed that it will never be relit now, which is a surprise to almost nobody but a tragedy for the 500 workers who are going to be made redundant. They're expected to be victims of this closure, and it's my contention therefore that they are also victims of Labor's relentless ideological pursuit of the climate scam, as it is now known and as it is now openly referred to.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The so-called decarbonisation of this country makes it near impossible to do any sort of manufacturing and therefore provide jobs for Australians. It certainly makes it impossible to keep a blast furnace competitive by price. We were talking this morning about what sort of prospect you'd have of building this very building we're in today when a result of the climate scam is that we don't even make flat glass in this country anymore, let alone any of the other products that would have gone into it. That's the Australia we live in now.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">All the while, our international competitors blast ahead, so to speak. You don't think you're going to see the same excuses the government are using for this closure—'old equipment', 'hole in the ozone layer', 'my dog did it'. Whatever the excuses are, you don't see them coming out of the People's Republic of China; they're just carrying on. And what have they got? They've got cheap energy.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Once again, Labor prioritises their positioning in amongst the global elite and in amongst the global climate glitterati higher than they do Australian jobs. It doesn't sound very much to me like the words that we heard coming out of the great premier from South Australia, the exalted man that can do no wrong in the eyes of the Adelaide <span style="font-style:italic;">Advertiser</span>! By the way, the Adelaide <span style="font-style:italic;">Advertiser</span> gets a lot of kickbacks from the state government in South Australia. It's totally unrelated, but I thought I'd throw it in there, just as we're here! The words 'green energy superpower', 'green energy superpower', 'green energy superpower'—it doesn't sound much like a green energy superpower out in Whyalla anymore.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The other one who stood up this week was the great—what do they call him?—minister for climate or the minister for the environment, Minister Bowen, who is the gift that keeps on giving. My advice, though I hate to give advice to the Australian Labor Party, is to keep rolling that guy out, particularly on social media, where he has almost a world record now in ratios. For people who don't know what a ratio is, it's when you put up a comment and you then get smashed by the comments coming back at you. He is a world leader in that respect. But he also—what did he say? He said he 'never bought into the hype'. It's unimaginable. To say those words—they're right here. It must have been 15 times that he bought into the hype or at least proclaimed to. On 13 April 2023—it's a long time ago, by the way, so maybe his memory is not quite there—the minister said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">Today's release of the annual State of Hydrogen report reinforces that Australia has the foundations to become a global leader in green hydrogen.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">On 23 May of the same year, he said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">Now some people might think, oh, you know, is green hydrogen real, is it going to happen? Well, it's already being manufactured right there in Gladstone …</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I'm going to run out of time, but there are so many more. There are millions of them! Unbelievable! <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>36</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:13</span>):  Can I start by expressing sympathy with the people in Whyalla and an understanding that they are going through a really insecure period at the moment. When industries that are highly important to local towns are in jeopardy or have threats associated with them, it creates deep insecurity around jobs and people's lives. So I think it's incumbent on us to recognise that when we start debates like this, because these are people's lives, and there are huge impacts not only on people's economic futures but also on their families and their communities. So I start on that note.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But I quickly turn to a note of incredulity because the coalition's approach to this today just illustrates once again why they are not an alternative government in their current state. The first reason for that is that their industry policy has no coherence. It is utterly contradictory at its core, and the people opposite don't understand where they stand on this economically. Industry policy has had a complicated and difficult history in this country, but it is something that requires close attention. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The reason I say they have no coherence is that in the past you could reliably know that the coalition would oppose industry policy. People like former treasurer Joe Hockey would stand there and tell the car industry to go overseas, damned be the jobs, damned be the impact on the Australian economy. But today you don't know that because they don't know where they stand. They're opposed to the investment in Australian industry. They opposed Future Made in Australia. But every time one of these plants is under jeopardy, every time people's jobs and communities are on the line, they come in here and bleat about it. They complain about the job losses, but they don't actually support the solutions. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The second reason they have no coherence or no credibility as an alternative government is they don't look at the whole picture because the whole picture requires you to see the whole board but then also look at details. The opportunism on show today was really quite something. You've had opposition members say that this is all about energy. Well, actually the blast furnace that has shut down and is causing this difficulty is actually about a failure to invest in that maintenance and the technology itself, but it also reflects an older technology that probably needs to be replaced in the long-term. So when they talk about energy, they're really talking past the blast furnace issue. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's a blast furnace that the people in Whyalla have tried to get working, but they can't do it and keep workers safe at the same time. There was not a word about worker safety today either when it came to the blast furnace. You then had Senator Antic saying, 'We should just try and emulate China because the only difference between the Australian economy and the Chinese economy is they have cheap energy prices.' You must be joking. The simplistic reductionist nonsense on economic policy that comes from the coalition today must make their former finance ministers and treasurers just embarrassed to be a part of this party. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But I can tell you there's a different approach on the Labor side. There's a different approach that is committed to not only a thriving and dynamic market economy but one recognises that, in the global environment we're in right now, industry policy has changed as well. That's because we have a strategic environment that requires us to allyshore and friendshore some aspects of our supply chains to prevent monopolies. It's because, from a competitive perspective globally, we have countries around the world that are also protecting their own industries, and in order to give Australian companies and firms and workers a fair shot and a fair and free marketplace, we need industry policy here too. It's about levelling the playing field. It's not about giving us an unnecessary advantage. It's about recognising the global environment we're in. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The third thing is that it's recognising that industrial capacity is important for an economy. It's important for two reasons. It's important for jobs and it's important to ensure that you have diversity in an economy so you're not vulnerable to price shocks. If you're highly limited in the number of industries and areas that you compete in globally and one of them goes up or down, you effectively go up and down with it. That diversity is important too. This government recognises that the government needs an industry policy. Government can't be the dumb money, but it needs to be done in a structured and smart way. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>37</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Blyth, Sen Leah</name>
              <name.id>315170</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="315170" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BLYTH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:17</span>):  The irony coming from those on the other side of this chamber! It is devastating what the closure of the blast furnace means for the people of Whyalla. As a proud South Australian, it is something that you never, ever want to see. This is after $2.4 billion of taxpayer money was invested to keep this blast furnace going and to keep the ability to make steel a sovereign capability here in Australia. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The irony is not lost on me. We live in a country that has bountiful resources. We have more iron ore than we could possibly ever, ever need, we have gas, and we have coal. What we don't have in this country is cheap, reliable power that makes us able to manufacture things like steel at an affordable rate. You want to talk about why the investment wasn't made into the old technology of the blast furnace? That's because companies, the steelworks, were too busy paying high electricity prices. Because of the high energy prices, it was no longer economical to be able to make steel and to be able to invest in the technology that they needed to keep the steelworks going well into the future.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The politics and ideology from this Labor government has meant that the only steelworks we have left in South Australia is now shut. What does that mean for Australia? What does that mean for our sovereign capability? What does that mean for the township of Whyalla? Overnight 600 people lost their jobs in a country town with no prospect of anything to replace it. I think of some of the job offers that the Labor premier in South Australia was talking about yesterday. They were talking about between 10 and 15 jobs. Well, that's going to be really great for the 585 people that aren't going to be lucky enough to get one of those very few jobs.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This is an absolute disgrace and a failure in policy from this Labor government not just at a federal level but at a state level too. We want to talk about this green hydrogen fantasy and how green hydrogen was going to mean we could make green steel in Australia. That fantasy has sent us down a path of not being able to make steel at all. What is this going to mean for things like Osborne? We want to build submarines and ships in Australia, but we can't make steel. What is it going to mean for places like Henderson? What does it mean for our Defence capability in this country that we are going to rely on international supply chains at a time when this government says we are living in the most dangerous strategic environment since the end of the Second World War?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This Labor government has followed a net-zero ideology, and what it has done is kill the industrial base in Australia. They have gutted it. It has meant that towns like Whyalla won't prosper anymore. Those 600 people are going to have to move away and find jobs elsewhere. When we do get that new technology, if there is a new blast furnace that the new buyer of the steelworks might invest in and put in—but who knows, because there is still no buyer. There are people that are interested, but, now that the blast furnace doesn't start, are they still interested? Are we still going to be able to sell it, are we still going to be able to make steel, and who is going to make that steel? The people that have lost their jobs can't sit around and wait six months, until a new buyer comes in, for a new job to be offered to them. This is an absolute, catastrophic failure. This is what following a net-zero ideology is doing to Australia across our whole country, and it's a disgrace.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Waste Management and Recycling: Plastic Packaging</title>
          <page.no>37</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Waste Management and Recycling: Plastic Packaging</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>37</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
              <name.id>310860</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator HODGINS-MAY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:22</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Minister for the Environment and Water (Murray Watt) to a question without notice I asked today relating to Labor's monumental backflip on bringing in a federally mandated packaging scheme.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Only this Labor government could look at a policy this straightforward, look at the evidence, hear the overwhelming support for reform and say yeah-nah. This reform is backed by environmental groups. It is backed by recyclers and the waste industry. It is backed by packaging producers and businesses that want a level playing field. Australians themselves have told government through their own consultation that they want action and that they expect action. And what does Labor say? 'Yeah-nah, not today. Probably not tomorrow either.' What a load of garbage from a government that itself conceded that voluntary packaging schemes do not work.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The principle for reform is so incredibly simple. If you produce packaging, you should be responsible for what happens to it from cradle to grave. You shouldn't be able to put millions of tonnes of plastic packaging into the Australian market, make your profit and then make households foot the bill through council rates and waste charges. That is what the current system does. That is what this Labor government is willing to let continue. When it isn't consumers paying the price, it's our environment. It's our oceans, our rivers, our wildlife, and Labor's response is to keep kicking that can down the road.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Minister Watt talked about Labor being the only government that has ever taken action on waste and recycling. Well, Minister, those actions speak for themselves. The voluntary approach has failed. Australia was supposed to have 100 per cent of packaging reusable, recyclable or compostable by 2025—last year. We reached 86 per cent. We were supposed to recycle or compost 70 per cent of plastic packaging. We reached just 20 per cent. We were 50 per cent short. We are leading the world in one of the sorriest leaderboards there is, and that is the amount of plastic waste that we produce. Even APCO, the organisation responsible for driving these packaging targets, is now advocating for nationally consistent regulation and extended producer responsibility because the current system isn't working. They acknowledge that. When the minister tells us, insults us, with comments that Labor has acted, the results or lack thereof simply speak for themselves. While the minister pontificated to me and patted himself on the back for what a good job he thinks he's done, the recycling industry was sitting in here in the gallery. They were listening to his dribble and his avoidance. What an embarrassment he brought to this place today.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Industry is demanding urgent action. Environmental groups want reform. They want less waste. Packaging companies want certainty. Australians want less waste in their rivers, in their bodies, in their local environments. Why doesn't Labor? Minister, you and I both have increasing amounts of microplastics in our bodies, as much as 4,800 micrograms of microplastic per gram of brain tissue. After the answers I heard from the minister, I do wonder if he's got a bit more in each brain cell. The minister was quick to call out the number of recycling centres that have opened under Labor but failed to mention that Australia's plastic recycling facilities are operating at around only half of their available capacity. I would suggest that this minister focuses less on the Greens, who, by the way, have been fighting for this reform since before he was even elected to this place, and more on mandating that plastic packaging actually reaches these plants.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Then there's the question the minister, of course, didn't want to answer. He really didn't like this one. It comes down to following the money. Pratt Holdings, one of Labor's biggest corporate donors, owns Visy, a major packaging company that has opposed mandatory packaging reform. Australians are entitled to ask whether this has anything to do with Labor's backflip away from a reform that it has spent years promising and to ask whether it was a captain's call from the very top, because, frankly, nothing else makes sense. This should be a no-brainer. Make producers responsible for the plastic waste that they are producing. Build a functioning recycling industry. Stop dumping those costs onto families and onto households. Finally, deliver the mandatory national packaging scheme that Labor promised.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Defence Procurement: Submarines</title>
          <page.no>38</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Defence Procurement: Submarines</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>38</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
              <name.id>250026</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>JLN</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:27</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs (Senator Watt) to a question without notice I asked today relating to AUKUS.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Not a week goes by where I'm not surprised by the AUKUS program. I'm not against nuclear powered submarines, but I am against the delinquent spending of taxpayers' money, especially when Australians are dealing with a cost-of-living crisis and when our national debt is heading off a cliff. AUKUS has massively impacted Defence, with procurement projects, upgrade projects, the maximum number of annual reserve service days and the Defence estate all subject to cuts, and now it's impacting the Australian Federal Police. There has been some extra funding for the AUKUS command for the AFP to protect those AUKUS assets in Western Australia, so the whole AFP got an overall headcount increase, including protective service officers. But the portfolio budget statements only increased the headcount by 101.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We hear from the minister today that the head count is increasing by 435. No-one knew about that. We already know that, for the AUKUS security framework, at least 199 personnel are needed. How was recruiting to cope with these additional numbers not known until today? I suggest the AFP officers will still need to be pulled away from other frontline duties until the AFP recruitment catches up. We'll be disrupting the lives of AFP officers and their families, forcing redeployment of officers from potentially important frontline roles, creating operational friction, degrading our overall capacity—all to protect not Australian assets but foreign owned assets, American and British assets. The AFP recognises that their people are their greatest asset. My challenge to the government is to make sure the AFP is properly funded so the AUKUS impact won't hurt the people.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Migration</title>
          <page.no>39</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Migration</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>39</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bell, Sen Sean</name>
              <name.id>319142</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="319142" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BELL</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">One Nation Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:29</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs (Senator Watt) to a question without notice I asked today relating to migration.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">What we heard today was more deflection from a Labor government that has lost control of immigration. I asked a simple question about visa-hopping, low-quality student courses and Labor's failed migration forecasts, but we could not get a straight answer on them. Why? It's because, on ending mass migration, the Labor Party is hopelessly divided. Ministers like Tony Burke and Jim Chalmers—through you, Deputy President—cannot agree on the direction of migration policy, and the Prime Minister simply refuses to make a call.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">They will not outline a real policy forward on ending mass migration. Labor forecasts overseas migration of 260,000. That was in their budget, and yet they can't tell us what it's going to be. When I ask a straightforward question on that, they refuse to answer. Meanwhile, Australians are paying the price through housing pressure, high rents and overloaded infrastructure. Unlike Labor, One Nation has a clear plan. We can end the visa hopping. We can stop low-quality student visa rorts, and we can end mass migration and put Australians first.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Artificial Intelligence</title>
          <page.no>39</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Artificial Intelligence</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>39</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:30</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate take note of the answer given by the Special Minister of State (Senator Farrell) to a question without notice I asked today relating to consultation on artificial intelligence, copyright and the government's approach.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">He said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The terms … include terms regarding the control and the payment … owners in relation to the use of their material … Strong protections for … artists and the media will remain a core … approach …</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">However, information that I have received contradicts this statement. In fact, information provided to me suggests that the government is consulting on options that significantly weaken protections for creatives and other rights holders. In fact, the government is consulting on the opposite of what we currently have.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Under the current laws, content is automatically protected under our copyright laws. That's the default position. The onus is on AI companies and others to seek permission and make payment to utilise copyright material. Shockingly, despite what the Prime Minister and others have said, the government is seeking to flip that onus. They want to put the onus on creatives, on artists and on everyday Australians to actively seek to protect their work through a statutory data-training authorisation model, and this model would give AI companies statutory permission to access material on the internet for training purposes. It would mean putting AI companies' interests over those of everyday Australians, giving AI companies access to all Australians' content, unless they opt out and somehow put some sort of label on it to say 'please don't use this for training'.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This would be huge and mean that our legal system would protect AI companies first and Australians second. The burden should not fall on Australians to defend the rights they already hold over content they create and own and invest in. I'm deeply concerned by this, and I seek leave to table screenshots of consultation proposals from the government.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave not granted.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  Pursuant to contingent notice, I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That so much of the standing orders be suspended as would prevent me from tabling a document.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I'm really concerned, when it comes to these big AI companies, that the government is not only going to go against what they've promised the Australian people—that probably wouldn't be a big surprise to many—but going to throw Australian creatives under the bus, the bus that is the express bus to data centres and the express bus to training AI models here in Australia. That is something that we should not tolerate as the Senate. Creatives own that intellectual property. That is their property, and we rightly have a copyright system that we should be proud of. If these companies that come to us and say that they are the most valuable companies in the history of the world and that they have technology that's going to—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="30484" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The DEPUTY PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, I'll ask you to resume your seat. I was just getting some advice from the clerk. The time for taking note of answers has expired, so we do need to move on. You are free to speak to the whips about future events, but we do need to move on now.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>39</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade (The DEPUTY PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>30484</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>40</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Artificial Intelligence</title>
          <page.no>40</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Artificial Intelligence</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>40</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
              <name.id>112096</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The PRESIDENT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Time">15:34</span>):  Senator Pocock, you need to seek leave again, because that was a hard marker. We're done and dusted with that. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>40</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:34</span>):  I seek leave to table a document. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave not granted. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  I'll do it again then. Pursuant to contingent notice of motion, I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That so much of the standing orders be suspended as would prevent me from tabling a document. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Do you wish to speak to it, or do you want me to put the motion? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  I might just finish. I've got a couple of minutes, thanks to the Senate. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, I do want to remind you this is a suspension motion, so you can't go to the substantive matters. You need to focus on why it is important that you've moved that motion and what's urgent about it. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  For people listening along, the government has told us many times that they respect copyright. That they want to look after creatives whose income and work is what they've written, what they've recorded—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  I'm going to remind you again: it is about your reasons for suspending. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  And this is exactly why I'm suspending—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  You're not in a debate with me, Senator. But you've moved to suspend business so that you can deal with this. You need to tell my why it's important. I don't mind the odd sentence about the substantive matter, but this is a suspension motion. It is not about the substantive matter. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  I'm suspending to try and table a document that shows that the government, in consultation—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Just a moment, Senator Pocock. I've got Senator Sheldon on his feet.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="168275" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Sheldon:</span>
                  </a>  Just as a point of order, it's normal for correspondence and documents that are wanted to be handed up to be given to both parties. We haven't seen the document that we're referring to.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  That is true, but that's a debating point. You will recall the Deputy President invited Senator Pocock to share the information that he wants to table.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  I'm trying to table this information from a government consultation which basically goes against everything that they've told us publicly. It flips the protection on copyright—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Once again, Senator Pocock, I'm going to remind you that it is about the suspension.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  I'm suspending to table this. Is that not— </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Yes, but you need to explain to the Senate why it's important for your suspension to get up, not to debate the substantive matter. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  Okay. I'm trying to explain that it's important that I suspend so I can table this information so the Senate can actually see what the government's doing, because the government publicly is telling us one thing, but, in consultation, is presenting a solution which is not that thing. I think we have a Senate that would like to back our creatives and would like to back the people who have told— </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, please resume your seat. Senator Chisholm, why are you on your feet? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="39801" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Chisholm:</span>
                  </a>  He's not following the direction from the chair. He could've actually consulted with us about this—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  We're going to the substantive matter. I will remind you, Senator Pocock, once again to focus on the suspension. </span>
              </p>
              <a href="250026" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Lambie interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Lambie, come to order.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Lambie:</span>
                  </a>  Let him table the document!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Order! Order across the chamber.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Honourable senators interjecting</span>—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Chisholm! Order! Senator Lambie, take note. I am standing because you are out of order. </span>
              </p>
              <a href="250026" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Lambie interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  No, Senator Lambie.</span>
              </p>
              <a href="250026" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Lambie interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Lambie, resume your seat. I will name you. Senator Duniam. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="263418" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Duniam:</span>
                  </a>  On a point of order, I'm just seeking some clarification. I'm just wondering whether it is the case that, if the document was circulated in the ordinary way and the government were able to look at it, we might then be able to seek to—</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you for that help, Senator Duniam. I will remind you that the Deputy President invited Senator Pocock to share the document with the whips, so he's already had that invitation. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                  </a>  President, given how upset some colleagues are with using the standing orders, we might just put the question and get this done. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Thank you, Senator Pocock. Senator Chisholm, you're speaking to the motion. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="39801" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Chisholm:</span>
                  </a>  Yes.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Pocock, I'm informed you can't move that the question be put on your own motion. I call Senator Chisholm.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Sheldon, Sen Tony</name>
                <name.id>168275</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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          <continue>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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          </continue>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Chisholm, Sen Anthony</name>
                <name.id>39801</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>40</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Lambie interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
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          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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          </interjection>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                <name.id>250026</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>JLN</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Lambie interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Lambie interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Duniam, Sen Jonathon</name>
                <name.id>263418</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Chisholm, Sen Anthony</name>
                <name.id>39801</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
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            </talk.text>
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          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>41</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Chisholm, Sen Anthony</name>
              <name.id>39801</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="39801" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CHISHOLM</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Assistant Minister for Regional Development, Assistant Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry, Assistant Minister for Resources and Deputy Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:39</span>):  This matter isn't urgent and Senator Pocock never put forward any coherent argument about why this matter urgently needs to be dealt with now. The fact of the matter is he knows the procedure that people go through to table documents. It's actually not that hard to do, but this is the second week in a row that Senator Pocock has ignored that because he's more interested in using this to do a stunt and get a social media video. We know what motivates him. It's actually quite easy to do this if you want to do it properly. Senator Pocock hasn't done it properly for the second week in a row.</span>
              </p>
              <a href="250026" type="GeneralIInterjecting">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralIInterjecting">Senator Lambie interjecting</span>—</span>
                </p>
              </a>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Lambie, if you don't come to order, I will name you. I've warned you. It's the standing orders. You don't stand up and yell out like that. If I don't notice you, the Clerk will draw it to my attention.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Lambie:</span>
                  </a>  I raise a point of order on relevance.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  Senator Chisholm is speaking to the reasons around a suspension.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="39801" type="MemberContinuation">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator CHISHOLM:</span>
                  </a>  As I was saying, Senator Pocock knows the procedure that people go through in these matters. It's not that hard to do. Most of the senators in the chamber comply with it—and it's just a bit of courtesy, to be honest, about treating each other with respect in how documents are tabled. I encourage Senator Pocock to move away from the stunts that he seems prone to want to do and just treat the chamber with the respect that so many other senators are happy to show when it comes to the tabling of documents.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  The question is that the suspension motion as moved by Senator David Pocock be agreed to.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Senator Lambie interjecting—</name>
                <name.id />
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                <name.id>250026</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>JLN</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Chisholm, Sen Anthony</name>
                <name.id>39801</name.id>
                <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
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            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>41</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
        <division>
          <division.header>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [15:45]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
            </body>
          </division.header>
          <division.data>
            <ayes>
              <num.votes>35</num.votes>
              <title>AYES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                <name>Antic, A.</name>
                <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                <name>Bell, S.</name>
                <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                <name>Collins, J.</name>
                <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                <name>Hume, J.</name>
                <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                <name>Payman, F.</name>
                <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                <name>Thorpe, L. A.</name>
                <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                <name>Whitten, T.</name>
              </names>
            </ayes>
            <noes>
              <num.votes>20</num.votes>
              <title>NOES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                <name>Lines, S.</name>
                <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                <name>Polley, H.</name>
                <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                <name>Walker, C.</name>
                <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
              </names>
            </noes>
            <pairs>
              <num.votes>10</num.votes>
              <title>PAIRS</title>
              <names>
                <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                <name>Wong, P.</name>
                <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                <name>Cox, D.</name>
                <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                <name>Grogan, K.</name>
              </names>
            </pairs>
          </division.data>
          <division.result>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to.</p>
            </body>
          </division.result>
        </division>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>42</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>256136</name.id>
              <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
              <party>IND</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:48</span>):  I table a document relating to AI consultation.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>NOTICES</title>
        <page.no>42</page.no>
        <type>NOTICES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">NOTICES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Presentation</title>
          <page.no>42</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Presentation</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Kovacic</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(1) That a select committee, to be known as the Select Committee on Corruption in the Construction Industry, be established to inquire into and report on:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) allegations of corruption, criminal infiltration, intimidation, coercion and misconduct in the construction industry;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the impact of such conduct on project costs, productivity, workplace safety, competition and public confidence in the construction industry;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the adequacy of Commonwealth laws, policies, procurement rules, regulatory frameworks and enforcement responses;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) risks arising in relation to tendering, subcontracting, labour hire, industrial arrangements and Commonwealth-funded projects;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) the adequacy of existing oversight and administration mechanisms, and whether administrative or legislative reform is required; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) any other related matters.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(2) That the committee present its report by 12 March 2027.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(3) That the committee consist of 7 senators, as follows:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) three nominated by the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) two nominated by the Leader of the Government in the Senate;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) one nominated by the Leader of the Australian Greens; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) one nominated by minority party or independent senators.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(4) That:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) participating members may be appointed to the committee on the nomination of the Leader of the Government in the Senate, the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate or any minority party or independent senator;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) participating members may participate in hearings of evidence and deliberations of the committee, and have all the rights of members of the committee, but may not vote on any questions before the committee; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) a participating member shall be taken to be a member of a committee for the purpose of forming a quorum of the committee if a majority of members of the committee is not present.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(5) That the committee may proceed to the dispatch of business notwithstanding that all members have not been duly nominated and appointed and notwithstanding any vacancy.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(6) That the committee elect as chair a member nominated by the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate and, as deputy chair, the member nominated by the Leader of the Australian Greens.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(7) That the deputy chair shall act as chair when the chair is absent from a meeting of the committee or the position of chair is temporarily vacant.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(8) That, in the event of an equally divided vote, the chair, or the deputy chair when acting as chair, have a casting vote.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(9) That the committee have power to appoint subcommittees consisting of 3 or more of its members, and to refer to any such subcommittee any of the matters which the committee is empowered to consider.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(10) That the committee and any subcommittee have power to send for and examine persons and documents, to move from place to place, to sit in public or in private, notwithstanding any prorogation of the Parliament or dissolution of the House of Representatives, and have leave to report from time to time its proceedings and the evidence taken and such interim recommendations as it may deem fit.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(11) That the committee be provided with all necessary staff, facilities and resources and be empowered to appoint persons with specialist knowledge for the purposes of the committee with the approval of the President.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(12) That the committee be empowered to print from day to day such papers and evidence as may be ordered by it, and a daily Hansard be published of such proceedings as take place in public. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Payman</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Defence, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 16 October 2026, copies of all ministerial submissions, briefing notes, meeting notes, emails and instant or other electronic messages held by the Minister for Defence, his office or the Department of Defence which relate to the incident referred to in question on notice no. 74 of the 2026-27 Budget estimates in which a shipment of firearms was delayed due to import permit changes. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 726</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Payman</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the Senate notes that, in response to a question on notice with portfolio question number SQ26-000696, asked during the 2026-27 Budget estimates and relating to the United States Department of State's planned 'freedom.gov' service, the Office of the eSafety Commissioner responded to 3 parts of the question by stating 'As the service is not operational the question is hypothetical and falls within the ambit of Senate standing order 73';</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the Senate affirms that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) standing order 73 does not apply to Senate estimates,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) there is no rule against the asking of hypothetical questions during Senate estimates, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the only relevant rule is the standard test of relevance; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Communications, by no later than 5 pm on Thursday, 24 September 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) a new response to the question which does not refer to irrelevant standing orders of the Senate, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) copies of all correspondence between the Minister for Communications or her office, the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts and the Office of the eSafety Commissioner in relation to the preparation of the original response to the question, including draft responses. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Payman</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Special Minister of State, by no later than 5 pm on Wednesday, 7 October 2026, copies of all documents held by the minister, his office or the Australian Electoral Commission that relate to:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the awarding of the contract with contract notice ID CN4214225 (the contract), including all value for money assessments; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) any variations to the contract. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Payman</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Science, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 16 October 2026, copies of all ministerial submissions, records of conversation, letters, briefing notes, meeting agendas, file notes, meeting invitations, meeting notes, meeting minutes, emails and instant or other electronic messages, created after 1 November 2025, relating to the Australian Nuclear Science and Technology Organisation's (ANSTO) Nuclear Medicine Manufacturing Program or the new Nuclear Medicine Manufacturing Facility between:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) any member of the ANSTO Executive (including the Chief Executive Officer (CEO)) and the Deputy Secretary, Science and Technology at the Department of Industry, Science and Resources (DISR);</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the Chief Financial Officer (CFO) of ANSTO and the head of the Science Division in DISR;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the CFO of ANSTO and any member of the Science Governance and Astronomy Branch in DISR;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) any member of the ANSTO Executive (including the CEO) and the ANSTO Board;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) any member of the ANSTO Executive (including the CEO) and the Minister for Science or his office; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) the ANSTO Board and the Minister for Science or his office. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Bragg</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 30 June 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 546, relating to first home guarantees issued by Housing Australia for the 2025-26 financial year, requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply by midday on Thursday, 2 July 2026,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 2 July 2026, the minister provided an interim response from the Minister for Housing stating that additional time was required to respond to the order,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) on 17 August 2026, the Senate agreed to a further order noting that the original order had not been complied with and requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply by midday on 19 August 2026, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the order has still not been complied with; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to attend the Senate at the start of proceedings on Thursday, 17 September 2026 to provide an explanation, of no more than 5 minutes, of the failure to comply with the order, and that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) any senator may move to take note of the explanation, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) any such motion may be debated for no longer than 30 minutes and shall have precedence over all other business until determined, and senators may speak to the motion for not more than 5 minutes each. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Bragg</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 12 August 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 573, relating to the impact of the Government's 5% deposit scheme on lending risk, requiring the Minister representing the Treasurer to comply by midday on Friday, 14 August 2026,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 17 August 2026, the Minister representing the Treasurer tabled an interim response from the Treasurer noting that the order was under active consideration and advising that additional time was required to comply with the order, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the order has not been complied with; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Treasurer to comply with the order by midday on Thursday, 17 September 2026. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Bragg</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 2 July 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 565, relating to executive salaries at Housing Australia, requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply by midday on Wednesday, 8 July 2026,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 17 August 2026, the Senate agreed to a further order noting that the original order had not been complied with and requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply by midday on 19 August 2026, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the order has still not been complied with; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to attend the Senate at the start of proceedings on Thursday, 17 September 2026 to provide an explanation, of no more than 5 minutes, of the failure to comply with the order, and that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) any senator may move to take note of the explanation, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) any such motion may be debated for no longer than 30 minutes and shall have precedence over all other business until determined, and senators may speak to the motion for not more than 5 minutes each. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Shoebridge</span> to move on 17 September 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the following bill be introduced: A Bill for an Act to amend legislation relating to customs, and for related purposes. <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">Wearable Recording Devices (Import Control) Bill 2026</span>. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 733</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Henderson</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Climate Change and Energy, by no later than midday on Monday, 21 September 2026, the final iteration of a document titled 'NRMA Grit in the Gears September 2026', as received by the Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 734</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Thorpe</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Resources, by no later than midday on Monday, 12 October 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) all ministerial submissions and briefs on the proposed North to East Australian Pipeline project (NEAP);</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the minister or her office and the Northern Territory Government or any Northern Territory departments regarding the proposed NEAP;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the Department of Industry, Science and Resources (DISR) and the Northern Territory Government or any Northern Territory departments regarding the proposed NEAP;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the minister or her office and the APA Group;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the DISR and the APA Group;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the minister or her office and Santos;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(g) all records of meetings, calls or correspondence between the DISR and Santos; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(h) any assessment by or for DISR on the cost of the NEAP and potential funding mechanisms. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Dean Smith</span> to move on 17 September 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the following bill be introduced: A Bill for an Act to amend the <span style="font-style:italic;">Census and Statistics Act 1905</span>, and for related purposes. <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">Census and Statistics Amendment (Parliamentary Oversight of the Census) Bill 2026</span>. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 736</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senators Lambie And Thorpe</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(1) That the Senate notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) in accordance with Senate resolution 44(1), government responses to committee reports are required to be tabled within 3 months of a report being tabled;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the Select Committee on PFAS (per and polyfluoroalkyl substances) tabled its final report on the extent, regulation and management of PFAS in November 2025; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) a government response has not been tabled even though it was due by February 2026.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(2) That there be laid on the table by the Minister for the Environment and Water, by no later than midday on 30 September 2026, the outstanding government response to the final report of the Select Committee on PFAS on the extent, regulation and management of PFAS. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Faruqi</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Foreign Affairs, by no later than 9.30 am on Monday, 12 October 2026, all ministerial submissions, letters, briefing notes, meeting agendas, file notes, meeting invitations, meeting notes, meeting minutes, emails and instant or other electronic messages, documents or correspondence from 15 September 2025 to 15 September 2026 between the Minister for Foreign Affairs and the Embassy of Israel in Australia, including the Israeli Ambassador to Australia. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 738</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Faruqi</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Foreign Affairs, by no later than 9.30 am on Monday, 12 October 2026, the presentation, attendance list, recording of the Zoom event and PowerPoint slides delivered by the Special Envoy to Combat Antisemitism at the New South Wales Judicial Seminar event on 5 June 2025. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 739</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator McDonald</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the following matters be referred to the Rural and Regional Affairs and Transport References Committee for inquiry and report by 31 March 2027:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the design, objectives and administration of the Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the eligibility criteria and assessment processes used to determine which fertiliser companies, suppliers and importers receive government support;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the nature, value and commercial terms of government guarantees, underwriting and other financial assistance provided under the facility;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the financial risks and potential liabilities to Australian taxpayers, including the adequacy of risk management and safeguards;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) the impact of the facility on competition and market conditions in the Australian fertiliser industry, including whether government support has advantaged particular market participants or disadvantaged non-participating suppliers and importers;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) the impact of the facility on fertiliser prices, supply and availability for Australian farmers, including whether the benefits of government support are being passed through to producers;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(g) the transparency and accountability of the facility, including the disclosure of participating entities, the basis on which support was provided, government financial exposure and the outcomes achieved;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(h) the effectiveness of the facility in strengthening Australia's long-term fertiliser security and supply chain resilience, including whether the design of the facility has created unintended market or competition consequences, and whether alternative policy approaches could achieve these objectives more effectively or at lower cost; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) any other related matters.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Dean Smith</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Treasurer, by no later than midday on Monday, 12 October 2026, copies of all written or digital documents, correspondence, briefing notes, file notes, meeting notes, meeting agendas or minutes or other records of interaction from 12 May to 11 August 2026, between the Australian Bureau of Statistics and the Treasurer or his office or the Assistant Minister for Productivity, Competition, Charities and Treasury or his office regarding the 2026 Census. (<span style="font-style:italic;">general business notice of motion no. 740</span>)</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Bragg</span> to move on 17 September 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the following matter be referred to the Environment and Communications References Committee for inquiry and report by 26 March 2027:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">The impacts of, and Commonwealth policy responses to, coastal erosion in Australia, with particular reference to:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the scale and rate of coastal erosion across Australia and the adequacy of current national coastal hazard mapping, monitoring and data-sharing arrangements;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the environmental impacts of coastal erosion, including the loss of dunes, wetlands and coastal habitat and impacts on biodiversity, and the role of natural and nature-based mitigation measures in reducing erosion risk;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the economic and financial impact of coastal erosion, including impacts on individuals and regions, insurance liabilities and costs, regional Australia, housing supply and prices, industry sectors, such as on tourism and agriculture, ports and other infrastructure and overall productivity;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the social and community impacts of coastal erosion, including the psychological toll on affected residents, including in regional and remote communities;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) the adequacy of existing policy responses at the Commonwealth level, including the relevant data and evidence base, national disaster and related risk management frameworks, environmental impact and biodiversity frameworks, and regional and industry policy aspects, and community engagement and consultation approaches;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) potential additional policy responses at the Commonwealth level, and how they would interact with existing efforts at the state and territory, as well as local government, level; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(g) any other related matters.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Barbara Pocock</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 2 July 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 553, relating to the Homes for Australia plan, requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply by no later than midday on Friday, 31 July 2026, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) the order has not been complied with; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Housing to comply with the order by 10 am on Wednesday, 23 September 2026. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Barbara Pocock</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs, by no later than 5 pm on 9 October 2026, for contract notice CN4254651:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) copies of all ministerial submissions, records of conversation, letters, briefing notes, meeting agendas, file notes, meeting invitations, meeting notes, meeting minutes, emails and instant or other electronic messages, calculations and modelling; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) documentation regarding the contract's work description, a list of tasks given, any management of actual and perceived conflicts of interest, an index of all work products produced, the application of Article 5.3 of the World Health Organisation's Framework Convention on Tobacco Control to the Australian Public Service and the details of any meetings or correspondence between Deloitte and the Illicit Tobacco and E-cigarette Commissioner prior to the contract. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Payman</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Early Childhood Education, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 2 October 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) copies of all ministerial submissions, briefing notes, meeting notes, meeting minutes, emails and instant or other electronic messages between the minister or her office and the Department of Education that provide an update on the paid practicum subsidy program for early childhood teachers and early childhood educators; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) a document which outlines, to date, the number of applications for the paid practicum subsidy program received, processed, accepted and rejected by the Department of Education and, for the applications that were rejected, the number of applications grouped by reason(s) for rejection. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator McGrath</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on Thursday, 8 October 2026, in relation to the Australian Government's additional commitment of $3.8 billion to the Suburban Rail Loop East project announced in the 2026-27 Budget:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) all documents provided by the Victorian Government to the Australian Government, the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts or Infrastructure Australia between 31 January 2025 and 12 May 2026 in response to, or for the purpose of satisfying, the recommendations contained in Infrastructure Australia's Suburban Rail Loop East business case evaluation report, dated 31 January 2025, including:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) an updated and detailed cost estimate for Suburban Rail Loop East and supporting station precinct interventions,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) a comprehensive funding and financing strategy with supporting quantitative analysis detailing how value capture will fund one third of the cost of Suburban Rail Loop East, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) analysis, including cost-benefit analysis, demonstrating the social, economic and environmental benefits attributable to Suburban Rail Loop East;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) all final assessments, reviews, reports or advice prepared by the department or Infrastructure Australia assessing whether the information referred to in paragraph (a) satisfied Infrastructure Australia's recommendations;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) all final advice provided to the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government concerning whether Infrastructure Australia's recommendations had been satisfied before the decision to commit the additional $3.8 billion; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) all correspondence between the Australian Government and the Victorian Government concerning whether the requirements or recommendations identified in Infrastructure Australia's 31 January 2025 evaluation had been satisfied. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator McGrath</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on Thursday, 8 October 2026, in relation to the first funding round of the Thriving Suburbs Program:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the final assessment spreadsheet, matrix or equivalent document recording, for each eligible application:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the scores awarded against each assessment criterion by the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) the total score and rating,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the project's order of merit or ranking, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the amount of Commonwealth funding sought;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the final assessment pack provided to the multi-party parliamentary panel;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the final recommendations, scores or rankings provided by the multi-party parliamentary panel to the department or minister;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the final assessment pack, project rankings and funding recommendations provided by the department to the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government as decision maker;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) documents recording the minister's final funding decisions, including documents recording the reasons for:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) approving any application that was not recommended for funding by the department,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) not approving any application that was recommended for funding by the department, or</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) approving an application ranked below an application that did not receive funding; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) any document, spreadsheet, database extract or analysis prepared or held by the department, the minister or the minister's office which identified an application or applicant by reference to:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the federal electoral division in which the proposed project was located,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) the political party of the member representing that division,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the electoral margin of that division, or</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) whether that division was classified or described as marginal, target, held or not held by a particular political party. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator McGrath</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on Thursday, 8 October 2026, in relation to the Australian Government's commitment of $220 million to the Circular Quay Renewal Program:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) any final or updated business case, revised business case, project proposal report, cost-benefit analysis or equivalent document provided by the New South Wales Government to the Australian Government in support of the $220 million Commonwealth funding commitment;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) all final assessments, reports or advice prepared by the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts concerning:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the scope and estimated cost of the Circular Quay Renewal Program,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) the economic benefits, costs and benefit-cost ratio of the project,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the value for money of the proposed Commonwealth contribution, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the Commonwealth funding contribution of $220 million;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) all final advice provided to the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government concerning the decision to commit $220 million in Commonwealth funding to the project;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) all documents provided by the New South Wales Government and all final departmental assessments or advice, explaining or assessing the differences between:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the Circular Quay Renewal proposal evaluated by Infrastructure Australia on 12 April 2022, with a P50 capital cost of $973 million and proposed Australian Government contribution of $486.5 million, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) the Circular Quay Renewal Program currently included in the Infrastructure Investment Program, with an estimated total project cost of $440 million and Australian Government contribution of $220 million, including any changes to the project scope, design, staging, benefits, costs, delivery model or Commonwealth-funded components;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) all documents, including legal advice, departmental advice, assessments and correspondence with the New South Wales Government, concerning the project-specific condition contained in the Federation Funding Agreement Schedule on Land Transport Infrastructure Projects that the Australian Government contribution to the Circular Quay Renewal Program is 'subject to clarification of eligibility under the <span style="font-style:italic;">National Land Transport Act 2014</span>', including:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the nature of the eligibility issue requiring clarification,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) which elements of the project were, or may have been, considered ineligible for Commonwealth funding under the Act,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) whether that eligibility issue has subsequently been resolved,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) if so, the date on which it was resolved and the statutory basis upon which the relevant expenditure was determined to be eligible, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) the current Federation Funding Agreement schedule, implementation plan, project proposal report, milestone schedule or other agreement governing the provision of Commonwealth funding for the project. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator McGrath</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on Thursday, 8 October 2026, in relation to the Australian Government's $60 million commitment to the project known as Expanding Perth's Ferry Network:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) any final business case, feasibility study, cost-benefit analysis, patronage or demand modelling, cost estimate, route options analysis or terminal options analysis provided to the Australian Government by the Western Australian Government in relation to the project;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) all final assessments, reports or advice prepared by the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts concerning:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the need for and value for money of the project,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) projected patronage or demand,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the proposed Applecross and University of Western Australia/Matilda Bay terminal locations,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the cost and scope of the project,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(v) the Australian Government's $50 million contribution towards the two new terminals, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(vi) the Australian Government's $10 million contribution towards planning and design for a future extension of the ferry network;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) all final briefing material provided to the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government concerning the decision to provide Commonwealth funding for the project; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) any executed Federation Funding Agreement schedule, project agreement, implementation plan, milestone schedule or other instrument governing the provision or payment of the Australian Government's $60 million contribution. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Collins</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the following matter be referred to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee for inquiry and report by 15 December 2026:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">The use and impact of monetary, expenditure based and numerical restrictions on Department of Veterans' Affairs-funded health treatment, with particular reference to:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the policy basis, evidentiary basis and anticipated operation of the Government's proposed $5,000 annual monetary limit for allied health treatment;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the use of monetary limits, expenditure thresholds, numerical treatment limits, review points, additional approval requirements, co-contributions or other restrictions affecting access to treatment;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the consequences of such restrictions for continuity of care, clinical outcomes and veterans with complex, chronic or multiple service-related conditions;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the particular impact on veterans and health service providers in regional, rural and remote Australia;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(e) the adequacy of existing statutory protections and options for strengthening legislative protections against monetary and numerical restrictions on veterans' health treatment;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(f) the financial, clinical and administrative implications of restricting, removing or legislatively prohibiting monetary and numerical limits on veterans' health treatment;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(g) consultation undertaken with veterans, ex-service organisations, health practitioners and other affected stakeholders; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(h) any related matters.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Waters</span>
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                </span>to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Climate Change and Energy, by no later than 4 pm on Friday, 2 October 2026, the first and last two offset reports, audit reports and gateway reviews for each of the following Human Induced Regeneration projects:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(1) ERF101557—Urana Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(2) EOP100275—Arbon—Tooligie—Human Induced Regeneration.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(3) ERF101718—Corrie Downs Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(4) EOP101133—Delta Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(5) ERF101228—Poon Boon Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(6) EOP100570—Kinchela Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(7) ERF101251—Congararra Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(8) EOP100992—Galambo Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(9) ERF101525—Ularunda Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(10) ERF101323—Tambua Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(11) EOP101263—Buckambool Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(12) ERF101647—Aqua Downs Station Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(13) ERF101517—Wapweelah Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(14) EOP101098—Mullagalah Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(15) ERF101812—Longdowns Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(16) EOP100548—Runnymede Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(17) ERF101865—Joonderee and Elmina Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(18) ERF101651—Yarrawonga Cobar Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(19) EOP101037—Lindermans Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(20) ERF101511—Jandra/Nulty Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(21) ERF101971—Cougar Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(22) EOP101114—Bora Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(23) EOP101101—Mulgaroon Forest Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(24) EOP101115—Byrock Station Regrowth Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(25) ERF101698—Darling River Eco Corridor 16.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(26) ERF101395—Morton Plains Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(27) ERF101492—Inverness Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(28) ERF101654—Richmond Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(29) ERF101671—North West Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(30) ERF101319—Kaleno Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(31) EOP101140—El Trune Regrowth Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(32) ERF101280—Lynwood Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(33) ERF101626—Curragh Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(34) ERF101706—Warana Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(35) ERF101437—Stanbert Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(36) ERF101630—Gambolalley Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(37) ERF102171—Woodstock Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(38) ERF101634—Regeneration Wongalee Mervyndale and Rundalua Forest Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(39) ERF101545—Glengeera Forest Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(40) ERF101674—Boonora Downs Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(41) ERF101326—Wancobra Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(42) ERF101494—Berangabah Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(43) ERF103313—Darling River Eco Corridor 7.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(44) ERF101269—Curranyalpa Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(45) ERF101318—Clovelly Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(46) ERF109630—Mullagalah II Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(47) EOP101262—Myroolia Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(48) ERF121619—Rocky Station Human-Induced Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(49) ERF101788—Mayfield Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(50) ERF101721—Kenilworth Regrowth Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(51) ERF115336—Initiative Site Catchment Conservation Alliance—Great Barrier Reef #3.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(52) ERF159425—Initiative Site Western Australian Rangelands Conservation #15.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(53) ERF121660—Woodleigh Station Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(54) ERF126426—Coodardy Station Regeneration Project.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(55) ERF158562—Western Australia Rangelands Conservation Initiative Site #7.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(56) ERF166768—Meka Station.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(57) ERF167183—WA Carbon Cattle Conservation Project #071921.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(58) ERF168138—Buckleboo Station.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(59) ERF173343—NT Cattle Conservation HIR Project #02142022 IDR.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(60) ERF180122—SA Cattle Conservation HIR Project #01112022 TP. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Shoebridge</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by 11 am on Thursday, 17 September 2026, all documents relating to:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) any departmental or ministerial advice on whether to extend the cruise ship exemption under the <span style="font-style:italic;">Coastal Trading (Revitalising Australian Shipping) Act 2012</span> (the Act) beyond 31 December 2026;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the 2023 review into the Act, including its terms of reference and any draft or final findings; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) correspondence since 1 January 2024 between the department or the minister's office and Carnival Australia, Carnival Corporation or the Cruise Lines International Association concerning the exemption. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Shoebridge</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 2 July 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 559, relating to relating to documents held by the Office of the Australian Information Commissioner (OAIC), with a compliance date of no later than 28 July 2026,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 30 July 2026, the Minister representing the Attorney-General provided a response from the Attorney-General and on 17 August 2026, the Senate agreed to an additional order:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(A) rejecting the public interest immunity claims raised by the Attorney-General in the response, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(B) requiring the Minister representing the Attorney-General to produce the documents set out in paragraphs (a) and (e) of the original order, subject only to the redaction of information that may be reasonably capable of causing harm to an individual, by 5 pm on 18 August 2026;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) on 25 August 2026, the Minister representing the Attorney-General provided an additional letter from the Attorney-General:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(A) maintaining the public interest immunity claims raised in the 30 July 2026 letter, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(B) withholding redacted versions of the documents ordered in the additional order, also on the grounds of legal professional privilege and that disclosure of the documents would unfairly influence the conduct of legal proceedings, and again citing the practice of successive Australian Governments not to disclose privileged legal advice;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the order has still not been complied with,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) has already rejected the public interest immunity claims raised by the Attorney-General in relation to the documents ordered in the original order, noting that the Attorney-General has raised the same public interest immunity claims in respect of the documents ordered in the additional order;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) again rejects the public interest immunity claims raised by the Attorney General in the 25 August 2026 letter, noting that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) as outlined in Odgers' Australian Senate Practice, the Senate has rejected government claims that there is a long-standing practice of not disclosing privileged legal advice and this claim is undermined by the fact that governments disclose legal advice when they choose to do so, particularly where the advice supports a government position,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) despite the Senate rejecting the public interest immunity claims raised by the Attorney-General in the 30 July 2026 letter, the Attorney-General's additional letter of 25 August 2026 reiterates those claims, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the additional letter from the Attorney-General does not acknowledge the need to balance any prejudice to legal proceedings against the public interest of having these documents disclosed;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(d) requires the Minister representing the Attorney-General to comply with the additional order agreed to by the Senate on 17 August 2026, by 11 am on 17 September 2026. </span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senator Ruston</span> to move on the next day of sitting:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 9 September 2026, the Senate agreed to an order for the production of documents, order no. 666, requiring the Minister for Aged Care and Seniors to provide documents relating to the number of people who died while on the National Priority System waiting list for a Support at Home or Home Care package during 2025-26 financial year,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) in response to the order, the minister advised that the scope of the searches required to comply with the order was expansive and that it was not possible to achieve compliance within the timeframe, but did not provide a date by which the documents would be produced, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the minister further advised that the data sought by the order is still undergoing validation, despite the order not requiring the provision of validated data;</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(b) notes that the order has not been complied with; and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(c) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Aged Care and Seniors to attend the Senate on Thursday, 17 September 2026 at the conclusion of private senators' time to provide an explanation no more than 5 minutes of the failure to comply with the order, and that:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(i) any senator may move to take note of the explanation,</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) any such motion may be debated for no longer than 30 minutes and shall have precedence over all business until determined, and</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
              <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) senators may speak for not more than 5 minutes each. </span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BUSINESS</title>
        <page.no>51</page.no>
        <type>BUSINESS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BUSINESS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Leave of Absence</title>
          <page.no>51</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Leave of Absence</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>51</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
              <name.id>306168</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:48</span>):  At the request of Senator Liddle, I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That leave of absence be granted to Senator Liddle for 16 and 17 of September for personal reasons.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>NOTICES</title>
        <page.no>51</page.no>
        <type>NOTICES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">NOTICES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Postponement</title>
          <page.no>51</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Postponement</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Clerk:</span>  Postponement notifications have been lodged in respect of the following:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">Business of the Senate notice of motion no. 1 (Senator Payman), till 16 September 2026.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">General Business notice of motion no. 550 (Senator McKim), till 16 September 2026.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">General Business notice of motion no. 720 (Senators Waters and David Pocock), till 16 September 2026.</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">General Business notice of motion no. 721 Senators Waters and David Pocock), till 16 September 2026.</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>51</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
              <name.id>112096</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The PRESIDENT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Time">15:49</span>):  If there is no objection, the business is postponed.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>51</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">COMMITTEES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Reporting Date</title>
          <page.no>51</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Reporting Date</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">
                <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Clerk:</span>  A committee has lodged an extension notification that has been lodged in respect of the following:</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">Community Affairs References Committee—</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Small">2025 National Health Reform Agreement with Western Australia—from 30 October 2026 to 31 March 2027.</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>52</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
              <name.id>112096</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The PRESIDENT</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Time">15:49</span>):  If there is no objection, the extension is agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BUSINESS</title>
        <page.no>52</page.no>
        <type>BUSINESS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BUSINESS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Rearrangement</title>
          <page.no>52</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Rearrangement</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>52</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Chisholm, Sen Anthony</name>
              <name.id>39801</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="39801" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CHISHOLM</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Assistant Minister for Regional Development, Assistant Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry, Assistant Minister for Resources and Deputy Manager of Government Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:50</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That consideration of the business before the Senate on Wednesday, 16 September 2026 be interrupted at approximately 5 pm, but not so as to interrupt a senator speaking, to enable Senator Gatenby to make his first speech (of approximately 20 minutes) without any question before the chair.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>52</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BILLS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Allied Health Care) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>52</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="s1515" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Allied Health Care) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>First Reading</title>
            <page.no>52</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">First Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>52</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:50</span>):  At the request of Senator Cadell, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the following bill be introduced:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">A Bill for an Act to amend the Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Act 2004, and for related purposes.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator KOVACIC:</span>
                    </a>  I present the bill and move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill may proceed without formalities and be now read a first time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill read a first time.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>52</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                  <name.id>306168</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>52</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Second Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>52</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:51</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a second time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I seek leave to table an explanatory memorandum relating to the bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator KOVACIC:</span>
                    </a>  I table the explanatory memorandum. I seek leave to have the second reading speech incorporated in <span style="font-style:italic;">Hansard</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">The speech read as follows—</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This bill rests on a simple principle—that a Veteran's health care should be determined by clinical need, not by an arbitrary dollar figure.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">In the 2026-27 Budget, the Albanese Labor government announced a $5,000 annual monetary limit on Department of Veterans' Affairs funded allied health care from 1 July 2027. DVA's own material called it what it was "a cap". Veterans requiring care above $5,000 would need to apply for additional funding.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">After veterans, families, providers and advocates raised the alarm, on the 31st of August, the language changed. The cap was no longer an "annual monetary limit", it had now become a "review threshold". Changing the words does not change the effect.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">When a veteran approaches a $5,000 spend on allied health, the Government proposes yet another approval process. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The allied health provider would prepare a treatment request. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The veteran's usual GP would review the proposal. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And then it would be up for DVA to decide whether care above the threshold would be funded. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Our Veterans deserve a guarantee, in law, that they will not be the ones to suffer to fix Labor's budget.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If, as Labor claims, the $5,000 is only an administrative marker with no effect on treatment, there is no reason for it to trigger additional approval. If it is designed to reduce care, or to save money, the Government should say so.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Budget papers expose this in black and white. The Government is investing $169.7 million over five years to lift allied health provider fees, and this increase is overdue and supported. For too long, inadequate DVA fees have made it harder for practitioners, particularly in regional Australia, to continue treating Veteran Card holders.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Yet the Government paired this investment with savings of $748 million over three years from the "Annual Monetary Limit" or cap, followed by $340.2 million every year on an ongoing basis. Those figures are not the footprint of a harmless administrative check, they show the measure is expected to materially reduce expenditure on Veterans' allied health care.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">DVA estimates around one in ten Veteran Card holders may exceed the threshold after provider fees increase. These are not necessarily people receiving inappropriate care. They are Veterans living with complex and chronic service related conditions. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">A Veteran may need physiotherapy and psychology, exercise physiology and podiatry, occupational therapy or speech pathology. Everyone understands that many will reach $5,000 quickly, especially once fees rise.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The consequences will be felt especially in regional, rural and remote communities. Veterans outside the capitals already face fewer participating providers, longer travel distances and limited alternatives when a clinician closes their books or stops accepting DVA rates. An extra approval process is not a minor inconvenience when the next suitable provider may be hours away. An interruption in treatment can mean lost mobility, unmanaged pain, deteriorating mental health and a much harder road back to independence.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This bill does not oppose clinical oversight. It does not protect fraud, duplication, unsafe treatment or inappropriate servicing and DVA must be able to act where there is genuine evidence of those things. This bill rejects using expenditure as a proxy for clinical need.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The bill prevents the Veterans' treatment framework from imposing a cap on the total cost of allied health treatment provided over a week, month, year or any other period. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It prevents a Veteran being required to pay a co-contribution or gap. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It also prevents additional review, evidence or paperwork being demanded solely or substantially because aggregate expenditure is approaching, has reached or exceeded, or is likely to reach or exceed a specified amount, and it prevents treatment being delayed, suspended, discontinued or refused for the same expenditure-based reason.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The protections extend across the principal statutory pathways under which Veterans receive treatment or compensation for treatment. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The definition of allied health in this Bill is inclusive so that the protection is not defeated because a recognised profession is omitted from a closed list or because services evolve over time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Senate has already demonstrated that this principle commands support as demonstrated by the Senate agreeing to amendments to the Statute Update Bill 2026 protecting Veterans' allied health care from expenditure caps and expenditure-triggered barriers. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This bill is dedicated to providing a durable vehicle to place that protection squarely in the Veterans' treatment framework.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There should be no aggregate monetary cap, and no additional review or evidentiary hurdle triggered solely or substantially by expenditure.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government still has time to abandon the measure. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The detailed arrangements have not been finalised and consultation is underway, however this is the right time for the Parliament to establish a statutory guardrail before Veterans and providers are forced to reorganise care around a policy intended to extract hundreds of millions of dollars in savings.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Our nation asks extraordinary things of the men and women who serve it. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">When service leaves a person with injury or illness, the Commonwealth's obligation is not discharged when an app or accounting system reaches $5,000.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Veterans should not have to watch a running total and wonder whether their next appointment will trigger another approval process. Their clinicians should not have to plan care around a budget threshold and regional Veterans should not bear an even heavier burden simply because alternatives are scarce.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Clinical need must come first.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I commend the bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator KOVACIC:</span>
                    </a>  I seek leave to continue my remarks later.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted; debate adjourned.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>52</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                  <name.id>306168</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>53</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                  <name.id>306168</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>53</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility</title>
          <page.no>53</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>53</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>53</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:51</span>):  At the request of Senator Canavan, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Trade and Tourism, by no later than 5 pm on Monday, 12 October 2026, all correspondence, meeting records, briefing notes, minutes and other documents created or received by Export Finance Australia between 1 March and 30 June 2026 concerning consultation with Fertiliser Australia or members of the Fertiliser Supply Working Group in relation to the Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility, including:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) recommendations concerning companies that should receive access to the facility;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) recommendations concerning eligibility or selection criteria;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) recommendations concerning the structure or pricing of contracts for difference;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) declarations or disclosures of actual, potential or perceived conflicts of interest;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(e) arrangements for managing any disclosed conflicts; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(f) communications involving representatives of Incitec Pivot, CSBP or Summit concerning the design of the facility prior to those companies receiving support.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>54</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>54</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:52</span>):  At the request of Senator Canavan, I move general business notices of motion Nos 707 and 708 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">GENERAL BUSINESS NOTICE OF MOTION NO. 707</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Trade and Tourism, by no later than 5 pm on Monday, 12 October 2026, all documents created or received by Export Finance Australia concerning the selection or eligibility of fertiliser companies for support under the Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility, including:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) eligibility and assessment criteria;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) national-interest criteria;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) lists of fertiliser importers considered for participation;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) invitations or approaches made to potential participants;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(e) applications, expressions of interest or proposals received;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(f) assessments of Incitec Pivot, CSBP and Summit Rural;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(g) assessments of companies that sought or were considered for support but did not receive support;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(h) reasons for accepting or rejecting each company;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) advice provided by the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry or the Department of Industry, Science and Resources concerning the selection of participating companies; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(j) any consideration of whether an open, competitive or expression-of-interest process should be conducted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">GENERAL BUSINESS NOTICE OF MOTION NO. 708</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for Trade and Tourism, by no later than 5 pm on Monday, 12 October 2026, all documents created or received by Export Finance Australia between 1 April and 31 August 2026 concerning the actual or potential impact of the Fuel and Fertiliser Security Facility on competition in the Australian fertiliser market, including documents concerning:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the effect of providing price-risk protection to participating companies but not to other importers or resellers;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) movements in Australian and international urea prices;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the risk of supported companies being able to sell fertiliser below the cost faced by unsupported competitors;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) potential market distortion or competitive advantage arising from the facility;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(e) complaints or concerns raised by fertiliser importers, wholesalers, retailers or industry bodies;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(f) any advice received from or provided to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(g) options to modify, suspend or terminate fertiliser support as market conditions changed; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(h) any consideration of compensation or other assistance for non-participating businesses.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Electoral Commission</title>
          <page.no>54</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Australian Electoral Commission</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>54</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>54</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
                <name.id>300707</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AV</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:52</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Special Minister of State, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 25 September 2026, copies of ministerial submissions received by the Special Minister of State from the Australian Electoral Commission with parliamentary document record numbers MS25-000045, MS25-000049 and MS26-000008.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>54</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BILLS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Red Lines Package Omnibus Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>54</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="s1517" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Red Lines Package Omnibus Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>First Reading</title>
            <page.no>54</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">First Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>54</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">15:53</span>):  I, and also on behalf of Senators Faruqi, Payman and Thorpe, move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the following bill be introduced:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">A Bill for an Act to amend the law relating to defence trade controls, investments in illegal undertakings, genocide, importation of goods and services from occupied territories, and for related purposes.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                    </a>  I present the bill and move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill may proceed without formalities and be now read a first time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that the motion moved by Senator David Pocock be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>55</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                  <name.id>256136</name.id>
                  <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                  <party>IND</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>55</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [15:58]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>39</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Thorpe, L. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>14</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>10</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J. N.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to. <br />Bill read a first time. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>55</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Second Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>55</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                <name.id>256136</name.id>
                <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                <party>IND</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256136" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DAVID POCOCK</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Australian Capital Territory</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Independent ACT Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:02</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a second time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I seek leave to table an explanatory memorandum relating to the bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                    </a>  I table an explanatory memorandum and seek leave to have the second reading speech incorporated in <span style="font-style:italic;">Hansard</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">The speech read as follows—</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I rise today to speak in support of the Red Lines Package Omnibus Bill 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">At its heart, this bill is about a pretty simple principle.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There should be some lines that Australia is simply not prepared to cross.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">We should not be supplying weapons or military technology where there is a serious risk they will contribute to genocide, war crimes or crimes against humanity.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australians' retirement savings and public money should not be financing illegal settlements or activities that contribute to genocide.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australian businesses and institutions should have a responsibility to identify and act on genocide risks in their operations and value chains.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And Australians should not be able to profit from trade that sustains illegal settlements in occupied territories.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">These should not be controversial propositions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They should be basic standards for a country like Australia that says it believes in international law, human rights and the rules-based international order.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This bill brings those principles together into one package, covering defence trade controls, investment, genocide prevention and reporting, and trade with illegal settlements in occupied territories.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Importantly, these laws are not about picking a side in one particular conflict.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They are about establishing rules that apply consistently.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Because international law means very little if we insist on its application when it suits us and look the other way when it does not.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If we believe genocide is wrong, that must be true regardless of who is committing it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If we believe war crimes are wrong, that must be true regardless of who commits them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If we believe illegal occupation should not be economically sustained, that principle has to apply consistently too.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That consistency matters enormously at this moment.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I've heard from so many Australians who are deeply distressed by what they are witnessing overseas and frustrated by what they see as a gap between Australia's stated commitment to international law and the practical decisions we make about trade, investment and defence.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>This legislation is an attempt to start closing that gap.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The first part of this package deals with defence exports.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia has a significant defence industry and increasingly sees defence exports as part of our economic and strategic policy.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But with that comes responsibility.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Schedule 1 deliberately adopts a broad definition of defence technology, goods and services. It covers not only arms, but relevant technical assistance, training, financial assistance, military personnel, technology, software and defence services.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It also strengthens end-use requirements so that there is greater accountability for where Australian defence goods and technology ultimately go and how they are used.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The principle here is straightforward: Australian weapons, technology and expertise should not contribute to genocide, war crimes or crimes against humanity.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>We cannot simply wash our hands of responsibility once something leaves Australian shores.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The second part of this package deals with investment.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This is increasingly important.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australians collectively have enormous financial power through our superannuation system, while the Commonwealth manages significant public assets through the Future Fund.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Most Australians would reasonably expect that their retirement savings and public money are not being used to support serious violations of international law.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This bill puts legal obligations behind that expectation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It establishes restrictions covering the Future Fund, registered Australian charities and superannuation entities.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">For example, the bill would require the Future Fund Board to take reasonable steps to prevent investment in prohibited companies, illegal settlement activity or entities engaged in practices that may contribute to genocide risks.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And importantly, where the Board becomes aware that an investment is inconsistent with those requirements, it must promptly divest.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Again, the principle is simple.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>Australia should not condemn serious violations of international law with one hand while allowing public money to help finance them with the other.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The third major element of this legislation is about prevention.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">One of the things I think is particularly important about this package is that it does not treat genocide solely as something we respond to after the fact.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It asks what Australian governments, institutions and businesses can do to identify risks earlier and prevent Australian involvement.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The bill establishes a system of genocide statements, due diligence and corrective action, backed by an Australian Anti-Genocide Commissioner.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Reporting entities would be required to take reasonable measures, including appropriate due diligence, to avoid genocide risks and practices that may contribute to those risks in their operations and value chains.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They would also have to identify those risks when they arise and report them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Crucially, this isn't intended to be a box-ticking reporting exercise.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Where risks are identified, entities are required to take action.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Commissioner would have powers to make remediation orders, including requiring an entity to divest investments, terminate or unwind agreements, or take other specified action. Senior managers would also have a duty to take reasonable steps to ensure their organisation complies with the legislation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That is an important shift.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Transparency matters, but transparency without action is not enough.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If an Australian institution discovers that something it is doing, buying, financing or investing in is contributing to an unacceptable risk, there should be a responsibility to do something about it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The bill therefore establishes an independent Australian Anti-Genocide Commissioner.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Commissioner would have functions relating to addressing genocide and supporting victims, including consultation, advocacy and inquiries.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The legislation expressly provides that the Commissioner has complete discretion in exercising their functions and is not subject to direction from anyone. Appointments would also be merit-based and publicly advertised, with candidates required to have appropriate expertise in areas including human rights, regulation or public policy relating to genocide.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I think that independence is particularly important.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Questions about Australia's involvement in conflicts overseas can be extraordinarily politically charged.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>An independent office provides another mechanism for scrutiny that is grounded in evidence and law rather than the politics of the day.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The final major part of this package concerns trade with illegal settlements in occupied territories.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The bill creates offences relating to settlement goods and services and establishes enforcement mechanisms around those prohibitions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Again, there is an important principle behind this.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">If a settlement is unlawful under international law, Australia should not be helping make that settlement economically viable through our trade.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There is little point saying we do not recognise unlawful territorial acquisition while simultaneously allowing economic activity that helps sustain it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This package is ambitious.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There will undoubtedly be debate about its details.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There should be.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">These are significant legal obligations, and Parliament should properly scrutinise how they operate, whether definitions are appropriately drawn, how compliance will work and whether the institutions tasked with enforcing them have the resources and independence they need.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But we should not lose sight of the fundamental question this bill puts before us.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">What responsibility should Australia take for the consequences of Australian money, Australian weapons, Australian companies and Australian trade?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">For me, the answer cannot be: none.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Global supply chains and financial markets have made it increasingly easy for countries and corporations to be connected to human rights abuses thousands of kilometres away.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Distance does not make those connections meaningless.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And complexity cannot become an excuse for doing nothing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia has spent decades arguing for a world governed by rules rather than simply by power.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">As a middle power, we have a huge stake in that system.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But if we want other countries to respect international law, Australia has to demonstrate that we are willing to apply those principles ourselves—including when doing so is difficult.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And we have to apply them consistently.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That is one of the things I have heard most strongly from people in the ACT.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">People are deeply concerned about the suffering they are seeing around the world.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They want Australia to play a constructive role.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But they also want consistency.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They don't want one standard for our friends and another for everyone else.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">They want to know that when Australia says there are certain things the international community should never tolerate, we actually mean it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Genocide.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">War crimes.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Crimes against humanity.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Illegal occupation.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">These are red lines.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And our domestic laws should reflect that.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This legislation says Australian weapons should not enable these crimes.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australian public money and retirement savings should not finance them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australian organisations should take reasonable steps to ensure their operations and value chains are not contributing to genocide risks.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And Australian trade should not help sustain illegal settlements.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Those are serious obligations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But they reflect the seriousness of the conduct we are talking about.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Ultimately, this bill is about ensuring that Australia's commitment to international law exists not only in the statements we make, but in the decisions we make about our weapons, our money, our businesses and our trade.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia cannot prevent every atrocity around the world.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But we can make sure we are not contributing to them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">We can make sure we are not profiting from them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">And we can draw clear legal red lines around what Australians, Australian institutions and Australian governments should never enable.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I commend the bill to the Senate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256136" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator DAVID POCOCK:</span>
                    </a>  I seek leave to continue my remarks later.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted; debate adjourned.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>55</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                  <name.id>256136</name.id>
                  <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                  <party>IND</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>58</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen David</name>
                  <name.id>256136</name.id>
                  <electorate>Australian Capital Territory</electorate>
                  <party>IND</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Healthcare Without Caps) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>58</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="s1518" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Healthcare Without Caps) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>First Reading</title>
            <page.no>58</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">First Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>58</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                <name.id>250026</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>JLN</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:02</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the following bill be introduced: A Bill for an Act to amend the <span style="font-style:italic;">Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Act 2004</span>, and for related purposes. <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Healthcare Without Caps) Bill 2026</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator LAMBIE:</span>
                    </a>  I present the bill and move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill may proceed without formalities and be now read a first time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill read a first time.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>58</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                  <name.id>250026</name.id>
                  <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                  <party>JLN</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>58</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Second Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>58</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                <name.id>250026</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>JLN</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:04</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a second time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I seek leave to table an explanatory memorandum relating to the bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator LAMBIE:</span>
                    </a>  I table an explanatory memorandum and seek leave to have the second reading speech incorporated in <span style="font-style:italic;">Hansard</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">The speech read as follows—</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The <span style="font-style:italic;">Military Rehabilitation and Compensation Amendment (Veterans' Healthcare Without Caps) Bill 2026</span> seeks to ensure that veterans' treatment for accepted service-related injuries, diseases or conditions should be determined by clinical need and not by an arbitrary cap. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This Bill is about a very simple principle: if a veteran needs treatment because of their service, they should be able to get that treatment. It should not come down to a number on a spreadsheet and a limit imposed by Canberra.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The final report of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide stated: "Aspects of DVA culture, processes and systems have been consistently highlighted in previous reviews as negatively affecting the mental health and wellbeing of ex-serving ADF members."</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Commissioners were clear that access to timely health supports is key to addressing the rates of veteran suicide. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">We have seen the government move towards a $5,000 threshold for allied health services. The government says it is not a cap because veterans can apply for additional treatment once they reach that threshold.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">But let's be honest about what that means.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">A veteran who needs ongoing physiotherapy, occupational therapy, psychology, exercise physiology or other allied health services may reach that threshold. The Veteran then has to go through another process and seek approval should they exceed the cap.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">How can veterans seriously believe the Department of Veterans' Affairs will quickly approve additional treatment when the average MRCA liability claim takes over 300 days to process? </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">For some veterans, these services are not optional extras. They are what allows them to walk, work, manage pain, maintain their independence and participate in family and community life.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide made it clear that timely, accessible and ongoing healthcare matters. Recommendations 71 and 72 are directly concerned with improving access to healthcare for veterans and strengthening the health system that supports them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This Bill says that where a veteran has an existing entitlement to treatment, that entitlement should not be cut off because a particular amount of money has been spent or because a particular number of services has been used. That means no arbitrary limit on allied health treatment where more treatment is clinically required. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It also means the same principle can apply across other healthcare settings where necessary treatment is required. Veterans may require ongoing treatment from general practitioners and medical specialists, hospital and rehabilitation services, mental health professionals and other appropriately qualified health professionals. For some veterans, these services may be required regularly or over many years because of the nature of their service-related injury or disease. Their access to necessary treatment should not be restricted simply because a predetermined financial or numerical threshold has been reached. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I also want to be clear about what this Bill does not do. It does not mean there should be no oversight or that every treatment must automatically be funded. There should still be proper clinical governance and standards for quality and safety as well as safeguards against fraud, abuse and inappropriate provider conduct. But those safeguards should not be confused with an arbitrary financial cap.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">I am calling on the major parties to put the interests of veterans first and support this Bill. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Veterans should not have to wait for another review, consultation or approval process before they can access the treatment they need. This is about making sure that when a veteran has an accepted service-related injury or disease, they can get clinically necessary treatment when they need it.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator LAMBIE:</span>
                    </a>  I seek leave to continue my remarks later.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted; debate adjourned.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>59</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                  <name.id>250026</name.id>
                  <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                  <party>JLN</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>59</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                  <name.id>250026</name.id>
                  <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                  <party>JLN</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>59</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Veterans</title>
          <page.no>59</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Veterans</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>59</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>59</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
                <name.id>250026</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>JLN</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250026" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:04</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Veterans' Affairs, by midday on Thursday, 17 September 2026, the final report titled 'Women Veterans' Strategy' completed in 2025.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Base Services Transformation Program</title>
          <page.no>60</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Base Services Transformation Program</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>60</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>60</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:05</span>):  At the request of Senator Collins, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 2 July 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 552, relating to the Base Services Transformation Program, requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Defence to comply by midday on Monday, 3 August 2026,</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 30 July 2026, the Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme provided an interim response from the Minister for Defence, advising that additional time was required to comply with the order, and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the order has not been complied with; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Defence to comply with the order by 10 am on Thursday, 17 September 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Major and Local Community Infrastructure Program</title>
          <page.no>60</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Major and Local Community Infrastructure Program</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>60</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>60</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:05</span>):  At the request of Senator McKenzie, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on 12 October 2026, any documents including correspondence, file notes or decision briefs regarding the application for funding for the Carter Field upgrades at the National Hockey Centre as part of the Major and Local Community Infrastructure Program, between 1 April 2025 and 12 May 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Aviation Services</title>
          <page.no>60</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Aviation Services</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>60</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>60</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:06</span>):  At the request of Senator McKenzie, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on 12 October 2026, any correspondence, emails, instant or other electronic messages, agendas, itineraries, meeting notes and meeting minutes, file notes and records of conversation held by the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, the minister's office or the department in relation to the Departmental Industry Forum and Airservices Australia between 1 January and 31 August 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>60</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">COMMITTEES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Environment and Communications References Committee</title>
          <page.no>60</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="34" type="Committee">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Environment and Communications References Committee</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Reference</title>
            <page.no>60</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Reference</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>60</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:07</span>):  At the request of Senator Cadell, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the following matter be referred to the Environment and Communications References Committee for inquiry and report by 31 March 2027: </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The design and implementation of Commonwealth marine spatial planning and protection, with particular reference to:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the scientific, environmental, social and economic basis for the Government's commitment to place 30% of Australia's marine environment in highly protected areas by 2030, including how the target is defined, applied and measured;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the preparation of 6 new management plans covering 44 Australian marine parks and proposed changes affecting the Norfolk, Lord Howe and Gifford marine parks;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the adequacy and transparency of consultation, First Nations engagement, scientific evidence, spatial modelling and economic analysis, including relevant findings from the Futures of Seafood project;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) whether existing and proposed marine park zoning delivers measurable biodiversity, habitat and fisheries outcomes, supported by effective monitoring, enforcement and review;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(e) the cumulative effects of marine parks, offshore energy development and other marine uses on First Nations, commercial and recreational fishing, seafood production and supply chains, fishing displacement and regional communities;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(f) the respective roles of highly protected areas, fisheries management, sustainable-use zoning, targeted habitat protection and other effective area based conservation measures;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(g) international approaches to balancing marine conservation, sustainable seafood production and access to marine resources;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(h) options to improve the design, implementation, transparency and periodic review of Commonwealth marine protection commitments; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) any related matters.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that business of the Senate notice of motion No. 3, standing in the name of Senator Cadell, be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>61</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:11]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>21</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>33</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>10</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>61</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Waste Management and Recycling</title>
          <page.no>61</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Waste Management and Recycling</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>61</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>61</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
                <name.id>300707</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AV</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:13</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for the Environment and Water, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 23 October 2026, copies of all ministerial submissions, briefing notes, meeting notes, emails and instant or other electronic messages between the Minister for the Environment and Water or his office and the Department of Climate Change, Energy, the Environment and Water that relate to the decision to no longer progress development of reforms which would have established national standards for packaging.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that general business notice of motion No. 709, standing in the name of Senator Payman, be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>62</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:15]<br />(The President—Senator Lines) </p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>34</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>19</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>11</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Executive Remuneration</title>
          <page.no>62</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Executive Remuneration</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>62</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>62</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
                <name.id>300707</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AV</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:17</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister for the Public Service, by no later than 5 pm on Monday, 19 October 2026, anonymised copies of all responses and submissions made to the Remuneration Tribunal's consultation paper entitled 'Remuneration of Departmental Secretaries'.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate—</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) notes that:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 2 July 2026, the Senate agreed to order for the production of documents no. 552, relating to the Base Services Transformation Program, requiring the Minister representing the Minister for Defence to comply by midday on Monday, 3 August 2026,</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) on 30 July 2026, the Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme provided an interim response from the Minister for Defence, advising that additional time was required to comply with the order, and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the order has not been complied with; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) requires the Minister representing the Minister for Defence to comply with the order by 10 am on Thursday, 17 September 2026.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>63</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
                <name.id>283585</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="283585" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:18</span>):  I seek leave to make a short statement. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  Leave is granted for one minute.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="283585" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator O'SULLIVAN:</span>
                    </a>  The coalition supports the review of secretaries' remuneration to ensure arrangements remain fair, transparent and aligned with contemporary expectations. We look forward to the outcomes of the review due to report in 2027. However, this motion seeks access to confidential submissions that were provided in good faith to inform the review process. Similar to the operation of parliamentary committees, we should respect the confidentiality of these submissions, and, as such, the coalition does not support this motion. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that general business motion No. 710 standing in the name of Senator Payman be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <talk>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>63</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>63</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
                  <name.id>283585</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>63</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </talk>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:20]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>17</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>26</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>0</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names />
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cybersafety Legislation</title>
          <page.no>63</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Cybersafety Legislation</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>63</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>63</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
                <name.id>300707</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AV</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:22</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That—</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the Senate notes that:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) on 8 September 2026, the Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development, Communications, Sport and the Arts (the department) lodged responses to questions taken on notice as part of the Environment and Communications Legislation Committee's inquiry into the Online Safety Amendment (Strengthening Enforcement for the Social Media Minimum Age) Bill 2026,</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) one of these responses with the identifier IQ26-000102 (the response) contained questions which sought clarification on whether officials from the department provided misleading evidence at a hearing on 14 August 2026 (the hearing) by claiming that certain links to references in the report of the Age Assurance Technology Trial (the report) were not broken at the time the report was provided to government, but became broken at some later point in time, and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) the response did not directly address the questions and instead referred to a letter between the Secretary of the department and the Chair of the Environment and Communications Legislation Committee, dated 31 August 2026, which notes that 'the representations made by officials were based on information available to them at the time and were honestly and reasonably held' but neither confirms nor denies that officials from the department provided misleading evidence at the hearing; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Communications, by no later than 5 pm on Friday, 18 September 2026, a revised version of the response which directly addresses the question of whether officials from the department provided misleading evidence at the hearing by claiming that certain links to references in the report were not broken at the time the report was provided to government, but became broken at some later point in time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that general business motion No. 711 standing in the name of Senator Payman be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>64</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:23]<br />(The President—Senator Lines) </p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>34</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Lambie, J.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>19</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>11</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BUSINESS</title>
        <page.no>65</page.no>
        <type>BUSINESS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BUSINESS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Consideration of Legislation</title>
          <page.no>65</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Consideration of Legislation</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>65</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Cash, Sen Michaelia</name>
              <name.id>I0M</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="I0M" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CASH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:25</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">1. That so much of the standing orders be suspended as would prevent this resolution having effect.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">2. That the Sex Discrimination Amendment (Restoring Common Sense and Recognising Biological Sex) Bill 2026 be restored to the Notice Paper and consideration of the bill resume at the first reading stage.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  The question is that general business notice of motion No. 713 standing in the name of Senator Cash be agreed to.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>65</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
        <division>
          <division.header>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:27]<br />(The President—Senator Lines) </p>
            </body>
          </division.header>
          <division.data>
            <ayes>
              <num.votes>22</num.votes>
              <title>AYES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Antic, A.</name>
                <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                <name>Bell, S.</name>
                <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                <name>Collins, J.</name>
                <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                <name>Hume, J.</name>
                <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                <name>Whitten, T.</name>
              </names>
            </ayes>
            <noes>
              <num.votes>32</num.votes>
              <title>NOES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                <name>Lines, S.</name>
                <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                <name>Payman, F.</name>
                <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                <name>Polley, H.</name>
                <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                <name>Walker, C.</name>
                <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
              </names>
            </noes>
            <pairs>
              <num.votes>10</num.votes>
              <title>PAIRS</title>
              <names>
                <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                <name>Wong, P.</name>
                <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                <name>Cox, D.</name>
                <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
              </names>
            </pairs>
          </division.data>
          <division.result>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question negatived. </p>
            </body>
          </division.result>
        </division>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>66</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Trade Unions</title>
          <page.no>66</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Trade Unions</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>66</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>66</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:30</span>):  At the request of Senator Hume, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs, by no later than 9 am on Thursday, 17 September 2026, copies of all documents recording or referring to a request made by Victoria Police to the Australian Federal Police to investigate alleged corrupting benefits paid to influence a trade union official in connection with Commonwealth funded infrastructure projects, including any document recording the Australian Federal Police's response to that request.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that general business motion No. 716 standing in the name of Senator Hume be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>66</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:31]<br />(The President—Senator Lines) </p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>33</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Hanson, P. L.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>20</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>10</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to. </p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Australian Federal Police</title>
          <page.no>66</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Australian Federal Police</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>66</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>66</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:34</span>):  At the request of Senator Hume, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Home Affairs, by no later than 9 am on Thursday, 17 September 2026, a copy of any response provided by the Australian Federal Police to the letter sent by the General Manager of the Fair Work Commission on 21 May 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that general business notice of motion No. 717 standing in the name of Senator Hume be agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>67</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                  <name.id>112096</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <division>
            <division.header>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [16:36]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
              </body>
            </division.header>
            <division.data>
              <ayes>
                <num.votes>31</num.votes>
                <title>AYES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                  <name>Antic, A.</name>
                  <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                  <name>Bell, S.</name>
                  <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                  <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                  <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                  <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                  <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                  <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                  <name>Collins, J.</name>
                  <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                  <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                  <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                  <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                  <name>Kovacic, M. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                  <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                  <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                  <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                  <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                  <name>Payman, F.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                  <name>Pocock, D. W.</name>
                  <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                  <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                  <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                  <name>Whitten, T.</name>
                </names>
              </ayes>
              <noes>
                <num.votes>19</num.votes>
                <title>NOES</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                  <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                  <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                  <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                  <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                  <name>Darmanin, L.</name>
                  <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                  <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                  <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                  <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                  <name>Lines, S.</name>
                  <name>O'Neill, D. M.</name>
                  <name>Sheldon, A. V. (Teller)</name>
                  <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                  <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                  <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                  <name>Walker, C.</name>
                  <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                  <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
                </names>
              </noes>
              <pairs>
                <num.votes>11</num.votes>
                <title>PAIRS</title>
                <names>
                  <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                  <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                  <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                  <name>Wong, P.</name>
                  <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                  <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                  <name>Faruqi, M.</name>
                  <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                  <name>Hume, J.</name>
                  <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                  <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                  <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                  <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                  <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                  <name>Paterson, J. W.</name>
                  <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                  <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                  <name>Cox, D.</name>
                  <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                  <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
                  <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                  <name>Polley, H.</name>
                </names>
              </pairs>
            </division.data>
            <division.result>
              <body>
                <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to.</p>
              </body>
            </division.result>
          </division>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Airservices Australia</title>
          <page.no>67</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Airservices Australia</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>67</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>67</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                <name.id>306168</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:39</span>):  I seek leave to amend general business notice of motion No. 724 standing in the name of Senator McKenzie.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="306168" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator KOVACIC:</span>
                    </a>  I amend the motion in the terms circulated in the chamber:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That there be laid on the table by the Minister representing the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government, by no later than midday on 12 October 2026, any records of meetings, meeting notes, meeting minutes and agendas of meetings between the Minister for Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government or the minister's office and Airservices Australia between 1 January and 31 August 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>67</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
                  <name.id>306168</name.id>
                  <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>MATTERS OF URGENCY</title>
        <page.no>68</page.no>
        <type>MATTERS OF URGENCY</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">MATTERS OF URGENCY</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Superannuation</title>
          <page.no>68</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Superannuation</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>68</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Polley, Sen Helen (The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT)</name>
              <name.id>e5x</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="e5x" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT </span>
                  </a>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">(</span>
                  <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator Polley</span>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">)</span> (<span class="HPS-Time">16:40</span>):  Senator Payman has submitted a proposal under standing order 75 today. It is shown at item No. 13 on today's order of business:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The need for the Parliament to expand the criminalisation of wage theft to include the deliberate underpayment of superannuation and to guarantee that Australians aged under 18 are paid superannuation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Is consideration of the proposal supported?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">More than the number of senators required by the standing orders having risen in their places—</span>
                </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>68</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Payman, Sen Fatima</name>
              <name.id>300707</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>AV</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300707" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator PAYMAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australia's Voice Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:41</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The need for the Parliament to expand the criminalisation of wage theft to include the deliberate underpayment of superannuation and to guarantee that Australians aged under 18 are paid superannuation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This parliament has a habit of celebrating progress before the job is done. We pass a reform, we hold a press conference, we declare victory, and then we wonder why Australians are still being left behind. We're doing it again with superannuation. This parliament rightly recognised that unpaid super is a serious problem. That is why payday super was introduced, requiring super contributions for eligible workers to reach their fund shortly after pay day. But we never asked the most basic question. Who actually gets guaranteed super in the first place? We fixed one part of the system, while leaving a much bigger problem untouched.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Superannuation is not a bonus, a gift or a favour from an employer. It is money a worker has already earned and set aside for retirement. If someone takes a worker's wages, we call that theft. It is legislated as theft. So, when a workers super goes missing, it should be treated exactly the same way. That's why I'm advocating for super theft to be investigated and prosecuted by the Fair Work Ombudsman, not brushed off as an administrative hiccup. Every dollar of unpaid super is a dollar stolen from someone's retirement, a dollar that cannot compound, a dollar that cannot grow and a dollar that could mean the difference between security and uncertainty in retirement. The theft happens today, but the damage is felt decades later.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There's an uncomfortable truth sitting right next to this one. Hundreds of thousands of young Australians are being denied guaranteed super before it can even be stolen. Right now, workers under 18 only get guaranteed super once they clock more than 30 hours in a week. Think about who that actually is. It's the teenager stacking shelves after school. It's the uni student serving coffee on the weekends. It's the young worker helping their family cover the rent. They show up. They do the work. They pay tax on what they earn. Yet the law decides that they don't count when it comes to super.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The numbers are staggering. The Super Members Council estimates that around 530,000 under-18 workers will miss out on guaranteed super this financial year alone. That's a combined $411 million in contributions that they'll never see. A typical teen working part-time for two years before turning 18 could lose around $2,500 in contributions now, which compounds into roughly $11,000 less at retirement. It's gone before they can even cast a vote. We tell young people to be financially responsible, to plan ahead and to start saving early. Then, the very first time they enter the workforce, we take the opportunity away from them. That's not fairness and it's definitely not common sense.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We talk a lot in this chamber about the gender super gap. Maybe we should talk more about where it starts. Evidence presented to my office showed that young women are hit the hardest by this exclusion because they're more likely to work part-time hours that fall below the threshold. For too many women, the first gap in their retirement savings is not created at 40; it is created with their very first job. This rule dates back to the creation of the modern super guarantee in 1992. At the time, contribution rates were lower and there were concerns that fees and insurance premiums could erode small balances. Those settings have changed. Contribution rates have gone up and protections have been introduced. Yet this outdated exclusion hasn't moved an inch. We see the workforce has changed, the economy has changed and young Australians have changed, but the law has not. That is exactly what's happening when governments govern through piecemeal reform. They fix the system, ignore the cause and celebrate the announcement, and they leave the worker behind.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">So my message today is very simple: workers do not need another announcement. They need a superannuation system that works as intended—a system where super is paid on time, a system where stolen super is recovered and a system where every worker who earns a wage earns super too.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>69</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Ghosh, Sen Varun</name>
              <name.id>257613</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="257613" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator GHOSH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:46</span>):  Industrial relations reform in this country that advances the interests of workers is done by the trade union movement, it's done by the Australian Labor Party and it's done by Labor governments. This government has introduced the most far-reaching industrial reforms in a generation, and they reflect those commitments, those values and those principles that underpin the Labor movement. It's not just about announcements; it's about actual change.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">When you look at what this government's done and what this government is going to do, you see a transformation in the superannuation system in Australia, and you see a transformation in the way wage theft is dealt with. The Albanese Labor government legislated Australia's first federal criminal offence for intentional underpayments. There's been a strengthening of wage theft penalties. Importantly, there's been the empowerment of the Fair Work Ombudsman and an increase in funding to enforce these claims. There are a number of different measures that have made it easier for both unions and individuals to bring claims to courts and the commission and to get their cases heard.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The key focus of this debate, though, and the key driver of these key reforms has been the Shop, Distributive and Allied Employees Association of Australia and its branches around Australia, its members, its delegates, its industrial officers and its leadership. It's not to say there isn't more work to be done here, but the role of the SDA in relation to being a leading voice on wage theft needs to be acknowledged. The union has run major union funded underpayment class actions. Its underpayment class action against Aldi reached a proposed settlement of $55 million in July 2026, getting money back into the pockets of workers. Its Eudunda Farmers Foodland case settled for $5.5 million in 2025. That was part of a formal submission made to the 2026 wage theft inquiry. That Eudunda case was interesting. It was resolving a case first brought to the Federal Court in 2021. They got money into workers' pockets based on things that they had been denied based on wage theft. I acknowledge there the role of the SDA secretary in South Australia, Josh Peak, who said at the time:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The SDA is proud to have secured $5.5 million in backpay … This is one of the largest retail underpayment cases in South Australian history.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The SDA, along with the ACTU, pressed for the federal wage theft criminalisation provisions that the Labor government has done. That was particularly in response to underpayment and retail scandals at Woolworths and Coles in 2019 and onwards. The Albanese Labor government adopted it and legislated it as part of its Closing Loopholes package. But there is more work to do. It is important that wage theft cases and wage underpayment cases are discovered properly. While the Albanese government has made changes to how unions have access to records, there is probably more work to be done in this space, and we would acknowledge that. We acknowledge that there is an important role for trade unions to be able to enter workplaces and inspect records in order to discover these cases on behalf of workers.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I go to my home state of Western Australia, where, under section 49I of the Industrial Relations Act 1979 (WA), unions have that power. They have the power, the right of entry, to go into workplaces and inspect records and to act on underpayment in wage theft cases. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But that power, in terms of its scope of operation, is limited by the scope of the federal industrial relations powers, so we need an equivalent provision in federal law. Again, the SDA continues to be a leader in this space. I want to take you to something that the national secretary of the SDA, Gerard Dwyer, has said. He's urging the government to restore the rights of unions to inspect time and wage records and conduct spot checks, expand the low-cost small claims jurisdiction, which the Albanese government is in the process of doing, and treat unpaid superannuation explicitly as wage theft. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I also want to acknowledge the role of the SDA and the role of the Labor Party in relation to under-18s' superannuation. The SDA has a long-running campaign, called Super on Every Dollar, which is aimed at ensuring that those people aged under 18 receive superannuation on every dollar they earn, regardless of how many hours a week they work. That's a very important development, and I was proud to be a member and a delegate at the ALP's national conference in July where that was included in the party's platform. What we will come to see is that we will get super on every dollar for those people who are under 18 years of age. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But, to take a big step back on all of this, it is Labor governments, Labor members, the trade union movement and the rank and file of the Labor Party that deliver serious industrial relations reforms in this country. We are in the process of delivering groundbreaking, once-in-a-generation, if not once-in-a-century, industrial relations reform, and credit must go to the Albanese Labor government and the wonderful work of the trade union movement.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>70</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Pocock, Sen Barbara</name>
              <name.id>BFQ</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="BFQ" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BARBARA POCOCK</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:51</span>):  The Greens will always stand up for workers' wages and conditions. It's the most powerless who are most affected by wage theft, and stealing wages from workers, especially workers with low bargaining power—young people, migrants, women—causes serious harm. Evidence to a recent Senate inquiry into wage theft clearly showed that it continues to be a widespread, systemic and entrenched problem across Australian workplaces, and the Greens were proud to support the criminalisation of wage and superannuation theft during the closing loopholes reforms. We need to make sure that our penalties for superannuation and wage theft are fit for purpose and that we increase the resources available to make sure that prevention and repayment are actually enforced. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But I want to move on to the other issue covered by this motion: the need for this Labor government to guarantee that Australians aged under 18 are paid the superannuation that they would be entitled to if there were not discrimination on the basis of age. I listened to Senator Ghosh tell us that Labor will get super for all under-18s. But all the young people out there watching this and thinking about super and wondering what they're going to have in their pay packet next fortnight will be asking Senator Ghosh: when are we going to see Labor actually do what we need here? Right now, hundreds of thousands of young Australians aged under 18 are missing out. Every year, 530,000 young workers are denied the astonishing sum of $411 million in super for no reason other than their age. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Greens have pushed three times to try and get Labor to act and give those young people the super they should be getting. We took this policy to the last election, and last year we tried to amend the government's Treasury Laws Amendment (Payday Superannuation) Bill 2025 to grant all young workers the right to super from their employers. Labor had a chance to back young workers then, but they decided to side with the very wealthy one per cent—those very big supermarkets, Maccas and the fast food industry; those big giants profiting from billions every year. They sided with them over the young people and the $411 million they are owed in their super. Then, just this July, we pushed again to partially disallow this exclusion in regulations and deliver super for young people.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">So, Senator Ghosh, I say to you and to the Labor Party: When are you going to deliver for young workers? When are you going to stop discriminating against them just because they're young and they work part time because they're at school? There are very good reasons why those workers work part time. They are there every afternoon in their hundreds of thousands, and they deserve superannuation. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I'm proud the Greens now have a private member's bill before this very Senate that would improve and change that outdated exclusion. We brought the bill forward because Australia's superannuation should apply to every worker. It's time for young workers to be paid the super they deserve. I've referred this bill to an inquiry and I look forward to hearing from young workers about how this unfair exclusion hurts them. It hurts them every day. It's time to stop boosting the profits of some of Australia's biggest and most profitable corporations by letting them continue to rip off young workers by taking money out of the pockets of those kids under 18 and putting it onto the bottom line of some of our most profitable big corporations. This parliament needs to support the Greens private member's bill and give superannuation to all workers under the age of 18, regardless of how many hours they work. If you earn a wage, you should earn super. If you pay tax and turn up for your job as someone under 18, you should be paid your super.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Greens will continue to fight for those young workers. We will push Labor. It's time Labor delivered for those young workers to remove those restrictions, to remove age discrimination and to pay those workers what they are entitled to. It's time to end that discrimination and shift that money, that $411 billion, from the bottom line of Coles, Woolies and Macca's into the pockets of those young people so they have a decent retirement when their time comes.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>70</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Brown, Sen Carol</name>
              <name.id>F49</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="F49" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator CAROL BROWN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">16:55</span>):  Labor has always believed that people should be paid properly for the work they do and that working Australians should be able to look forward to a secure retirement. This is particularly important for younger Australians. Many are working casual or part-time jobs while studying, helping with household costs and trying to get a start. The super they earn early in their working lives matters, because it has longer to grow and can help make a real difference later in life. At the moment, a worker under 18 generally has to work more than 30 hours a week for an employer before they're entitled to compulsory super. We know that is not how many young people work. They work after school, on weekends and during school holidays. They work in cafes, supermarkets, shops and businesses across the country. They are doing real work and earning real wages. The principle is straightforward. If you're earning a wage, you should also be building super for your future.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We want to strengthen superannuation and make sure working people receive what they are entitled to. That is also why this government has acted on wage theft and unpaid super. From 1 January 2025, deliberate wage theft became a criminal offence under federal law, and those protections include superannuation entitlements. I want to be speak now particularly about Senator Payman's motion. The suggestion that deliberate underpayment of superannuation sits outside the protections this government has put in place is not correct. We know too many workers still miss out on super that they are legally entitled to, particularly younger workers, lower paid workers and casual workers. That is why our focus is on making sure workers receive the money they have earned.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Since 1 July, payday super has begun rolling out, moving us to a system where super is paid at the same time as wages. Super is not an optional extra. It is deferred wages, and it belongs to the worker. Payday super means workers can sooner see whether their superannuation has been paid, and unpaid super is less likely to build up over months. We are also extending support for low-income workers through changes to the low income super tax offset, which will benefit more than a million Australians.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">While we're talking about strengthening super, there is another debate happening that should concern Australians. One Nation wants renters and mortgage holders to be able to divert a quarter of their compulsory superannuation contributions in 2 to two take home pay for up to three years. The superannuation guarantee is now 12 per cent. Under One Nation's proposal, workers would take three percentage points out of their super and spend it today. I understand why that might sound attractive to someone struggling with the cost of living, but there is no free money here. That money comes directly from workers' retirement savings. It means less money going into their super account and less time for that money to grow. Modelling cited by the Assistant Treasurer suggests that someone on the median wage who did this for three years would retire with around $25,000 less in super. For a couple, that would be around $50,000 less. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor does not believe the answer to the cost-of-living pressures today is to make working people poorer when they retire. Superannuation is one of Australia's great economic and social achievements. It's about making sure people who work hard throughout their lives can retire with dignity and security. We have taken the superannuation guarantee to 12 per cent. We are paying super on Commonwealth Paid Parental Leave. We are delivering payday super. We are improving support for lower paid workers, and we will keep looking at practical ways to strengthen the system so it works better for more Australians. Superannuation is a long-term system. Changes made today can have consequences over decades, so reform has to be careful and focused on better outcomes. That is the difference. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>71</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Shoebridge, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>169119</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="169119" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHOEBRIDGE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:00</span>):  I rise to support Senator Payman's motion, which says pretty simple things that you would have thought that the Labor Party would embrace with both hands—the need for the parliament to expand the criminalisation of wage theft to include the deliberate underpayment of superannuation and to guarantee that Australians under 18 are paid superannuation. It is pretty remarkable. I've listened carefully to the Albanese Labor government's position in this debate, and it seems to be that firstly they don't like what One Nation says about superannuation. Well, take a ticket. That's hardly novel. Secondly, they like superannuation. Well, take a ticket. It's popular in the Australian public. And, thirdly, they've moved to payday superannuation. Thankfully my party, the Greens, supported that move, and that's how it got through this parliament. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But what I failed to hear was: why on earth they haven't supported a Greens' bill that's been repeatedly put on the books and amendments we've moved repeatedly, supported by Senator Payman and by the crossbench, except for One Nation; why Labor has repeatedly opposed giving mandatory superannuation to under-18s; and why they said no, not once but twice, to giving mandatory superannuation to under 18s. I've listened carefully, and from what I can tell, it's because Labor doesn't like One Nation. Maybe they talk about unintended consequences or about how you've got to do this carefully. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Every moment Labor faffs around about not supporting the position of actually ensuring that under-18s got their superannuation, which could go through this parliament in a heartbeat, Coles, Woolies, KFC, McDonald's and Bunnings are literally taking money out of the pockets of 16- and 17-year-old workers and put it in their corporate profits. That's what happens. Maybe it is that the SDA has got such a comfortable relationship with the big retailers that they don't want to rock the boat. Those members of the ALP who came here with the SDA are actively trying to say: 'Look, we've got this comfortable arrangement. We get union dues paid out of the wage packets. I don't want to rock that boat and actually make them give our members superannuation.' Is that what it is? There was no explanation given in any of the speeches here today from Labor. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The laws in this country take theft seriously unless it's a corporation doing the theft. Pay packets that come in short are never the pay packets of the CEOs. It's never the pay packets of the HR manager. It's always the pay packets of the least powerful workers. Those with the least are the ones who get cheated. When it comes to under-18s, it's the ones who are already not even getting an adult wage. To watch the Albanese Labor government repeatedly wriggle and squirm and do this kind of jellyfish politics to try and prevent laws going through to make sure that those who are the lowest paid—15-, 16- and 17-year-old workers—actually get their superannuation, to watch the Labor Party wriggle and squirm like some kind of jellyfish or squid to avoid voting for something that would actually make sure they get their superannuation, is not edifying. It's just this government all over. Is it just because the idea hasn't generated from the government benches? Is that why they're against it? Well, tell that to that young worker at Rebel Sport or Sushi Bay. Tell them why you've decided that they don't deserve to get superannuation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It is obviously true that parliament should extend the criminal wage theft framework to cover deliberate superannuation mispayment. It's also obviously true that young workers absolutely deserve their superannuation. I say again that, by continuing to resist this, what is the Albanese Labor government doing? It's taking money out of the pockets of that young worker working in a fast-food outlet and giving it to their corporate mates who fund the Labor Party in the first place. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>72</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
              <name.id>306168</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:05</span>):  Every Australian worker is entitled to be paid what they have earned. Deliberate, intentional underpayment is wrongdoing and should attract strong consequences. But that is not the reality of the question before us. The question is whether parliament should expand a serious criminal offence to superannuation before the existing offence has been properly tested and reviewed, which it hasn't. I chaired the Senate inquiry into the existing criminal wage underpayment offence. The committee was not convinced it was having the intended effect on the small number of businesses that deliberately and persistently underpay their workers. Seventeen months after section 327A commenced and after almost $50 million was committed to a dedicated Fair Work Ombudsman criminal function, experts, unions and practitioners still could not agree whether it had reduced deliberate wage underpayment. At the time of the inquiry, there had not been a single referral for prosecution—not a single one.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Why is this the case? Part of the problem is that wage theft is not even defined in the Fair Work Act. The term is used to describe everything from deliberate exploitation to genuine mistakes that may have been corrected in an extraordinarily complex workplace relations system that is crushing Australian small businesses. Criminal law must distinguish between the two. That complexity is real, and we can't pretend that it is only complex for those who are bad faith actors. The ABC, major charities, major banks and even the Department of Employment and Workplace Relations have struggled to correctly interpret workplace entitlements and have underpaid their workers. Small businesses with a fraction of those resources are expected to navigate that same system and are labelled thieves when, despite their best efforts, they too are sometimes unable to.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Superannuation adds another layer of complexity. Employers must determine the correct earnings base, navigate choice and stapled fund rules, verify fund details, comply with SuperStream and now ensure that contributions reach the correct fund within seven days of pay day. A processing failure, classification error, rejected contribution or system breakdown is not necessarily deliberate theft. The answer to genuine mistakes is to simplify the system—clearer awards, clearer superannuation obligations and less compliance complexity—not to keep expanding the criminal law as though every error reflects dishonesty or a deliberate act.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor's instinct is always the same: if a law isn't working, add another law; if enforcement isn't working, create another offence. The government treats businesses, especially non-unionised small businesses, with outright hostility and contempt, even when it is obvious that they are struggling to navigate the complexity that this government has created.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It is a wonder that business confidence has plummeted. Productivity is lower, and our regulatory burden is higher than the OECD average. Business is drowning under red tape. Since 2000, the number of federal regulations has doubled. The federal rule book has tripled in size, and compliance roles have doubled since 2010. That has a cost. Every hour spent navigating unnecessary complexity is an hour not spent hiring, investing, innovating or improving productivity. Good policy should do two things: come down hard on deliberate exploitation and make it easier for honest employers to get it right. Don't set them up to fail with your complexity. This government can't get either right. They should make the laws we already have work. Workers deserve effective enforcement, and businesses doing the right thing deserve a system that they can actually comply with.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Economy</title>
          <page.no>72</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Economy</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>72</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Polley, Sen Helen (The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT)</name>
              <name.id>e5x</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="e5x" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT </span>
                  </a>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">(</span>
                  <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator Polley</span>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">)</span> (<span class="HPS-Time">17:11</span>):  The Senate will now consider the proposal, under standing order 75, from Senator Collins, which is also shown at item 13 of today's Order of Business:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The need to expose the Albanese Government's increasingly desperate attempts to convince Australians they are better off, when real wages are falling, housing is becoming less affordable and, as Labor elder Bill Kelty has warned, Australians cannot pay their bills with the Treasurer's economic spin.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Is consideration of the proposal supported?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">More than the number of senators required by the standing orders having risen in their places—</span>
                </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span class="HPS-OfficeContinuation">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT:</span>  With the concurrence of the Senate, the clerks will set the clock in line with the informal arrangements made by the whips.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <continue>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>73</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT, The</name>
                <name.id>10000</name.id>
                <electorate />
                <party />
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </continue>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>73</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Collins, Sen Jessica</name>
              <name.id>297964</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="297964" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator COLLINS</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:11</span>):  I move:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That, in the opinion of the Senate, the following is a matter of urgency:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">The need to expose the Albanese Government's increasingly desperate attempts to convince Australians they are better off, when real wages are falling, housing is becoming less affordable and, as Labor elder Bill Kelty has warned, Australians cannot pay their bills with the Treasurer's economic spin.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This is an urgent matter because we heard here, in question time yesterday, that the government continues to deceive the Australian people about the economy, and so I rise to expose the Albanese Labor government's increasingly desperate attempts to convince Australians they are better off, because they are not. I say to Australia that, if you feel poorer, that's because you are poorer. The Treasurer offers clever economic spin, but, as Labor luminary Bill Kelty warns, everyday Australians cannot pay their bills with the Treasurer's broken promises while real wages are falling and housing is becoming completely unaffordable. Everything costs more under Labor.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Look at Labor's trifecta of housing failure: fewer homes, higher rents and smashed market confidence. Property tax changes under Labor's budget will stunt construction and lower our national GDP by $1 billion. Let's look closer at the human impact. We now see reports that first home buyers under the five per cent deposit scheme now in negative equity has jumped fivefold in one single month. Young Australians were sold a dud policy and are now financially worse off because of Labor's economic gaslighting. That is why this motion is urgent. Australians need to understand what they are getting themselves into in Labor's bad policy, and, every day that passes, the Labor government pushes a narrative that is simply not true.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Australian people need to hear this debate because the longer it continues, the more misinformation that is peddled. Here we are in the Senate to correct the record today. Let's return to housing. Under Labor, just 173,000 homes are built a year, falling roughly 335,000 short of its own 1.2 million home target. At the same time, builders are going broke. Nearly 13,000 construction businesses have suffered insolvency since Labor took office. That is 60 builders collapsing every single week. The coalition brought more homes every year than Labor, and we didn't need a defective $40 billion housing fund to do so. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Rents have soared 24.8 per cent under Labor, vastly outstripping wage growth of 16.1 per cent, with the median rent sitting at $670 a week. By Labor's own admission, its budget tax hikes mean higher rents and 35,000 fewer homes over the next decade. You simply cannot tax your way out of a housing shortage. Housing has never been less affordable. Mortgage affordability reached an all-time low in 2025-26. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Now, let's talk wage theft. Australians are going backwards, plain and simple. Labor's reckless spending is driving up inflation and everyday workers are paying the price. The latest ABS data exposes the reality: wages rose just 0.8 per cent in the June quarter, reaching 3.2 per cent annually. Headline inflation hit 3.8 per cent over the same period. That means a 0.6 per cent real pay cut for Australian workers. Your hard work is buying less than it did last year. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Instead of reining in out-of-control budget spending, the Albanese government refuses to tame the inflation beast. Labor's policy choices actively smash household budgets, leaving families poorer at the checkout, at the bowser and on their mortgages. Adding insult to injury, public sector wages grew at 3.4 per cent. Bureaucrats are pulling ahead while taxpayers foot the bill. At the same time, every pay rise Australians have had has been completely wiped out by Labor's homegrown inflation crisis. Real wages are back at the levels of 2011. The verdict is clear: Labor's economic failures are shrinking your pay cheque. Australians can't afford this government. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Here's the urgency. Here's our message: there is a better way. The coalition's plan to fix the economy and protect our way of life will cap migration to housing completions, invest $5 billion in infrastructure to unlock 400,000 homes, slash construction red tape by up to $70,000 per build and axe Labor's housing taxes. Better yet, our tax back guarantee will end wage theft by indexing income tax thresholds to inflation, delivering $250 in relief in year 1, scaling to $1,000 in year 4. Ending bracket creep is bold economic policy. We will deliver lower taxes, cheaper power, less migration and more homes to get Australia back on track. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>73</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Whiteaker, Sen Ellie</name>
              <name.id>316555</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="316555" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator WHITEAKER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:17</span>):  In response to this motion put by Senator Collins, I remind the chamber that when Labor came to government the wage share of national income was sitting at 49 per cent. Today, under our government, it is 54.3 per cent—the highest it has been in a decade. That's because our government is creating jobs and getting wages moving again. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">When we came to office real wages were in freefall, and it has taken sensible and disciplined economic management to turn that around. Let's be clear about where that damage that we inherited on coming to government came from. Two-thirds of the fall in real wages since the 2001 peak happened on the coalition's watch, so it's always a little strange when those opposite walk into this place and claim that they're better economic managers. Frankly, the evidence just doesn't stack up. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We shouldn't sugarcoat things. These are tough times. Inflation is higher than any of us would like, and real wages have slipped in the most recent data. Globally, the pressure is on, and we know that it's tough for people out there, but, if we look at the bigger picture, wages have grown in eight of the last 11 quarters. Those opposite have shown, time and time again, that they don't believe in higher wages for Australians. In fact, when they were last in government, they had a deliberate policy of keeping wages down. That's no solution to the cost of living for Australian families. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Our government is focused on pulling every lever we can to help Aussie families while those opposite vote against our plan for higher wages and vote against our plan for tax cuts time and time again. It doesn't make any sense. When we back workers, when we back families, the Liberal Party stand in the way. It's as simple as that. Whenever we have stepped in to help Australians with the cost of living, those opposite have taken every opportunity to vote against it, to stand in the way of that work. Tax cuts, wage rises, our plan to build more homes, our tax changes for housing investors, cheaper medicines, bulk-billing, fully funding our public schools, better funding for public hospitals—the list goes on and on and on.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We're all familiar, I'm sure, with the line from Benjamin Franklin, 'In this world, nothing can be said to be certain except for death and taxes.' But what seems to be certain right now is that the Liberal Party will stand in the way of our work to help Australians with the cost of living. Labor has cut income taxes five times in five ways since coming to government. That's $3,000 a year back in the pockets of the average workers by 2028. I don't see how those opposite can call that economic spin. That is real money back in the pockets of Australians. We know people are doing it tough, and the first port of call is cutting taxes and lifting their wages.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Does anyone in this chamber remember the genius idea the Liberals took to the last election? No, I'm not talking about the $600 billion nuclear plan. No, I'm not talking about their attacks on working from home. I'm not even talking about their plan to gut the Public Service so that 41,000 Aussies would lose their jobs. I'm not even talking about their plan for higher taxes. I'm talking about their idea that the bosses should get taxpayer funded lunches. I think some people in this chamber had forgotten about that, but I tell you what, I haven't forgotten about that. Absolutely insane. That was their solution to the cost of living at the last election. It's almost laughable.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In contrast, Labor wants workers to earn more and keep more of what they earn. We will continue to do what we can to help Australians with the cost of living and to deliver real change.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>74</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McKim, Sen Nick</name>
              <name.id>JKM</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="JKM" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McKIM</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australian Greens Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:22</span>):  The neoliberal project so beloved of Labor and coalition governments over many decades has broken Australia's social contract. People used to be told that if they worked hard, if they got a good education, they could afford the basics that we all need to lead a good and dignified life. But we can't say that to young people anymore. Just ask any young person how things are going for them right now. Youth allowance is below the poverty line. Young people are working two or three jobs just to get through uni. They're paying tens of thousands of dollars for a degree their parents and just about everyone in government got for free, while they watch artificial intelligence smash their future career opportunities. If they do get a job, their wages are buying less and less and less over time. Meanwhile, it's almost impossible to buy a house unless you've got super wealthy parents, which leaves most young people living in rentals where the landlord can hike the rents just as often as they can get away with. And you've got climate change and international geopolitical instability looming large over all of that.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor has been in power for four years and things are getting worse, not better, for young Australians. Bill Kelty is absolutely right that the Treasurer's economic spin is insulting, and it's particularly insulting for young people. Honestly, Labor sometimes forget they're even in government. They need to make a choice—a choice to do something, a choice to make young people's lives better rather than just produce spin while young people watch their future turn to dust. Here are just five things that Labor could do today, right now, to improve the lives of young people here in Australia—make TAFE and uni genuinely free, freeze rents, put dental and mental health into Medicare, stop approving new coal and gas mines and stop supporting the genocide in Palestine. You can pay for what you need to pay for out of that list by making big corporations and the superwealthy one per cent pay their fair share of tax. Unlike Labor, the Greens will always be here for young Australians.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>74</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Dean</name>
              <name.id>241710</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="241710" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DEAN SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:25</span>):  Labor is in crisis. Labor's budget is in crisis. Labor luminaries are now criticising Labor prime ministers and Labor treasurers. None other than Bill Kelty, the former secretary of the Australian Council of Trade Unions, has called it out. He has said that the approach of Dr Jim Chalmers, the Labor Treasurer, is insulting to voters. Bill Kelty has said that Labor is actively isolating itself from traditional Labor voters. Bill Kelty has said that Labor's spin will not fix the economy.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">'Who is Bill Kelty?' I hear you ask. Bill Kelty is the architect of the Prices and Incomes Accord. He is part-architect of compulsory superannuation in this country. He is part-architect of restoring Medicare. He is part-architect of the consolidation of the Australian trade union movement in our recent past. So this is no ordinary Labor person criticising the Labor Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese, and the Labor Treasurer. This is, if you like, the king of the Australian labour movement criticising the Labor Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese, and the Labor Treasurer, Jim Chalmers.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But Bill Kelty is just saying to Australians what they already know—that life has got much harder for Australians and that Australian families are getting poorer and poorer by the day. After four years of the Albanese Labor government, Australians are working harder than ever but falling further behind. Every trip to the supermarket costs more. Electricity bills continue to rise. Insurance premiums have surged. Mortgage repayments remain painfully high and will go higher if economist predictions are correct. Those predictions are for two further RBA rate rises in this year alone. Rents continue to climb, and small businesses are struggling under higher wages, higher energy costs, higher borrowing costs and an ever-growing mountain of regulation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This is not bad luck. It is the consequence of four years of economic mismanagement by this Albanese Labor government. Labor has fuelled inflation through reckless spending and then quietly profited through bracket creep. Australians who receive a pay rise simply to keep pace with inflation are pushed into higher brackets and pay more tax despite being no better off. Labor calls it economic management. It is stealth tax on hard work and aspiration. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Nowhere is Labor's failure more obvious than on housing. The Albanese government encouraged thousands of young Australians into the housing market with just a five per cent deposit while simultaneously driving demand through record migration and failing to increase housing supply. As housing markets have cooled and economists warn now of further price falls, thousands of first home buyers, particularly in Perth's outer suburbs in my home state, are being left exposed to negative equity, owing more on their mortgage than their home is worth. These young Western Australians did exactly what the government encouraged them to do. They worked hard, they saved for their deposit and they bought their first home. Labor has rewarded that ambition by leaving many burdened with record debt and virtually no financial buffer. Of course, Labor's record migration has only made the matter worse. Population growth has far outstripped housing construction, placing ever greater pressure on housing affordability, rents and essential infrastructure.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There is a better way. The coalition will restore balance by ensuring that migration is linked to the nation's capacity to build homes and to provide the infrastructure communities need. The coalition also believes that Australians should come first. Our migration and welfare systems must prioritise Australian citizens, protect the integrity of our borders and ensure that those who embrace Australian values and contribute to our nation are the most welcomed, while maintaining a sustainable migration program that works in Australia's national interest. Labor is in crisis. The budget is in tatters, and Labor voters around the country are now being left with nowhere to hide. Things are about to get significantly worse for Australian families under Labor.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>75</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Darmanin, Sen Lisa</name>
              <name.id>301128</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="301128" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DARMANIN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Government Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:30</span>):  I think that what this debate is actually showing this afternoon is the increasingly desperate attempts from those opposite to try to convince Australians that the coalition are better economic managers. It's actually the coalition that is in crisis, not Labor. Australians know better. They can see the track record that is relevant and credible when it comes to who has the backs of workers and who can manage the economy.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I'm not sure about urgent, but this motion is quite remarkable, if only because it requires those opposite to ignore their own record and their own policies on exactly this matter. Those over there want to lecture the Australian community about wages, cost of living and housing affordability. When Labor came into government back in 2022, inflation was higher and rising, interest rates were rising, and real wages were going backwards. In fact, real wages were falling by 3.6 per cent. That didn't happen by accident. It happened because those opposite viewed low wage growth as a feature of their economic strategy. Those opposite spent a decade presiding over wage stagnation. It's getting really tedious to hear lectures on wage growth from the political party that treated low wage growth as an economic achievement. They could not even bring themselves to support a modest increase in the minimum wage for Australia's lowest paid workers. When I say modest, it was $1 an hour—a $1 increase that those opposite could not support. Don't lecture us about wages.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Senator Collins talked about wage theft, yet the coalition voted against the laws to criminalise wage theft. You've suddenly realised that Australians want higher wages. What a shame that you spent a decade suppressing them. Let's not forget that you voted against other workplace reforms, like same job, same pay and multi-employer bargaining. Does that ring a bell? These are the real policies that help move wages.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Far from relying on a narrative, as Senator Collins talked about, we have focused on action. This government has backed minimum wage increases. We have backed increases to the modern award because we understand the simple truth—one of the best ways to help with Australians' cost of living is to help Australians earn more. The latest ABS data shows that nominal wages have grown above three per cent for 16 consecutive quarters. It's the first time this has occurred in 17 years. Not once during the 35 quarters of the former government did wage growth exceed three per cent. Is there more to do? Of course there is, but we are getting on with it. No-one on this side of the chamber pretends otherwise. We recognise that there is more to do, and so we've implemented practical measures that make a difference—higher wages, tax cuts for every taxpayer, six months of paid parental leave, cheaper child care, cheaper medicines and policies that continue to bring inflation down. Meanwhile, those opposite vote against these practical measures, and, instead of admitting why they're doing it—that is, because they don't want working Australians to earn more—they hide behind the words of Bill Kelty.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Then we come to housing. The opposition's housing analysis seems to consist of reading the headline and skipping the article. It's a bit like declaring that winter is over because yesterday was warmer than the day before. Like all good Victorians, I know about a false spring. They saw one quarterly figure, got excited and forgot to check what happened over the previous 12 months. They consider a 0.3 per cent dip to be a housing crash. Let me put this into perspective. When the Howard government first implemented their investor tax breaks 26 years ago, the average dwelling price was equal to nine years and four months worth of disposable household income. Today, it is equal to 17 years and four months of that income. That is because, between 1997 and 2025, property values grew three times faster than wages.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">At the centre of this is something very obvious. We need to make it easier for people to buy their first home. That is why our focus is on improving wage growth and levelling the playing field for first home buyers. The coalition, meanwhile, want to focus on headlines. They do not support our measures and they do not have a sensible proposal of their own. We're increasing supply and tackling the structural causes of the housing shortage. What we're not doing is pretending that one quarterly statistic changes the underlying picture. Australians know there is more work to do and that we are getting on with doing it. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>76</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Roberts, Sen Malcolm</name>
              <name.id>266524</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="266524" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator ROBERTS</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:35</span>):  I thank Senator Collins for this motion, which One Nation supports. Labor elder Bill Kelty has warned that Australians cannot pay their bills with the Treasurer's spin. Last week, the Treasurer indulged in spin yet again when he said that six out of seven jobs created during the Albanese government were in the private sector. No, they were not. Seventy per cent of the jobs created under Treasurer Chalmers are in the care economy, which is government funded, not the private sector. This did not stop the Minister for Finance, though, repeating the line yesterday in question time. Truth be damned with you lot!</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Labor government is running up deficits to directly fund jobs to keep the economy from going into a recession. We are already in a per capita recession! Net zero madness and insane regulations are destroying huge numbers of private sector jobs. Mosaic Brands lost 950 jobs; Fortescue, 700 jobs; and Telstra, another 650 jobs. The Whyalla steelworks lost 600 jobs yesterday, although Minister Bowen's $1.9 billion handout of taxpayer money to fund a green steel arc furnace powered using weather-dependent solar and wind is still trying. Taxpayers can kiss that money goodbye. The Tomago smelter stood to lose 1,000 jobs until the government bailed them out with $2.5 billion of taxpayers' money to secure heavily subsidised, expensive power in the Hunter. It's a shame local residents didn't get the same deal. They're really struggling from high electricity prices and high petrol prices, after the Labor government reversed the fuel excise cut and put fuel up 32c a litre yesterday.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Under Treasurer Chalmers, Australian wages have gone backwards by five per cent. Headline inflation is at three per cent and rising, outpacing wage rises, forcing mortgage rates up and trapping many people who signed up for the Treasurer's five per cent deposit scheme in negative equity. 'Spin' doesn't come close to expressing the anger everyday Australians are feeling towards the Albanese government.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>76</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
              <name.id>283585</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="283585" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:37</span>):  I thank Senator Collins for bringing this important urgency motion before us today. Despite all the promises and announcements, it is clear that this government is failing to deliver the relief that Australian families need from this relentless cost-of-living pressure that they are all under. The economic mismanagement of this government is astounding, and it's been felt right across Australia.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In my home state of Western Australia, the <span style="font-style:italic;">West Australian</span> reported a story last week about the economic pain that's been felt by one couple in Perth. This couple pays about $2,450 per month towards the mortgage for their two-by-one villa. Another rate rise this month would likely add at least $50 to that figure. This is how they put it:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">Why should we bear the brunt of bad management? Surely there are better ways and more meaningful ways in the long term to try to sort this wild inflation out.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Well, they're right. They shouldn't be bearing the brunt of the bad management of this government. Unfortunately, more economic pain is coming for households, and nothing this government is doing is doing anything at all to alleviate it.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor Party luminary Bill Kelty was spot on when he said that real wages have fallen by five per cent. He said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">Real wages are not improving in any significant way—they're falling.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Well, that's true. You only had to visit the state electorate of Secret Harbour during the recent by-election to know just how unimpressed voters are with the smoke and mirrors and the economic tricks that are presented by this government. They know that every time they buy groceries, fill up their car or pay for things they are seeing the impact of inflation that's more than it should be. With oil again reaching $110 a barrel at one point in overnight trade, these voters know that even more pain is coming and that another interest rate rise is likely. Financial markets today have already priced in an 84 per cent chance that rates will go up later this month. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The voters in Secret Harbour know that when the Treasurer says workers should be happy because their wage share is increasing but their real wages are falling it's just ridiculous. Bill Kelty was also right when he said it's ridiculous and it's insulting. I've been saying for quite some time in this place that if this government does not get fair dinkum about national productivity Australian families will continue to see their standard of living decline. The government has two jobs: break inflation and fix productivity. Australians are working harder than ever, yet too many families are finding it harder and harder to get ahead. Every extra dollar spent on groceries, fuel, electricity or mortgages is a dollar that cannot be spent on building a better future for themselves and their families. After four years of promises, Australians are entitled to ask: where is the plan to genuinely reduce those cost-of-living pressures? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Temporary rebates and headline announcements are no substitute for long-term economic reform. Australia cannot spend its way out of inflation, nor can it regulate its way to prosperity. The key to restoring living standards is higher productivity, lower inflation and stronger economic growth. Businesses need confidence to invest, workers need opportunities to advance, and families need relief from the relentless cost-of-living increases. But the warning signs are flashing red. The latest NAB monthly business survey found business confidence remains well below its long-run average, while business conditions have fallen into negative territory for the first time in six years. Businesses are telling this government that higher costs, weaker demand and economic uncertainty are making it harder to invest, grow and enable Australians to employ more people. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Australians deserve an economic plan that rewards effort, encourages enterprise and lifts those living standards. Until this government gets serious about tackling inflation and improving productivity, households will continue to fall behind. Australians expect better from this government. They expect more from this government, and they are demanding more and better performance from this government. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="112096" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The PRESIDENT:</span>
                  </a>  The question is that the urgency motion as moved by Senator Collins be agreed.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal"> </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>77</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Lines, Sen Sue (The PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>112096</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
        <division>
          <division.header>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionPreamble">The Senate divided. [17:47]<br />(The President—Senator Lines)</p>
            </body>
          </division.header>
          <division.data>
            <ayes>
              <num.votes>31</num.votes>
              <title>AYES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Allman-Payne, P. J.</name>
                <name>Antic, A.</name>
                <name>Babet, R. D.</name>
                <name>Bell, S.</name>
                <name>Bleyer, V. E.</name>
                <name>Blyth, L.</name>
                <name>Bragg, A. J.</name>
                <name>Brockman, W. E.</name>
                <name>Canavan, M. J.</name>
                <name>Colbeck, R. M.</name>
                <name>Collins, J. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Duniam, J. R.</name>
                <name>Gatenby, C.</name>
                <name>Hanson-Young, S. C.</name>
                <name>Henderson, S. M.</name>
                <name>Hodgins-May, S.</name>
                <name>Hume, J.</name>
                <name>Liddle, K. J.</name>
                <name>McDonald, S. E.</name>
                <name>McGrath, J. A.</name>
                <name>McKim, N. J.</name>
                <name>McLachlan, A. L.</name>
                <name>Payman, F.</name>
                <name>Pocock, B.</name>
                <name>Roberts, M. I.</name>
                <name>Sharma, D. N.</name>
                <name>Shoebridge, D. M.</name>
                <name>Smith, D. A.</name>
                <name>Steele-John, J. A.</name>
                <name>Waters, L. J.</name>
                <name>Whitten, T.</name>
              </names>
            </ayes>
            <noes>
              <num.votes>20</num.votes>
              <title>NOES</title>
              <names>
                <name>Ananda-Rajah, M.</name>
                <name>Ayres, T.</name>
                <name>Brown, C. L.</name>
                <name>Chisholm, A. D.</name>
                <name>Ciccone, R.</name>
                <name>Darmanin, L. (Teller)</name>
                <name>Dolega, J.</name>
                <name>Dowling, R.</name>
                <name>Ghosh, V.</name>
                <name>Green, N. L.</name>
                <name>Lines, S.</name>
                <name>McAllister, J. R.</name>
                <name>Polley, H.</name>
                <name>Sheldon, A. V.</name>
                <name>Smith, M. F.</name>
                <name>Sterle, G.</name>
                <name>Stewart, J. N. A.</name>
                <name>Walker, C.</name>
                <name>Walsh, J. C.</name>
                <name>Whiteaker, E.</name>
              </names>
            </noes>
            <pairs>
              <num.votes>9</num.votes>
              <title>PAIRS</title>
              <names>
                <name>Cadell, R. P.</name>
                <name>Watt, M. P.</name>
                <name>Cash, M. C.</name>
                <name>Wong, P.</name>
                <name>Chandler, C.</name>
                <name>Farrell, D. E.</name>
                <name>Kovacic, M.</name>
                <name>Cox, D.</name>
                <name>McKenzie, B. G.</name>
                <name>Grogan, K.</name>
                <name>Nampijinpa Price, J. S.</name>
                <name>Mulholland, C.</name>
                <name>O'Sullivan, M. A.</name>
                <name>McCarthy, M.</name>
                <name>Ruston, A.</name>
                <name>Tyrrell, T. M.</name>
                <name>Scarr, P. M.</name>
                <name>Gallagher, K. R.</name>
              </names>
            </pairs>
          </division.data>
          <division.result>
            <body>
              <p class="HPS-DivisionFooter">Question agreed to. </p>
            </body>
          </division.result>
        </division>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>PETITIONS</title>
        <page.no>78</page.no>
        <type>PETITIONS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">PETITIONS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Gaza</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Gaza</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>78</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Shoebridge, Sen David</name>
              <name.id>169119</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="169119" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHOEBRIDGE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:50</span>):  by leave—I table a non-conforming petition signed by 124,665 supporters of Amnesty International in relation to the ongoing genocide of Palestinians in Gaza.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>78</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Consideration</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Consideration</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">Documents reserved for future debate will be listed on the <span style="font-style:italic;">Notice Paper</span>.</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>78</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">COMMITTEES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Environment and Communications References Committee</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="34" type="Committee">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Environment and Communications References Committee</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Additional Information</title>
            <page.no>78</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Additional Information</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>78</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Hanson-Young, Sen Sarah</name>
                <name.id>I0U</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="I0U" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator HANSON-YOUNG</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Manager of Australian Greens Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:51</span>):  I present additional information received by the Environment and Communications References Committee in our inquiry into the algal blooms in South Australia.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Environment and Communications Legislation Committee</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="16" type="Committee">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Environment and Communications Legislation Committee</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Additional Information</title>
            <page.no>78</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Additional Information</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>78</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Sheldon, Sen Tony</name>
                <name.id>168275</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="168275" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator SHELDON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Chief Government Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:52</span>):  On behalf the chair of the Environment and Communications Legislation Committee, I present additional information received by the committee on its inquiry into the Online Safety Amendment (Strengthening Enforcement for the Social Media Minimum Age) Bill 2026.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>COVID-19 Select Committee, Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Legislation Committee, Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee</title>
          <page.no>78</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">COVID-19 Select Committee</span>
              </p>
              <a href="32" type="Committee">
                <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Legislation Committee</span>
                </p>
              </a>
            </p>
            <a href="42" type="Committee">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Government Response to Report</title>
            <page.no>78</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Government Response to Report</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>78</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:52</span>):  I present four government responses to committee reports as listed at item 15 on today's Order of Business. In accordance with the usual practice, I seek leave to have the documents incorporated into <span style="font-style:italic;">Hansard</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Leave granted.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">The documents read as follows—</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Australian Government response to the Senate Select Committee on COVID-19: Third Interim Report—Public Interest Immunity Claims</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">SEPTEMBER 2026</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response to the recommendations</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian Government response</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation. However, given the passage of time since the report was tabled in December 2021, a substantive Government response is no longer considered appropriate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The department (then the former Department of Health and Aged Care) did, however, provide input into the Commonwealth Government COVID-19 Response Inquiry.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">______</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Australian Government Response to the Report of the Senate Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Legislation Committee on the Defence Force Discipline Amendment (RCDVS Implementation and Related Measures No. 1) Bill 2026</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">August 2026</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Introduction</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 14 May 2026, the Defence Force Discipline Amendment (RCDVS Implementation and Related Measures No. 1) Bill 2026 (the Bill) was referred to the Senate Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Legislation Committee (the Committee) for inquiry and report by 31 July 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 31 July 2026, the Committee tabled its report on the Bill. The Bill seeks to implement the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide (RCDVS) recommendations relating to sexual violence, unacceptable behaviour and military justice.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Bill introduces significant reforms to Australia's military discipline framework, including measures to modernise the treatment of mental health in the military justice system, and a range of reforms aimed at improving fairness, efficiency and accountability. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Bill seeks to use this opportunity to go beyond the minimum measures necessary to implement the RCDVS recommendations, by implementing the broader RCDVS intent to create a streamlined, modernised and people-focused military justice system.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Report made five recommendations. In addition, the Coalition Senators and the Jacqui Lambie Network also made additional comments. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government's response to those recommendations and additional comments is set out below: </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 1</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Committee recommends the following additional measures to address historical discrimination against LGBTIQA+ personnel and veterans:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">on request by an affected person, the Department of Defence should annotate any relevant Defence records to acknowledge that the action or outcome in question arose wholly or partly from conduct, status or circumstances relating to that person's sexual orientation or gender identity that would not constitute an offence under current Australia law or breach current Australian Defence Force policy;</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">the Department of Defence should offer a Certificate of Honourable Service to personnel and veterans impacted by historical discriminatory policies; and</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">the Australian Government should issue a formal apology acknowledging any harm experienced by LGBTIQA+ personnel and veterans as a result of historical discriminatory policies.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees</span> with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Administrative amendment of records will be achieved through separate amendments to subordinate Defence legislation. These amendments are intended to facilitate annotation of records and the provision of correspondence, acknowledging where a member's separation from service was connected to the application of a historical discriminatory policy. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Certificates of service are available to personnel who request them and, while they are not annotated as relating to 'honourable' service, the applicant's records will be annotated to reflect the 'no-fault' nature of their separation. This ensures compliance with the <span style="font-style:italic;">Archives Act 1983</span> and makes the records available to the individual.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government agrees to issue a formal apology acknowledging any harm experienced by LGBTIQA+ personnel and veterans as a result of historical discriminatory policies. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 2</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government continue its efforts to fully implement Recommendation 18 of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees </span>with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government has prioritised implementation of the agreed recommendations of the RCDVS Final Report. On commencement of the Bill, the proposed changes to suspension powers in Schedule 1 will enable associated instructions and policies to be updated to fully implement RCDVS Recommendation 18.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government recognises that legislative reform is only one element of implementing the RCDVS recommendations. The Chiefs of Service Committee has committed to a dedicated program of training and policy reform to support implementation of the Bill, including training for commanders on the management of military justice matters and the application of the revised suspension framework.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 3</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Committee recommends that Part 2 of Schedule 1 of the Bill be amended so that an offender's rank is treated as </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">an aggravating factor only when the offender is of a higher rank than the victim as originally intended by Recommendation 20(b) of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">notes</span> this recommendation. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 4</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Committee recommends that the Defence and Veterans' Service Commission conduct a review into the effectiveness of the Bill within 24 months of the commencement of all schedules and table its findings in Parliament.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees-in-part</span> with this recommendation. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Defence and Veterans' Service Commission is required to conduct inquiries into the implementation of the RCDVS recommendations. This is specified in its standing functions set out in section 10 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Defence and Veterans' Service Commissioner Act 2026</span> with a relevant statutory reporting date of 2 December 2030. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Defence and Veterans' Service Commission will review the effectiveness of the relevant measures of the Bill that contribute to the implementation of RCDVS recommendations through this reporting obligation. A report will be provided to the Minister by 2 December 2030 and tabled in Parliament thereafter, which is later than the timeframe proposed by the Committee (noting the latest implementation of all schedules of the Bill is to be 1 January 2028). </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Other provisions contained in the Bill may be considered as part of other inquiries undertaken by the Commission into serving and ex-serving member wellbeing at the discretion of the Commissioner.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Additional Comments from Coalition Senators</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 1 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Australian Government needs to better justify to the Australian Defence Force community its deviation from the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide on suspension from duty while under investigation as included in Schedule 1, Part 1 of the Bill.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees</span> with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The justification is that the Bill is not only intended to implement the necessary outcomes of the RCDVS recommendations, but seeks to use this opportunity to implement the broader RCDVS intent of creating a streamlined, modernised and people-focused military justice system.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The measure promotes consistency with other suspension provisions and is necessary to practically implement the RCDVS intent in Recommendation 18, noting the exact scope of offending will not be known at the time of investigation. Limiting the measure to specified classes of offences would reduce the practical ability of commanders to utilise this tool to achieve the protective purpose of the Bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 2</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Defence Mental Health Tribunal (DMHT) Framework should be deferred and considered alongside the Defence Legislation Amendment (RCDVS Implementation and Related Measures No. 2) Bill 2026.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">notes</span> this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The proposed DMHT framework modernises the existing regime that deals with mental incapacity and unfitness, to plead before service tribunals, and thus should remain as part of this Bill, which amends the <span style="font-style:italic;">Defence Force Discipline Act 1982</span>. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes that the DMHT modernises the existing mental incapacity regime and is aligned with civilian best practice. It is only used if a person is found unfit to plead, or not criminally responsible for their actions due, to mental impairment reaching the high threshold of incapacity. It is a measure designed to align critical community safety measures with the protective measures available in civilian jurisdictions, where a person commits serious misconduct that may put community safety at risk.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes the concerns raised by the Coalition, regarding the use of the PM008—Referral for a Mental Health/Psychological Assessment and Management Advice form, and the finding in the IGADF <span style="font-style:italic;">Inquiry into the Weaponisation of the Military Justice System </span>Report that the use of this process has entrenched stigma, mistrust and perceptions of misuse. The Government notes that a comprehensive response to the IGADF <span style="font-style:italic;">Inquiry into the Weaponisation of the Military Justice System</span> Report is being progressed separately. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 3</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Protect the independence of the Director of Military Prosecutions by clarifying that the Minister for Defence will not be able to direct the Director of Military Prosecutions to undertake prosecutions in relation to specific Defence Force members.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees</span> with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Minister for Defence will not be able to direct the Director of Military Prosecutions to undertake prosecutions in relation to a specific Defence Force member. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This reflects the operation of section 87 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Defence Force Discipline Act 1982</span>, which requires that the Director of Military Prosecutions form the independent belief, on reasonable grounds, that a person has committed a service offence before charging them.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 4</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Government mitigates risks associated with civilian investigating officers and confirms no corporations will be contracted to provide investigations officers.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government<span style="font-weight:bold;"> partially agrees </span>with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The appointment of such civilian investigators is controlled by delegation from the Chief of the Defence Force. The limitations set out in the Bill require appointed civilian investigators to work alongside Australian Defence Force investigators. Appointed civilian investigators do not have powers to charge a person with a service offence, seek a sum against a person for a service offence, request a physical search of a person under the <span style="font-style:italic;">Defence Force Discipline Act 1982</span>, and is limited in terms of requesting photographs, fingerprints and exercise of powers by force under the Act.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This measure supports better use of consultant experts by allowing them to directly collect evidence under the provision. The Government notes that this measure supports the use of specialists, structured in a way so that they must work alongside Australian Defence Force investigators. The full suite of investigative powers (such as coercive powers) are not given to non-Australian Defence Force investigators, and this measure will result in an uplift in the Australian Defence Force investigative capability, rather than contract it out as suggested. By formalising the manner in which consultants or external experts may participate in investigations, this measure enhances transparency by making clear the role and functions of these investigators under the Act.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Additional Comments from Jacqui Lambie Network</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 1</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Australian Government should amend the Bill to ensure that the key features of the Defence Mental Health Tribunal (DMHT), including the appointment, qualifications, tenure, independence, jurisdiction and core procedural safeguards applying to Tribunal members, are prescribed in the primary legislation rather than left to delegated legislation.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">notes</span> this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Bill already includes procedural safeguards that limit the powers of the DMHT and sets out the minimum qualification requirements for members of the Tribunal. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Specifically, procedural safeguards related to command review, time limits, limits on the types of orders available to the DMHT, and an oversight regime (through command review and petition and appeal rights) exist under the Bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes that the Bill allows delegated legislation to provide for the specific terms of orders, necessary to align with the treatment processes in the state or territory regime under which the affected person receives mental health treatment. The Government notes that listing specific treatment options in primary legislation also risks the regime diverging from state and territory best practices.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 2</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Australian Government should amend the Bill to require that the categories of equipment that Defence Police may carry, handle and use are prescribed in primary legislation.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">notes</span> this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Bill introduces powers to authorise military police to use certain equipment, and to authorise specified persons to carry or handle the equipment (to support its use by military police), as prescribed in a legislative instrument. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This replaces the current requirement for individual state and territory agreements to be reached in respect of the suite of policing equipment used by military police, which mirrors the equipment that civilian police use to perform their functions. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">It will allow the carriage and use of body-worn cameras while undertaking military police functions, and streamline the authorities currently required to store, maintain and carry other equipment, such as conducted energy weapons (also known by the brand name of 'Taser'). </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The basis for use of such weapons will not be changed by this measure. For example, the use of conducted energy weapons will still only be lawful in circumstances of self-defence where other responses were not reasonably available. With this measure, if such a circumstance arose military police would have the benefit of a body-worn camera recording their use of the weapon. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This is an efficiency and transparency measure, which enables the use of the same equipment by military police across all jurisdictions in which they operate, with conditions and circumstances of carriage and use able to be limited through Ministerial direction.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 3</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The Australian Government should provide a clear and evidence-based justification for increasing the maximum </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">term of imprisonment that may be imposed by a restricted court martial or Defence Force Magistrate from six months to two years. If such justification cannot be demonstrated, the proposed increase should be reconsidered.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">agrees</span> with this recommendation. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The justification for this measure is that it implements a recommendation of the Judge Advocate General to achieve better alignment with the powers of civilian magistrates. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">As set out in the explanatory memorandum to the Bill, this change aligns sentencing powers of courts martial and Defence Force magistrate with those of equivalent civilian magistrates across Australia. This modernises the <span style="font-style:italic;">Defence Force Discipline Act 1982</span> penalty framework and ensures that superior tribunal sentencing powers reflect contemporary expectations, as recommended by the Chief Judge Advocate and the Judge Advocate General. The increased maximum imprisonment term operates prospectively only, consistent with fundamental principles that changes to criminal or disciplinary penalties should not apply retrospectively.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 4</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">The government should amend the Bill to prescribe clear statutory criteria governing when a non-disclosure order may be made, including an express requirement that such orders be granted only in exceptional circumstances and only where satisfied that the interests of justice outweigh the public interest in recording and disclosing a service conviction.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government <span style="font-weight:bold;">partially agrees</span> with this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Detailed criteria for the making of non-disclosure orders will be prescribed through subordinate legislation following the passage of the Bill. This approach will provide clarity and consistency while maintaining flexibility to address the unique circumstances of Australian Defence Force service. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">_____</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Australian Government response to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee report:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Adaptive sport programs for Australian Defence Force veterans</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">July 2026</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Introduction</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>The Australian Government (the Government) thanks the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee (the Committee) for its report on <span style="font-style:italic;">Adaptive sport programs for Australian Defence Force veterans</span> (the Adaptive Sports Report). The Government extends its thanks to the individuals and organisations who took the time to engage with the inquiry and provide submissions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Comprehensive reform is ongoing</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>Since the tabling of the Adaptive Sports Report in May 2023, the Government has commenced a substantial and long-term program of reform in response to the Final Report of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide. This represents the most comprehensive reform ever undertaken across the systems, culture, and processes across the Department of Defence and the Department of Veterans' Affairs (DVA).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">To date, 32 of the Royal Commission recommendations have been implemented, with work underway on the remainder. Critically, the Australian Government has committed $78 million over 4 years from 2025-26 and $7.5 million per annum ongoing to establish a new agency dedicated to veteran and family wellbeing. This agency commenced operations on 1 July 2026.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">In a nation where everyone has a place in sport, the Government encourages veterans to be actively involved in sport programs, activities, and events, either as participants, coaches, officials, or volunteers.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response to recommendations </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 1 </span>The committee recommends that the term 'veterans' sport' should be adopted to describe the spectrum of activities from adaptive sports—where modifications of equipment or rules are required to allow veterans with physical injuries to participate—to activities designed to facilitate the inclusion of veterans in community-based sporting clubs as part of transition or rehabilitation from mental health impacts of service.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Agreed-in-principle. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government supports the use of inclusive and context-specific language to describe sport as a wellbeing tool for current ADF members and veterans. The use of the term 'veterans' sport' to broadly refer to veterans' participation in sport as a tool for health, wellbeing, rehabilitation, and transition from the ADF is consistent with this approach, as is the continued use within Defence of the term 'ADF Adaptive Sport' to describe funded sporting programs tailored for wounded, injured or ill ADF members to participate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 2 </span>The committee recommends that the focus of veterans' sports should be on rehabilitation and supporting transition from service for any veteran who wishes to participate, with facilitation of teams for competitive events being an adjunct for the small number of veterans who wish to try out for selection. Government, sporting organisations and codes, and the veteran community should take an active role in supporting this focus.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Agreed. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government acknowledges the positive impact that participation in sport can have on a person's health, wellbeing, and transition from a predominantly ADF Service-centred life to a predominantly civilian-centred life ('transition'). The Government also recognises the people, organisations, and programs in the Australian sporting ecosystem that contribute to those impacts. While participation in elite-level and competitive international events provides value for some veterans, these events are not suitable for the needs of all veterans. The Government therefore agrees that the focus of veterans' sport should be on rehabilitation, supporting transition from service and improving access for all veterans who wish to participate.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Defence currently supports access to sport and recreational activities for ADF members who are medically unfit for duty and participating in an occupational rehabilitation program. Where eligible, support is provided through a Meaningful Engagement Program, which aims to prevent the development of secondary mental health problems associated with a lack of purposeful activity. Meaningful Engagement Activities support the implementation of the member's overall rehabilitation program. Funding is provided for both serving and transitioning members. Defence also considers transition preparedness and personal wellbeing domains when developing individual transition plans for ADF members who are transitioning. Defence Transition Support Officers are able to assist transitioning members identify potential community-based activities, including sports, to help establish post-service social connections. Eligibility for Career Transition Training funding has been expanded to engagement activities, including sporting programs for those leaving full time service.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Eligible clients also have access to psychosocial rehabilitation activities as part of the DVA Rehabilitation Program. Depending on a client's assessed need and rehabilitation goals, those activities could include participation in sport and/or the provision of necessary sporting aids. More information on the DVA Rehabilitation Program is available on the DVA website.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 3 </span>The committee recommends that the criteria underpinning selection of staff for management or coaching roles in events such as the Invictus Games should require—in addition to sporting or management qualifications directly relevant to the role—a commitment and demonstrated capability to ensure veteran rehabilitation as a priority.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government supports placing veteran wellbeing at the centre of any rehabilitative activities, including sport. This is why when selecting individuals for management or coaching roles, Defence considers their qualifications and sporting experience, and requires that the individuals demonstrate a commitment and capability to prioritising the recovery, rehabilitation, and reintegration of wounded, injured, and ill participants.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11.35pt;&#xA;        &#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 4 </span>The committee recommends that the Department of Defence and the Department of Veterans' Affairs align policies to jointly support the Joint Transition Authority to facilitate veterans' sports programs that support transition from service into civilian life.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes that a range of programs and initiatives that can facilitate access to sport to support the rehabilitation and transition of ADF members and veterans are already delivered through Defence and DVA. Effective coordination is a priority when a person is separating from the ADF on medical grounds and transitioning from the Defence Rehabilitation Program to the DVA Rehabilitation Program. If a person's rehabilitation activities include sporting activities, these are considered during the warm handover process as the person transitions between these programs. This will be further supported from 1 July 2026 by the new Veteran and Family Wellbeing Agency, which has been established to better assist with navigation to existing programs and supports for veterans.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 5 </span>The committee recommends that the Department of Defence and the Department of Veterans' Affairs assess the benefit of directing some existing funding for rehabilitation programs for veterans (including those still serving) to structured programs such as the Invictus Pathways Program where sport is used as a vehicle to provide physical and mental support to veterans, and making such programs more accessible to veterans across Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The DVA Rehabilitation Program provides rehabilitation support to veterans who satisfy the legal requirements of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Military, Rehabilitation and Compensation Act 2004</span> (MRCA), or historically those also outlined in the <span style="font-style:italic;">Safety, Rehabilitation and Compensation (Defence-related Claims) Act 1988 </span>(DRCA). The aim of this support is to maximise the potential to restore a person who has an impairment, or an incapacity for service or work, as a result of a service-related injury or disease, to at least the same physical and psychological state, and the same social, vocational, and educational status, as they had before their injury or disease. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Rehabilitation activities (such as participation in sport) are supported through the DVA Rehabilitation Program so that any activity can be delivered as part of the fulsome consideration of a veteran's needs. Defence and DVA continuously review and assess policies and programs that provide physical and mental health supports to veteran and serving members.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 6 </span>The committee recommends that Department of Veterans' Affairs grant guidelines should be amended to accommodate programs that are specifically targeted at veteran participation in community-based veterans' sport.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Veteran Wellbeing Grants Program, administered by DVA, funds social inclusion and connectedness activities that promote good mental health and wellbeing among the veteran community, which may include sporting or recreational projects for veterans and their families. Organisations can apply for small grants of up to $50,000 and large grants of between $50,001 and $200,000, subject to their eligibility requirement, either as an ex-service organisation (ESO) or as a non-ESO in a consortium with at least one ESO.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">From 2022 the Government, through the Veteran Wellbeing Grants Program, has provided grants of over $10.3 million to 172 organisations to undertake a variety of veteran wellbeing activities, including sport programs. More information on the Veteran Wellbeing Grants Program is available on the DVA website.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">DVA will continue to encourage a diverse range of grant applicants and projects to be supported, including those that support participation in sport as a tool for health, wellbeing, psychosocial rehabilitation, and transition from the ADF.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 7 </span>The committee recommends that the Department of Veterans' Affairs include in its resourcing advice, as per Recommendation 4 in the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide's Interim Report, to the Australian Government the necessary funding to adequately support community-based veterans sport programs.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government invested $11.1 million over 4 years to expand and enhance the existing DVA Demand Driven Funding Model (DDFM) and to support its operations, in response to Recommendation 4 of the Interim Report of the Royal Commission into Defence and Veteran Suicide. Consistent with Recommendation 4, DVA provides advice to Government on its resourcing needs as part of the Budget and Mid-Year Economic and Fiscal Outlook processes. Where relevant, this advice includes the resourcing required for the programs and initiatives delivered by DVA that facilitate access to sport to support the rehabilitation and transition of ADF members and veterans. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11.35pt;&#xA;        &#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 8 </span>The committee recommends that future Commonwealth funding for veterans' sport to organisations that are not community-based sporting clubs should include conditions regarding a minimum amount that must be "flowed through" to help sustain the delivery of programs at the community level.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes the importance of the wider community in supporting and sustaining a vibrant sporting culture in Australia. However, ongoing investments in veteran rehabilitation, including sporting activities, will continue to be guided by a focus on ensuring positive wellbeing outcomes and program effectiveness.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11.35pt;&#xA;        &#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 9 </span>The committee recommends the Department of Defence consider making Reserve days available to the Senior Australian Defence Force Officer in each state or region to engage local veterans—already active in veterans' sports—to facilitate increased community-based sporting clubs engagement with local ADF units and ex-service organisations as well as support with administration such as grant applications.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes that Defence maintains and resources Base Community Engagement Plans and supports the incorporation of engagement with community-based sporting clubs into these plans. Reserve days are made available, where required, to engage local reservists to facilitate this engagement.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11.35pt;&#xA;        &#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 10 </span>The committee recommends that the Department of Defence and the Department of Veterans' Affairs assess the feasibility of providing a voucher system to encourage and support veterans access to veterans' sports as part of their transition, and where appropriate, gain relevant vocational qualifications. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted.</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Defence Force Transition Program provides up to $5,320 for Career Transition Training (CTT) for transitioning members who wish to take up employment within sport, in some form, or gain meaningful engagement through sport related programs. The CTT funding aligns with the concept of a voucher system. This may include match officials, coaching, or other sport specific support services. Members seeking to leave full-time service are encouraged to apply for CTT, and to have their existing sporting credentials formally recognised or to gain relevant vocational qualifications through CTT, to enable them to engage more effectively in local community sporting programs.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:left;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11.35pt;&#xA;        &#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 11 </span>The committee recommends that the Department of Defence and the Department of Veterans' Affairs work with veteran's sports stakeholders to design the package of reform that will deliver recommendations 1-10 of this report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted. </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">While a reform package is not agreed, noting that the majority of recommendations have been noted, Defence and DVA will continue to support veterans' sport through the programs and initiatives detailed in this response, which are delivering important outcomes for veterans, and will continue to work closely together to support serving and former members of the ADF more broadly.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 12 </span>The committee recommends that the Australian Government consider a recommendation to the Governor-General to declare the 2014, 2016, and 2017 Invictus Games as nominated multi-sport events under the Regulations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Noted </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government recognises the importance, to both potential individual recipients and the broader Australian community, of honouring participants who represent their country at the Invictus Games. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The 2020 amendments to the Letters Patent and Regulations for the Australian Sports Medal (ASM) enabled appropriate medallic recognition to Australians who, at the highest level, represent their country at international multi-sport events, including the Olympics (Summer and Winter), Paralympics, Special Olympics, Commonwealth Games, Invictus Games and the International Sports Federation for Persons with Intellectual Disability (INAS) Global Games.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia's hosting of the 2018 Invictus Games was a key catalyst to the changes made to the ASM and the importance of this 2018 event and the Invictus Games more broadly. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Until these amendments there was no specific award in the Australian Honours and Awards system for participants at eligible international sporting events to receive medallic recognition. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government acknowledges that changes made to the ASM do not provide retrospective recognition for Invictus Games participants prior to the 2018 Invictus Games, or indeed, participants of any of the other International Sporting events now specified in the Letters Patent and Regulations. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>Extending retrospectivity to one particular medal, or one particular cohort within a medal, has broader implications for the entire Australian Honours and Awards system. The system is founded on considerations of consistency, equity, and fairness. Upholding the integrity of the system as a whole is fundamental to the value Australians place on it. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">_____</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australian Government response to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee report:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Democracy and human rights in Myanmar</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">SEPTEMBER 2026</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Introduction</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australian Government welcomes the opportunity to respond to the report of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade References Committee ('the Committee') on its inquiry into Democracy and human rights in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government remains deeply concerned by the ongoing crisis in Myanmar. Since</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">1 February 2021, the people of Myanmar have endured escalating violence, widespread human rights violations and severe humanitarian suffering.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This crisis, caused by the coup, continues unabated. In 2026, an estimated 16.2 million people will require lifesaving humanitarian assistance, and over 4 million people are internally displaced due to ongoing conflict. The economy has contracted significantly, and transnational and serious organised crime has flourished, threatening regional stability.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia has consistently condemned the regime's brutal and ongoing atrocities against the people of Myanmar, and we will continue to judge the Myanmar military by its actions. We continue to support ASEAN's Five-Point Consensus as the framework for addressing the situation in Myanmar and urge for its full implementation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government is working with international partners to respond to human trafficking, people smuggling, and other transnational crime threats arising from the Myanmar crisis, including online scam operations, drug trafficking, and illicit financing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government remains committed to supporting the people of Myanmar through the provision of development and humanitarian assistance, and stands ready to support genuine efforts to alleviate suffering, improve economic and social conditions, and advance a lasting resolution to the ongoing crisis. We stand with the people of Myanmar, and share their ambitions for a better future.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government recognises and appreciates the work of the Committee. The report is comprehensive and detailed, with 11 recommendations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government has carefully considered the report and:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">accepts Recommendation 11 in principle</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">partially accepts Recommendations 2 and 7</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">does not accept Recommendation 10; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">notes Recommendations 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8 and 9.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response to the recommendations</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 1 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">maintain its clear and principled objection to the continuing military rule of Myanmar and its rejection of the 2025-26 elections and attempts to use the 'sham' elections to build a cloak of respectability for the military regime; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">actively object to any attempts to legitimise the military regime, normalise military rule and the acceptance of Myanmar into diplomatic, parliamentary and regional or multilateral forums.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 1 February 2026, the fifth anniversary of the coup, the Minister for Foreign Affairs issued a statement noting that the crisis in Myanmar continued unabated and that the people of Myanmar had endured escalating violence, widespread human rights violations and severe humanitarian suffering. The statement also noted that elections were not free, fair or inclusive.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government has consistently maintained that a genuine path to peace requires an end to violence, the release of all those unjustly detained and inclusive dialogue between all Myanmar stakeholders. Australia condemns ongoing atrocities against the people of Myanmar and will continue to judge the Myanmar authorities by their actions. Australia's diplomatic engagement is calibrated to that which is necessary to pursue our national interests. Australia continues to support ASEAN's Five-Point Consensus as the framework for addressing the crisis in Myanmar and urge for its full implementation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 2 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">more regularly state its ongoing concern about the conflict in Myanmar and continue to draw attention to the sustained repression, violence, and human rights abuses perpetrated by the military regime;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">recognise that continued conflict in Myanmar is now entering a new and more complex phase as it evolves from not just a humanitarian challenge to a strategic one, recognising the challenge now intersects with regional security, migration pressures and transnational crime networks; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">maintain its policy of avoiding direct engagement with the military regime.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government partially accepts this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia regularly raises its concerns about the conflict in Myanmar, in public statements and in bilateral and multilateral fora, including the United Nations and the UN Human Rights</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Council. We will continue to draw attention to the sustained repression, violence and human rights abuses.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Recent examples of our regular statements include:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">on 25 August 2026, the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade (DFAT) issued and joined statements marking the ninth anniversary of attacks against Rohingyas</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">on 6 May and 22 April 2026, DFAT issued statements via social media calling for the unconditional release of Aung San Suu Kyi and the release of all prisoners who remain unjustly detained</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">on 1 February 2026—the fifth anniversary of the coup—the Minister for Foreign Affairs issued a statement reiterating Australia's concerns about the crisis, condemning the atrocities against the people of Myanmar, and reaffirming Australia's expectations and pathway for its peaceful resolution</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">on 10 December 2025—Human Rights Day—DFAT issued a statement which condemned the Myanmar military regime's widespread human rights abuses and violations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia recognises the interlinkages of conflict in Myanmar with regional security, migration pressures, and transnational crime networks. Consistent with the statement issued by the Minister for Foreign Affairs on 1 February 2026, the Government acknowledges that transnational and serious organised crime has flourished as a result of the crisis, threatening regional stability.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia's diplomatic engagement is calibrated to that which is necessary to pursue our national interests.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 3 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government work towards aligning its Myanmar-related sanctions with key allies such as the United States of America.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australian Government engages regularly with likeminded partners on sanctions, including the United States of America, however precise listing criteria and requirements vary between countries. Decisions to impose sanctions are carefully considered on a case-by-case basis. Australia keeps its sanctions towards Myanmar under regular review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 4 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government impose sanctions against Myanmar's Central Bank and other banks controlled by the military regime in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australian Government has imposed sanctions on 21 individuals and 7 entities under the Myanmar sanctions framework. These are contained in the publicly available Consolidated List, which is kept and maintained by the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 1 February 2023, Australia imposed autonomous sanctions on those directly responsible for the military coup and ongoing repression and violence in Myanmar, targeting 16 members of the previous State Administration Council and two Myanmar military-controlled entities: Myanmar Economic Public Holdings Ltd and Myanmar Economic Corporation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 1 February 2024, the Government imposed further targeted sanctions, including on two regime-controlled banks that enable the purchase of arms and materiel: Myanma Foreign Trade Bank, and Myanma Investment and Commercial Bank.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia keeps its sanctions towards Myanmar under regular review. We weigh a range of considerations when deciding to impose sanctions; they are one tool at our disposal. The Government does not speculate on potential future sanctions measures.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 5 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government seek to disrupt and sanction the supply of jet fuel to the Myanmar junta and government.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">On 1 February 2024, the Government imposed targeted sanctions on five entities to limit the regime's access to funds for arms and military matériel, including jet fuel. This includes three Myanmar-based companies providing jet fuel to the Myanmar military: Asia Sun Group, Asia Sun Trading Co Ltd and Cargo Link Petroleum Co Ltd.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia keeps its sanctions on Myanmar under regular review. We weigh a range of considerations when deciding to impose sanctions; they are one tool at our disposal. The Government does not speculate on potential sanction measures.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 6 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends the Australian Government supplement its engagement with the Association of Southeast Asian Nations by:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">strengthening engagement through other regional mechanisms such as The Bali Process on People Smuggling, Trafficking in Persons and Related Transnational Crime; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">exploring new additional Myanmar-specific regional initiatives with countries such as India.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government is working with international partners to respond to human trafficking, people smuggling, and other transnational crime threats arising from the Myanmar crisis, including online scam operations, drug trafficking, and illicit financing.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">As referenced by the Committee, the Bali Process provides a vital regional platform to build capacity, conduct research into emerging trends and coordinate responses across borders (including law enforcement agencies' approaches to detection, prevention, investigation and prosecution) to combat these crime types. Australia co-chairs the Bali Process with Indonesia. The Bali Process' 2023 Adelaide Strategy for Cooperation identifies priority areas for cooperation, including addressing the proliferation of online scams operations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia also actively engages through ASEAN transnational crime mechanisms. For example, Australia is an important dialogue partner for the Senior Officials' Meeting on Transnational Crime (SOMTC) and the Senior Officials' Meeting on Drug Matters (ASOD). These forums are focused on combatting key regional challenges, including drug trafficking, human trafficking and cybercrime (including cyber scam centres).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia supports several ASEAN-focussed initiatives, including the ASEAN-Australia Counter Trafficking Program ($80 million, 2018-2028), the TRIANGLE labour migration program ($15m, 2025-30) and the ASEAN-Australia Political Security Partnership</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">($11m, 2026-31). Complementing this, Australia also supports broader regional initiatives, including the Mekong-Australia Partnership on Transnational Crime and the Southeast Asia and Pacific Cyber Program.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 7 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends the Australian Government:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">prioritise the finalisation and publication of initiatives contained in the announcement of the $370 million over three years to address the humanitarian crisis in Myanmar and support Rohingya refugees and host communities in Bangladesh, including establishing a Civil Society Pooled Fund;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">bring forward of the proposed mid-cycle review of the Australia-Myanmar Development Partnership Plan 2024-2029 to reflect the rapidly increasing humanitarian needs arising in Myanmar and border communities in Thailand, India and Bangladesh;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">prioritise the development of the publication of clear operational principles to guide non-avoidable engagement between development partners and entities associated with the military regime;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">demonstrate how the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade due diligence framework is working to facilitate greater access, flexibility and use of locally led organisations in the delivery of Australia's humanitarian program in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government partially accepts this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">DFAT is in the process of finalising a range of agreements under the new $370 million humanitarian package for the people of Myanmar, including displaced Rohingyas and host communities in Bangladesh. Noting the sensitivities and security situation, the Government does not publicise the details of our initiatives in Myanmar or our local implementing partners for their safety. This is at their request.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australia-Myanmar Development Partnership Plan and our development programs are subject to ongoing oversight and monitoring to ensure they are appropriate and responsive to immediate changes and shifts in the Myanmar development context. This process is complemented by a mid-cycle review of the Australia-Myanmar Development Partnership Plan 2024-2029 which will be undertaken in the 2026-27 financial year. The review process will take into consideration longer-term contextual shifts to ensure that our development and humanitarian priorities for Myanmar remain relevant.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australia's development and humanitarian partners have rigorous processes in place to ensure that funding is delivered appropriately and to intended beneficiaries. This is a fundamental condition of Australia's engagement with them. We take proactive steps to ensure our assistance to Myanmar neither goes to the authorities nor lends them credibility. Noting the sensitivities and security situation in Myanmar, it would not be appropriate to publicise operational details of these processes.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">DFAT's due diligence framework establishes important minimum requirements for any implementing partner delivering development cooperation or humanitarian assistance. This framework is one element of the Government's risk management approach to the delivery of official development assistance in the high-risk context of Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Locally-led assistance, including work with civil society organisations, remains at the heart of Australia's development assistance program in Myanmar. Australia's humanitarian assistance is delivered through United Nations partners, the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement, and international non-government organisations (INGO). Our implementing partners in Myanmar provide support to many local organisations—in some sectors they are the only entities that can deliver programming, particularly in remote and conflict-affected areas. We prioritise programs that give funding to local downstream partners and support funding for local organisations, including women's groups and organisations for people with disability. While in many cases direct funding is not possible to, or desired by, civil society organisations, most of our programs provide subgrants which include capacity development components and/or funding for local organisations. We will continue to track our support to local organisations through our United Nations and INGO partners, including via funding to subgrantees, depending on local sensitivities.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 8 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee reiterates the recommendations made in the Committee's report into the Efficacy of the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade due diligence framework. In particular, recommendation 1 of that report which urges greater flexibility in Australia's delivery of aid, recognising that locally led organisations can often better deliver aid in conflict situations.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government notes this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government recognises the key role that locally-led organisations can play in delivering humanitarian and development assistance. Strengthening localisation is a key commitment of <span style="font-style:italic;">Australia's International Development Policy </span>and this is built into the Australia-Myanmar Development Partnership Plan 2024-2029. While Australia's direct funding partners in Myanmar are mostly multilateral agencies and international non-government organisations, they partner with local organisations to deliver assistance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government considers the existing due diligence framework used by DFAT to be fit-for-purpose. This framework is one element of the Government's risk management approach to the delivery of official development assistance in the high-risk context of Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 9 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends the Australian Government increase resettlement opportunities and alternative visas for education, research and employment opportunities for Myanmar asylum seekers and refugees and expand the Myanmar Australia Awards program.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australian Government notes the recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">In recognition of the grave humanitarian and security situation in Myanmar, the Australian Government has designated Myanmar nationals in Australia as a priority caseload in our onshore humanitarian visa program.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">This focus sits alongside Australia's ongoing offshore humanitarian resettlement efforts, where Myanmar nationals continue to feature prominently. From 2019-20 to 2024-25, Myanmar has consistently been in:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">the top five countries of origin for offshore humanitarian visas granted;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">the top ten countries of origin for vulnerable women and children granted offshore humanitarian visas; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">the top five countries of origin for the Community Support Program (CSP) and its predecessor, the Community Proposal Pilot (CPP).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">From 1 July 2025 to 31 March 2026, 1,364 permanent offshore humanitarian visas were granted to Myanmar citizens, making up almost 10% of offshore humanitarian grants in the 2025-26 program year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australia Awards program in Myanmar is a valued component of our development program, supporting emerging and future leaders to develop skills and knowledge to drive change and contribute to development in Myanmar while maintaining strong links to Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 10 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends that the Australian Government provide a quarterly statement to Parliament on its response to the ongoing conflict in Myanmar and include:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">progress on the implementation of the Australia-Myanmar Development Partnership Plan 2024-2029;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">progress of initiatives undertaken with the Association of Southeast Asian Nations;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">the monitoring and compliance of Australia's sanctions regime; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-SmallBullet" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-SmallBullet">engagement with the Myanmar diaspora and National Unity Government.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government does not accept this recommendation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">There are a range of existing mechanisms and avenues in place to provide transparency of the</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Government's response to the ongoing conflict in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Progress of all DFAT initiatives, including our bilateral development program, ASEAN and other regional programs on and related to Myanmar, are aggregated and reported on through the DFAT Annual Report, Annual Performance of Australia Development Cooperation Report and DFAT's Online AusDev Portal. This includes progress of regional initiatives including the ASEAN-Australia Counter Trafficking Program, the Mekong-Australia Partnership on Transnational Crime and the Southeast Asia and Pacific Cyber Program.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">As is the case for all Development Partnership Plans (DPP), DFAT undertakes an internal performance assessment process of DPP implementation each year. A mid-cycle review of the DPP is scheduled for 2026-27. The review process will take into consideration key shifts in the Myanmar development context since 2024 to ensure our development and humanitarian priorities for Myanmar remain relevant. To ensure the safety and security of our implementing partners, we do not share information about our programs, implementing partners or implementation progress.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">As Australia's sanctions regulator, the Australian Sanctions Office conducts robust, independent evaluations of potential non-compliance and takes appropriate corrective action where a risk of a contravention is found. It is the longstanding practice of successive Australian governments not to comment on sanctions compliance matters.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Australian officials engage with a diversity of voices and groups as opportunities arise, including National Unity Government representatives. The Government also engages with diaspora at both organisational and individual levels. We refrain from publicising this engagement due to the risks posed to these groups, the diaspora and their families still in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Recommendation 11 </span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Committee recommends the Australian Government formalise its engagement with Myanmar diaspora groups to access the extensive first-hand knowledge, experience and networks these groups can bring to sustaining Australia's response to the ongoing conflict in Myanmar.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">Response:</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Government accepts this recommendation in principle.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">The Australian Government acknowledges the importance of consultation and engagement with a broad range of views and perspectives. Australian officials engage with a diversity of voices and groups as opportunities arise, including members of the Myanmar diaspora.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">However, public formalised engagement with diaspora carries sensitivities due to the risks posed to them and their families still in Myanmar. Australia stands with the people of Myanmar and we will continue to engage with groups and voices working for democracy.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Consideration</title>
          <page.no>89</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Consideration</span>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-Normal">Committee reports and government responses reserved for future debate will be listed on the <span style="font-style:italic;">Notice Paper</span>.</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>DOCUMENTS</title>
        <page.no>89</page.no>
        <type>DOCUMENTS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">DOCUMENTS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Veterans: Health Care, Services Australia, Australian Parliament</title>
          <page.no>89</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Veterans: Health Care</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Services Australia</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Australian Parliament</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Order for the Production of Documents</title>
            <page.no>89</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Order for the Production of Documents</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>89</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:53</span>):  I table documents relating to orders for the production of documents concerning allied health services for veterans, Services Australia market research contracts and the Secretaries Board submission on committee proceedings. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Quorum formed)</span></span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>COMMITTEES</title>
        <page.no>89</page.no>
        <type>COMMITTEES</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">COMMITTEES</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Economics References Committee</title>
          <page.no>89</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="40" type="Committee">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Economics References Committee</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Reference</title>
            <page.no>89</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Reference</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>89</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade</name>
                <name.id>30484</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="30484" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BROCKMAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy President and Chair of Committees</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:56</span>):  At the request of Senator Bragg, I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That the following matter be referred to the Economics References Committee for inquiry and report by 7 June 2027: </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Mortgage offset accounts, with particular reference to:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the establishment of home mortgage offset accounts, including setup and linking of accounts;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the implementation of ongoing management and governance arrangements, including policies, procedures and internal controls;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the impact of costs and fees versus benefits of offset accounts for customers;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the identification of account failures and internal incident reporting and escalation;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(e) remediation for customers affected by account failures;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(f) compensation for customers experiencing account failures;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(g) the impact on mortgagees and implications for home ownership including increased interest costs, effects on mortgage repayments and sustainability of home ownership; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(h) any other related matters.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Mortgage offset accounts are an important issue for the Senate economics committee to consider, and I think this is an issue that has been under discussion for quite a long while. I can remember having this discussion when I was Mathias Cormann's chief of staff when he was shadow minister for financial services, and that goes back a fair way now. I may have even had a chat about this with Senator Bragg back then. Obviously, I wasn't Senator Brockman, and he wasn't Senator Bragg, but this topic is one that is of interest. It is one that is worthy of consideration, but, given Senator Bragg has now entered the chamber, I'm happy to hand the description of the motion over to him, because he is in a lot better position to talk about it than I am.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>90</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Bragg, Sen Andrew</name>
                <name.id>256063</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="256063" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BRAGG</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">17:57</span>):  I thank the good Senator Brockman for moving this important motion, because it's very important that we do our job here as parliamentarians and that we are able to inquire, from time to time, into great matters of community concern. I believe we are living through a period in Australian history where there is a huge concentration inside certain vested interests. In this case, we're talking about the banking sector, which I believe has an undue level of influence over our society.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">One of the things that has characterised the Australian economy over the past 2½ centuries is the fact that we have been a nation largely of oligopolies, and the banking system, which has been particularly known through its four-pillars policy, is one such sector where this is very problematic. What we have seen in recent times—given the context of this debate, we should remember that homeownership is harder than it ever has been. I avoid making all the routine and boring political points about the government's terrible tax policies, but, in effect, we end up with higher rents, fewer houses and fewer homeowners as a result of these policies. The context is important because, in this case, we are talking about consumers who have decided to take out a mortgage, and a mortgage is a hard, hard thing to get these days, given how expensive housing is and given the supply constraints that we see in the housing system.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The reason this inquiry has come up for debate is that there have been many Australians that have lost considerable sums of money as a result of the offset systems not working properly. What I mean by that is that, when a person establishes a loan, they may be given an opportunity to also establish an offset account. The money they hold in their offset account would actually reduce the amount of interest that the person needs to pay to their bank. The general feeling and sentiment in the community has been that people would expect, perhaps naively in some cases, that the banks would try and do the right thing when those systems are set up so that the offset account is linked to the mortgage account and therefore the money that is held in the offset account would actually benefit the individual who holds the mortgage by reducing the amount of interest that they are required to pay. But we have found, due to some important research by the financial regulators, that there have been many cases where that hasn't been true and that, in fact, many Australians have been ripped off by these major banks where they have not done the right thing and ensured that they had processes to protect their interests by always linking their mortgage offset account to their mortgage.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">That is really the heart of this issue that we want to pursue, because it's not good enough for a major scandal like this to be unearthed by the financial regulators and for that to be the end of it. These are the most privileged organisations. They are protected with banking guarantees. They are protected by the four pillars policy. They are protected by a range of other preferential rules. They operate in a very concentrated market. They generate enormous, eye-watering profits. So it is only reasonable that the CEOs of these banks should be required to explain how it's happened that people's mortgage offset accounts fell apart. I think that is an eminently reasonable question for this chamber to ask, because the regulators appear to have done a report and that's been the end of it. We hear nothing from the government. They're not interested in digging into this any deeper. But I would say that this is a good example of the executives of these banks, who are very well-paid people, establishing and presiding over regimes where people have been seriously damaged by virtue of the failure to link these offset accounts to mortgages.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">So that is why I think it is very important that we have the opportunity to properly interview people and get to the bottom of this matter by bringing in the CEOs of these banks and understand exactly what systems worked, what systems didn't work, what implications that was going to generate for these customers, how much money they actually lost, what the processes are for remediation, what the processes are for compensation and what the overall impact is on their home-loan journey. These are the basic questions that we need to ask.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I think this is a very good example of how there is effectively an inertia tax here, where the banks just assume that you're going to set and forget. You set this up at the start and you make some changes midway through the loan. You hope for the best that the banks will do the right thing by you. But we've found, again and again, that these institutions, if they can get away with it, will steal your money in the dark, where they there is no sunlight and no disinfectant.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">That is why there have been a series of banking inquiries over the last couple of decades. There have been royal commissions. I question whether or not all of them have been able to actually get to the bottom of the issues. But this is a very targeted scope to look at the offset accounts and how that is tied back to senior management. It is ultimately the senior management that should be on the hook for these important consumer judgements. We have more laws than you can poke a stick at in financial services regulation. We have the BEAR. We have the accountability rules. But what we don't see is a mean, lean, hungry law enforcement agency. We see the financial regulators publishing reports which state that there are terrible consequences for people when these things happen, but what we don't see is prosecutions, incarceration or fines which are big enough to be more substantial than just speeding tickets for these institutions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Again, I'm loath to be critical of the government, but it is also a fact that the government took 2½ years to respond to the ASIC inquiry and, when they did, they just rejected all the recommendations. I don't think you can seriously argue, when you look at the DPP figures and the number of referrals, where referrals from ASIC have almost halved over the past half decade, that the corporate cop is doing the work it should be doing. There is no way that white-collar crime in Australia has just gone away. In the last parliament and a half we've seen the First Guardian, Shield and Lion collapses. All these people who have lost significant sums of money, often through fraud, thought they were living in a country where the rule of law would be strongly enforced and the regulator would come in quickly and act. What we saw in these cases was the same thing we saw with Melissa Caddick and the other cases, where ASIC was given warnings in writing by organisations with standing saying, 'Someone over here is running an unlicensed financial services organisation,' and where ASIC loses the pieces of paper, brings the dogs in to eat the pieces of paper and fails to do anything for years and years. The problem with this model is, if I'm given a warning about financial malfeasance and I take two years to do anything about it, in that period a lot of people will lose their money. They might lose their money and they might lose their mental health. That is the reality of the situation that we have today. It's all well and good for the corporate cop to go and do research into offset accounts and put out papers and the like. That's helpful, but what really matters is establishing a precedent where, if you break the law and you damage consumer interests significantly, then you will be facing serious penalties—the executives of the banks will be facing penalties. That is not the situation we have today.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I think it is an important test case for this parliament to put these people in the dock and work out: 'What exactly did you do when it came to the offset accounts? What did you know about it? What have you done to satisfy yourself that people are not going to be wronged?' The cascading effect of not aligning an offset account with a mortgage could be very significant over the life of a loan. These are the longest form transactions people will have in their whole lives. We're looking at 30- or 40-year mortgages in some cases that people will be taking out, so it is only reasonable, off the back of the failure to properly calibrate ASIC to become the lean, mean crime-fighting machine that we want it to be, that we look at this as a very important case in point.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I say to the Senate tonight that the people who've been wronged here are people living all across our country. They're people who took out a mortgage in good faith and established the mortgage with an offset account. They, perhaps naively, trusted that their institution would do the right thing by them. They also trusted that they live in a country where there is a rule of law, and they imagined that all these laws we talk about here would be enforced. They imagine they're living in a serious country where they remunerate parliamentarians well to come to Canberra to make laws that the regulator will take seriously and enforce. That is their expectation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">In this particular inquiry, if it is supported this evening, I think we will be seeing a lot of individuals who have lost significant amounts of money and have lost trust in these institutions. What you'll be able to see, I believe, is the cascading effect of the failure to link these accounts over the long term, because a failure to link an offset account to a mortgage could mean many hundreds of thousands of dollars will be lost to that person, even on just an average loan at the average house value in this country. This is a serious matter and a great opportunity for this Senate to do the best work that we do, in my view, which is the committee work. It's a great opportunity for us to properly interview the people who run these institutions to work out what went wrong and what they are doing to ensure that it doesn't happen again, and to consider whether or not the compensation and remediation that they say they have undertaken is appropriate. I make the point that it is very important that we never give up on the idea that law enforcement is just as important as new laws.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">There is an addiction in Canberra to new laws being placed onto the books, with ministers from all different kinds of governments historically deciding: 'We will announce today that we are doing XYZ. We will pass these laws, and that will solve the problem.' The reality is that the law enforcement in this country is often porous, and it doesn't mean that the systems work any better.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">There are many, many laws in this area of financial services, and I suspect that this committee, if it were to be established, will not recommend more laws, because more laws won't solve the problems when the existing laws are already on the books. All you need to see happen is the corporate cop actually do their job and rigorously enforce those laws. Until we see a few people be made an example, I don't believe there's a culture of fear that is needed to clean up this sector. That's why I commend this particular motion to establish this inquiry to the chamber.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>92</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McKim, Sen Nick</name>
                <name.id>JKM</name.id>
                <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="JKM" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McKIM</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Australian Greens Whip</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:11</span>):  I thank Senator Bragg for providing us with this opportunity this evening to discuss matters associated with the banks in Australia. I want to start by making the obvious point here that, while millions of Australians are really struggling to pay their bills—including their grocery bills, their electricity bills, the costs to educate their children, the costs to go to the doctor or the dentist, or the costs to fill up their cars with a tank of fuel—Australian banks, particularly the big four banks, are absolutely making off like bandits.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Remember, colleagues, the Commonwealth Bank recently announced its 2026 financial year profit, an eye-watering $11 billion in profit. That's from just one of the big four banks, the Commonwealth Bank. Collectively the big four banks made somewhere in the region of $30 billion in the last financial year. These are eye-watering figures when you consider that every dollar of those profits came out of the pockets of Australians or were underpinned by banking services provided in Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Who can forget the banking royal commission? Who can forget that, when the Greens put up demands, motions, amendments and in fact legislation to properly scrutinise the rotten culture in Australian banks, the two major parties in this place—the parties of government, the Labor Party and the coalition—time after time voted against establishing a royal commission into the way Australia's banks were operating.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I want to pay credit to former senator Wacka Williams, who broke ranks with the Nationals. As many people have pointed out, over recent decades when the Greens and the Nationals get together, things can happen in this parliament—</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="259819" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Green:</span>
                    </a>  Or not happen!</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="JKM" type="MemberContinuation">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberContinuation">Senator McKIM:</span>
                    </a>  Things did happen, Senator Green, in this parliament. The Nationals got on board, and then finally the Liberals got on board. Labor saw the writing on the wall, and the then prime minister, Mr Turnbull, supported the creation of a royal commission into the banks.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Boy oh boy, what a royal commission that was! It exposed an absolutely stinking, rotten culture in Australia's banks. Commissioner Kenneth Hayne, in the section of his interim report which dealt with how we ended up in this place, said it was 'greed—the pursuit of short term profit at the expense of basic standards of honesty'. I could not have put it any better myself. The banks—when we say 'banks', of course, what we are talking about here is the senior executives in our big banking corporations—pursued greed and pursued profit at the expense of basic standards of honesty. In other words, they were crooked, they were dishonest and they lost sight of the requirement on our so-called captains of industry to behave ethically and to behave honestly. Instead, driven by greed, driven by a relentless desire to expand the size of their remuneration packages, they behaved dishonestly. It was ordinary Australians who paid the price for that through the dollars that the banks were skimming off the top of the mortgage repayments and other banking services provided to ordinary Australians.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Of course, out of the banking royal commission came a number of recommendations, including some to improve executive accountability. These were known as the Financial Accountability Regime recommendations. Who can forget the infamous time when the Greens had made an agreement with former minister Mr Jones to amend the Financial Accountability Regime to put in place million-dollar fines for dodgy bankers—that is, fines levied personally on bank executives when they failed to fulfil their obligations under the Financial Accountability Regime package. I looked Mr Jones in the eye and shook hands with him on this agreement. It took less than 24 hours to be overturned because, of course, former Labor premier of Queensland Anna Bligh, who was then head of the Australian Banking Association, made some calls to Dr Chalmers's office or into Mr Albanese's office—I actually don't know who she called, but rest assured it was pretty high up inside the Labor Party—and within 48 hours Labor completely backflipped and reneged on that deal.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">What a brazen demonstration of power that was. The banks didn't care who knew that they were pulling Labor's strings; they just needed Labor's strings to be pulled, and pulled they were. The puppetmasters pulled the strings, and the Australian Labor Party puppet danced to their tune. The deal was off. The million-dollar fines for dodgy bankers are still not enshrined in legislation to this very day, and that is a shame. In fact, it is a disgrace because unless you have these fines in place, there is nothing to focus the minds of the people who get paid many, many millions of dollars a year to run the big banks in this country on the need to behave ethically and honestly. Remember, they were found not to have behaved honestly by Commissioner Ken Hayne in his interim report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Why am I going through relatively ancient history like this? Well, I'll tell you why: because Senator Bragg has put up a motion calling for another inquiry into the banks. Obviously, this is a very narrowly scoped motion compared to the scope of the royal commission, and I offer that as no criticism of Senator Bragg. He's identified an issue here, and he's made a quite reasonable request of this Senate: that the matter of the banks' treatment of offset accounts ought to be further scrutinised. That is not an unreasonable request by Senator Bragg.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The point here, colleagues, is that we've heard these stories before. We've repeatedly heard these stories. The behaviour of Australia's banks—and, I might add, the failure of some of our corporate regulators—was so bad and of such a high level that this chamber, and in fact both chambers of this parliament, decided that they should face the most serious of inquisitions—that is, a royal commission. It doesn't get any more serious than that. There was a royal commission where the banks were hauled over the coals and their executives were publicly humiliated, as they should have been. The royal commission found that bank executives had acted motivated by greed and by the pursuit of short-term profits at the expense of basic standards of honesty.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Now, do we need another royal commission into the banking sector? Well, that is an open question. But what I can say is that it's not just the banks' treatment of offset accounts that has offended Australians. Who can forget the serial and repeated breaches of the anti-money-laundering and counterterrorism framework that at least one Australian bank engaged in? Who can forget that? Who can forget their failures to realise that many of their so-called customers were actually deceased and still paying bank fees even though they were dead?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The litany of failures from Australia's big banks continues to grow, and Senator Bragg is quite reasonably requesting that this chamber have a look at quite a narrowly scoped element of that. When you've got a corporation—just the one corporation, the Commonwealth Bank—making over $10 billion in profits just in the last financial year alone, and yet banks cannot maintain basic standards of probity and accountability and responsibly exercise those very basic standards, then you have a problem that needs to be considered by this chamber. While millions of Australians are struggling to make ends meet, while wages are failing to keep pace with the cost of living, while the housing bubble—even though house prices have come off recently, which is a good thing—still means that for millions of Australians—in particular millions of young Australians—the great Australian dream of owning their own home continues to recede into the distance, and while you still have a banking sector that appears not to have learned the lessons that it should have learned from being hauled over the coals by the Hayne royal commission, then you have a scenario where the eyes of this Senate should be open and the ears of this Senate should be alert to what is going on.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I will say to you something very, very obvious. If you go out onto the street and you ask an ordinary Australian—whether it's someone waiting to pick up their kid after school, whether it's someone down at the local bowls club, whether it's someone you might be yarning to over the back fence or whether it's someone you might be having a beer with down at your local watering hole—what they think about the big banking corporations, I'll tell you what you're going to get. You're going to get an earful and rightly so, because these big corporations are absolutely taking the proverbial. The big banks are making off like bandits, and they are doing it by screwing over ordinary Australians. They are making obscene eye-watering profits while the people that they are price gouging are struggling to meet their mortgage repayments or are watching the Australian dream of owning their own home fade ever further into the distance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The big banks need to be held to account, and, if the government won't do it, it is the job of this Senate to do it. It is time that we stop bowing down before big corporate price gouging in this country, and it is time that we absolutely had the back of ordinary Australian people, who are sick of being price gouged by big banking corporations.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>92</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Green, Sen Nita</name>
                  <name.id>259819</name.id>
                  <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
            <continue>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>92</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">McKim, Sen Nick</name>
                  <name.id>JKM</name.id>
                  <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
                  <party>AG</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </continue>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>93</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Steele-John, Sen Jordon</name>
                <name.id>250156</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>AG</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="250156" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator STEELE-JOHN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:26</span>):  Do you know what? Sometimes the conversations in this place are so disconnected from reality. We have conversations about banking, and somebody will come in here and talk about the minutiae of a particular sector or a reform needed to a subgenre of mortgage. A lot of complicated talk, often fed straight into the back of the head of the minister or shadow minister by the banking lobby, gets spewed out in here.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It is so disconnected from the reality that the community members talk to me about in Western Australia and across the country. You know what they tell me about? They tell me about how much they hate the big four, because people know that these banks have ripped them off for generations and are ripping them off to this very day. They know that on average the salaries of these fat cats are paid off the interest of the sweat of the brow of people paying their mortgages in some of the most difficult situations you can possibly imagine. Over the life of a loan, a big bank will make $229,000 from an average mortgage. It's disgusting. These are Australians doing their best, trying to actually pay their bills, actually do the work of raising a family, contribute to community and build this country up. Yet along comes the Commonwealth, along comes NAB, along comes ANZ, and they cut them off at the knees every damn time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">And, oh, don't the high priests of neoliberalism come forth with their explanations as to why it is justifiable that a mother and a father, that a family, that grandparents doing it tough should go without food and should go without medical care in order to pay their monthly pound of flesh to this system. It's disgusting, and it has built for the big four a pile of wealth that exceeds the ability of most people even to conceptualise. The Commonwealth Bank alone in the last year made a net profit of $11 billion. Let's put that into context. If you earnt $1 a second, it would take you 11½ days to earn $1 million. If you earnt a dollar a second, it would take you over 31 years to earn $1 billion. These are scales of wealth almost beyond imagining. I have to apologise to Senator Allman-Payne for the mutilation of her excellent analogy there, which was, in fact, meant to be quite different to what I just shared with the chamber. I put that on the record right now.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">But, in all seriousness, my family got into debt. This is why I'm angry about this. My family built a home because my great-grandma was kind enough, at the end of her life, to leave a chunk of money to my mum. With that money we built a home. My mum was able to do it without a mortgage because of that generosity. In the run-up to the global financial crisis—a lot of people don't remember this—the big banks here in Australia were just as guilty as the big banks elsewhere of really dangerous and coercive mortgage practices, such as lending to people who could not pay the money back. We got into debt. My family got into debt. We did what so many families at the time were doing. We were told by our local bank: 'Your house is a pot. Your house, itself, is a form of bank. Why not release the equity? It's so cheap. You'll never notice the payments.' We thought that we'd finally be able to build a small business and that we'd finally be able to get a shot at being independent, after medical bill after medical bill and mental health crisis after mental health crisis knocked the wind out of my family again and again.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Between the mortgage payments building up, then rebuilding up and the credit card debt coming in, what was sold to us as a lifeline ended up being a chain around our neck. That chain sat there until I was elected. My nan and pop paid the mortgage for us as long as they could. Every single utility bill that we had was in a payment arrangement when I was elected. Finally, when I got this job, I was able to pay the mortgage. Mum could never refinance because of her health conditions. Once you get into a situation where you have been in arrears for a certain amount of time, even when you've got out from under that structure, they'll never do a refinancing package for you. We had a relatively tiny mortgage, but we were locked into this rate that just sucked everything we had. It went to ANZ. What did they do with it? Did they finance a couple of coalmines or subsidise a few billionaires' holidays? They didn't care. Whatever they did with it, they didn't care. If luck and fate hadn't meant that I ended up here, we would still be under that right now.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These are the types of lending practices that were laid bare during the royal commission into Australia's banking sector. I pay tribute to Senator Whish-Wilson and others who brought about that much-needed investigation. But can anybody honestly say that there has truly been accountability in this sector—that there has truly been adequate accountability for the lives destroyed by scandal after scandal? People in this country are furious. They are grabbing at any and every stone and stick they can find and hurling it with all their might at the mainstream establishment of politics. The treatment they have experienced at the hands of the big banks is a big part of why, because, though they may have expected their bank, or the colloquial 'banker', to rip them off, they certainly didn't expect their elected representative to help that banker, to let that banker off the hook, to peddle that banker's nonsense lines in this place and to allow the whole process to start again.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Can anybody in this place truly blame a voter for not believing a single word that comes out of the mouth of a politician, the mouth of a minister, the mouth of an opposition leader, when we sit here right now and there are so many more penalties that may and do fall on the head of somebody that may take an illicit substance or may fail to pay a fine than there are those that would fall on the head of the CEO of a bank in this country? It's a disgrace. In Western Australia, if you don't show up to your mutually obligated structure, served to you via Services Australia, if you don't meet those mutual obligations, you lose, or you risk losing, the money you need to live. What of the banking sector's mutual obligations to the Australian people—let alone any sort of human morality that might ask whether an industry that makes its living scraping and scrounging around to seize as much of the wealth of the people as it can and place it into private hands is something that should be allowed to exist in the way it does right now?</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Some of the people, some of the parties, in here are proud of this. They will proudly speak of Australia's financial sector, of its competitiveness on the global stage—the wisdom of deregulation, of selling off the banks. They're proud of it. It's their legacy. And yet the people live in the reality that was let rip under deregulation and neoliberalism as it tore through communities in Tasmania, as it tore through communities in Queensland, as it tore through communities in Western Australia. It tears through them still—all sacrificed on the altar of neoliberalism, all aspiration and hope smashed on the anvil of ideological commitment to people whose political ideology is nothing less than academically justified greed and selfishness, those human traits which our parents teach us, when we are knee-high to a grasshopper, are behaviours that we should steer clear of. We teach the values of hope and love and sharing and mutual support to our kids, yet, in our corporate leaders, we celebrate and justify ruthlessness, greed, avarice of the most disgusting nature. We give them awards for it. We plop them up on Forbes—'Richest people of the year', 'Best corporations in Australia'.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Well, it's time for a change. It's time to stop the banks making bank on the backs of Australian people. It's time for banking to be boring again for those that run it—the simple, humdrum transaction and transfer of savings from one place to another, not to be traded on a global blackjack board and not to be passed around like chips in a casino, but basic financial services, such as boring mortgages with low rates. We need to go back to a time when to introduce yourself as a banker was not notable at all because it simply meant enabling people to get hold of the money they have and spend it in the ways that they need to. We need to go back to community banking, we need to go back to public banking and, more than anything, we need to go back to—or, indeed, we need to create—moral banking driven by community, owned by community and in service of community. We need to stamp out the greed and replace it with accountability.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>BILLS</title>
        <page.no>95</page.no>
        <type>BILLS</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">BILLS</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>95</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7434" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>In Committee</title>
            <page.no>95</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">In Committee</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Consideration resumed.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>95</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade (The CHAIR)</name>
                <name.id>30484</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="30484" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">The CHAIR</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Time">18:42</span>):  The committee is considering the Health Legislation Amendment (Improving Choice and Transparency for Private Health Consumers) Bill 2026 and amendments (1) to (8) on sheet ES128.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>95</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:42</span>):  The coalition will be supporting the amendments that have been put forward by the government on sheet ES128, but I want to put on the record that these amendments are a result of what we've seen as an incredible pattern of behaviour by this government, and that is its persistent lack of preparedness to consult about bills before it brings them into this place, and then we have to fix them later. At least, in this instance, we're actually having the bill fixed on the floor before we're being asked to vote on it, as opposed to the many times we have to wait until the flaws that were highlighted before the bill was brought into this place actually come to reality in the real world before the government comes back here to fix them. As I said, at least these amendments to this bill recognise some of the fundamental omissions, faults and flaws in the original bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">But maybe we should prevent the other problems that we're likely to see, because there are other parts of this bill that we think would have been equally well served by actually having some proper consultation with the sector. To that end, we've moved a series of amendments that we believe will avoid the necessity to come back into this place and fix the problems that would never have occurred in the formation of this bill if the government had just bothered to consult with the stakeholders before they brought it in. Sadly, I believe, the government will continue with its pig-headed, non-consultative, arrogant approach to this bill, as it has to other pieces of legislation. But, because we believe that the amendments that have been put forward by the government on this occasion do at least go some way to fixing up some of the flaws that have been identified—albeit not all of those flaws, by any stretch of the imagination—the coalition will be supporting these amendments. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="30484" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The CHAIR:</span>
                    </a>  The question is that government amendments (1) to (8) on sheet ES128 be agreed to. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>95</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Brockman, Sen Slade (The CHAIR)</name>
                  <name.id>30484</name.id>
                  <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                  <party>LP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>95</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:45</span>):  by leave—I move amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 3776 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 2, item 8, page 22 (lines 3 and 4), omit subsection 66-8(11), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(11) A fee specified for the purposes of paragraph (2)(b):</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) must not amount to taxation; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) must not exceed the amount the Minister estimates to be the reasonable costs of processing an application made under subsection (1).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 2, item 8, page 24 (lines 23 and 24), omit subsection 66-10(11), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(11) A fee specified for the purposes of paragraph (2)(b):</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) must not amount to taxation; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) must not exceed the amount the Minister estimates to be the reasonable costs of processing an application made under subsection (1).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These amendments seek to make sure that there is clarity in the bill about the application of fees associated with applying for the ministerial approval that is required under this cap. We want to make sure that the ministerial approval process that needs to be undertaken is capped to cost recovery. Unfortunately, there hasn't been a strict requirement to build in a cost-recovery mechanism that recognises the actual cost of this, as opposed to just an opportunity for the government to be able to make more revenue to fix up a broken budget. If the government is truly transparent about making sure that only the costs that are associated with the actual application of the measure—we would hope that the government would see clear to supporting these amendments to make sure that fees associated with applying for ministerial approval are capped to cost recovery and only cost recovery. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>96</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:47</span>):  The government will support these amendments. The intent behind these amendments is already reflected in the existing framework on cost recovery. If any fees are to be introduced, charges will be designed to reflect the cost to the Commonwealth. The government takes the imposition of reasonable fees under any cost-recovery arrangement seriously; this would not amount to taxation. The government has no current plans to impose cost recovery. Further policy approval and a cost recovery implementation statement are required for charging for regulatory activities. Insurers would be consulted if cost recovery is proposed, including on the rationale and basis for charging as outlined in that cost recovery implementation statement, ensuring adequate opportunity for feedback prior to charges being prescribed. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>96</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:48</span>):  by leave—I move amendments (1) to (3) on sheet 3821 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (after line 19), after section 124ZZA, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">124ZZB Annual report</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Secretary must, as soon as practicable after the end of each financial year that starts after the commencement of this section, prepare a written report in relation to the information published under section 124ZY before the end of that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: The report is not limited to information published in that year only.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Without limiting subsection (1), the report must include analysis of any trends in the published information, including, for example, trends in relation to:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) changes in the median costs of particular kinds of professional services; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) variations in those costs between different geographical areas where those services are rendered.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) The Secretary must give the Minister a copy of the report no later than 3 months after the end of that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) The Minister must cause a copy of the report to be tabled in each House of the Parliament within 15 sitting days of that House after the Minister receives the report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 2, page 9 (after line 21), after section 324-15, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">324-20 Annual report</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Secretary must, as soon as practicable after the end of each financial year that starts after the commencement of this section, prepare a written report in relation to the information published under section 324-5 before the end of that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      45pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: The report is not limited to information published in that year only.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Without limiting subsection (1), the report must include analysis of any trends in the published information, including, for example, trends in relation to:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) changes in the median costs of particular kinds of *hospital treatments and *general treatments *covered by *complying health insurance policies; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) variations in those costs between different geographical areas where those treatments are provided.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) The Secretary must give the Minister a copy of the report no later than 3 months after the end of that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) The Minister must cause a copy of the report to be tabled in each House of the Parliament within 15 sitting days of that House after the Minister receives the report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 2, item 8, page 26 (after line 31), after section 66-12, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">66-13 Annual report</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Minister must, as soon as practicable after the end of each financial year that starts after the commencement of this section, cause a review to be conducted of any changes during that year to *products and premiums payable under policies in products.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Without limiting subsection (1), the review must consider:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) applications made during that year under section 66-8 (about new product subgroups); and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) applications made during that year under section 66-10 (about changes to premiums and products); and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) any *designated changes to *complying health insurance products made during that year; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) whether, and to what extent, insurers engaged in any product phoenixing during that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) The person or persons conducting the review must give the Minister a written report of the review no later than 3 months after the end of that year.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) The Minister must cause a copy of the report to be tabled in each House of the Parliament within 15 sitting days of that House after the Minister receives the report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) If the report includes any recommendations, the Minister must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) prepare a written statement setting out the Commonwealth Government's response to each recommendation; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) cause a copy of the statement to be tabled in each House of the Parliament within 6 months after receiving the report.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These amendments require the annual reporting of what the government is finding with the information that it is publishing on its cost finder website. We need to make sure that trends are identified in the information published, such as movements in the median price and ranges in respect of particular kinds of professional services, geographical variations et cetera. The population do not just need to know what a number is; they need to understand whether costs are going up, whether costs are going down, whether costs are changing within particular professional service areas and whether costs are changing based on geography. We want to make sure that Australians are not disadvantaged because of their postcode, so we are very keen to make sure that we have greater transparency about what is being reported, not just what the government wants. We believe this information will be very valuable to the people who will be using the cost finder. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>97</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:49</span>):  The government will support these amendments. The proposed bill and the existing act already go some way to addressing the issue raised in the proposed amendments, but the government does support the intent of the amendments. We should be providing greater transparency around insurer and specialist pricing practices, which, indeed, is what the bill before the chamber seeks to do.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>97</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:50</span>):  by leave—I move opposition amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 3822 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (after line 3), at the end of section 124ZY, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(8) If information about amounts of medical expenses incurred in respect of particular kinds of professional services rendered by or on behalf of particular medical practitioners is published under this section, the Secretary must also publish under this section:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) if any formulas were used to work out those amounts—those formulas; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) if a material reduction in the amounts of those expenses occurs after publishing the information and the Secretary becomes aware of the reduction—the reduced amounts (as soon as practicable after the Secretary becomes so aware).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 2, page 9 (after line 5), at the end of section 324-5, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(11) If information about fees and charges relating to the provision of particular kinds of covered treatment by or on behalf of particular medical practitioners is published under this section, the Secretary must also publish under this section:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) if any formulas were used to work out those fees and charges—those formulas; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) if a material reduction in the amounts of those fees and charges occurs after publishing the information and the Secretary becomes aware of the reduction—the reduced amounts (as soon as practicable after the Secretary becomes so aware).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These amendments are similar in nature, in terms of transparency, to the amendments that I just moved. They require a provision for the minister to actually publish why and how he is making a determination in relation to the information that is published. This is particularly specific about publishing any formula used to work out an amount of medical expenses for the purposes of publication under this particular section. If the minister publishes information about medical expenses in respect of a particular kind of professional service rendered on or behalf of particular medical practitioners and becomes aware of a material reduction in those expenses, the minister must update the published information as soon as practicable after becoming aware. We do this to make sure that the information that's being provided to the patients who seek to use this service is as up to date and as accurate as it possibly can be.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>98</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:51</span>):  The government will be supporting these amendments also. The methodology is currently being developed. Further data analysis will occur after the passage of legislation, and that will be informed by technical advice. The department already intends to publish this methodology, and the updated Medical Costs Finder website will also provide a plain-English explanation of the methodology, with a worked example. The department also intends to refresh data on a regular basis so that changes in fees will be visible to patients.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>98</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:52</span>):  by leave—I move opposition amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 3773 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (after line 19), at the end of section 124ZZA, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: Nothing in this section confers protection from civil proceedings on an entity other than the Secretary or a delegate of the Secretary.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 2, page 9 (after line 21), at the end of section 324-15, add:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: Nothing in this section confers protection from civil proceedings on an entity other than the Secretary of the Department or a delegate of the Secretary of the Department.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These amendments seek to remove the provisions relating to the protection from civil proceedings for the department as a whole. Sufficient recourse exists in provisions for damages arising from false or misleading data displayed on a website, and courts will decide on the merit of individual cases, as per standard legal proceedings. The idea that the government would regulate or legislate itself out of a liability in relation to damages for action that the department has taken is, we believe, inappropriate, given that every other member of our society cannot legislate to remove their obligations in relation to their responsibilities and obligations. We believe that there is already plenty of recourse that exists within the normal proceedings to enable the department to be protected in any manner, and we do not believe that they should be using the powers of this chamber or the government in order to remove their being subject to the same provisions that every other business or person in this country is subject to.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>98</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:54</span>):  The government will not be supporting these amendments. Essentially, the bill does not act as Senator Ruston indicated in her introductory remarks. In particular, the bill does not displace the general principle that the Commonwealth remains responsible for the actions of its officers. The immunity provisions are intended to operate in a very limited and targeted manner that is consistent with similar provisions in other Commonwealth legislation. They are not intended to remove the Commonwealth's liability more broadly.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The immunity provisions as proposed in section 124ZZA and 324-15 are expressed as applying to the secretary in respect of the publication of information. It's not intended to extend that immunity to the Commonwealth as a whole, and the purpose of the provision is to protect the secretary and the person acting under the secretary's authority from civil proceedings arising from the lawful exercise of the statutory publication powers where those powers are exercised in good faith and within the scope of the legislation. Consequently, as a combination of these two facts, the immunity provisions do not remove appropriate avenues of recourse for affected individuals.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>98</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:55</span>):  by leave—I record the coalition's support for the amendments, and I move amendments (1) to (7) on sheet 3775 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 2, item 3, page 18 (line 11), before "the premiums payable", insert "except in the case of a policy that does not *cover *hospital treatment and in relation to which the insurer has not made a change referred to in paragraph 66-10(1)(a) or (b)—".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 2, item 8, page 20 (line 10), after "<span style="font-weight:bold;">premiums</span>", insert "<span style="font-weight:bold;">for hospital cover</span>".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 2, item 8, page 20 (line 12), after "<span style="font-style:italic;">premiums</span>", insert "<span style="font-style:italic;">for hospital cover</span>".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Schedule 2, item 8, page 20 (lines 17 and 18), after "to be charged under", insert "any policy in the product that *covers *hospital treatment and that belongs to any of".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) Schedule 2, item 8, page 20 (line 28), after "policy in the product", insert "that *covers *hospital treatment and".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) Schedule 2, item 8, page 20 (after line 31), after subsection 66-8(4), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4A) The Minister must do so within 30 days of receiving the application.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4B) However, if at the end of that 30-day period the Minister has not given a written notice to the insurer either approving or refusing to approve the proposed premiums:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the Minister is taken (despite subsections (5) and (6)) to have made a decision approving the proposed premiums; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the approval has effect (including for the purposes of subsection (7)) from the day after the end of that 30-day period.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4C) For the purposes of calculating that 30-day period, do not count a day on which the Minister may refuse to consider the application because of the operation of subsection 66-11(2) or 66-12(3).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(7) Schedule 2, item 8, page 26 (lines 24 to 29), omit subsection 66-12(6), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) If a private health insurer receives a notice under this section in relation to an application (the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">original application</span>), and the insurer resubmits the application in accordance with the notice, then for the purposes of section 66-8 or 66-10 (as the case may be):</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the resubmitted application is taken to have been submitted on the same day as the original application; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the original application is taken to be withdrawn.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note: This subsection confirms the day on which the resubmitted application is made, which determines whether subsection 66-8(5) or (6) or subsection 66-10(5) or (6) applies in relation to the Minister's decision. It also confirms that the resubmission does not restart any period for the Minister's decision (including a deemed decision under subsection 66-8(4B)).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The intent of these amendments is to amend the approval provisions to stipulate that ministerial approval, in relation to the application of new products, is open to a new product only required for those products that relate to hospital cover. It is not related to products that come under extras policy. We are really concerned at the potential for this to slow down the process of Australians being able to get ready access to new and innovative procedures or services and that this measure, if it is not restricted only to those services for which the purpose of the outline of the government for the reason for doing this particular amendment—if we're not careful, we'll just end up with more bureaucracy, more time, more cost and less access and less timely access for Australians to new and innovative approaches to how they receive their care as it relates to the extras that one accesses through their private health insurance.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Whilst we accept that the intent of the policy is in relation to hospital cover, we do not believe it is necessary for it to be extended to extras policy, because we believe Australians deserve better access, more timely access and quicker access to innovation than they currently are receiving.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>99</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">18:58</span>):  The government won't be supporting these amendments. These amendments would limit oversight and would reduce the government's ability to apply appropriate public interest scrutiny and protect consumer rights. It would also undermine the intent of the bill by applying inconsistent oversight across private health insurances. Our reforms do, we would assert, apply consistent oversight across private health insurance products, regardless of whether they cover hospital or general treatment services. This helps to ensure that significant product changes remain subject to appropriate public interest scrutiny, and they support strong consumer protections.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The policy settings also guard against insurers margin shifting from scrutinised hospital products to unscrutinised general treatment products. The amendments also potentially present risks to government being able to adequately scrutinise premiums. The annual premium round process typically takes more than 30 days. A 30-day limit, as proposed in the amendment, would constrain the minister's ability to protect value for consumers and support an appropriate balance of market powers and equitable funding arrangements across the private healthcare industry.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>99</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:00</span>):  by leave—I record the coalition's support for the amendments, and I move amendments (1) to (4) on sheet 3777 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 4 (lines 26 and 27), omit subsection 124ZY(4), substitute: </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Information published under this section must be published:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) on the Department's website and in a manner that ensures the Secretary can readily remove the information for the purposes of section 124ZYA; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) in any other manner specified by the Minister under paragraph (5)(b).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, page 5 (after line 3), after section 124ZY, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">124ZYA Requests for incorrect information to be removed</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) A person may request the Secretary to remove information published on the Department's website under section 124ZY if the person reasonably believes the information is incorrect.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) The request must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) be in writing; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) specify the information the person believes to be incorrect.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) As soon as practicable after receiving a request under subsection (1), the Secretary must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) remove the information from the Department's website; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) review whether the information is, or is not, correct.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) The Secretary must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) complete the review before the end of 30 days after receiving the request; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) give the person written notice of the review's findings as soon as practicable after completing the review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) If, after completing the review, the Secretary is satisfied the information removed is correct:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the Secretary may reinstate the information on the Department's website in accordance with section 124ZY; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the person cannot make another request under this section in relation to the same information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 1, item 2, page 8 (lines 1 and 2), omit subsection 324-5(4), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Information published under this section must be published:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) on the Department's website and in a manner that ensures the Secretary can readily remove the information for the purposes of section 324-7; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) in any other manner specified by the Minister under paragraph (5)(b).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Schedule 1, page 9 (after line 5), after section 324-5, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">324-7 Requests for incorrect information to be removed</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) A person may request the Secretary to remove information published on the Department's website under section 324-5 if the person reasonably believes the information is incorrect.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) The request must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) be in writing; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) specify the information the person believes to be incorrect.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) As soon as practicable after receiving a request under subsection (1), the Secretary must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) remove the information from the Department's website; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) review whether the information is, or is not, correct.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) The Secretary must:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) complete the review before the end of 30 days after receiving the request; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) give the person written notice of the review's findings as soon as practicable after completing the review.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) If, after completing the review, the Secretary is satisfied the information removed is correct:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the Secretary may reinstate the information on the Department's website in accordance with section 324-5; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the person cannot make another request under this section in relation to the same information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These amendments seek to make sure that, if a medical practitioner lodges a complaint with the department, the department must follow the complaints procedure and unpublish the medical practitioner's information while the complaint is being considered. So basically we're asking for the information to be taken down while the matter is being reviewed. We would seriously urge the government to consider supporting these amendments, because it seems completely unreasonable to leave up a piece of information that potentially is incorrect and potentially is damaging and misleading and without the government actually accepting the fact that a review is underway.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It also means that, if the government is convinced that their information is accurate, they can move quickly for the information to be put back up again. But we think it is completely unreasonable, if a piece of information is being questioned, that it remains misleading on a site whilst it is being reviewed.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>100</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:02</span>):  The government won't be supporting these amendments. That's principally because the government amendment that was adopted earlier in the debate that was circulated on sheet ES128 largely deals with these issues by providing that a non-delegable ministerial power will be incorporated in the legislation that will establish a statutory internal review process for decisions to publish information on the Medical Costs Finder. The government amendment on internal review will enable the department to correct, alter, update or remove information that's been published, and it follows that the information that's been published will be able to be amended consistent with the review process. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>100</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:03</span>):  by leave—I record the coalition's support for the amendments, and I move amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 3817 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 4 (lines 34 to 36), omit subsection 124ZY(6), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) The Minister may only specify a kind of information under paragraph (5)(a) if the Minister is satisfied that:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) publishing that kind of information would further the objects of this Part; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) appropriate consultation in relation to publishing that kind of information has been undertaken with peak bodies representing:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) health care professionals; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) hospitals; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) health insurers; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the interests of consumers of health care.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note 1: Consultation for the purposes of paragraph (b) may include, for example, consultation with the Australian Medical Association, specialist medical colleges, the Australian Private Hospitals Association, Private Healthcare Australia and the Consumers Health Forum of Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note 2: To avoid doubt, paragraph (b) does not limit section 17 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Legislation Act 2003</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 2, page 8 (lines 9 to 11), omit subsection 324-5(6), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) The Minister may only specify a kind of information under paragraph (5)(a) if the Minister is satisfied that:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) publishing that kind of information would further the objects of this Division; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) appropriate consultation in relation to publishing that kind of information has been undertaken with peak bodies representing:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) health care professionals; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) hospitals; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iii) health insurers; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(iv) the interests of consumers of health care.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note 1: Consultation for the purposes of paragraph (b) may include, for example, consultation with the Australian Medical Association, specialist medical colleges, the Australian Private Hospitals Association, Private Healthcare Australia and the Consumers Health Forum of Australia.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">Note 2: To avoid doubt, paragraph (b) does not limit section 17 of the <span style="font-style:italic;">Legislation Act 2003</span>.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This provision requires that the minister can only make new categories of information to be published on their website after they have consulted with key stakeholders. To be quite frank, a lack of consultation has become almost a hallmark of this government. If the government choose not to support this amendment to the legislation, they would, in effect, be saying that they don't believe that they need to consult before they make a decision. I don't know anybody who can make the best decision in the absence of actually speaking to the people that that decision is likely to impact. So we would urge the government to actually show that they are prepared to be transparent. It's all well and good to say you're going to be transparent, but if you're not even prepared to say that you will consult with the stakeholders before you make any changes to information that is going to be published before you speak to stakeholders then—it doesn't matter what you say—that is absolutely hiding, and it is not transparent. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It's pretty sad that we are now in a situation where we have to come into this place and seek to move amendments to require the government to consult on its own legislation and its own policymaking, but that's what we're having to do today. I commend this amendment to the chamber and hope that it passes, because I think that the only thing that will make our legislation better is if we have greater transparency, and part of that is actually having consultation instead of making decisions before you even speak to the people that this is going to impact upon.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>101</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:05</span>):  The government won't be supporting these amendments. The government has consulted extensively with stakeholders. We continue to consult with stakeholders. That consultation is live and ongoing. I will say that, as a general rule, the government doesn't support prescribing consultation arrangements in primary legislation. It reduces flexibility and responsiveness. It also introduces legal risk and contention around what constitutes appropriate consultation.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>101</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:06</span>):  by leave—Although no division is required, I would ask that the position of the coalition be noted for the record.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="281503" type="MemberInterjecting">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The TEMPORARY CHAIR </span>
                    </a>
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">(</span>
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Ciccone</span>
                    <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">):</span>  Thank you for your assistance. Are there any other amendments that senators would like to move?</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
            <interjection>
              <talk.start>
                <talker>
                  <page.no>101</page.no>
                  <time.stamp />
                  <name role="metadata">Ciccone, Sen Raff (The TEMPORARY CHAIR)</name>
                  <name.id>281503</name.id>
                  <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
                  <party>ALP</party>
                  <in.gov />
                  <first.speech />
                </talker>
              </talk.start>
              <talk.text>
              </talk.text>
            </interjection>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>101</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:07</span>):  by leave—I move amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 3818 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 5 (after line 15), after section 124ZZ, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">124ZZAA Complaints about published information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Minister must, by legislative instrument, make provision for, and in relation to, complaints by medical practitioners about information published under section 124ZY.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) The instrument must (without limitation) provide for:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the manner for making complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the processes for handling complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the resolution of complaints, including criteria for making decisions on complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the consequences of decisions on complaints, including, where appropriate, correcting or removing published information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Information cannot be published under section 124ZY unless an instrument is in force under this section.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 2, page 9 (after line 17), after section 324-10, insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                    </span>
                    <span style="font-weight:bold;">324-12 Complaints about published information</span>
                  </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) The Minister must, by legislative instrument, make provision for, and in relation to, complaints by medical practitioners about information published under section 324-5.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) The instrument must (without limitation) provide for:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(a) the manner for making complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) the processes for handling complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(c) the resolution of complaints, including criteria for making decisions on complaints; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      34pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(d) the consequences of decisions on complaints, including, where appropriate, correcting or removing published information.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Information cannot be published under section 324-5 unless an instrument is in force under this section.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">This amendment, once again, is seeking to make sure that we have got greater accuracy, transparency and relevance in terms of what is actually being provided. We're seeking to have no information published by the secretary under this section until the minister has made, by legislative instrument, an internal review process for managing and resolving complaints by medical practitioners in relation to the decisions made by the secretary. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">At the moment, no internal review process has been outlined, and we believe that there needs to be a dispute resolution process contained in this legislation before the government proceeds to have this website go live. We have seen a government and a department that is often quick to make decisions and slow to resolve them. We have seen the unsatisfactory review processes that have been contained in many pieces of legislation in the past, not least of which is the absolutely woefully inadequate resolution or review process that is available to older Australians after they've had their care needs and priorities determined by a computer-generated algorithm. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I would have thought that, in relation to that particular failure, the lesson for having a proper, robust, transparent and fair resolution process included in their legislation should have been learned. I would like to think that the government would seek to support this amendment, put forward by the coalition in the interest of making sure that disputes are resolved in an appropriate, quick and fair manner and are not left to a timeless decision process that takes months and months and leaves in great uncertainty those people who are seeking a review by the government of a decision that they believe is unfair or incorrect.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>102</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:09</span>):  The government amendments that were considered and adopted by the chamber earlier already addressed this issue. They provide for a non-delegable ministerial power to establish a statutory internal review process of the kind described by Senator Ruston that will enable review of decisions to publish information on the Medical Costs Finder. The process for that review is currently being developed in consultation with the sector. This amendment would introduce confusion by creating a separate and additional complaints framework in addition to that review process. On that basis, we won't be supporting the amendment. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>102</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:10</span>):  by leave—I record the coalition's support for the amendments, and I move opposition amendments (1) to (13) on sheet 3819:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 8), after "<span style="font-weight:bold;">about</span>", insert "<span style="font-weight:bold;">financial costs of</span>".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 13), after "transparency of", insert "the financial".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 15), omit "those services", substitute "information about those costs".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 16), omit "health care", substitute "those costs".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(5) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 20), after "<span style="font-weight:bold;">information about</span>", insert "<span style="font-weight:bold;">financial costs of</span>".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(6) Schedule 1, item 1, page 3 (line 21), after "relating to", insert "the financial costs associated with".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(7) Schedule 1, item 1, page 4 (after line 21), after subsection 124ZY(2), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2A) The Secretary must not publish information under subsection (1) unless the Secretary is satisfied that publishing the information would further the objects of this Part.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(8) Schedule 1, item 2, page 5 (line 23), after "<span style="font-weight:bold;">information about</span>", insert "<span style="font-weight:bold;">financial costs of</span>".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(9) Schedule 1, item 2, page 5 (line 27), after "transparency of", insert "the financial".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(10) Schedule 1, item 2, page 6 (line 1), omit "those treatments", substitute "information about those costs".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(11) Schedule 1, item 2, page 6 (line 2), omit "health care", substitute "those costs".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(12) Schedule 1, item 2, page 6 (line 11), after "relating to", insert "the financial costs associated with".</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(13) Schedule 1, item 2, page 7 (after line 32), after subsection 324-5(2), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2A) The Secretary must not publish information under subsection (1) unless the Secretary is satisfied that publishing the information would further the objects of this Division.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We believe that, in order to meet the objects that the government are seeking in relation to the provision of financial information as it relates to the costs of surgeries and medical costs, they should be clearer about the information that they are intending to publish. It is quite clear, from the memorandum that they published in relation to this bill, and the contributions that have been made, that the intent of this Medical Costs Finder—and when you use the word cost, one assumes we're talking about financial costs—refers to financial costs only, which is to limit the scope of information to the policy problem that is being sought to be resolved by this particular bill.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We do not believe this bill should be an opportunity for the government and the department to have a complete free-for-all about what they seek to put up on their website. If they wish to put different information, they should come back through this chamber and seek the chamber to give the government permission in order to make those particular amendments. The objects of this particular bill are very clear. They relate to the financial costs that relate to services that are rendered. Therefore, we believe that the word 'financial' should be inserted to make sure that the government does not grant itself a whole heap of powers to be able to do whatever it feels like without the appropriate scrutiny of this chamber. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>103</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:12</span>):  The government doesn't support these amendments, essentially because there is other non-financial information that does benefit consumers—for example, the location where a specialist provides a common medical service. Through the consultation process, both consumers and doctors have been clear that the information provided to a patient should be more than just fee information. For example, a doctor should be able to detail their training, their memberships, the languages they speak and their years of experience. </span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>103</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:13</span>):  by leave—I record the opposition's support of the amendments, and I move opposition amendments (1) to (4) on sheet 3820 together:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(1) Schedule 1, item 1, page 4 (lines 9 to 11), omit paragraph 124ZY(2)(b), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) information about amounts of medical expenses incurred in respect of particular kinds of professional services rendered by or on behalf of particular medical practitioners, including:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the medians, and interquartile ranges, of those amounts; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) whether, and to what extent, those amounts exceed the high expenses threshold (see subsections (2AA) and (2AB)) for those kinds of professional services;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2) Schedule 1, item 1, page 4 (before line 22), before subsection 124ZY(3), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2AA) The Secretary must, by legislative instrument, determine an amount to be the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">high expenses threshold</span> for each kind of professional service in respect of which information about amounts of medical expenses is published as mentioned in paragraph (2)(b).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2AB) The amount determined for a kind of service must be the amount the Secretary considers is the highest reasonable amount of medical expenses for that kind of service.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(3) Schedule 1, item 2, page 6 (lines 23 to 25), omit paragraph 324-5(2)(b), substitute:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(b) information about fees and charges relating to the provision of particular kinds of covered treatment by or on behalf of particular medical practitioners, including:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(i) the medians, and interquartile ranges, of those fees and charges; and</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      23pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(ii) whether, and to what extent, those fees and charges exceed the high fees threshold (see subsections (2AA) and (2AB)) for those kinds of covered treatment;</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(4) Schedule 1, item 2, page 7 (before line 33), before subsection 324-5(3), insert:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2AA) The Secretary must, by legislative instrument, determine an amount to be the <span style="font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;">high fees threshold</span> for each kind of covered treatment in respect of which information about fees and charges is published as mentioned in paragraph (2)(b).</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;        margin-left:&#xA;      11pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">(2AB) The amount determined for a kind of covered treatment must be the amount the Secretary considers is the highest reasonable amount of fees and charges for that kind of covered treatment.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">We believe there needs to be additional information provided, particularly around the median and the interquartile ranges for particular kinds of professional services. Simply providing a number fails to provide the level of information that we believe would be useful for people who are using the Medical Costs Finder to actually make an informed decision in relation to any procedures that they are intending to pursue. We think more data and more information will make the data that's contained on the website more useful and meaningful to those people using the website.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">If we are to provide information, we need to make sure that that information actually informs people's decisions and is not merely a number that may well be completely meaningless. We would recommend that the government give consideration to supporting that amendment. </span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>104</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:15</span>):  The government won't be supporting the amendment essentially because we don't consider it to be the appropriate role for primary legislation to prescribe statistical measures. These questions raised by Senator Ruston are not unimportant, but that work would be based on technical analysis, including to assess patient privacy risk and the ability to present meaningful and robust data to users of the website.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Moreover, the amendment as proposed would narrow the ability to provide information in a format that's meaningful for patients. In terms of a high-fee threshold, there is a consultation process being undertaken concerning high specialist fees. The government does not consider it appropriate for a transparency website to be the mechanism for determining high-fee thresholds.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question negatived.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>104</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Ruston, Sen Anne</name>
                <name.id>243273</name.id>
                <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="243273" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator RUSTON</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:16</span>):  by leave—In the interest of not calling a division, could I have the coalition's position recorded.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill, as amended, agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill reported with amendments; report adopted.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Third Reading</title>
            <page.no>104</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Third Reading</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>104</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">McAllister, Sen Jenny</name>
                <name.id>121628</name.id>
                <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="121628" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McALLISTER</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:18</span>):  I move:</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a third time.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Question agreed to.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Bill read a third time.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Universities Accord (Opening the Doors of Opportunity) Bill 2026</title>
          <page.no>104</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <a href="r7501" type="Bill">
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Universities Accord (Opening the Doors of Opportunity) Bill 2026</span>
              </p>
            </a>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <subdebate.2>
          <subdebateinfo>
            <title>Second Reading</title>
            <page.no>104</page.no>
          </subdebateinfo>
          <subdebate.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-SubSubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubSubDebate">Second Reading</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Consideration resumed of the motion:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Small">That this bill be now read a second time.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </subdebate.text>
          <speech>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>104</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
                <name.id>283585</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>LP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
              <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">
                    <a href="283585" type="MemberSpeech">
                      <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                    </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:18</span>):  I rise to speak on the Universities Accord (Opening the Doors of Opportunity) Bill 2026. This is a substantial bill. It changes the way Commonwealth supported university places are allocated. It creates a new framework for controlling international student commencements, it establishes needs based funding arrangements and it gives significant new powers to the minister.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">When the bill first came before the House of Representatives, we, as the opposition, were strongly critical of aspects of this legislation. We pointed out the extraordinary ministerial powers. We highlighted some of the concerns around needs based funding, and we looked at the way the bill used centralised control rather than competition and growth as a tool to drive the higher education sector. We also said that the bill offered pathways to resolve pressing and far-reaching problems that affect Australians outside the university sector. We spoke about uncontrolled migration and fracturing social cohesion on campus, driven, in particular, by antisemitism. We spoke about a pathway to support higher education and also about support for regions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The coalition reserved its position on this bill to allow for detailed Senate scrutiny. We said that the legislation should be examined on its merits. That was an appropriate course. I acknowledge Senator Marielle Smith, as chair of that committee, in the chamber today. We had a good examination of this bill through the inquiry that we had. We said we would speak to the government and the sector in relation to this bill, and that's exactly what we've done. That scrutiny was very useful. The inquiry was very good. However, it also exposed some serious defects that should be addressed. Therefore we will move some amendments to address some of those defects.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">There are also aspects of this bill which provide an opportunity to speak to coalition core equities around migration and support for the regions. It's part of the very DNA of the coalition. We as the coalition will always stand for control of our borders. This bill gives a much more granular level of control over international student migration than has previously been the case. That should not in any way be eroded. We as a coalition will always stand up for the regions. We have spoken with the government about this, and we will put forward a regional funding guarantee to lock funding to the regions so that regional actually means regional. There are other amendments that we will put forward too, but, with the passage of the regional funding guarantee and the preservation of migration powers, this bill will pass with the coalition's support.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Let me turn to some of the issues in detail. The first, and arguably the most important, issue addressed in this bill, relates to international students. It's not controversial to say that management of the rate of migration is now one of the central challenges that Australia is facing today. All serious parties recognise that current levels of migration are unsustainably high, that net overseas migration must come down and that international education must play its part. All serious parties in this place recognise that this must be done in a very measured way that preserves our institutions, particularly in the regions.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">It must also meet the pressing need to bring the NOM, net overseas migration, levels down. The bill attempts to bring international student migration under control through a clear statutory framework. The bill creates an international allocation pool determination. The minister will be able to determine the overall number of international student commencements in higher education. In effect, this means that the bill transitions the international student visa system from an uncapped to a capped system, insofar as it relates to higher education.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The powers in this bill go further than setting a national number. The minister can prescribe matters with which ATEC must comply, in effect giving directions about how the allocation should occur. The framework permits differentiation between providers. It permits differentiation between classes of students, and it allows particular cohorts to be excluded from the cap, all of which means that the minister of the day can shape both the scale and the composition of international education. It means that the minister will be able to respond to excessive international student growth at individual institutions, distinguish between different parts of the sector and, importantly, align international student commencements more closely with Australia's broader economic skills and our migration priorities.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Importantly, the minister of the day has flexibility, where he or she can intervene to ask that allocations be varied. This means that the level of international student migration can be varied to meet community expectations and to align with impacts on services and infrastructure. This is a very constructive change. It is surprising and, in fact, rather extraordinary, that Labor has downplayed this point. It has received minimal attention from Labor. The committee hearing on this issue was entirely lopsided. Coalition senators raised this point consistently, and, from my reading, Labor senators raised the issue of international students just once, only in response to some questions from, I think, Senator Scarr, to clarify the answer. It is a major part of this bill. It has significant flow-on impacts for our universities, our cities, our infrastructure, our housing and our services. It's rather an extraordinary thing to downplay.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The second major issue is regional higher education. Regional universities and regional campuses are essential to the ongoing livelihood of our regions, but the simple truth is that delivering higher education in regions costs more. The cohorts are smaller. There are greater difficulties recruiting staff. There is often recruitment sometimes set down in state and territory laws to maintain facilities across multiple campuses or sustain a breadth of course offerings beyond really what is economically viable. We on this side of the chamber recognise this. This bill also recognises this or at least attempts to do so. The regional component of needs based funding is expressly intended to offset the higher costs of regional delivery.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">The intent is sound, but there are two major loopholes in this bill as drafted. First, the definition of a high-priority area was not confined to regional, remote or very remote Australia. It would have allowed the minister to specify any area that they want to set as a high-priority area. This could be Glebe in Sydney or Parkville in Melbourne. Second, the bill allows regional funding to go to a university if it has a course that is 'administered in the regions'. In other words, on paper, what the bill allows for is a university to set up a course that is administered in a regional area but actually delivered in a metro tower in a city. That course would be eligible for regional funding.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">These two loopholes undermine the intent and the purpose of regional funding. They really should be closed. Regional should mean regional; it's not that profound. The coalition will introduce its regional funding guarantee to ensure that this is the case.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">They are the key benefits of this bill, but, as I said, there are also some obvious downsides. The third main issue in this bill is its chief downside, which relates to student choice. This deserves more attention. There is no real question that this legislation reduces choice for Australian students. The evidence has been clear and consistent to this point. Why? It's because the bill tries to prevent so-called overenrolment. Overenrolment occurs when a provider offers more places than its government funding allocation covers. There are good reasons for permitting over enrolment for the taxpayer. It means educating more students for the same amount of taxpayer money. It means economies of scale for the university. It means being able to respond to student demand, and there is flexibility to respond to factors beyond the university's control. For the student, it means that they are more likely to be able to study at the university of their first preference, because there are more places that are on offer. Provided that a university can deliver an appropriate standard of instruction, overenrolment can serve a valuable purpose.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">I realise that we're about to adjourn, so I will continue my comments when I get the opportunity at a later time. Thank you very much.</span>
                </p>
                <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                  <span class="HPS-Normal">Debate adjourned.</span>
                </p>
              </body>
            </talk.text>
          </speech>
        </subdebate.2>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
    <debate>
      <debateinfo>
        <title>ADJOURNMENT</title>
        <page.no>106</page.no>
        <type>ADJOURNMENT</type>
      </debateinfo>
      <debate.text>
        <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:WX="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
          <p class="HPS-Debate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Debate">ADJOURNMENT</span>
          </p>
          <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Normal">
              <span style="font-weight:bold;">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT (Senator Ciccone):</span>  Order! I propose the question:</span>
          </p>
          <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
            <span class="HPS-Small">That the Senate do now adjourn.</span>
          </p>
        </body>
      </debate.text>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Dementia, Tasmanian Football Club</title>
          <page.no>106</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Dementia</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Tasmanian Football Club</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>106</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Polley, Sen Helen</name>
              <name.id>e5x</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>ALP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="e5x" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator POLLEY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:29</span>):  Once again I'm speaking about dementia and the impact that it has on the Australian community. Tomorrow we have an event here. As the co-chair of Parliamentary Friends of Dementia, I want to encourage senators and members of that other place to come along from 10 o'clock tomorrow to understand and to talk about dementia and the impact it's having on our Australian community. Dementia does not discriminate on political party lines. It does not discriminate on age. It does not discriminate on your postcode. But what we need to do is we need to talk about dementia. We need to have the conversations around dementia. I don't know if anyone here watched <span style="font-style:italic;">Spotlight</span> on Sunday night. It was about childhood dementia, and it was absolutely devastating to see the impact that it has on those children who were healthy, everyday kids who were learning to walk and talk, tie their shoelaces and ride a bike and who then regress backwards. It's a devastating disease. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The early impact of dementia has a devastating effect. It actually affects our economy. It does. Not only does the person that has been diagnosed but ultimately their partner or their carer will have to give up work. It has an enormous impact not only on the individual and their carer and their family but on their communities. It is now the biggest killer in this country of men and women. That's how significant it is. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Tomorrow we want to highlight the need to talk about dementia. We have somebody who's been diagnosed and is on that journey. We're also bringing in general practitioners because it is about brain health. It's about ensuring that you do everything you can from the earliest age to make sure that you eat well, that you exercise and that you get the sleep that you need. This is an amazing opportunity. We have come so far in the time that I have been the co-chair, but there is so much more to do. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Can I say the research that is happening in Australia, whether it's the Queensland Brain Institute or whether it's The Florey in Melbourne, we are on the cusp of some very exciting advances. Early diagnosis is so important. As someone whose family has been directly impacted, I can tell you it is devastating to the family. I encourage people to come along tomorrow to the Dame Dorothy Tangney Alcove up on the second floor from 10 o'clock onwards. You will be enlightened. We're going to have a panel. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The other exciting news that's happened in this place today is that the Parliamentary Friends of the Tasmanian Devils has been launched in this place. Julie Collins and Richard Colbeck, our colleague here in this place, are the co-chairs. Finally, after the Tasmanian football elite, who have been holding up the AFL and the VFL for decade after decade, will have our own team taking the field in 2028. When I was in high school, I campaigned for the girls to be able play the boys in high school football, so you know what is the really exciting news for the women that are in this chamber? It will be the first AFL team that will actually have a men's and women's team entering at the same time. That is really, really significant. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I'm very proud of what we will embark to do, and I want to congratulate those that are part of organising for this campaign. It hasn't been without controversy in Tasmania, obviously, over the new stadium and what that means for Tasmanians. But the reality is that football, basketball, netball—whatever sport it is—is a great leveller and that those who are participating at the elite level are great role models. It is a gateway for many kids to aspire to do better than those in their family that have come before. So it's fantastic news. I want you to get behind the Tasmanian Devils. I still am a Richmond fan. I can't get the Tigers out of my heart, but I'm there every day with them Tassie Devils.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="e68" type="MemberInterjecting">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT </span>
                  </a>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">(</span>
                  <span class="HPS-MemberInterjecting">Senator Sterle</span>
                  <span class="HPS-GeneralBold">):</span>  You saved me from talking about the expiration of your Richmond membership. Anyway, your time has expired.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
          <interjection>
            <talk.start>
              <talker>
                <page.no>107</page.no>
                <time.stamp />
                <name role="metadata">Sterle, Sen Glenn (The ACTING DEPUTY PRESIDENT)</name>
                <name.id>e68</name.id>
                <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
                <party>ALP</party>
                <in.gov />
                <first.speech />
              </talker>
            </talk.start>
            <talk.text>
            </talk.text>
          </interjection>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Victoria: Roads</title>
          <page.no>107</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Victoria: Roads</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>107</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McKenzie, Sen Bridget</name>
              <name.id>207825</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>NATS</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="207825" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McKENZIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Leader of the Nationals in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:34</span>):  In the not too far distant past, Victorian roads were the envy of Australia. By virtue of its geography and a deliberately well-maintained road network, there was a noticeable difference in Victorian roads when you crossed the border from the north or from the west. In fact, Victoria was built to have the best maintained road network in the country and, for that matter, lead the country on road safety.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Country Roads Board was established in 1913 and gave the state a professional, disciplined system for planning and building its roads for 70-odd years, yet, today, that network is falling apart. It fell apart under three Labor premiers in succession—Daniel Andrews, Jacinta Allan and now Ben Carroll. The Victorian Auditor-General's Office found that 48 per cent of state owned roads were in poor or very poor condition in 2024, up from 39 per cent just three years earlier. The people of Victoria have had enough—enough of tyres and undercarriages being damaged and enough of knowing, once again, that the people of regional Victoria are second-class citizens.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This year's budget included an emergency top-up, as the Labor government realises the jig is up, but Premier Carroll himself was the roads minister at the time, and now we're seeing not just the lag in delivery times of getting the kids to school and getting freight to and from the port. It now has a human cost. Just on Sunday, Peter 'Tiki' Mason, a 71-year-old man from Ballarat, was killed when his motorcycle struck a pothole on the Western Freeway at Trawalla. Asked whether his government bore responsibility for Mr Mason's death, Premier Carroll said he accepted responsibility for making sure our roads were safe. Asked how many of the over 500,000 potholes he'd promised to fix had been filled, Mr Carroll actually didn't have a number. He said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">… I'm the Premier not the roads minister.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Heads up, Premier, you were the roads minister. It is simply not good enough.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There is a better way, and the Nationals in government will give our crumbling Victorian roads the attention they deserve through a $5 billion plan to repair and rebuild Victoria's failing road network. Victorians don't need to be told their roads are falling apart. They drive on them every single day. Victorians are constantly dealing with rough surfaces, potholes and roads that should have been repaired properly years ago. Too often, Labor's answer has been another temporary patch-up job that quickly breaks apart, leaving motorists back where we started. Victoria's road crisis developed while Labor oversaw billions of dollars in project cost blow-outs and waste. They've watched $40 billion in major cost blow-outs, not to mention the $15 billion sent off to organised crime in a corrupt CFMEU through Victoria's Big Build.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We need to get back to fixing our roads properly before they fail, not waiting until they become dangerous and then scrambling to patch them up. The roads commitment from the Nationals in government is part of their fair-share guarantee, which would ensure regional Victoria receives 25 per cent of all new infrastructure spending. Regional Victorians produce the food, energy and resources that keep our state moving, yet regional Victoria continues to miss out under the Labor Party with its city-centric corrupt Victoria's Big Build projects. The plan to fix regional Victoria will stop the waste and the corruption so that we can deliver a fair share for regional Victorians, build and maintain better and smoother roads, invest in reliable health care that is closer to home, save Victorians money with fewer taxes and fees and recruit 3,000 more police to tackle the crime wave that regional Victoria is experiencing.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-style:italic;">
                  </span>Victorians have had enough of a corrupt Labor government. They want to see their state restored, trust restored in government and investment in the things that they're concerned about—crumbling roads, accessible health care and decreasing crime. Only a vote for the National Party in the upcoming November election will deliver that. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Artificial Intelligence, Red Lines Package</title>
          <page.no>107</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Artificial Intelligence</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Red Lines Package</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>107</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Hodgins-May, Sen Steph</name>
              <name.id>310860</name.id>
              <electorate>Victoria</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="310860" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator HODGINS-MAY</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Victoria</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:39</span>):  This week, people building the most powerful AI systems have warned that, within six to 12 months, they could become powerful enough to pose an existential threat to humanity. Yet the Albanese government is pressing ahead with a massive build out of AI data centres across the country. Anthropic CEO Dario Amodei has warned that AI is advancing so quickly that it could soon become capable of sophisticated cyber attacks, manipulating people at scale, disrupting critical systems and causing enormous economic damage. Others working at the frontier of AI have been issuing similarly stark warnings. I hope they're wrong. We all hope they are wrong.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But, if there is a serious possibility that we are developing technology that could become more powerful than our ability to control it, then we need to act, we need to heed these warnings and we need to slow down. AI is already changing how information is produced, who controls it and what people see online. It can generate convincing misinformation at enormous scale. It can impersonate real people and manipulate what people see and believe. Bot farms are deploying mis- and disinformation, including about climate change and energy, here in Australia right now. This has profound implications for our democracy. A healthy democracy depends on people having access to reliable information, and being able to challenge those in power and make informed decisions.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We should be deeply, deeply uncomfortable with handing more and more of that information environment to a small number of immensely powerful technology companies that exist to make a profit. The question should not be simply about what AI can do. It should be about what is AI allowed to do. Who sets the rules? Who's accountable when these systems cause harm? The people building these systems are telling us that this technology is moving faster than our ability to make it safe. It's up to us legislators to put on the brakes until proper guardrails are in place. We must put democratic oversight, digital rights and human safety ahead of the commercial race to build powerful AI systems. We must urgently slow down the development of frontier models and get those guardrails in place before those tech billionaires destroy us all.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I've just come from the launch of the Red Lines Package here at Parliament House. It is a package of four bills built around a simple principle: Australia should never arm fund, invest in or profit from genocide, from war crimes, from crimes against humanity or from illegal occupation. The package would put real guardrails around defence exports, require institutions to identify and prevent genocide risks, stop Australian money being invested in illegal settlements and prohibit trade in goods and services connected to illegal occupation. When it comes to war, weapons and foreign policy, decisions of enormous consequence continue to be made behind closed doors with too little transparency and accountability.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We cannot continue to be tied at the hip to the United States, outsourcing our judgement on matters of war and peace to an increasingly erratic and unstable administration. Australia must be capable of making independent, sovereign decisions about where our weapons go, where our public money is invested and what conduct we are prepared to support. Our opposition to genocide cannot depend on who is committing it, our opposition to war crimes cannot depend on who our allies are, and our foreign policy cannot simply be whatever Washington decides.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Red Line Package draws a line. I want to acknowledge senators David Shoebridge and Mehreen Faruqi, and the many parliamentarians, legal experts and civil society organisations who have worked on this critical Red Lines Package. Today, Senator Shoebridge tabled a petition from Amnesty International, signed by around 125,000 Australians, calling for an end to Australia's involvement in the supply of weapons to Israel. That's 125,000 Australians demanding action, demanding that Australian weapons and components do not contribute to the atrocities being inflicted on Palestinians and demanding that Australia not arm fund, invest in or profit from genocide. Some things must be beyond political discretion. They must be red lines.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Income Tax</title>
          <page.no>108</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Income Tax</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>108</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McGrath, Sen James</name>
              <name.id>217241</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>LNP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="217241" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McGRATH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:44</span>):  Sixty-five billion dollars—that's how much poorer working Australians have become during the last four years of this Labor government, and that's only when we're talking about income taxes. Parliamentary Budget Office analysis shows that, under Labor, Australians have paid an estimated $65.3 billion more in personal income taxes over the last four years because tax thresholds have failed to keep pace with inflation. Whilst Labor have been busy creating a cost-of-living crisis and stoking inflation, they've also been busy taking a bigger slice of working Australians' wages through bracket creep. This is $65.3 billion that would not have been collected if tax thresholds had simply been indexed to inflation. Make no mistake, this is a Labor tax on inflation and the inflation is due to Labor's policies. This is a government obsessed with taxing Australians—taxing us when we're born, taxing us while we're alive and taxing us when we die, just taxing us nonstop, 24/7—and, because of Labor's active inflation agenda, this tax grab is only going to get worse.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In Labor's first full financial year in office, bracket creep created around $9 billion in additional personal income tax. Last financial year, that figure exploded to $23.9 billion. That is an increase of more than 2½ times. It means bracket creep was generating an estimated $65.5 million in additional income tax every single day last financial year. Think about that. Every day, while Australian families were trying to make ends meet, Canberra was collecting another $65.5 million because inflation had pushed people's wages into higher tax brackets. Across the last four years, it's equivalent to $2,350 for every Australian man, woman and child.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">And this inflationary Labor tax is hitting Australians when they can least afford it. Right now, Australians are paying more for groceries, more for electricity, more for insurance, more for housing, more for petrol—and the list goes on. When Australians work harder and more often and receive a pay rise just to keep up with those higher prices, the tax office takes a bigger slice of their income. That is the insanity of bracket creep. Australians are paying more for everything and, if they are lucky enough to get a pay increase, that money goes straight into Mr Chalmers's pocket for him to splurge—probably on another $6 million for a golf course for the Prime Minister. That money could have gone towards a mortgage, a power bill, a grocery bill, school costs and petrol. Instead it goes to Mr Chalmers and Mr Albanese and they benefit from the very inflation they're creating, and Labor gets more revenue without having to officially announce a tax hike. Mr Chalmers doesn't have to stand before the Australian people and say, 'We're increasing your taxes.' He's just allowing inflation to do his dirty work.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Australian people deserve better, and that's why the coalition has a clear alternative. It's called the Tax Back Guarantee. Under our plan, income tax thresholds will be indexed to inflation. This means, when inflation rises, tax thresholds rise with it. This is not a temporary election sweetener. It's structural reform to the taxation system. From 2028-29 the bottom two income tax thresholds will be indexed to inflation, protecting around 85 per cent of income earners from bracket creep. From 2031-32, the top two thresholds will also be indexed, protecting all taxpayers. It means Australians do not automatically pay more tax simply because prices have increased. And it means that, if a future government wants to increase Australians' taxes, they'll have to do it honestly. Within four years, the Tax Back Guarantee will deliver a tax cut of more than $1,000 a year to a typical taxpayer. That's the difference between Labor and the coalition. The coalition sees Australian wages as money Australians have earned and should be allowed to keep, where Labor sees inflation as a source of additional revenue.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Men</title>
          <page.no>109</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Men</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>109</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Whitten, Sen Tyron</name>
              <name.id>317026</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="317026" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator WHITTEN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:49</span>):  I'd like to acknowledge the work of Kristie Johnson in preparing and presenting a petition to the House of Representatives calling for the establishment of an office for men. The point of this petition and an office for men is not to take anything away from anybody; it is not playing a zero-sum game. Supporting men does not diminish support for women. Improving the lives of men is good for women, good for children and good for the country. Stronger husbands, fathers, brothers and sons make stronger families. Stronger families make a stronger society. That is why I've called, and will keep calling, for a dedicated office for men.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Every day, my office receives messages from men who are at breaking point—fathers who feel they have been ground down in the family law system, veterans who say they cannot get the care they were promised after they served, men who believe they have been abandoned by the institutions that were meant to help them. These are not isolated complaints, and I can guarantee every single person in this place has received the same cries for help. We are failing men and boys in so many areas, and we have become far too comfortable looking the other way.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Men make up three-quarters of suicides in Australia. That is more than 2,500 men every year, or one man every three hours. Suicide remains the leading cause of death for men aged 15 to 44. Fathers have primary care of their children in around 10 per cent of separations. Ninety-five per cent of work related fatalities are male. Ninety-two per cent of the adult prison population is male. Only 38 per cent of university commencements are men. Boys under 18 are three times more likely to be prescribed ADHD medication. These are the disparities staring this parliament in the face. We have diagnosed the problems. We can see the wounds. But we have failed to act.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There is a special envoy for men's health, and I acknowledge the work that role can do, but an envoy and a social media page are not a national strategy. Depressed? Go to social media. Family breakdown? Social media. Struggling with suicidal thoughts? Social media. That is not good enough for a problem that affects half the population.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">If people in here are genuinely concerned about the so-called manosphere and negative influences on young men, then the answer is not to lecture boys as if they are the problem; the answer is to promote good influences. Let's encourage our boys to become good men. Show them what they can be if they strive to reach their potential: decent, responsible, capable and needed. You do not raise better men by badgering them. You raise better men by expecting something of them and standing with them while they strive to be their best.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But we must also make sure the systems themselves are fair. We have to stop demoralising young men by treating ordinary male struggle as misogyny and slapping the label of toxic masculinity on anything that does not fit a fashionable script. Men have so much to offer this country, but too often they are being shut out, talked down to and pushed towards dark places because our culture offers precious little encouragement.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">An office for men would not be a slogan. It would place the onus on government to address the issues that are impacting men and their families—suicide prevention, family law, veterans care, education, workplace deaths, imprisonment. It would look at the strategies that work around the world and work towards a system where men can reach their full potential.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I thank all those who have worked tirelessly in advocating for men. I thank Kristie Johnson for launching this petition and for her work alongside Daniel Bettinelli in organising the International Men's Day event 'The Ripple Effect' on the Gold Coast. This event is an opportunity for men to gather, support one another, hear one another's stories and know they are not alone.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I will keep up this fight for men who feel the system has let them down. We know the issues. We have the statistics. We have the petition lodged in the lower house. What we do not yet have is a government willing to treat the problems facing men as a national priority rather than an awkward afterthought. It is time to act. Thank you to everyone supporting this work. I will continue to be a voice in this place for you.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Marine Sanctuaries</title>
          <page.no>110</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Marine Sanctuaries</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>110</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Bleyer, Sen Vanessa</name>
              <name.id>25813</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="25813" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator BLEYER</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:54</span>):  I am here to protect our oceans. It must be done, it must be done right and it must be done right now. Australia is responsible for managing one of the largest ocean estates on the planet. It is deeply connected to our way of life. More than 85 per cent of our human population live by the coast. With climate change and other adverse impacts, we have no time to waste in protecting our oceans. The Australian Greens do not support delay tactics, as were attempted by the coalition today, by anyone in this chamber when it comes to protecting our marine environment.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The federal Labor government has promised to protect 30 per cent of our marine environments by 2030, and we need to get on with it. But we do not support the proposition 'We've reached 30 per cent—job done!' by only promising new marine parks at Lord Howe Island and Norfolk Island. Those marine environments are important to protect, but protecting at least 30 per cent of Australia's marine environments means protections across all marine habitats, not just grabbing 30 per cent of any part of the sea and being done with it. By 'marine habitats', I'm talking about coral reefs, deep oceans, rocky reefs and kelp forests. They must be protected equally and based on their intrinsic value as part of the review of our marine park networks.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Most of our existing marine parks are far too remote or cover waters that are far too deep to support commercial activities. They do nothing to mitigate the harm caused by human activities and offer little by way of conservation value, particularly because the commercial activities were not going to occur there anyway. It's like identifying native forests that are too remote to log and proclaiming a national park over them just to crow about saving forests. Science has shown that us a majority of the existing marine parks do not adequately prevent threats to biodiversity like mining, seismic blasting and commercial fishing. We are putting corporate profits ahead of our planet's future, letting extractive activities continue in our oceans at an unsustainable level. These are only parks on paper.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Marine sanctuary areas need to be created in the right places, guided by science and in line with the aspirations of First Nations people. If we do it right, we can give marine species threatened by climate change a fighting chance of survival—species like the dugong, which has made headlines lately due to its plummeting population, or Tasmania's underwater magical kelp forests, which have shrunk by more than 95 per cent since the 1970s, not to mention other marine wildlife like the sharks and dolphins that routinely become entangled in gillnets to die a slow and painful death.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Marine environments are complex, interconnected systems which go beyond lines on a map. Science has shown that properly designed, highly protected sanctuaries have benefits for the environment at large beyond their borders, like larger and more plentiful marine wildlife and populations which are more resilient to disasters like cyclones, bleaching, diseases and invasive species. These are all disasters which are becoming more common as climate change worsens while this government drags its feet on real action.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Creating these parks alone will not save our oceans. We need to urgently cut carbon emissions. We need to urgently cut nutrient run-off. We need to urgently stop land clearing in coastal river catchments. With the advent of 30 per cent marine protection by 2030, we have an opportunity to contribute to real and necessary change for the future of our oceans. We need to do better than paper parks. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Defence Properties</title>
          <page.no>110</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Defence Properties</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>110</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">O'Sullivan, Sen Matt</name>
              <name.id>283585</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="283585" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator O'SULLIVAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Manager of Opposition Business in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">19:59</span>):  The government's proposed Defence estate sell-off raises some very serious questions it has not yet answered. It is a real hammer blow to my home state of Western Australia. Earlier this year, Labor announced that 67 Defence sites would be wholly or partially divested. This is the largest Defence estate divestment in Australia's history. Decisions of this scale must be driven by Australia's national security needs, not by the short-term value of the land. This government continues to struggle to manage the budget. That's why they're going after this. The coalition has been clear that every proposed sale must be scrutinised on a strict case-by-case basis. First, will it strengthen Defence capability? Second, will it affect readiness, training, recruitment and retention? Third, will Defence still have the infrastructure that it needs to expand and mobilise in a crisis? Fourth, will taxpayers receive a real financial benefit once remediation, relocation and replacement costs are taken into account?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These questions are particularly important for Western Australia. The government wants to sell Leeuwin Barracks in East Fremantle and Irwin Barracks in Karrakatta and end leases on the Coolilup and Karratha/Dampier rifle ranges. Irwin is Western Australia's main Army Reserve base, and it's home to the 13th Brigade. It's been operating as a military training area since 1895. Defence's own figures show that its sale could affect up to 1,150 reservists, around 200 permanent ADF personnel and approximately 250 cadets. Leeuwin is also used by reservists, cadets and ADF personnel. Labor wants to sell both of these barracks and move their activities more than 20 kilometres away, to Palmer Barracks in South Guildford, but has not shown that Palmer actually has the capacity to absorb this uplift or explained what this will mean for reservist and cadet participation in Western Australia. RSL Western Australia has warned that the loss of these sites, particularly Irwin Barracks, would have severe implications and could undermine the long-term viability of future capability.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These concerns deserve proper answers. They are even more significant as Western Australia prepares to take on a much larger role in preserving our national security through AUKUS and the expansion of HMAS <span style="font-style:italic;">Stirling</span> and Henderson Defence Precinct. That will require more housing, improved roads and a significant investment in local infrastructure. I've repeatedly raised in this place the question of how this government plans to deliver on that? Where are the houses? Where are the upgraded roads and intersections to absorb the significant increase in traffic volumes? Where is the community infrastructure that's needed to support the thousands of people who live and work around Rockingham and Henderson? The government's AUKUS Community Taskforce is not due to report until later this year. It's still examining the transport requirements. It has not committed to building the Garden Island Highway. In fact, it handballed that to the Western Australian government, who put it, frankly, in the too-hard basket. As I said recently, in August, it had just selected the site and boundaries for the expanded Henderson Defence Precinct. This government is always big on the announced number and vague on details. An announcement is not delivery, and another study does not put boots on the ground. Yet, while Labor is still working out the infrastructure that Western Australia needs, it is already pressing ahead with selling Defence assets that we have. Once these assets are sold, they're gone forever. It is reducing the Defence footprint that we have today before demonstrating that the infrastructure needed for the future will be ready.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The financial case also requires much greater scrutiny. The government has lost control of this agenda, and it needs to address it. National security must come first, and putting Defence personnel's needs ahead of everything else is absolutely vital.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>John XXIII College</title>
          <page.no>111</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">John XXIII College</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>111</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Smith, Sen Dean</name>
              <name.id>241710</name.id>
              <electorate>Western Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="241710" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator DEAN SMITH</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Western Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:04</span>):  I rise tonight to acknowledge the year 6 students and teachers from John XXIII College in Perth who visited Parliament House earlier this year, and to reflect on why school visits to our national capital remain one of the most valuable educational experiences we can offer young Australians. On 27 May, I had the pleasure of welcoming 73 students who had travelled more than 3,000 kilometres from Western Australia to see firsthand the institutions they had been studying in the classroom. For students from the eastern states, a visit to Parliament House is relatively straightforward, For Western Australian students, it requires a significant commitment from schools, teachers and their families. It involves a long journey across the continent and considerable planning and expense, yet schools continue to make that investment because they understand its lasting value. No textbook or classroom lesson can compare with standing in the Great Hall, walking through the Marble Foyer, sitting in the Senate gallery or watching the House of Representatives in action, For these students, Australian democracy became something real.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Following their visit, several students kindly shared their reflections with me. Ivy wrote that 'it was exciting to see most of the things we had learned about in class' and said, 'Parliament House was a very educating experience.' She particularly enjoyed comparing Old Parliament House with the modern parliament and learning how Australia's democracy has evolved. Emmanuel said, 'Arriving at Parliament House was like watching everything that I had learnt at school come to life.' He enjoyed seeing both chambers before we discussed my journey to parliament and the work senators do representing their respective states. Tiela described visiting Parliament House as an amazing once-in-a-lifetime experience and said, 'It was fascinating to see Australia's democracy in action.' Dallan wrote that he was in awe to see the heart of the Australian federal government come to life. He was struck not only by the debates but also by the beauty and symbolism of this remarkable building. Addison said, 'It was a great experience to see our country being run,' and appreciated the opportunity to ask questions about his parliament. Gabe perhaps captured the visit best when he wrote that 'Parliament House was filled with learning and fascination'. He also observed, with the honesty that only year 6 students can provide, that, while the House of Representatives was busy, the Senate was, well, empty. I can assure him that it isn't always the case.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These reflections remind us of why school visits matter. Students return home with a deeper understanding of our constitution, our parliament and the responsibilities of Australian citizenship. They discover that democracy is not simply something they read about or watch on television. It relies on informed citizens who are prepared to participate, ask questions and contribute to their communities. For Western Australian students, these visits are especially important. Despite the distance and cost, they gain a stronger appreciation of their national institutions that represent every Australian and the freedoms and democracy of all of us.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Among those students sitting in the gallery may well have been future teachers, journalists, public servants, community leaders, business owners, future senators and perhaps even a prime minister again from Western Australia. I extend my heartiest congratulations to the staff, parents and students of John XXIII College for making the important journey across our vast continent. Their curiosity, their enthusiasm and their thoughtful reflections were a timely reminder that Australia's democracy will remain strong only if each new generation understands it, values it and is inspired to help shape its future.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Avian Influenza, Renewable Energy</title>
          <page.no>112</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Avian Influenza</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Renewable Energy</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>112</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McLachlan, Sen Andrew</name>
              <name.id>287062</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="287062" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McLACHLAN</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:08</span>):  I advise the chamber of a very serious matter that's occurred in my state. South Australia has confirmed the first bird flu infection of an Australian sea lion, found at Seal Bay on Kangaroo Island. About 85 per cent of our sea lions are in South Australia. The total population is estimated at fewer than 12,000, and the South Australian population is already declining by about two per cent each year. This is a significant event. The sea lion had been recovering from a shark attack and was tested for the bird flu. It tested positive and, ultimately, died from its injuries, having been further weakened by the flu.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We've now had four mammal species in South Australia that have had bird flu detected in them—a sea lion, a long-nosed fur seal, a little penguin and much other wildlife. Thankfully, there have been no detections in our poultry or livestock. These detections remind us that we must be ever vigilant in the control of our invasive species.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I want to congratulate the Invasive Species Council for their advocacy and great work in this area. With them, I recently visited the Minton Farm Animal Rescue Centre in South Australia, who impressed upon me the need to control the movements of domestic cats and address feral cats and foxes, not only for protection of our native animals but also for the domestic cats themselves. As the Invasive Species Council has done, I'm calling on the government to invest further in our programs to address invasive species. Without giving our native species an opportunity to breed and thrive, incidents like bird flu will have an even greater effect.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's been suggested by some that the concept of net zero is driving a reckless renewables rollout, with no regard for prime agricultural land and the rights of farmers and community. I say to the chamber that I don't agree with that. I think it's an extravagant statement and not particularly based on any substantive foundation. I'm not suggesting all renewable developments are perfect. They seem to be held by some in this chamber to a higher standard than mines or mining activities. I know there have been many incidences of mining affecting the environment to a large extent, and we don't hear calls to stop mining. I'm mindful of the philosophies articulated by Roger Scruton about the primacy of the landholder and their love for the land, and that drives conservative thinking that we should protect the environment for future generations. The suggestion that net zero should be abandoned and the suggestion that we should stop the rollout of renewables cuts across the primacy of the farmer and their decision of what to do with their land and the primacy of communities to decide how they're going to thrive and use their land. It's a blunt instrument which cuts across conservative philosophies, and I oppose it. I'm for the farmer. I'm for the community. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I know that there are and have seen renewable projects where there has been power bill relief for the communities. There have also been financial benefits for communities, direct neighbour payments, co-investment opportunities, co-ownership opportunities, job opportunities and improved farming productivity. Why would you throw all these benefits away because you simply have a bias towards coal and gas? Clean-energy income streams don't pollute. They provide viable income in times of drought, and they level out the income of the farmer and really underwrite those farming families when they wish to pass on their farms in good order with nature to the next generation. We've had windmills since Federation. I don't see the reason to stop now.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I would say that, when you're considering the debate between renewables and fossil fuels, you rarely hear in this debate those that are opposing renewables take into account pollution. The fossil fuel industry has to be held to account for the emissions it creates. I see no other way as a conservative other than to reach that conclusion. They do all they can to abrogate their responsibility. I think, as someone who is of centre-right disposition and conservative, that the only solution is with coal and gas bearing the cost of their own emissions. We need a carbon price, and we need it now.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Cost of Living, Housing, Waste Management and Recycling</title>
          <page.no>113</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Cost of Living</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Housing</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Waste Management and Recycling</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>113</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Allman-Payne, Sen Penny</name>
              <name.id>298839</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>AG</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="298839" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator ALLMAN-PAYNE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:14</span>):  Do you know who benefits from people believing that immigrants are to blame for an unaffordability crisis that almost all of us are experiencing? It's the massive private corporations who are raking in billions of dollars—and their profits come at our expense. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's been a hard year for so many people, but it hasn't been a hard year for the big four banks. They made over $30 billion in net profit last financial year. The big banks love it that houses cost over a million dollars, and they love it that people can't afford big deposits, because, the bigger the mortgage that you take out, the more money they can squeeze out of you, your neighbour and your neighbours to be. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It also wasn't a hard year for the Coles and Woolies duopoly. They both raked in over a billion dollars in net profits, and everyone is experiencing grocery price gouging, whether they're migrants or not. Big corporations want us to turn on each other so that we don't turn on them. They donate to political parties like Labor, the LNP and One Nation so that they don't need to worry about their own PR. Every time Labor, the LNP and One Nation punch down on immigrants, they're providing cover for big corporations. They want you to believe that the only option is for us to attack each other, but there is an alternative. We could make big corporations pay their fair share of tax. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">A majority of Australians want a tax on gas exports. Pressure is mounting, and more and more of us are coming together to demand that we all share the wealth from our natural resources, not just multinational gas exporters. With that money we could have the well funded public services that we all need to live good lives. Unless you are a First Nations person, we are all immigrants in this country. Being Australian is about helping your mates, and mates don't turn on each other. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The major parties and One Nation will always put privatised corporate profits ahead of renters, homeowners and the hundreds of thousands of people being shuffled around on the growing public housing waitlist. Public homes are poorly maintained. Many Queenslanders have contacted me and my team to share horror stories of black mould and unliveable conditions. They're not given a choice. Even if a house is unsafe and unliveable for them and their families, if they refuse a home, Queensland's department of housing will boot them off the public housing waitlist. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We had a gentleman come into my office last week. He told us that he'd requested maintenance on the range hood above his stove. The fan wasn't properly installed and it was causing mould to grow rampant in his roof. What did they do? Instead of fixing it, the department had it removed and patched up the hole where the fan should have been. As a result, when this gentleman cooks inside, it constantly sets off his five interconnected smoke alarms—so he just avoids cooking on the stove. This man is 67 years old. He has mobility impairments and he lives alone. The housing department knew all about this because he'd given them the medical certificate for his mobility and his chronic pain conditions. On top of all that, he was breached by the housing department for not maintaining his nature strip. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The department thinks that he should be grateful for having a home, even if he can't cook for himself there. The Greens think that governments should stop choosing private property developers, only in the game for quick profits, over you. The coalition and One Nation want to scrap construction codes and standards so their billionaire property developer mates can churn out unsafe housing. They call these standards 'woke palaces' because they'll never know what it's like to choose between a house riddled with pests and mould or another night in an underfunded and overcrowded shelter. The Greens believe that everyone deserves access to affordable, high-quality housing, and we are going to keep fighting for that for you.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor has broken its promise to introduce packaging standards to cut plastic waste. This is a travesty because Australia's voluntary model has failed. The voluntary targets were supposed to deliver 100 per cent reusable, recyclable or compostable packaging and 70 per cent plastic packaging recycling by 2025. Instead, we've reached just 86 per cent and 20 per cent respectively. Anyone who has watched the documentary <span style="font-style:italic;">The Plastic Country</span> will know plastic waste is clogging our environment and our landfills, and it's now even turning up in our bodies. Plastic is in the air that we breathe. It is in the water that we drink. It is in the clothes that we are wearing. It is in the food that we eat. Australia has a plastic problem. We are one of the biggest per capita users and generators of plastic waste in the world, and yet companies and governments would like you to believe that, in order to tackle this plastic problem, we all need to take individual responsibility and make sure that we put all our plastic in the recycling bin. But plastic is a systemic problem and the fossil fuel industry, whose profits are starting to decline as we phase out coal and oil and gas, are looking for their next big market—and where is that market? It's plastics. Plastic production, on the current trajectory, will triple by 2060. No individual person in this country can tackle the plastic pollution problem if governments don't act.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor can't keep pretending that this is a problem to be fixed with a patchwork of separate regulations. The inquiry of the Senate Community Affairs References Committee into microplastics and other toxics heard evidence from experts that we are now seeing plastic pollution affecting our health and our bodies. There is growing evidence that plastic pollution is reducing people's fertility. I, along with my Senate colleagues on that committee, went to Adelaide University and looked down microscopes in the lab that showed plastic in sperm and eggs. We now have plastic in our children before they are even born. This should be a problem that this government is taking seriously. Successive governments keep putting the burden on households and councils, while the companies who are producing and profiting from packaging get to just walk away from their mess.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The government needs to act. The Greens are calling for a mandatory federal extended producer responsibility scheme ahead of the meeting of federal, state and territory environment ministers this Friday. If you want a template for what that needs to look like, take a look at the bill that Senator Peter Whish-Wilson introduced into this place before he left the Senate. The template is there. The legislation is drafted. The evidence is in. Plastic pollution is harming our environment, our wildlife, our water and our health. On Friday, environment ministers need to act.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Climate Change, Energy, Trade</title>
          <page.no>114</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Climate Change</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Energy</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Trade</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>114</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">McDonald, Sen Susan</name>
              <name.id>123072</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>LNP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="123072" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator McDONALD</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Leader of the Nationals in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:24</span>):  The coalition has set a very simple ambition for Australia. Our plan will reward hard work, restore homeownership, secure Australia's future and put Australians first. Those words mean something. Putting Australians first is not just about who qualifies for a government payment. It should be a principle that runs through every decision the government makes. When we talk about energy, we should ask what that means for Australian families and businesses. When we talk about managing our oceans, ask how it will impact Australian fishers and our ability to feed ourselves. When we change biosecurity rules, ask whether we are protecting Australian farmers and Australian industries. When we discuss the Australian environment, check: are we still allowing Australia to thrive, or have we become consumed by ideology?</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There is a growing disconnect in Labor's public policy between what sounds good and what actually works. We see policies designed by people who ignore the consequences and theories given more attention than practical outcomes. Under Labor, ideology always comes first and Australians come second, third and last. The coalition wants to turn that around.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">A recent article in the <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian</span> examined the catastrophic floods in Nepal. It described a country that has received billions of dollars in climate related commitments. There have been programs for climate governance, nature based solutions, gender assessments, environmental safeguards and workshops. There have been strategies, plans and international programs. But, when a catastrophic flood came roaring down a Himalayan river valley, what people really needed were sensors, sirens and enough warning to seek higher ground. History has shown that the danger was known. According to the reporting, a relatively simple warning system could have given downstream communities about 45 minutes to evacuate.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">You may ask what Nepal's experience has to do with Australia. But, right here, right now, under Labor, we are seeing that the wellbeing of people, protecting them from disasters, improving resilience and helping communities grow are not just forgotten but ignored whenever they are raised. A council in North Queensland desperate to stop floods wreaking havoc was prevented from clearing mangroves that were clogging up drainage channels. Graziers wanting to clear firebreaks to protect property, livestock and habitat must seek special permissions via time-consuming bureaucratic process. Maybe building a dam would be effective to prevent floods destroying people's homes and provide water security for agriculture and drinking, but good luck with getting that past the ideology driven gatekeepers in Canberra.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Disasters will happen, but the answer isn't stronger safeguard mechanisms, higher taxes or increased enforcement. Government policies must make Australians more resilient. Flood mitigation, drainage, dredging, better roads and bridges, reliable communications, warning systems, fuel security and energy stability must all form part of the age-old contract between governments and their people. In northern Australia, we understand that very well. We live with cyclones, floods, fires and droughts. People don't need to hear about climate strategy; they need to know where the disaster is and how much time they've got to prepare. They need to know infrastructure can handle it and that it can be repaired quickly. Will there be fuel available? Will my phone work? That's what securing Australia's future looks like in the real world.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It is the same philosophy behind the coalition's decision to scrap net zero. We will not put ideological emissions targets ahead of the living standards, jobs and energy security for Australians. The coalition's plan is for cheaper power and energy abundance. We will use the resources and technologies Australia has available to achieve this—coal, gas, oil and, yes, nuclear. Hydro, batteries and renewables are also on the table. Putting Australians first means Australian families should not be worse off so politicians can boast about meeting an arbitrary ideological target. Australian resources should be developed where they can create jobs, lower costs and strengthen our national security. Governments should spend money on practical resilience rather than creating ever-larger climate bureaucracies. That is how we secure Australia's future.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The same principle should guide Australian food production. Researchers from James Cook University recently exposed one of the great contradictions in Australian seafood policy. Australia has the world's third largest fishing zone, and our fisheries are recognised internationally as among the best managed in the world. Yet Australia produces just 1.4 per cent of global seafood and we import up to 65 per cent of the seafood we eat. We are an island continent with enormous marine resources and an experienced sustainability focused fishing fleet, but Labor is so gripped by ideology that we simply outsource our seafood production overseas. Every time a sustainable Australian fishery is closed, Australians do not stop eating seafood. We just import more of it and pay more for it. According to the JCU researchers, that can mean shifting environmental and social impacts from Australia, with some of the world's strongest fisheries management, to countries with far weaker regulation and oversight. So what have we achieved if we stop an Australian fishery operating under Australian environmental laws only to replace that seafood with a product caught under weaker standards overseas? All we've done is deprive Australians from sustainably caught seafood and decimated thousands of Australian jobs. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Putting Australians first should mean putting Australian seafood first wherever we can sustainably produce it. The evidence says there is room to do precisely that. Research cited by JCU authors suggest Australia's wild capture fisheries could sustainably produce another 206,000 tonnes under existing management regimes. Meanwhile, Australian seafood imports exceed about $910 million. That is the sort of area where practical government should replace ideology. Above all, stop pretending that shutting down Australian industry somehow protects the planet while another country simply takes our place. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">And then we come to bananas. Australia currently permits no fresh banana imports from any other country. The federal government is now conducting a biosecurity import risk analysis following a request from the Philippines for access to the Australian market. Now, there's nothing wrong with undertaking scientific analysis. We have international obligations. Those processes should be rigorous and evidence based. But the starting point should always be: what is in Australia's national interest and are we putting Australian food producers first? </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Philippines banana industry is stricken with moko, black sigatoka and banana freckles. Any one of these diseases would destroy the industry and decimate communities in places like the Cassowary Coast, the Atherton Tablelands and Lakeland. These are vibrant communities with farming families, packing sheds, transport companies and regional businesses. They work hard, and the coalition believes that hard work should not be jeopardised. Australia is not short of bananas. Australian growers already supply Australian consumers with all the bananas they need.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Now, no matter the issue facing governments, the test should always be the same. Does it secure Australia's future? Does it protect our way of life? Does it put Australians first? If climate change presents a greater risk of disaster, then build the infrastructure and resilience that protects Australians, back sustainable Australian fishers rather than outsourcing production and environmental impacts to overseas. Australian farmers already grow the bananas Australian families need. Protect them from unnecessary biosecurity risks. That is practical government. It is also the difference between governing for Australians and governing by ideology. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The coalition's broader economic plan rests on the same idea—lower taxes, cheaper electricity, lower regulation, less migration, more homes, stronger national security and investment in productive infrastructure. You can't rebuild a washed-out road with new emissions targets. You cannot tax your way to prosperity. You cannot attack mining and expect the economy to thrive. Our country has extraordinary advantages in its land, its oceans and its people. The coalition will back them always. That is our commitment. That is how we secure Australia's future. <span style="font-style:italic;">(Time expired)</span></span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Social Cohesion</title>
          <page.no>115</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Social Cohesion</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>115</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Lambie, Sen Jacqui</name>
              <name.id>250026</name.id>
              <electorate>Tasmania</electorate>
              <party>JLN</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="250026" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LAMBIE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Tasmania</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:34</span>):  I got pretty angry last week, and, as often happens, it was my electorate office that had to wear the abuse. Thank you, guys, once again for being so stoic as you always are. I received lots of nice calls too, but the nasty calls and emails—oh my God, Australians—they were beyond awful. They were. They were just absolute un-Australian gutter trash. I don't mind people disagreeing with me. I'm pretty good at disagreeing with others. It's the level of personal abuse and hatred from One Nation supporters that absolutely blows me away.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We know social media can be used as a weapon of mass destruction and also as a fundraising tool. But calling a veteran a traitor because he responded, as he should, to a subpoena is just plain wrong. Calling Aboriginal people the most primitive people on earth is wrong. Blaming women for domestic violence is wrong. Saying there are no good Muslims is wrong. When things are wrong, you have to call it out. You have to show courage.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">One Nation whips up the anger, and they tell people who to blame. That's the populist trick—blaming immigrants, blaming the vulnerable, making enemies of those who get in their way and pretending to be fighting for working families. It's a trick, Australia, and we've got to wake up to it, because every time a populist leader like Trump or Farage get any power, the lives of working people don't get better; they get worse.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Nigel Farage led the campaign for Britain to leave the EU. Ten years later, two-thirds of English people think it was a mistake. The UK economy is tanking, and British families are facing a cost-of-living crisis. Their pensioners are going to bed fully clothed and under their blankets because they can't afford to turn on the central heating. Just like in the US, the gap between the rich and poor is surging. Nigel Farage is a millionaire. Trump told working American families that he would lower the cost of living on day one. He told them he wouldn't get involved in any more 'forever wars'. Then he went to war with Iran, tanking the world's economies in the process and driving up prices for fuel, fertiliser and food. When Trump first came down his golden escalator, he was worth roughly about $3.5 billion. He's now worth double that and some say much more.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Senator Hanson is fond of saying she knows what it's like to struggle for money, but since her election to parliament, she has stacked up a load of investments, with various media reporting that she is worth anywhere between $5 million and $20 mil. Senator Hanson has been dividing and frightening Australians for years. It's the only thing she's good at. In Donald Trump, she found her political hero. She said:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">I think it's fantastic what he's done. … Everyone thinks he's radical … but he goes and follows through. …We have to rely on people like Donald Trump.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Rely on Donald Trump—are you serious? Really? Do we? You know what Donald Trump, Nigel Farage and Senator Hanson are great at? They're great at telling people who have nothing that they will fight for them, but they don't care about you. They care about hanging out with billionaires and feathering their own nests.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I know people are doing it tough, but dividing Australians and setting us up against each other is not the answer. Our fuel prices are still going up as a direct result of the forever war Donald Trump promised never to start. When news of the bombing of Iran hit, Senator Hanson cheered it on and called on the Australian government to send in the ADF. Oh dear! Can you imagine, after 20 years in the Middle East and all the injuries inflicted on our diggers, you'd put them back in another American forever war? This woman is not only dangerous; she is delusional.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">In late 2025, Senator Hanson was at Trump's Mar-a-Lago. She told the audience:</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Small" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Small">It's wonderful to be in America with a re-energised, strong, and patriotic leader who has the best interests of his people at heart.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Trump's big message to Americans doing it tough is that immigrants are the problem—just like Nigel Farage in the UK and Senator Hanson in Australia. When Trump ran for election in 2016, the gap between the rich and the poor in America was at record levels. But the gap between rich and poor has only got worse. In his second term, one per cent of America's wealthiest people have over 30 per cent of its wealth. Trump's one big beautiful bill, as he called it, gave the wealthiest Americans a big tax cut and cut health care and supports for millions of Americans who needed it. It's not only the working poor who have been impacted; the American middle class have too. Instead of draining the swamp, he stacked his administration with his mates. His family members are on boards of companies that just happen to pick up massive government contracts. Something is terribly wrong there. Meanwhile, Americans have lost hundreds of thousands of jobs from their government departments. Families have lost food stamps and health coverage.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Trump calls journalists the 'enemy of the people'. Not only does he ban them; he puts his people in powerful positions to intimidate them. He gave Elon Musk, the richest man in the world, free rein to sack and strip out experts in US government institutions, sacking hundreds of thousands of Americans and making the cost-of-living crisis in America even worse.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We have our own cost-of-living crisis. Australians have a right to be angry. Too many families are going backwards, no matter how hard they work. But Senator Hanson will be fine in her retirement, as will Nigel Farage and President Trump in theirs, because, once again, they are all feathering their own nests. I'm angry too, but playing the blame game isn't going to make us a wealthier, stronger or smarter country. We need changes in policy. We need changes in law. That requires work, and it means you have to come up with policies that help the poorest, inspire the smartest and tell our kids, 'You can dream big, because we have your back.'</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Governments of both stripes ignored our housing shortage for years. That's where the problem lies. That's where it is. They don't properly fund our rural and regional areas. They let gas companies sell off our gas tax free. Social media platforms make billions out of Australians and then hide their profits overseas. There's a truckload of work to be done, but we don't have to follow in the failing footsteps of Trump or Farage. Don't go there.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Australians can choose not to follow the ugly politics of populism. We can do so much better. Do you know why? It's because we are so much bloody better. And it's not about right or left; it's about respect and it's about finding solutions, not operating from a place of fear. It doesn't matter what side you're on.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Whyalla Steelworks, Indigenous Australians</title>
          <page.no>117</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Whyalla Steelworks</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Indigenous Australians</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>117</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Liddle, Sen Kerrynne</name>
              <name.id>300644</name.id>
              <electorate>South Australia</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="300644" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator LIDDLE</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">South Australia</span>—<span class="HPS-MinisterialTitles">Deputy Opposition Whip in the Senate</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:42</span>):  Well, there was devastating news from my home state of South Australia this week: 500 Whyalla steelworkers will lose their jobs, and there are so many more contemplating what that also means for them. It's been a huge week for them. The timing could not be worse—in the middle of a cost-of-living crisis and when there are higher mortgages, falling house prices and business costs going through the roof everywhere across Australia. Our first thoughts, though, must be with those impacted workers and their families who are processing this latest development. I encourage all of those impacted by what is happening to reach out for help early and not hesitate to do what you need to do to seek out crisis help for mental health or for financial help and advice. That's really critical.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">We've got no less than four Labor cabinet ministers representing South Australia, and this is what workers and locals are left with—nothing. There are no real assurances; there's just a redundancy letter telling them their jobs are gone. You wonder how we got here. Well, let me explain that. In February 2025, state and federal Labor announced a $2.4 billion package. Six months later, taxpayers have a right to know what happened. Where's it gone? The blast furnace that turns base material into metal is Australia's only sovereign structural steelmaking capability.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">From Canberra, Minister Bowen peddled the fantasy that Australia will be 'leading the global green hydrogen revolution'. But, these days, he says he 'never quite bought all the hype on green hydrogen'. Make no mistake; it is Labor's business, energy and economic policies that are contributing to industry and businesses doing it really tough. Only Labor could come up with a business plan like this: tax a business to death, complicate just about everything, add a dash of uncertainty too and then use taxpayer funding to bail that same business out only to then let it fail.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Labor's mismanagement is reaching new heights. In 2016, steelworks owner Arrium was placed into administration, with KordaMentha appointed as administrators. In 2017, just a year later, KordaMentha named a Korean consortium backed by POSCO as the preferred bidder. But the state Labor government intervened at the last minute to collapse the POSCO deal. We still haven't had a proper explanation.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Under the new GFG Alliance owners, the Whyalla steelworks suffered years of underinvestment, financial problems and mounting debt. There is no way Labor provided a solution then, and it's not providing one now. In February 2025, Whyalla steelworks went into administration under GFG. Throughout this decline, the government's flagship climate safeguard mechanism complicated operations, delivering more red and green tape, pushing operations to unviable choices, requiring enormous investment in new technology to reduce emissions and requiring the purchase of emissions credits at substantial cost.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's not just the story of Whyalla; it's the story right across Australia. Simultaneously with this collapse, the state Labor government committed $593 million to the Hydrogen Jobs Plan hoax in 2022, which was sold as the centrepiece of South Australia's green industrial revolution. This was at a time when private investment in large-scale green hydrogen was being abandoned and delayed worldwide, yet both levels of Labor government were still selling its story until the very last day. In fact, let me tell you about that very same last day: Whyalla steelworks went into administration on the same day that the government quietly shelved the $600 million hydrogen plant.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">It's no wonder South Australia is in real trouble. The state Labor government has repeatedly asked South Australians to trust the plan, but South Australians can now see the result of that trust. The devastating impact on jobs doesn't end with a redundancy, and it isn't contained to the steelworks gate. It flows through local shops, cafes, schools, hospitals, contractors and small businesses. While Labor remains blinded by ideology, it won't do what is needed for Whyalla or for the struggling local industries.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Axe net zero and end the devastation of industry and business, and axe those terrible new taxes—the whole lot! Don't just tinker with them. That's not enough. It's also not enough to prioritise car races and golf courses when the health system is failing, the ambulances keep ramping, the aged-care lines are getting longer and there are record levels of business insolvency. There needs to be more than a tinker. It needs an axe to current policies, and it needs people in charge who understand what it takes to build businesses' prosperity, not ones who are insistent on bankrupting and breaking them.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I now turn to something else from earlier this week. Senator Hanson's falsehoods about Indigenous Australians not only are just ignorant but ignore history. South Australia is perfectly positioned to call it out. The podcast comments are not new, where Senator Hanson asks, 'What the hell have they done in this country?' Well, Senator Hanson, let me tell you, based on South Australia. Think of the late governor Sir Doug Nicholls KCVO OBE, community leader Gladys Elphick MBE, the artistic duo Ruby Hunter and Archie Roach AC AM and Aboriginal tracker Jimmy James OAM. In more recent times, there have been notable contributions from sports stars: former Australian of the Year Adam Goodes, Andrew McLeod, Shaun Burgoyne and national household names—Freeman, Barty, Thurston and Goolagong Cawley.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Look no further than one of the Australia's most renowned inventors, immortalised on our Australian $50 note: Ngarrindjeri inventor the late David Unaipon, who made provisional patents for no less than 19 separate inventions. From his home in the mighty Coorong, Unaipon made game-changing contributions from the action of shearer's clippers to centrifugal motors, mechanical propulsion and other technologies. Senator Hanson's comments are especially problematic because they are just plain wrong. Referencing Indigenous Australians as 'primitive' because 'they'd never invented the wheel' is particularly ironic, given one such patent of David Unaipon's was for a multiradial wheel. It seems that Senator Hanson's appalling, arbitrary benchmark for Indigenous contribution does not even pass her own test.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Across 65,000 years of survival, what continues is the management of fire risk and ecology through traditional burning practices and bush survival skills shared with our diggers, who are renowned as some of the best in the world. Hanson degradingly belittles rock art as having no value. Yet it is cultural art and the handing down of knowledge over thousands of generations that is the reason the work of renowned late artists Emily Kngwarreye and Clifford Possum today sells for many millions and millions of dollars. The Indigenous arts industry represents more than $250 million in sales in any year. When Unaipon was alive, he talked of respect for individuals despite their differences and irrespective of nationality, language and religion. This wisdom is relevant to today because our focus should be on building our nation by focusing on what unites us not looking and behaving in ways that seek to divide.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The simple truth is that Senator Hanson overreacted. That is why what could have and should have been a respectful and important discussion of curriculum content based on evidence not ideology descended into ignorant tirade. The coalition seek to protect our way of life because we value the historic strengths of Australian culture and institutions. Where there is ignorance, there must also be education—education of the integral contribution to our country that Indigenous Australians have made across our rich history. The school curriculum must reflect truth and that includes on Indigenous Australians, multicultural communities and their contribution to the building of country and community since 1788, while respecting the scientifically proven 65,000 year history that came before that.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Ultimately, the load on teachers must be more on reading, writing and maths. Issues of culture and language, I believe, are the responsibility of parents, families and the relevant community not, as we increasingly see, the job of those in taxpayer funded organisations. Instead of making a reasonable informed argument, Senator Hanson went low to unfair, unnecessary and unacceptable insult. It was offensive to condemn an entire race and culture, and it ignores the truth entirely. Let's hope we don't see it again. We don't need people who seek to divide us, we need people who seek to unite us, and we need people that leave no-one behind, because they're focused on them in their entirety.</span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>COVID-19: Vaccination, Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency, Migration</title>
          <page.no>118</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">COVID-19: Vaccination</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency</span>
              </p>
            </p>
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Migration</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>118</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Roberts, Sen Malcolm</name>
              <name.id>266524</name.id>
              <electorate>Queensland</electorate>
              <party>ON</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="266524" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator ROBERTS</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">Queensland</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">20:51</span>):  In the week since I spoke about the huge volume of scientific papers on the COVID scandal, more new papers have been published. After years of censorship, Dr Yaakov Ophir from the University of Cambridge published an excellent paper in the <span style="font-style:italic;">EXCLI </span><span style="font-style:italic;">Journal</span> titled 'Real-time pharmacovigilance and cardiac risk communication during the COVID-19 vaccination campaign in Israel'. The paper included the Israeli Ministry of Health's actual internal pharmacovigilance dataset, showing that, far from being rare and mild, adverse events from the COVID jab are dangerously high. From March to May 2021, immediately after injection started among males under 20, 85 per cent of the hospitalisations involved myocarditis or pericarditis. Among females under 20, 68 per cent of hospitalisations involved myocarditis or pericarditis. Two thirds of these patients had no medical history of heart disease, and 46 of these young people died.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">These are hospitalisations and deaths amongst healthy young people for whom COVID would not have been serious and certainly not fatal. This paper shows Israeli health authorities warned US and European authorities, 'We are seeing a large number of myocarditis and pericarditis cases in young individuals soon after Pfizer COVID-19 vaccination.' Yet the data behind that large number never reached the public. Instead, the warning was framed as 'rare, mild and transient'—a lie—and the injection regimen was extended to even younger people. Australia did the same. Did we get the data Israel shared? Was our pharmacovigilance compromised? Only a royal commission can get to the bottom of who knew what and when. Only a royal commission can unpack decisions made and recommend changes for those who ignored the adverse events and acted contrary to the best interests of the public.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Australian researcher Dr Raphael Lataster from the University of Sydney has published in the peer reviewed dedicated cancer journal <span style="font-style:italic;">Oncotarget</span>. His paper shows a mechanistic link, which means the process that links, in this case, COVID injections with an outcome—in this case, cancer. I spoke last week of a paper from the McCulloch Foundation, which established a similar mechanistic link. The work in this area is now impossible to ignore.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Why is this not big news? We have cause and effect, absolute proof of actual cases and hundreds of autopsies of people who should still be alive, and nobody in authority cares. Only One Nation will call a royal commission into a medical response that killed thousands—tens of thousands—of Australians due to adverse events, suicides, incorrect protocols or delays in medical treatment. That is criminal. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">What's also criminal is the performance of the Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency, which is tasked with maintaining Australian medical standards. In Senate estimates hearings I've questioned Ahpra on many occasions. I've mentioned their jihad against any doctor who refuses to follow their self-determined medical truths and I've spoken about capable, sound doctors who are deregistered for the crime of providing their patients with the best possible medical care. Their actions during COVID and since show that Ahpra is dedicated to protecting orthodoxy, maximising pharmaceutical use and causing doctors to break the Hippocratic oath. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">I read an article in the <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian</span> newspaper last weekend from obstetrician Dr Michael Gannon, former head of the Australian Medical Association. The headline correctly summarises the situation in which Ahpra has put us: 'System to catch bad doctors is causing harm to the good ones.' It's killing good ones, and the regulator meant to protect patients has no filter on accepting complaints. Ahpra's own data shows 16 doctors took their lives while under its scrutiny. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Doctors' registration fees have risen fivefold to pay for Ahpra's mission creep, which is more reminiscent of a ministry of truth than a studious group of medical professionals ensuring their colleagues' skill levels meet practising standards. In April this year, Ahpra convened the 'organisational review group—incidents of distress' to consider serious incidents relating to the suicide of people involved in their regulatory processes, and it's no bloody wonder. This regulator has an appetite for more and more complaints, growing its budget and power. It's lacking the ability to manage complaints in a morally fair and expeditious manner and it's harming our society. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">A One Nation government will convene a conference of state health ministers to review the performance of Ahpra and explore alternative models of regulation based on correcting the balance between the practitioner's standards and rights and the patient's best interests. In doing so, One Nation will listen to doctors, nurses and health practitioners. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Liberal Senator Hume described One Nation's immigration policy as 'a headline number and a few slogans'. I have the policy here. It's seven pages of details and facts. It took months of research to source the numbers and formulate the measures, which are comprehensive, detailed, consistent and will fix so many of the problems Australia is facing in housing, household wealth, service delivery, social cohesion and the current per capita recession in which Australians are suffering. It's clear that people criticising the policy have never read it or are lying out of political self-interest. For clarity, there's no change in backpackers, no change in PALM workers, no change in tourism numbers. All three can increase if the market can sustain more. Labor Minister Watt made this criticism: 'One Nation policy will destroy the economy and drive the economy into recession.' The minister is not alone in this deceit. Some Liberal-aligned business leaders and Labor-aligned media have repeated this unfounded fabrication, contrary to the facts. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">The Treasury's Fiscal Impact of New Australians model, FIONA, looks at the lifetime contribution of a new immigrant—the cost and the benefit. A young migrant in the sweet spot of 25 to 35 years of age—someone who assimilates, works his or her whole life and stays out of trouble—will add $198,000 to the economy in their lifetime, increasing GDP and wealth for all, which is why we are not reducing that cohort; we are increasing it. This is our immigration target demographic. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">FIONA shows each person arriving under the family program, though, costs the Australian economy $126,000 across their lifetime. FIONA shows a migrant arriving after the age of 50 will never pay back the taxpayers either. In addition, their lifetime value is negative. The current mix of this government's new arrivals is heavily weighted towards older migrants, family reunions and nonworkers, and there are hundreds of thousands of fake students working in the gig economy, cheating on their tax and sending home as much money as possible. Children of new arrivals or family reunions have a huge lifetime economic cost. The younger the child, the more likely it is that they will have a negative lifetime economic impact. This is why FIONA only puts the average lifetime contribution of all migrants that this government is letting in at $41,000. The more committed, young, educated or skilled workers we let in, the more nonproducers we can screen out. It only takes 20 per cent of all arrivals to be our target young demographic for the total value of arrivals to hit the $41,000 figure. So what do other arrivals contribute? They don't. They add costs to Australians. Do the maths. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Prime Minister Carney grew Canada's economy with the same approach One Nation is proposing. He grew it. Canada's largest banks report that Canadian immigration cuts were easing rental pressures and supporting employment. In Canadian provinces where the immigration cuts were most significant, rents are falling fastest. The banks concluded the immigration slowdown has been great news for Canada's battlers. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Speaking last night on—of course—the ABC, George Megalogenis said our cut would cause the worst depression since the 1890s. Talk about seeing what you want to see! What utter nonsense—a lie. The data I have just presented shows the reverse will be true. Canada proved the reverse will be true. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">As for a supposed labour shortage, One Nation is not changing backpacker numbers. We're offering skilled visas to genuinely skilled workers in areas we need them, including construction; the care economy, such as nursing and aged care; and rural industry. Let's be clear; only one per cent of skilled arrivals last year under this government were construction workers, half a per cent were aged-care workers and one per cent were nurses. Our numbers leave plenty of room for more skilled and educated workers where we need them. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Our policy looks after those who are already here. Right now, there are 690,000 Australians out of work—690,000. There are another 1.65 million Australians looking for extra work. Business lobbies should start there—with Australians who want a job. It's industry's fault that workforce planning was sacrificed on the altar of high profits and lazy management. The workers are here in Australia. It's time for industry to get back in the business of training the new generation of apprentices and staff, instead of lazily importing them.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Under One Nation, the cheap-labour gravy train will be over, and Australians can begin to restore Australian productivity and living standards. Together we Australians can restore Australia. </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
      <subdebate.1>
        <subdebateinfo>
          <title>Housing</title>
          <page.no>120</page.no>
        </subdebateinfo>
        <subdebate.text>
          <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
            <p class="HPS-SubDebate" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
              <span class="HPS-SubDebate">Housing</span>
            </p>
          </body>
        </subdebate.text>
        <speech>
          <talk.start>
            <talker>
              <page.no>120</page.no>
              <time.stamp />
              <name role="metadata">Kovacic, Sen Maria</name>
              <name.id>306168</name.id>
              <electorate>New South Wales</electorate>
              <party>LP</party>
              <in.gov />
              <first.speech />
            </talker>
          </talk.start>
          <talk.text>
            <body background="" style="" xmlns:w="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/wordprocessingml/2006/main" xmlns:a="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/main" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:wx="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/word/2003/auxHint" xmlns:aml="http://schemas.microsoft.com/aml/2001/core" xmlns:pic="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/picture" xmlns:w10="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:wp="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/drawingml/2006/wordprocessingDrawing" xmlns:r="http://schemas.openxmlformats.org/officeDocument/2006/relationships">
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <a href="306168" type="MemberSpeech">
                    <span class="HPS-MemberSpeech">Senator KOVACIC</span>
                  </a> (<span class="HPS-Electorate">New South Wales</span>) (<span class="HPS-Time">21:02</span>):  For a generation of Australians, homeownership is becoming less a dream and more a distant prospect. House prices are now around 8.9 times the median household income, and young Australians are already being asked to save larger deposits for longer, while meeting increasing everyday costs. And yet, at precisely the moment when government should be making it easier for young Australians to save, invest and build a deposit, the Albanese Labor government has introduced tax changes that will make that task even harder. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">New modelling from economists of Victoria University and the former chief economist of the New South Wales Parliamentary Budget Office shows what these changes could mean for an ordinary young Australian trying to get into their first home. Under one scenario, for a young Australian starting with a $50,000 investment portfolio and trying to build that into a $150,000 deposit for a $750,000 home, it would take around 20 years under the current system. But, under the government's tax changes, that same task could take 28 years, eight more years—eight more years that is being sold to Australians as intergenerational equity, eight more years of renting, eight more years of trying to catch a housing market that always seems to be out of reach. </span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There is another extraordinary finding. In modelling where a portfolio earns only one per cent of a real return, as much as 98 per cent of that real gain could be taxed under the new arrangements. This problem was reported in the <span style="font-style:italic;">Australian</span> this morning and is pretty straightforward. The system recognises the real gains for tax purposes, without giving the same recognition for real losses. The upside attracts tax, while the downside does not receive any equivalent offset.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Young Australians are constantly told to work hard, save, invest what you can responsibly and build something for your future. But, when they do, this government's answer is to tax them harder. You cannot say you want more Australians to own a home while making it harder for them to keep the deposit that they are saving. The government cannot claim to stand for intergenerational fairness while putting forward policies that risk pushing the next generation further and further away from home ownership, and the government cannot keep putting new barriers in front of young Australians and then wonder why so many of them feel at a loss and feel that the Australian promise is slipping away.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But tax policy is only one part of the pressure being placed on housing, because, once an Australian has saved the deposit, secured the finance and is ready to build, there is another problem that is making it harder for young Australians to buy a home: the cost of construction in our country impacted by the corrupt and criminal conduct of the CFMEU. For almost a year now, I've been calling for a Senate inquiry into corruption, criminal conduct and the influence of organised crime in the construction sector. Five times this Senate has had the opportunity to support this proposal, and five times the Australian Labor Party and the Greens have voted it down.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">This week, senators will have a sixth opportunity to show Australians that this parliament is serious about integrity, serious about transparency and serious about cleaning up an industry that builds the homes, the roads, the hospitals and the infrastructure that all Australians need. Because the allegations we have seen are not minor, they go to the integrity of taxpayer funded construction projects and to allegations of payments involving organised crime figures and access to CFMEU controlled building sites.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Former IBAC commissioner Robert Redlich has called what we are seeing an 'unprecedented historic scandal'. They are not my words. Former Victorian ombudsman Deborah Glass has said the circumstances warrant a royal commission. Geoffrey Watson QC, who investigated the CFMEU and lifted the lid on $15 billion worth of corruption on Victorian infrastructure sites, said the Setka led branch was effectively a crime syndicate. They are not my words. They are the words and the analysis of people who hold high office in our country whose job it is to investigate such matters, and yet this parliament still cannot bring itself to support a Senate inquiry. Australians can see what's happening. They're not stupid. They know exactly what is going on. They understand these allegations, and they demand answers. That is why more than 62,000 Australians have now signed my petition calling for a Senate inquiry. That number continues to grow.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Last week, I sent a pledge to every member and Senator in this parliament. It wasn't complicated. I didn't ask anyone to sign up to a party position or to endorse a particular agenda or policy. I simply asked them to say where they stand. Do you stand for integrity? Do you stand for cleaning up corruption? Do you stand against criminal conduct, organised crime and bikie gangs having influence on our construction industry? I want to thank my coalition colleagues, whose signatures have been coming through thick and fast. They have all been prepared to put their names to those principles and tell Australians plainly where they stand. I also acknowledge independent members of the House who are supporting this campaign, such as the member for Mackellar, who has signed the pledge and displayed it in her office window, and the members for Bradfield and Mayo, who have advised my office that they also support our campaign to end corruption in construction.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">But what is extraordinary—or perhaps it is not—is that not a single Labor member has signed it. Not a single Greens member has signed it. I'm disappointed that Senator Roberts has left, because not a single member of One Nation has signed it either. Not one of them has completed the simple task of telling Australians that they stand against corruption and criminality in the construction industry and the waste of taxpayer dollars. At some point, silence becomes its own statement. It tells a story. If members and senators do not want Australians drawing conclusions from their refusal to sign, then there is a very simple solution: sign it.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">To the independents who have built political careers campaigning on transparency, accountability and integrity, this is your opportunity to demonstrate that those principles apply even when the politics are a little bit uncomfortable. Stand by your convictions. Do what the people who elected you expected you to do when you are given a choice like this one.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">Cleaning up the corrupt and criminal conduct of the construction industry does not end with the CFMEU. We must take a proactive approach and say that this conduct doesn't fit the standards for any worksite, especially when we are hearing concerns of former CFMEU members now moving to the ETU. The whole purpose of placing the CFMEU into administration was not to merely change the names on the office doors; it was to break the culture of lawlessness, intimidation and corruption that has become entrenched in parts of the union.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">There's an obvious weakness in the administration's safeguards. A removed person from the CFMEU cannot, without the Fair Work Commission's approval, take office in another union, become employed or engaged by it, or act as a bargaining representative. But the law doesn't stop the removed person joining another union, and CFMEU members expelled for misconduct may fall outside restrictions altogether.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">That matters because we know industrial influence doesn't begin and end with a job title. Membership provides access to union networks, workplaces, meetings and other members. Take, for example, the CFMEU New South Wales president, Rita Mallia. She is a removed person. The administrator later found that she and other senior New South Wales officials had committed multiple serious breaches of duties owed to union members. Yet she is now CEO of Electrogroup, a group training organisation partnered with the ETU and described by the <span style="font-style:italic;">Financial Review</span> as 'the ETU's training arm'. The ETU operates alongside the CFMEU across the construction industry, and its New South Wales leadership was among the CFMEU's biggest backers during the administration fight. Labor told Australians the administration would stop the CFMEU's rotten culture spreading elsewhere. It hasn't, and it's time for it to stop.</span>
              </p>
              <p class="HPS-Normal" style="text-align:center;direction:ltr;unicode-bidi:normal;&#xA;          text-indent:0pt;&#xA;        ">
                <span class="HPS-Normal">
                  <span style="font-weight:bold;">
                  </span>
                  <span style="font-weight:bold;">Senate adjourned at 21:12</span>
                </span>
              </p>
            </body>
          </talk.text>
        </speech>
      </subdebate.1>
    </debate>
  </chamber.xscript>
</hansard>